Mid-Range Game 9: The Steel Ministry

[Creccio he/him]

@Wyrm

 

I haven't burned because I didn't want to waste them. I did not know a thing about who was what and i thought my metal would be pointless to use. Maybe i messed up a seeker or lurcher job.

 

I am almost positively going to burn tonight if a seeker wants to check. Wyrm, who are you suspicious of? Let us work together

[Wyrmhero he/him]

@Wyrm

 

I haven't burned because I didn't want to waste them. I did not know a thing about who was what and i thought my metal would be pointless to use. Maybe i messed up a seeker or lurcher job.

 

I am almost positively going to burn tonight if a seeker wants to check. Wyrm, who are you suspicious of? Let us work together

 

Understandable. I was not too sure about my metal either. In the end I just decided to use it all and info-dump, hoping I found *something* odd with it. I did not, but that's not too surprising. As someone said, we can't follow-the-cop in this game. We might be able to follow-the-coinshot though, but I would really rather they remain hidden unless they are afraid of being targeted for some reason or another and want to request Lurcher defence (which we should probably be careful with to try and ensure we don't waste Lurches).

 

I'm not amazingly suspicious of anyone at the moment, unfortunately. I'm wary of Alvron because of his reasoning for voting for me, but much of that is probably just reactionary. To a certain extent, I'm also cautious because Gamma likes to have an experienced player on the Eliminator team, and there are only three long-time players left - Myself, Karippimar, and Alvron, and I'm not suspicious of Karippimar. But by now, other people probably count as experienced as well, and it's really metagamey to argue based on this point anyway. I'd much rather have solid evidence than rely on a potential shot that Gamma may be planning on us trying to abuse anyway. Hell, I know I would be trying to screw with expectations as much as possible as a GM (take note, those of you playing LG15...).

 

The only other person I'm really looking at oddly is Orlok, because of his comments about me still being alive and that scaring him because it's me >>. I kind of understand this, but I don't think he's actually had any actual complaints about me? Nothing to bring forward to actually try nominating me, anyway. I'm just always a little suspicious about people who make small comments about people all game but never do anything big based on those suspicious.

[Clanky he/him]

 

As for everyone else: I have no idea.

In the SE games I've played so far, my instinct has been terrible. So, I prefer to look at more logical evidence. At the same time, I'm not very familiar with everyone's play style (aside from maybe Stink's). I don't really have any overarching suspicions of anyone, really. Could anyone explain to me the argument against Zepher and Creccio? I've tried reading though the thread multiple times, and I fear I am stuck in the four-page zone.

 

I first brought up my suspicions of Zephrer here. That is what makes me suspicious of him and that is when others started voting for him as well. 

 

As for Creccio I believe it is all more instinctual and the tone of his posts being slightly abrasive. 

Edited October 27, 2015 by Clanky

[Creccio he/him]

I first brought up my suspicions of Zephrer here: http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/47852-mr9-day-3-blessings-in-disguise/?view=findpost&p=347631That is what makes me suspicious of him and that is when others started voting for him as well. 

 

As for Creccio I believe it is all more instinctual and the tone of his posts being slightly abrasive. 

 

I am naturally aggressive and abrasive i have been told, i really try my hardest to sound as kind as possible and try to be clear, guess its not working out D:

 

Again, I am a Zinc, does anyone have any information I should know before burning? Some metals i believe i cant do nothing about Pewter and Bronze and some others might want me to burn to confirm I am actually Zinc.

 

Clanky, other than Zeph, any other suspicions?

[Clanky he/him]

I currently have my vote on Alv and I am also suspicious of everyone lurking at the moment since it feels to me like the inquisitors are in a self-destructive phase at the moment where we are all focusing on a few active inquisitors while the Skaa just stand back and let it happen.

[Creccio he/him]

I currently have my vote on Alv and I am also suspicious of everyone lurking at the moment since it feels to me like the inquisitors are in a self-destructive phase at the moment where we are all focusing on a few active inquisitors while the Skaa just stand back and let it happen.

 

Thanks for your opinion... Could you name those persons later in the day in case you meet a not-so-happy fate?

[Clanky he/him]

Yep I will but there is still plenty of time in this cycle for everything to change.

[Creccio he/him]

Yep I will but there is still plenty of time in this cycle for everything to change.

 

Yes, I will too post my suspicions later on the day.

 

I do believe some of the Skaa are laying low, just like Shallan did, and we should all see what the not-so-active players have said and see if they have any connection to the Skaa or if they have said anything suspicious

[DeathClutch19 he/him]

Zephrer what are your thoughts on Orlok?

[Clanky he/him]

Yes that could be the case but since it seems like everybody in the conversation has a good chance of dying and there isn't really any very good reasoning behind most of the votes I would expect the Skaa to avoid it.

I am not a fan of cats. Mostly because If I go near one I can't breathe or see for a few days.

[Zephrer he/him]

@deathclutch

He does look suspicious, but he has also defended himself very well...

I don't trust him, but I don't really know him well enough to determine his alignment...

However, the way he has deflected suspicion up to now has left me thinking that he most likely Skaa... But I'm not certain by any means.

Edit: added @deathclutch

Edited October 27, 2015 by Zephrer

[Alvron]

2. Alvron. Used no metal. Potentially could be killer skaa, but frankly he'd be the worst person on an Eliminator team to try it if he was Skaa, considering he's relatively high-profile as a player. So he either didn't use his power, or made the kill. I'd bet on the former.

For what it's worth a can confirm that I didn't use my metal on cycle 2.   Also I didn't kill anyone that round either.

 

 

Woah there, hold your horses, let's not go putting words in peoples' mouths. You are entirely wrong on the first count, and that just shows maliciousness or carelessness, Alvron. I gave multiple reasons for Mailliw's death and reached the conclusion that looking for meanings in his death would be pointless as there could be so many different ones responsible when it's just as easy to say 'active and experienced'. So actually the opposite.

 

Adavantos... To be honest, I actually didn't know he was the one who died. I looked at the player list and saw it belonged to 'Alvom'. I didn't realise Adavantos was Alvom until just now when I looked over it.  And then you add a little bit on about Smart when I have no idea why you're connecting my previous comments to his death.

Apologies Wyrm.  I didn't go back and check cycle 2 as I really couldn't be bothered.  All I wanted at that stage was sleep.  You did give various reasons for Maills death but didn't for Adavantos or Sart and I just lumped it all in together without really double checking my facts.  The point I was trying to make was that the Skaa seem to be targeting analysers (of which you are one) so I felt that either you were a Skaa removing the competition for lynch control or you were going to be a target for this round.  I was hoping that the Skaa would reveal themselves by either defending you or by trying to push the lynch through on you.

 

 

Vote Tally:

Stink(0) : Polking

Zephrer(0) : Clanky, Deathclutch

Polking(0) : Deathclutch

Wyrm(1) : Alvron, Lopen

Orlok(3) : Creccio, Deathclutch, Winter

Creccio(2) : Orlok, Meandbooks

Alvron(2) : Wyrm, Clanky

Edited October 28, 2015 by Alvron

[The Honey Badger he/him]

Hey guys, sorry, school has been ramping up and I haven't had a ton of time, but I have a little now. Congratulations to that coinshot, solid work

 

I think that the 'newer' player feud is just that and might have substance but I can't call it an entirely rational argument. I don't know what Orlock did, I haven't seen a whole lot from him. I think there'd be a balance of Skaa players in experience, due to the high density of newer to medium players I'd say there is maybe one or two experienced people in that group. Most of the experienced people have been dying, which means that it's either fear kills or an experienced person picking off people that know them well. I'm not sure enough to place a vote, but I am keeping an eye on Alv and Wyrm. I think one of them is probably skaa, but we'll see. 

You guys are strange, but I love cats, I have two of them,

I am not going to throw my role out there, because if the eliminators keep tally, which (in my experience) they do. They'll look at it. And those that didn't throw out there role are likely to be the lurchers/ coinshots, wanting to protect themselves. I'm not saying that I have that role, I'm just saying that I want to protect those that do. 

[Orlok Tsubodai]

Good job, on nailing an eliminator. First kill for the coinshot is an eliminator! And I'm on, so I'll say that I don't really suspect the newer player feud thing that's going on that much, probably just them working it out. Orlok, however, has been on my watchlist for a while. The last vote on Joe, who I trusted. I'll try and go back and see if Shallan posted anything at all. Don't remember if she did.

Winter, I did explain this earlier - whilst you may have trusted Joe, I was still rather wary of him, and decided that even if he wasn't a Skaa, it was certainly worth lynching him for the confirmation of his intentions, and to see his voting patterns, and those voting on him etc. I didn't have a firm view on Zephrer's alignment, and didn't have time to form one.

Other than this, is there anything I can explain to you to better help you understand why I've acted as I have?

Wyrm - in terms of bringing you up - part is a real wariness that you are positioning for a repeat of QF9, part is some niggling suspicion about you, but to a degree it's a lighthearted reminder - I would be highly critical of anyone who placed a vote with it as justification at this point.

Given I'm on the topic, Alvron is still alive - which isn't necessarily indicative of anything much - it's only cycle 4, but given he was kept alive last game only to break his dodo award record, which he's already lost, there isn't quite as innocent an explanation if he continues to survive.

[Zephrer he/him]

@Honey Badger

Gamma said this was a role-madness game, so everyone has a role of some sort. Claiming you might not have one is somewhat suspicious in my mind, but I'll give you benefit of the doubt and just assume it was a mistake...

But I agree that keeping your role hidden as long as possible (while not always the most trust promoting thing to do) is very wise. No need to provide the eliminators with information on whom they should kill.

 

[Clanky he/him]

Zephrer, Honey was claiming that he wasn't necessarily a lurcher or coinshot, not that he had no role at all. 

 

Also on the note of role reveals, how many vials of metal did everyone start out with? I had three. Do we think that the amount of vials you got were dependant on your power? Or maybe everyone got the same amount or they were completely random.

[Zephrer he/him]

@clanky
whoops, you're right. I misread that. Sorry Honey Badger, that was my bad.
I had three vials as well.  I this the amount of vials was dependent upon the power you were assigned, but I could be wrong. I don't think that it was random, though I wouldn't put it past Gamma to have done that just to mess with us.

[RippleGylf she/her]

@ Clanky 

I started with 4 during my first life as a soother, then 3 during my current one.

[The Honey Badger he/him]

@Zepherer, As clanky stated, I am withholding information to prevent the skaa from picking off the lurchers and coinshots. We don't want to spoon fead them who has the most valuable roles. Sorry if that wasn't completely clear

Edit: Stupid Autocorrect

Edited October 28, 2015 by The Honey Badger

[Wyrmhero he/him]

Vote Tally:

Stink(0) : Polking

Zephrer(0) : Clanky, Deathclutch

Polking(0) : Deathclutch

Wyrm(1) : Alvron, Lopen

Orlok(3) : Creccio, Deathclutch, Winter

Creccio(2) : Orlok, Meandbooks

Alvron(2) : Wyrm, Clanky

 

 

Seven votes at the moment? Good grief... Alvron.

 

HoneyBadger is 100% correct - We do not want to have everyone give out their Role because it makes it easy for the Eliminators to pick people off that they are afraid of. People should only be revealing their Role if they are providing information via it.

 

Unfortunately I'm running out of time to post, and will have to get back to you all after work. In the meantime, I guess I'd like some more from Lopen, considering he's accusing me of seeming to be helpful without actually contributing. Clearly my vote on Alvron worked at getting more information from him, and I participated in other discussions too. Admittedly that happens after he posts, during the evening, but I don't think I can be blamed for not posting while at work.

[Creccio he/him]

@Wyrm

 

I believe the post has to be greened out in the original post for it to take place, you can message Gamma or something, I just remember reading somewhere about greening the original post, not posting again with the green, sorry if I am making you go back pages D:<

[Orlok Tsubodai]

Ok, well after I die, which now seems inevitable, I would ask that you look again at Creccio, and her interaction with Deathclutch yesterday - as I put above, it seemed to me to be reminiscent of trying to divert attention with an overly dramatic post, by a player perhaps not as experienced as others.

Creccio made a very interesting statement yesterday - that Skaa hate to discuss.

I would argue that, in keeping with her own actions, she is diverting attention away from the active Skaa in thread - and I would guess that the Skaa are fairly active - but again, paranoia!

Other that that - Winter seems to be behaving erratically, but I haven't paid enough attention to her playstyle in previous games to really attribute it to anything - I would just suggest that she is watched.

[nicocoberru she/her]

I still haven't finished rereading everything but I do have to wonder why the skaa killed Sart. I don't know much about the players of SE but aren't there other better targets for the Skaa to kill?

The only thing I could think of is:

a. It was completely random

b. Sart suspected someone that is a Skaa or said something

c. An experienced player is a Skaa and it's not like they can kill themself right?

d. The Skaa wants us to think of ©

Am I completely running in circles here?

[DeathClutch19 he/him]

I still haven't finished rereading everything but I do have to wonder why the skaa killed Sart. I don't know much about the players of SE but aren't there other better targets for the Skaa to kill?

The only thing I could think of is:

a. It was completely random

b. Sart suspected someone that is a Skaa or said something

c. An experienced player is a Skaa and it's not like they can kill themself right?

d. The Skaa wants us to think of ©

Am I completely running in circles here?

Either they got a good check on Sart and knew he was the Lurcher or they killed him solely based off the fact that Sart was the last living member of the "corporation" from Quick Fix 10. (In which they won the game and skaa may be salty)

Mailliw-Medkit-9 atium --------------------------------------------Killed by skaa

Alvom - Larger Pan, Medkit, 0 Atium (as of C11)------------Killed by skaa

Feligon - Larger pan, 5 Atium, medkit--------------------------Not in game

Sart (aka a smart guy) - 1 atium :\-------------------------------Killed by skaa

Edited October 28, 2015 by DeathClutch19

[Wyrmhero he/him]

@Wyrm

 

I believe the post has to be greened out in the original post for it to take place, you can message Gamma or something, I just remember reading somewhere about greening the original post, not posting again with the green, sorry if I am making you go back pages D:<

 

I'm sorry, I'm a little confused? I can't see any red-text on my previous posts...

 

And with regards to reasons for Smart's death, Nicco... If nothing amazingly jumps out at you, then I wouldn't spend too much time on it. Your time is far better spent looking at peoples' posts and using that as evidence rather than trying to second-guess the Eliminators retroactively with no other information.

Edited October 28, 2015 by Wyrmhero