CtrlAltDepressed

Done, my bad! You are incredible. Thank you

I didnt mention this but I believe Odium is Invested in Roshar at this point (i think there is a wob). Even if he is released he can't just leave without injuring himself. Rayse knew this and thats why he was talking about the war of the gods. Instead of going around as a free shard to shatter the others, he will be more of a general presiding over his galactic army. Once the army has conquered the physical location, they will bring Odium with them spiritually, growing his influence without him ever needing to 'leave' Roshar.

Not disagreeing at all, just want to point out that Rayse is lying here. Yes, he wants to get out of the Rosharan system - but not before killing Cultivation and the remaining splinters of Honor (the stormfather for example). Dalinar asks Rayse what he will do if released and he responds that his transformation of the realm (Roshar) will be substantial. One of the restrictions that Honor placed on Odium is that the shard is not able to directly interact with as many people as Rayse would like MB era 1 spoilers: If Odium was not restricted by Honor he would almost certainly smite a lot of people. He also mentions to Dalinar that there is a 'war of the gods' coming and he needs soldiers - hence the myth of the Tranquiline Halls. He is not simply looking to leave Roshar. Honor is the only reason that 10% survived each time. Odium is there to wipe out their Gods and enslave the people for a cosmere wide war of the gods.

Have you read the SA5 sample chapters?

He also has his live spren blade, doesnt necessarily have to be his Honorblade. Im sure there is a description that will confirm either way, but off the top of my head I am not sure.

I believe Nale only got his after his chat with Gavilar.

I thought this was confirmed?

Agreed. A fullborn is the most OP individual in the cosmere. In a one on one / hand to hand situation, the fullborn wins every time in my opinion. However, Alder has a good point. Stormlight Spoilers:

The blessings so far seem to match up pretty well, though i suppose this is possible. They could also make a memory fabrial for the heralds. Hoid is only using breaths because the nature of breath fits his need, I imagine storing memories to prevent / help insanity would also be possible. Agreed this is not going to be the fix, but would be the way to mitigate symptoms moving forward once the bulk of their madness is dealt with. I do wonder how Brandon is going to fix them. It would be pretty hard to have Taln as a main POV character with his current level of insanity.

Hello everyone. While browsing the coppermind, I noticed on the copper page, that type of blessing provides Kandra with resistance to madness. This got me thinking, shouldn't there be a way for Navani to create an anti-madness fabrial using copper and intelligencespren or mindspren or something similar? We have seen that the metals effect in fabrials coincides with their Metallic arts effects. Thoughts?

While I agree that she is, I don't agree that this would have any effect. Shallan has been effected because all of these aspects of Roshar are interested in her because her mom is a herald (skybreakers, two spren, potentially an unmade) but I dont think she intrinsically gained / lost anything from a herald mom. Like she was biologically a normal Rosharan human at birth.

Some relevant wobs on the matter attached. They don't shed too much light but I found them interesting. Personally I think Hoid is collecting all of the magic systems as a way of Connecting himself to all the shards (or as many as he can), and once he has done that he will move on to phase 2. What that phase is I can only guess but in my head he is either going to use his Connection to try and reform all of the shads (who knows if that is the same as Adonalsium) for himself and / or use his Connection to them to splinter the shards and 'complete' the shattering of Adonalsium.

Towerlight / Warlight are not full combinations, they are Harmony-like combinations. I think that points more towards needing a dawnshard to actually fully merge the different intents. The rhythm of a shard should be independent of the vessel. I dont know if we have confirmation either way but it doesnt make sense to me that a pure tone could be changed. Thats the rhythm of that investiture, not much for a vessel to interpret imo.

Ok this is a crazy theory, bear with me. Since the spiritual realm is time and space all compounded at once, and we have seen that Shallan is both being pointed to find BAM as well as drawing better potential versions of people, is it possible that the version of BAM that is extracted is not the one that was put in? Isnt it possible that Shallan is able to bring a previous version of BAM from the spiritual realm, like i dont know, before she was unmade? This is crazy I know and Im sure @alder24 will gracefully destroy it but it was an interesting thought.

With the addition of this wob: Questioner With the incredible ability Bondsmiths have to reassemble things, would they theoretically be able to reassemble Adonalsium himself out of the Shards if they were detached from their hosts? Brandon Sanderson This is kind of a chicken-and-the-egg question. Would they be able to reassemble Adonalsium? Can you use Adonalsium's own power to reassemble Adonalsium? Can someone externally do it? I'm gonna give you a RAFO on that right now, but I'm gonna warn you this idea of using something to reassemble itself is more tricky than you might assume, all right? C2E2 2024 (April 26, 2024) I would dare to say this isn't entirely Sazed's fault. I think this wob is implying that in the same way you need an external power to split the intents of a shard, you also need an external power to combine intents. That external power of course being the dawnshards. I think Brandon is slightly telling us here that it isn't as simple as combining them in the right way (surprise surprise). Also, i created a very similar thread if you would like to check out the replies. NOTE: FULL COSMERE SPOILERS IN THIS THREAD https://www.17thshard.com/forums/topic/194162-tones-and-harmony/

On the contrary, she seems to have locked down Taldain because they were too advanced and would soon be expanding to other systems. This is why Khriss is unable to go home.

I would say Whimsy is the opposite of Honor if it has an opposite.

Could this be Shardic interference? I'd be willing to bet that Cultivation had something to do with this. I think the perfect gemstone is what would have immediately caused the wide-reaching effects, and being in the SR is why no one has found / released her in all this time. They are not the same but the Thrill stopped effecting the Alethi soldiers as it was put into the gemstone, not when it was shipped far away. How would she not know? She should remember when Odium first arrived on Roshar - fighting with the humans against the singers. I think this hatred of humans is specifically stemming from her Connection to all the singers of the past. Since she is 'too little' she lost a large part of her original Identity by bonding so many people. Personally I think that both Sja-anat and BAM will be thrilled with their new vessel. They are both Odius creatures at heart - their issues were with Rayse. Tarvanagian is seeming like a much more capable Odium. I bet you that Shallan draws BAM from her imprisonment in a very similar way to her drawing Pattern into reality in WOK. It will likely need to be a drawing on a scale we haven't seen before (in terms of grandeur). I think this is probably part of the reason, but both of Shallans are cryptics. She hasn't gained access to more than 2 surges with her bonds. I bet it has something to do with not warping the soul too much. Having a full on nahel bond is a lot of change to a soul, I imagine having 2 high level bonds could have some weird effects (see Shallan able to draw upon Fortune when she draws).

Dang these are all really good! I especially like Pity, Insanity, and Control. Fantastic.

This is much closer to what I meant, thank you. Always another WOB, indeed. I didn't know this either. ROW Spoilers

I don't think it is the bond specifically. I think it has to do with their Connection to the SR in some way. My evidence for this is that we see that Lift (ofc its Lift) is able to 'break' through Nale's insanity for a long time considering she is just speaking with him and not furthering her bond. This is when he is trying to kill her for being Radiant and she asks him if he feels anything any more. I think if we see any of the Heralds 'cured' it will be due to either Dalinar using his bondsmithing powers to Connect them to who they used to be / their spiritual self, or BAM's return.

The name is not canon, but the combination of Honor + Cultivation creates Towerlight, and this shard would be the Towerlight equivalent shard. Science was chosen as the name due to the fact that the Sibling herself is a bunch of fabrials and her association with Navani was very academic. I would like to point out that the Warlight and Towerlight combinations that we have seen would not actually be the investitures of those combined shards. Those lights exist as two separate tones, instead of one pure tone as a shard would have. Since these shards are not in direct opposition like Harmony's, I think we should expect an actual combination of the shards in this instance and not another Harmony 2-in-1 situation. To respond to the post, im going to attempt to find something that works for the grey boxes. Virtuosity + Dominion = Expertise Virtuosity + Autonomy = Individuality Honor + Virtuosity = Competition Honor + Whimsy = Neutrality Preservation + Cultivation = Progress Mercy + Odium = Apathy Mercy + Ruin = Execution Whimsy + Devotion = Mischief Trying to come up with more.....these are hard

I don't see how this prevents them from trying it. Their goal from Autonomy was to demonstrate their power in such a way to convince her that Scadrians can take care of themselves. If that is the goal, why wouldn't they try everything? Most of my issue is on the Brandon side of things. I think the story works and I like the story, I don't think its current state needed someone burning Trellium to be a good story or anything like that. But Im just confused / slightly frustrated that Brandon made that retcon for Atium specifically because he wanted god metals to be burnable by anyone, includes another god metal in the burning metals books, and doesnt even mention someone trying to burn it. I would be totally ok with a single line from a Set scientist 'We tried burning it and it did nothing' (that they can tell) or 'We tried burning it and the guy exploded' but we dont get any mention of even people being interested in exploring the other metallic art implementations of Trellium. Even if they don't know about Lerasium and Atium, this is the burning metals planet. Even unaware Scadrians will know that a metal like steel has (at least) three magical uses. Why, when given a metal they KNOW is from a shard, would they only experiment with Hemalurgy? The Words of Founding go into a lot of depth with Feruchemy, and the only written 'instructions' for Hemalurgy are from Spook, which the Set did not have. It seems like a plot hole to me that they would exclusively try experiments with the least known of the metallic arts when given a new metal. Why make all the god metals burnable if the series that could have used it / mentioned it, doesnt bring it up at all? Why is this a mechanic at all? Does Brandon have one specific scene in mind that he wants to write that involves burning a not Pres/Ruin god metal so hes made this mechanic? It just doesnt make sense to me that he would do the retcon AND make trellium an integral part of the story and not mention 2/3 metallic arts.

Hi All. This is an issue Ive had in the back of my mind since I read era 2 and I'm hoping you all can reason me through it. We see in Era 2 that spikes made from Trellium are able to shield Kandra from Harmony's sight. This is a huge revelation that leaves the Kandra and Set investigating further into the Metallic Arts as clearly there are things they haven't figured out (what secrets of Rashek will we never know?). My issue is this - why, in all of these scientific experiments did no one try burning Trellium or using it as a metalmind? The Set would know the history of Lerasium and Atium and were given Trellium by Autonomy. It seems like a plot hole that they would only use this new metal in one of their three Metallic arts. If it has no function in the other two, why not mention that quickly either in text or ars arcanum or in person? There were no mistborn, did they just not try because of this? The Atium retcon was put in because God Metals should be burnable by anyone. This seems like a plot hole to me. Sorry if this has been discussed before.