Quick Fix Game 69: Dark One: Too Light

[Mat he/him]

4 hours ago, Kasimir said:

@Ookla the Bald @Ookla the Destined Interested in your thoughts on this vote mechanic. How should it be used? Do you see it as V!leaning or E!leaning?

Missed this because I’m not used to my own Ookla name .-.

I feel it’s e leaning because we lose most of the pressure that comes from shuffling votes around during the cycle. The orange votes aren’t a great substitute because they’re not real but it’s better than nothing.

As for how it should be used, I think the wrong answer is last second, honestly. Last hour is much better, it gives time to respond to things and for votes to bounce off each other. There’s something to be said about voting early early but that’s only good in specific circumstances (sorry :p)

Apologies if that’s overly scatterbrained, I’m half paying attention to something else as I’m typing this lol

2 minutes ago, Ooklil the Wei said:

Whats your experience with Aeoryi before and how does it compare?

I relate to the last pages feeling like fluff.

Very high WiM for a newish player which is awesome, but their play is pretty unpredictable. Their second game I locked in a correct v read early on for a reason I don’t remember, but I solved them early on. Their third game we were elims together and they proved to be very good at matching their v tone, and played very aggressively, arguably too much so

Their WiM so far seems to match, which is expected, but what I think is different is the angles they’re pushing. They seem to come from an e mindset. Could specify more later if you want.

But again, hard to say for me, after just coming off being their teammate for their first elim game

Now to submit and hope this merges wheeeeeee

[Aeoryi she/her]

9 minutes ago, Ookla the Destined said:

That’s the opposite of completely different, you read me light village with a heavy ????? every single D1 lol

Because I agreed with one of Stick’s points? I think you’re misusing the word ‘fishy’ here.

Mixed vibes from Aeoryi. They seem weirder than before but it’s hard to tell after elimming with them. Definitely not getting the strong v vibes I got from them two games again though. But it is early. The main thing stopping me here is the self vote but I have firsthand experience with their reckless e play, so there you go :P. If the cycle ended right now I’d vote them I think.

Illwei feels village so far but iirc I was horrible at reading them so /shrug

I like the questions Stick is posing but I trust nothing 

I’m seeing a lot of statements and reads being made in a state of ignorance (such as Raven reading Kas e) which makes the last four pages feel largely like fluff.

Honestly e!mat still scares me after that game. We only lost cause you got rb'd 

Also, you missed illwwi's question 

[---]

2 minutes ago, Ookla the Resolute said:

illwwi

it begins

[Aeoryi she/her]

Just now, Ooklil the Wei said:

it begins

That's auto correct

"ill WWI"

Why

14 minutes ago, Ookla the Destined said:

Missed this because I’m not used to my own Ookla name .-.

I feel it’s e leaning because we lose most of the pressure that comes from shuffling votes around during the cycle. The orange votes aren’t a great substitute because they’re not real but it’s better than nothing.

As for how it should be used, I think the wrong answer is last second, honestly. Last hour is much better, it gives time to respond to things and for votes to bounce off each other. There’s something to be said about voting early early but that’s only good in specific circumstances (sorry :p)

Apologies if that’s overly scatterbrained, I’m half paying attention to something else as I’m typing this lol

Very high WiM for a newish player which is awesome, but their play is pretty unpredictable. Their second game I locked in a correct v read early on for a reason I don’t remember, but I solved them early on. Their third game we were elims together and they proved to be very good at matching their v tone, and played very aggressively, arguably too much so

Their WiM so far seems to match, which is expected, but what I think is different is the angles they’re pushing. They seem to come from an e mindset. Could specify more later if you want.

But again, hard to say for me, after just coming off being their teammate for their first elim game

Now to submit and hope this merges wheeeeeee

Also, Aman said I also had a very high WiM back in MR66 if that helps

[The Unknown Order he/him]

11 hours ago, Stick. said:

AYO??? 

Why? I could be elim. 
 

Edit:

Instinctively dislike this post because of the second paragraph. I can’t tell if it’s an intentional attempt at a derp clear? Both factions get one double vote/one vote negation. 
 

So far looking at aeori and tkn

I fully realize both factions get vote change, but it is extremely difficult for the village to coordinate it in a meaningful way (and the chances of friendly fire are much, much higher)

, whereas the elims can almost certainly use it to create exlo a cycle earlier. I suspect based on past games that the village will burn their vote change earlier than they should.

3 hours ago, Stick. said:

he thinks only mafia can double their vote, and has only talked about mech thus far. wet sock energy if you ask me

Again, not what I think. And when you'd made this comment I had all of a single post. And, Tis d1, mech is pretty much all we have, especially as relatively early as I had posted. 

@Kasimir, got reminded of your question by Mat also missing it. I think the ability to double and remove is an elim leaning mechanic, but only one vote per turn is actually a bit village leaning. It removes a bit of elim strategy but very little village reading capacity. 

I'd say removing isn't that useful, except maybe to cause a tie (what do ties do this game?), and we should probably save our doubling for the turn before and the turn of exlo.

There's also some smart strategies the elims could try to do, but I won't say too much about them because they're a little counterintuitive and therefore they might not realize. 

[Aeoryi she/her]

Just now, Ookla the Bald said:

I fully realize both factions get vote change, but it is extremely difficult for the village to coordinate it in a meaningful way (and the chances of friendly fire are much, much higher)

, whereas the elims can almost certainly use it to create exlo a cycle earlier. I suspect based on past games that the village will burn their vote change earlier than they should.

Again, not what I think. And when you'd made this comment I had all of a single post. And, Tis d1, mech is pretty much all we have, especially as relatively early as I had posted. 

@Kasimir, got reminded of your question by Mat also missing it. I think the ability to double and remove is an elim leaning mechanic, but only one vote per turn is actually a bit village leaning. It removes a bit of elim strategy but very little village reading capacity. 

I'd say removing isn't that useful, except maybe to cause a tie (what do ties do this game?), and we should probably save our doubling for the turn before and the turn of exlo.

There's also some smart strategies the elims could try to do, but I won't say too much about them because they're a little counterintuitive and therefore they might not realize. 

Ties kill no one

[The Unknown Order he/him]

Just now, Ookla the Resolute said:

Ties kill no one

Obrigado. 

So not crazy useful to cause one, but there might be reason to.

[Mat he/him]

24 minutes ago, Ookla the Resolute said:

Honestly e!mat still scares me after that game. We only lost cause you got rb'd 

Also, you missed illwwi's question 

That was one of many reasons we lost that game  I just as easily could have had you submit the kill.

I don’t think I did. Which one?

I like TKN doubling down on his reasoning and explaining it in a way that makes sense. Feels village.

[Kasimir he/him]

1 hour ago, Ookla the Destined said:

That’s the opposite of completely different, you read me light village with a heavy ????? every single D1 lol

It's different from what was going on in the thread. Curious why that wasn't the intuitive read here?

1 hour ago, Ookla the Destined said:

Because I agreed with one of Stick’s points? I think you’re misusing the word ‘fishy’ here.

Interesting.

1 hour ago, Ookla the Destined said:

I feel it’s e leaning because we lose most of the pressure that comes from shuffling votes around during the cycle. The orange votes aren’t a great substitute because they’re not real but it’s better than nothing.

As for how it should be used, I think the wrong answer is last second, honestly. Last hour is much better, it gives time to respond to things and for votes to bounce off each other. There’s something to be said about voting early early but that’s only good in specific circumstances (sorry :p)

Interesting. Thank you. Mild here.

44 minutes ago, Ookla the Bald said:

@Kasimir, got reminded of your question by Mat also missing it. I think the ability to double and remove is an elim leaning mechanic, but only one vote per turn is actually a bit village leaning. It removes a bit of elim strategy but very little village reading capacity. 

Could you elaborate?

Edited to add:

@Stick. Sis, curious about your take now.

Edited November 28, 2023 by Kasimir

[Mat he/him]

Glad I could help? :P.

Anything you want me to clarify? Feel like I wasn’t super clear in that post.

[Aeoryi she/her]

Either way, if someone could please vote so that way it doesn't look like the two options are stick and I

(But vote wisely)

[Stick. she/her]

5 hours ago, Ookla of Ravens said:

i think its a good argument.

but (in your own words) people can say things, right? so it is a good argument - is it a villagery argument? 

 

4 hours ago, Ookla the Resolute said:

1. Your reaction shows an absurd amount more effort. I'd have to check, but that could be a WiM sign.

2. Mat seems very eager to jump on to what you say. I do know he hates self-voting however. Mildly fishy imo, but not enough to warrant a ghost vote 

3. What's a scumread?

 

1. is that a village read or?

2. is that an elim read or? 

        @Ookla the Destined whats your actual nonhedge stance on tkn?

3. my bad yeah, what jnv said

 

1 hour ago, Ookla the Destined said:

Their WiM so far seems to match, which is expected, but what I think is different is the angles they’re pushing.

their wim seems to match with...what? both their elim and villa games?

1 hour ago, Ookla the Destined said:

They seem to come from an e mindset. Could specify more later if you want.

please do

 

1 hour ago, Ookla the Bald said:

I fully realize both factions get vote change, but it is extremely difficult for the village to coordinate it in a meaningful way (and the chances of friendly fire are much, much higher)

bro whyd you phrase it in the most elimmy way possible:

14 hours ago, Ookla the Bald said:

So my only observation so far, elims have double voting power, yes? So we need to be worrying about exlo a bit earlier than normal. On second thought, it's not too bad, maybe only a turn before there would be exlo anyways, but something to keep in mind regardless.

but eh, ill move on for now

 

but ill ask you this, at the time of writing this post, were you aware of the elim wincon being parity and not overparity? @Ookla the Bald

1 hour ago, Kasimir said:

@Stick. Sis, curious about your take now.

i dont really care how people use their vote doubling/negations, but ideally we come to a consensus wagon before eod so that elim vote manip cant affect anything

[TheRavenHasLanded he/him]

im gonna say villagey

[Stick. she/her]

6 minutes ago, Ookla of Ravens said:

im gonna say villagey

what do you think of illwei trying to potentially kill you? i noticed you didnt have a reaction to that

[TheRavenHasLanded he/him]

oh, its understandable. i have had some nonsense explanations. im just a little bit out of it right now, so i dont have many thoughts right now.

[Kasimir he/him]

13 minutes ago, Stick. said:

i dont really care how people use their vote doubling/negations, but ideally we come to a consensus wagon before eod so that elim vote manip cant affect anything

To clarify, I was more curious about your views on the vote lock-in. I just decided to prod them for more since why not.

Edit:

@Stick. Also curious—how do you go from "intentional attempt at a derpclear" to "why did you phrase it in the most elimmy way possible"?

Edited November 28, 2023 by Kasimir

[Stick. she/her]

 

4 minutes ago, Ookla of Ravens said:

oh, its understandable. i have had some nonsense explanations. im just a little bit out of it right now, so i dont have many thoughts right now.

Really? none of your explanations sounded nonsensical to me so it's interesting you have that self perception. What posts are you referring to?

 

1 minute ago, Kasimir said:

To clarify, I was more curious about your views on the vote lock-in. I just decided to prod them for more since why not.

ah yea we can vote 3-2 hours before eod so the person dying has time to leave a few last words

 

ill be asleep tho so ill vote in an hour or so and then dip

 

i think locked votes in a game this small have the potential to swing hard in one alignment's favour depending on how d1 goes

[TheRavenHasLanded he/him]

Just now, Stick. said:

 

Really? none of your explanations sounded nonsensical to me so it's interesting you have that self perception. What posts are you referring to?

 

ah yea we can vote 3-2 hours before eod so the person dying has time to leave a few last words

 

ill be asleep tho so ill vote in an hour or so and then dip

 

i think locked votes in a game this small have the potential to swing hard in one alignment's favour depending on how d1 goes

well, by nonsensical, i meant easily debunked with better reasoning. but im sticking with my thoughts, even if it makes me seem elim. because i will know that i stayed with my opinion.

[Stick. she/her]

3 minutes ago, Ookla of Ravens said:

well, by nonsensical, i meant easily debunked with better reasoning. but im sticking with my thoughts, even if it makes me seem elim. because i will know that i stayed with my opinion.

ah, gotcha. that's fine, youre good

edit:

 

actually no wait, i assume what youre referring to here is the elim!kas take that kas and i argued against? but you just said you villa read his response. so are you sticking with your initial read or?

@Ookla of Ravens

Edited November 28, 2023 by Stick.

[---]

32 minutes ago, Stick. said:

1. Your reaction shows an absurd amount more effort. I'd have to check, but that could be a WiM sign.

Stick obviously didn't say this but I'm quoting from her post-

Confused by this, what do you mean a WiM sign?

Acknoledged that stick also asked a clarifying question but

[Stick. she/her]

27 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

@Stick. Also curious—how do you go from "intentional attempt at a derpclear" to "why did you phrase it in the most elimmy way possible"?

missed this - my initial line of thought was the former, then i read it again and realised it doesnt have to be intentional, and that elims couldve misunderstood the mech just the same. so it cant be a derp clear in any case. i assume theres only two elims, and i assume they hadnt gone over every detail of the game that early into the cycle, so it's possible. 

edit:

and imo the first post doesnt match his claimed line of thought in the follow up explanation post which makes it come across as wolfily phrased if true  

Edited November 28, 2023 by Stick.

[Kasimir he/him]

10 minutes ago, Stick. said:

missed this - my initial line of thought was the former, then i read it again and realised it doesnt have to be intentional, and that elims couldve misunderstood the mech just the same. so it cant be a derp clear in any case. i assume theres only two elims, and i assume they hadnt gone over every detail of the game that early into the cycle, so it's possible. 

edit:

and imo the first post doesnt match his claimed line of thought in the follow up explanation post which makes it come across as wolfily phrased if true  

Can you talk me through it a bit more? Because my reflex was to ascribe TKN the charitable reading of that para and move on. I also think his status as LHF when V is causing me concern here when this currently feels like a stretch to me.

[Stick. she/her]

1 minute ago, Kasimir said:

Can you talk me through it a bit more? Because my reflex was to ascribe TKN the charitable reading of that para and move on. I also think his status as LHF when V is causing me concern here when this currently feels like a stretch to me.

yea it's why i said im gonna drop it, it's not fun to chase after that weird angle anyway. i dont village read him and still want the answer to my question but im prob not voting there today

[Aeoryi she/her]

56 minutes ago, Stick. said:

but (in your own words) people can say things, right? so it is a good argument - is it a villagery argument? 

 

1. is that a village read or?

2. is that an elim read or? 

        @Ookla the Destined whats your actual nonhedge stance on tkn?

3. my bad yeah, what jnv said

 

their wim seems to match with...what? both their elim and villa games?

please do

 

bro whyd you phrase it in the most elimmy way possible:

but eh, ill move on for now

 

but ill ask you this, at the time of writing this post, were you aware of the elim wincon being parity and not overparity? @Ookla the Bald

i dont really care how people use their vote doubling/negations, but ideally we come to a consensus wagon before eod so that elim vote manip cant affect anything

N+ for stick

N- for Mat 

Also N- for Kas, since elims tend to avoid interacting with strange things that might reveal their alignment

1. That is a slight village read

2. That is a slight Elim read

3. Okay cool

24 minutes ago, Ooklil the Wei said:

Stick obviously didn't say this but I'm quoting from her post-

Confused by this, what do you mean a WiM sign?

Acknoledged that stick also asked a clarifying question but

A sign of dedication. Lots of Effort tends to be a village tell 

[---]

Matrim