Chapters 27 and 28

[morcey2]

1 hour ago, Zea mays said:

I'm almost afraid to find out how bad Kaladin's cooking skills are.

Hopefully better than Fort's.  

[The Sovereign]

2 hours ago, Wanguu said:

Is it possible that it is Trellium? I know Trellium pushes away investiture, maybe it attracts anti-investiture?

This seems extremely unlikely to me. Keep in mind Trellium is the metal of Autonomy. By it's nature it shouldn't attract anything. It should try to remain Autonomous.

@alder24 I agree with you regarding the Spren. I think we can even cut Cryptics off the list as this is very likely an Elsecalling.  That leaves us with Inkspren and Lightspren. Of the two, I still think Inkspren is the far more likely for the reasons you stated.

Quote

Then he, Iyatil, and Lieke—who had been lingering—vanished. The air around them warped with a light tinged black-violet, and they were gone.

I should acknowledge that it is certainly possible, they have different Spren. 

Edited November 4, 2024 by The Sovereign

[Sparks]

2 hours ago, alder24 said:

 

>Doesn't matter. Any anti-investiture will react with any investiture. If they match, the reaction is stronger. But humans were on Roshar for 7000 years, they've been invested with investiture of Shards present in the system, every human have Honor's investiture in them - "Honor isn't dead as long as he lives in hearts of man."

Is there a WOB about this? Because I don’t think this is the case, otherwise there wouldn’t be a real need to manufacture specifically attuned anti-Stormlight or anti-Voidlight. Either would be deadly to invested individuals or spren / cognitive shadows. If anti-investiture is modeled on the physics of waves and specific opposite out of phase frequencies cancelling each other out, then yes, they do need to be the same frequency for it to work.

For example: I don’t think you can create a bunch of anti-Voidlight, travel to Scadrial and start blowing up every piece of invested metal that you see.

Edited November 4, 2024 by Sparks

[alder24]

1 hour ago, Sparks said:

Is there a WOB about this? Because I don’t think this is the case, otherwise there wouldn’t be a real need to manufacture specifically attuned anti-Stormlight or anti-Voidlight. Either would be deadly to invested individuals or spren / cognitive shadows. If anti-investiture is modeled on the physics of waves and specific opposite out of phase frequencies cancelling each other out, then yes, they do need to be the same frequency for it to work.

For example: I don’t think you can create a bunch of anti-Voidlight, travel to Scadrial and start blowing up every piece of invested metal that you see.

The WoB was provided in that post, just below the fragment you quoted, in the spoiler box:

4 hours ago, alder24 said:

Doesn't matter. Any anti-investiture will react with any investiture. If they match, the reaction is stronger. But humans were on Roshar for 7000 years, they've been invested with investiture of Shards present in the system, every human have Honor's investiture in them - "Honor isn't dead as long as he lives in hearts of man."

  Hide contents

R'Shara

Does anti-Investiture react to a different Shard’s Investiture in any significant way?

Brandon Sanderson

The answer is kind of a no, kind of a yes. Mostly a no. Anti-Investiture is going to have an explosive reaction. But the thing is, if it’s anti-Investiture of a specific Shard, that explosion is much grander. But you can make that explosion happen in a just antimatter-and-matter same sort of thing. But you can make the explosion bigger.

Dragonsteel 2022 (Nov. 14, 2022)

 

This makes sense. Consider what would happen if an atom of helium (2 protons, 2 electrons and 2 neutrons) meet an antiatom of antihydrogen (1 antiproton, 1 positron and 0 antineutrons). There would be annihilation of 1 pair of proton-antiproton and 1 pair of electron-positron (which would be fully turned into energy), but not the entirety of the helium atom - 1 proton, 1 electron and 2 neutrons would be left without being annihilated because there is not enough antiparticles for that. But there would still be a reaction of whatever can react.

Edit: that was a bad example tbf. Mass obviously doesn't match, it's like comparing 2 broams of investiture with 1 broam of anti-Investiture - of course there would be leftovers... Different approach - Investiture is a wave, destructive interference makes it annihilate with anti-investiture. But you can have partial destructive interference too. That's why investiture will annihilate with any type of anti-investiture, but when they match, the reaction is stronger.

If you want full annihilation, you need to manufacture proper lights, otherwise you won't destroy all of your enemy's soul, especially if just injecting them with anti-light isn't enough to annihilate their soul. The more efficient the reaction is, the more deadly it is.

 

3 minutes ago, BinarySecond said:

Is it correct that Anti-Stormlight isn't Anti-Investiture, it's just oppositely polarised Stormlight coded Investiture?

Anti-Stormlight is anti-investiture and it's opposite to Stormlight. 

Edited November 4, 2024 by alder24

[BinarySecond]

Is it correct that Anti-Stormlight isn't Anti-Investiture, it's just oppositely polarised Stormlight coded Investiture?

Edited November 4, 2024 by BinarySecond

[Wanguu He/Him]

It's very odd to me that anti-stormlight will annihiliate with any investiture. You can't cancel the sound waves of a B+ with a F#; they would just add together like normal. We saw in RoW that Stormlight and Voidlight don't really mix or do anything when put together until the appropriate rhythm (a harmony, containing both tones) is present to be the emulsifier, as Navani loved to say. Considering that anti-voidlight was made with the same tone, just with the intent for it to be anti'd, I feel that anti-voidlight should do nothing to stormlight. 

(Can anyone quote the relevant passages from RoW?)

[Dreamwa1ker she/her]

5 hours ago, alder24 said:

Edit:

5 hours ago, teknopathetic said:

Which is why I think Shallan was the one who got tricked. The meeting was far too obvious in order to talk about nothing. 

The Ghostbloods are more likely to have given away their now useless pieces in order to get closer to their Mishram goal. 

Expand  

Iyatil was clear in last week's chapter - she didn't expect Shallan to infiltrate and was surprised that Shallan impersonated as one of her own people. There is nothing more to it, no trick. They've been outsmarted too quickly, which we have to accept, even if this is disappointing. 

I agree there is not more to it, I think she did truly get the drop on the Ghostbloods, else her character development in these chapters of finding her courage to do this as Shallan vs Veil would be undermined.

But I also think the folks saying she got off too easy may be assuming too much - I suspect there will be some sort of consequences to her taking the anti-light into her system, that may come up in the following chapter. I think it is still in her system - how will they get it out safely? Are we sure it is really anti stormlight and not voidlight and could give Odium some access to her - similar to how being spiked let Ruin talk to people? I'm not really sure what is coming but I do suspect this incident is going to have some big ramification.

Also re Kaladin and Szeth:

Edited November 4, 2024 by Dreamwa1ker

[anna she/her]

5 minutes ago, Dreamwa1ker said:

But I also think the folks saying she got off too easy may be assuming too much - I suspect there will be some sort of consequences to her taking the anti-light into her system, that may come up in the following chapter. I think it is still in her system - how will they get it out safely?

I was wondering this too. I wouldn't be surprised if this ends with Radiant somehow sacrificing herself to neutralize the anti-stormlight

[bmcclure7]

6 hours ago, Sedside said:

Yeah, it felt too easy for Shallan to get out of there. Just armor, Shardblade and Shardshield, a couple of words - and that's it... I would at least expect Ghostbloods to have that anti-Radiant fabrial from RoW or something else, but they were absolutely unaware of what can happen, though they knew Shallan is going to hunt them. And they've even spent a rare anti-Stormlight bolt and let Shallan know more about it. I'm disappointed with this too 

She almost died not exactly easy. And shallan only just turned on them so there hasn’t been much time for them to prepare 

7 hours ago, alder24 said:

Shallan got hit with anti-Stormlight gemstone, surprisingly she was mostly fine because she didn’t breathe it in. This seems kind of the opposite to what was shown to us in RoW, when Raboniel killed her daughter - it just reacted directly with her soul, no breathing required. But we did have a WoB asking a question like this that said if a person is invested enough he will live, but it won’t be a fun time - it checks out. 

In the end I'm still disappointed by the total lack of preparation from Ghostbloods. They did nothing, they just run away, no secret off-world weapons, no technology ready to be used against Radiants - nothing. I've expected too much from them and now I'm just utterly disappointed by how this eneded.

And we now know what spren did Mraize or Iyatil bond - Inkspren, Lightspren or Cryptics - all three allow them to travel to CR physically, but Cryptics aren’t so obvious to use. I doubt Lightspren agreed to be Enlightened when they all decided to bond with Singers and that leaves Inkspren as the most likely candidate. And we’ve seen Corrupted Inkspren already so I bet at least one of them is bonded with an Inkspren.

I think one of the reasons why there are no Lifespren in Shinovar is because those aren’t plants native to Roshar. No surprise here, but Rosharan plants probably need Lifespren to infuse plants with Stormlight - a mechanism amplified by the proper Rhythm, used by Parshendi and later Rlain in RoW ch 15 to increase the rate at which plants were growing. Shin flora don't need investiture to grow, they don’t need Stormlight and Lifespren just aren’t attracted to them. 

Disappointing yes, but it makes sense. If kel and his crew would have been caught in FE Then I doubt anyone but vin and kel would have stayed a fought and even that case they would’ve only fought long enough for the others to escape. Why should this be any different?

[The Stick]

I just thought of another way to potentially beat Radiants, although it would be insanely expensive. In addition, it actually probably would be a catch-all solution to all Invested people. If Kel was to make small amounts of Lerasium, then attach them to bullets or crossbow quarrels, he could have a very effective weapon. Now, this obviously sounds stupid, why allow your opponent a ginourmously expensive power boost. To answer this, I would propose that there is also a large amount of aluminum in this projectile. In this way, you could potentially get an Investiture user to become mistborn, then burn aluminum to destroy their Investiture reserves. Now that I think about it even further, if you were to alloy the Lerasium with aluminum to stay, you would grant only that power.

While this is still wildly expensive, I think it is potentially viable.

[bmcclure7]

4 minutes ago, The Stick said:

I just thought of another way to potentially beat Radiants, although it would be insanely expensive. In addition, it actually probably would be a catch-all solution to all Invested people. If Kel was to make small amounts of Lerasium, then attach them to bullets or crossbow quarrels, he could have a very effective weapon. Now, this obviously sounds stupid, why allow your opponent a ginourmously expensive power boost. To answer this, I would propose that there is also a large amount of aluminum in this projectile. In this way, you could potentially get an Investiture user to become mistborn, then burn aluminum to destroy their Investiture reserves. Now that I think about it even further, if you were to alloy the Lerasium with aluminum to stay, you would grant only that power.

While this is still wildly expensive, I think it is potentially viable.

You can’t force someone to burn a metal

[The Stick]

1 hour ago, bmcclure7 said:

You can’t force someone to burn a metal

Yes, but I am thinking a long the lines that they will burn it instinctually. After all, we see Vin do this with Brass. I would say someone who is already working with an Invested art may indeed accidentally burn the aluminum as well.

[Njvodin]

8 hours ago, alder24 said:

I think one of the reasons why there are no Lifespren in Shinovar is because those aren’t plants native to Roshar. No surprise here, but Rosharan plants probably need Lifespren to infuse plants with Stormlight - a mechanism amplified by the proper Rhythm, used by Parshendi and later Rlain in RoW ch 15 to increase the rate at which plants were growing. Shin flora don't need investiture to grow, they don’t need Stormlight and Lifespren just aren’t attracted to them. 

Made up a semi theory when I was reading that part, that the native Rosharan plants need to bond a lifespren to grow, as they seem much more intelligent than a regular plant. I can't remember where I saw it, but I read that the more sapient a lifeform is, the more Investiture it has. This could be reversed, the more Investiture something has the more sapient it is (like leaving chunks of raw Investiture alone and it becoming it's own thing).

Either way, glad we came to similar, if not the same, conclusion

[Sedside she/her]

4 hours ago, Dreamwa1ker said:

But I also think the folks saying she got off too easy may be assuming too much - I suspect there will be some sort of consequences to her taking the anti-light into her system, that may come up in the following chapter. I think it is still in her system - how will they get it out safely?

Looks like she will have to stab herself again with the reverted bolt to get it out  Poor Shallan 

[duladen he/him]

5 hours ago, The Stick said:

I just thought of another way to potentially beat Radiants, although it would be insanely expensive. In addition, it actually probably would be a catch-all solution to all Invested people. If Kel was to make small amounts of Lerasium, then attach them to bullets or crossbow quarrels, he could have a very effective weapon. Now, this obviously sounds stupid, why allow your opponent a ginourmously expensive power boost. To answer this, I would propose that there is also a large amount of aluminum in this projectile. In this way, you could potentially get an Investiture user to become mistborn, then burn aluminum to destroy their Investiture reserves. Now that I think about it even further, if you were to alloy the Lerasium with aluminum to stay, you would grant only that power.

While this is still wildly expensive, I think it is potentially viable.

Not sure Kel is getting any Lerasium without Sazed’s very explicit consent.

[+Oltux72 he/him]

8 hours ago, anna said:

I was wondering this too. I wouldn't be surprised if this ends with Radiant somehow sacrificing herself to neutralize the anti-stormlight

It does behave like Stormlight in most other regards. As she has no gem heart, simply waiting a few minutes should solve the issue.

[RedBlue]

I enjoyed this infiltration mini-arc. It felt like a natural evolution of everything Shallan has learned so far, while still retaining her old bad habits of taking huge risks with little preparation and no safety net.

And I think it’s good that Shallan got a minor victory here. She isn’t a clueless young girl scrambling for more effective ways to pretend anymore, and hasn’t been for a while. She’s a fourth-level Lightweaver with an extra spren, a network of followers and her special Connection-based drawing ability. She’s a major player on this stage. She’s a credible threat to these Ghostbloods. It’s time for her to take control of the situation.

On that note, I like how the Ghostbloods’ facade is crumbling just as Shallan’s facade is becoming the truth. These Ghostbloods are not a big, powerful organisation like they’ve been claiming to be. They’re just a ragtag shady bunch with a vague connection to Thaidakar. They use violence, an air of mystery, and a few props to intimidate people and look important. In that way, they’re a mirror of Shallan — pretending, putting on a show, and blurring the line of where the performance becomes a reality.

[alder24]

13 hours ago, bmcclure7 said:

Disappointing yes, but it makes sense. If kel and his crew would have been caught in FE Then I doubt anyone but vin and kel would have stayed a fought and even that case they would’ve only fought long enough for the others to escape. Why should this be any different?

The difference is that Kel and his crew made every possible precaution to avoid being caught. They had Seekers, Smokers and Tineyes guarding their hideouts, two Mistborn, several Thugs with trained troops and one Feruchemist ready to defend their crew. In comparison Ghostboolds had some sand and a secret tunnel - that's it. Where is this "most powerful organization in Cosmere" Mraize was talking about? Not on Roshar apparently. Everything went way too smoothly for Shallan, so much so that it seemed like it was foreshadowing some twist, but there was nothing, Ghostbloods were just spectacularly incompetent. That's why it's dissapointing. 

 

13 hours ago, The Stick said:

I just thought of another way to potentially beat Radiants, although it would be insanely expensive. In addition, it actually probably would be a catch-all solution to all Invested people. If Kel was to make small amounts of Lerasium, then attach them to bullets or crossbow quarrels, he could have a very effective weapon. Now, this obviously sounds stupid, why allow your opponent a ginourmously expensive power boost. To answer this, I would propose that there is also a large amount of aluminum in this projectile. In this way, you could potentially get an Investiture user to become mistborn, then burn aluminum to destroy their Investiture reserves. Now that I think about it even further, if you were to alloy the Lerasium with aluminum to stay, you would grant only that power.

While this is still wildly expensive, I think it is potentially viable.

Why? Just why? Why not just burn Lerasium themselves to gain powers? That's just a bad idea - use primer cubes charged with aluminum instead. Cheeper, simpler, reliable and more effective. And during WaT Era 2 is still in the future. Kel has no Lerasium and probably won't have Lerasium even after TLM.

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

9 minutes ago, alder24 said:

The difference is that Kel and his crew made every possible precaution to avoid being caught. They had Seekers, Smokers and Tineyes guarding their hideouts, two Mistborn, several Thugs with trained troops and one Feruchemist ready to defend their crew. In comparison Ghostboolds had some sand and a secret tunnel - that's it. Where is this "most powerful organization in Cosmere" Mraize was talking about? Not on Roshar apparently. Everything went way too smoothly for Shallan, so much so that it seemed like it was foreshadowing some twist, but there was nothing, Ghostbloods were just spectacularly incompetent. That's why it's dissapointing. 

 Just had a thought, what if Mraize intentionally let all this happen. It does seem kind of sloppy and while Iyatil is panicked by the Radiants dropping in on a somewhat important meeting, Mraize is totally calm, almost like he's fine with this happening.

Plus Iyatil has brought up her worry about his loyalty to her and her own goals.

I think, that this fiasco was allowed to happen by Mraize in order to get Iyatil desperate enough to follow his lead and enable him to achieve his true goal, whatever that may be.

[alder24]

52 minutes ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

 Just had a thought, what if Mraize intentionally let all this happen. It does seem kind of sloppy and while Iyatil is panicked by the Radiants dropping in on a somewhat important meeting, Mraize is totally calm, almost like he's fine with this happening.

Plus Iyatil has brought up her worry about his loyalty to her and her own goals.

I think, that this fiasco was allowed to happen by Mraize in order to get Iyatil desperate enough to follow his lead and enable him to achieve his true goal, whatever that may be.

Maybe, but I wouldn't go this far. He was warning Iyatil about Shallan, that's true, but she dismissed it. He might have expected Shallan to try something like this and he was ever proud of her. However, that's not enough for me not to feel disappointed. Ghostbloods just failed to deliver what was promised and I don't see any reason to believe that someone planned all of this, Mraize included.

[CtrlAltDepressed]

1 hour ago, alder24 said:

Everything went way too smoothly for Shallan, so much so that it seemed like it was foreshadowing some twist, but there was nothing, Ghostbloods were just spectacularly incompetent. That's why it's dissapointing. 

I completely agree on this. 

 

I know Shallan has been increasing her spy skills for a couple of years now, but this was still a letdown. Mraize and Iyatil should have, if not a magical object from another world, at least the common sense to avoid this. Shallan is the biggest threat to the Ghostbloods on Roshar, and they dont have someone tailing her? They havent gotten to ANY of the Unseen Court? Really? I just find that a very stupid mistake to make for someone like Mraize. 

 

It seems like Brandon is seriously hindered by his effort to keep cross references as minimal as possible. While I respect the intention there, it seems obvious to me the plot of this book is suffering from it. They have at least 1 trophy case of objects from other worlds. Why would they not use them? Where is Mraizes' aviar? Having an aviar with seeker abilities would have been fantastic here. "Just like your bond with Pattern gives abilities, mine with *bird name* does the same" There are clearly malwish involved, where are the medallions? Where is the hemalurgy?

 

Mraize and Iyatil have been on Roshar a while and have a lot of resources. Where is their plate and blade? Why would they not have at least a dead blade?

 

I know we got a hint of hemalurgy happening in a previous book, but it wasnt really a plot point and hasnt come up since. I dont know. Im really intrigued by the interactions between these systems and so far Brandon is completely avoiding that. I know that going deep into Mistborn stuff would detract from the Stormlight only peoples experience, but I think Brandon could get around that. 

 

"by shoving this spike through their soul, i have stolen their *insert ability or attribute here*"

 

"I can store my strength in this ring for later"

 

"this medallion sucks out investiture like a larkin"

 

I dont know where exactly this could have been applied but I feel like there are a million ways that Mraize and Iyatil could have fought back, or seen this coming, and instead they just TP away. Sad. 

[listerfeend]

I really feel like we are completely overlooking what the entire subject of this chapter was. They are fallible humans, and all that comes along with it. They have vices, hubris, they can overlook things, completely miss them. 

6 minutes ago, CtrlAltDepressed said:

I dont know where exactly this could have been applied but I feel like there are a million ways that Mraize and Iyatil could have fought back, or seen this coming, and instead they just TP away. Sad. 

That is just it. Yes, they have all these magical things and what have you, but they still wouldn't stand a chance against 2 or three Radiants of 3rd Ideal. And it's entirely likely they knew that right behind Shallan would be the force of Windrunners and Stonewards that showed up. What would they have gained by staying and fighting? How, exactly, would they have detected Shallan after she took the place of one of their own? 
 

9 minutes ago, CtrlAltDepressed said:

Why would they not have at least a dead blade?

The spy organization should have essentially a kingdom? There are, what, a hundred or so known deadblades in the world? And they should have access to one of them? One of the things that is, typically, held by some of the most powerful people on the continent? How? Sure they could recruit someone with a Blade, maybe. Convince them to give that up? Never. And if a Blade had been used there, then they would know a member of the GB's they didn't know before, or, if that bearer had been able to take Shallan out, then, at the very least, they'd have a small pool of suspects to track down.

What did Shallan actually learn here? That Sja-Anat is working with the GB's, and they have a potential weapon to bring parity with GB's and Radiants. Maybe. 

I get that it feels a little like a let down, to see a cell of the GB's get infiltrated so easily, but, honestly, I think we are giving way too much credit to them.

[CtrlAltDepressed]

36 minutes ago, listerfeend said:

And it's entirely likely they knew that right behind Shallan would be the force of Windrunners and Stonewards that showed up. What would they have gained by staying and fighting? How, exactly, would they have detected Shallan after she took the place of one of their own? 

This is exactly it. They saw NONE of this coming. Shallan is by far the biggest threat to their organization and plans, and they just let her walk in. They are somehow able to spy on Hoid / Jasnah / Dalinar / Sibling and Navani while inside the tower but are unable to figure out that Shallan is coming for them. Really? Thats silly. 

 

The Ghostbloods have basically trapped themselves in this house....with no defenses. As a spy organization, I feel like you should have more precautions then simply setting some white sand at the doorway. 

 

40 minutes ago, listerfeend said:

And they should have access to one of them? One of the things that is, typically, held by some of the most powerful people on the continent? How?

Ghostbloods have infiltrated every aspect of Roshar. They had people whispering to Gavilar for years. Getting a dead blade is not THAT difficult, especially for a group that can surprise the holder with magic they have never seen before. (Felt trapping Kalak). They just need to kill a blade holder. Easy. 

 

They are allied with Sja-Anat. One of the most powerful entities on the planet. In addition, Sja-Anat has gifted them spren to bond. In all these years, getting an unmade to gift you surges is easier than a dead blade?

 

43 minutes ago, listerfeend said:

What did Shallan actually learn here? That Sja-Anat is working with the GB's, and they have a potential weapon to bring parity with GB's and Radiants. Maybe. 

She also learned that they are going to be present for Dalinars SR stuff, that they know where BAM is, that Felt is a spy, and that getting BAM is Iyatils plan, not Thaidakars. In addition she learned about the divide between Mraize and Iyatil, as well as several new members she was not aware existed. 

[Isilel]

3 hours ago, alder24 said:

Ghostbloods were just spectacularly incompetent. 

 

Yes, though to be fair, it kinda makes sense for the Rosharan leadership to have grown complacent, after they have been so far ahead of everyone else for so long. I can, maybe, forgive their security blunders, but them not breaking out off-world powers and weapons against Shallan makes zero sense.

Also, it didn't seem to me that Mraize had faithfully reported his last conversation with Shallan and her declaration of war to Iyatil, as well as the fact that her brothers had been spirited away. Otherwise her remark about Shallan scrambling to protect her family doesn't make any sense.

Honestly, I was much more disappointed by Kelsier's own incompetence on Scadrial. I mean, Ghostbloods' lack of discretion there provided impetus for formation of the Set! And then they just let them grow big and super powerful, allowed them to get control over the underworld(!) and also completely slept on them becoming an acute threat to their planet's very existence! The very planet that they have sworn to protect at all cost, but only endangered instead.

And, of course, only a couple of people were available to help in the pitch, with some fun off-world magics, but no medallions, allomantic grenades or spikes, which was an incomprehensible omission on Scadrial itself, no less! 

Also use of Seekers, Tineyes and Smokers to protect secret locations seems to have completely gone out of style in Era 2, which makes zero sense in-world, but was required for Our Heroes to be able to infiltrate places without relevant help. 

Sanderson clearly wanted every important character to stay in their "lane", which is why Wayne an Marasi weren't allowed to use weight medallions like they should have been - manipulating weight being Wax's speciality. And why the Ghostbloods didn't have access to other  medallions,  allomantic grenades (which have been designated as Marasi's specialty) or spikes. Or why they couldn't provide more people to help, etc. It all felt extremely contrived. 

And to some degree the same thing is happening here. The Ghostbloods really should have had a Tin Metalborn, natural or hemalurgic, among their ranks, it being one of the abilities most suited to ferreting out secrets. But if they had, Shallan wouldn't have been able to get in, so they didn't. 

I could imagine them having a Seeker, maybe, and being unaware of Lightweaving being very "quiet" and difficult to detect, as per events in Kholinar in OB? Which might explain them missing Shallan's crew surge-binding as it was observing the entrance and setting up? 

I dunno. So far, the Ghostbloods come across as dangerous blunderers who only make things worse for Scadrial and will become the reason for the future Cold War.

 

@CtrlAltDepressed:

 

2 of them do whip out deadblades? And they couldn't have arrived inconspicuously while wearing deadplate . It also takes time to put on, if there was any in the hideout. 

P.S. Thaidakar wanted Kalak specifically, presumably because of BAM too. As seen in the prologue. Felt also had his instructions re: finding out her whereabouts and sharing this information with Iyatil directly from him. Kelsier just may have something else for her in mind than Iyatil.

 

Edited November 5, 2024 by Isilel

[Wanguu He/Him]

One thing that confounds me is how they have anti-investiture already - It was discovered what, three days ago? and it needs a super-complicated vacuum tube. I don't know how you source that in a few days. The only thing that makes it easier is that you don't need to sing any tones to manufacture the anti-light, just the plate.

Either way, I think the point of this Ghostbloods arc is to show what they really are - a powerful group, sure - but a group of individuals who all have their own ideas and plans for the future of the organization. Felt, Iyatil, and Mraize have different plans. They're not the Diagram with one central plan. I think that Day Three onward will have Shallan going to find Ba-Ado-Mishram, with Mraize coming after her, and that the Mraize plotline will end this book. I think Iyatil will stick around for the second half, but not Mraize, considering that Shallan has foiled his plans for the most part.