Mistborn Tools

[Trusk'our he/him]

Figured I'd start a thread for furthering input; since there is going to be a Mistborn as an antagonist come era 3, what kinds of tools would help them perform the traditional processes of a Mistborn assassin/sneak/warrior?

1. Cloth-covered coins: we see Vin use this a little in HoA, where having a little cloth covering you coins used for Steeljumping gives you greater stealth.

2. Aluminum daggers: since this is going to be a lot more common come era 3, it would prove quite useful for a Mistborn to have some upgrades to their hand-to-hand weaponry. Maybe their would even be an alloy of aluminum to make it sturdier. You could also coat the blade(s) in a dark substance to keep it from being shiny in the dark.

3. Aluminum vials/pouches: this would keep your metals safe from being Pushed or Pulled on, so no need to worry about losing them in combat. 

4. Fingerless aluminum-lined gloves: now, I see a lot of potential for these; you can handle Bendalloy nuggets in your palm to ingest while keeping them safe from Allomancy, you can add aluminum covered steel knuckles for more punching force, when punching a Leecher they won't be able to Leech you, and with the finger tips exposed you have more dexterity and can Leech your own targets. 

5. Ball-bearing cannon box; not really something they're going to use to often as it's big and clunky, but imagine a box with 100-300 steel ball-bearings held in place by a thin cloth. Then put the box on its side and attach it to a crossbow handle.

Basically, this allows the Mistborn to use a duralumin/pewter/Steelpush to make a massively destructive grapeshot when in battle.

6. Allomantic body piercings; another source of Allomantic reserves that my be more tolerant to being Leeched or may be usable for longer periods of time. Plus, they can just be kept in the body without the need to ingest them if the Mistborn were to be attacked unexpectedly. They could also be used in an emergency as a Pushable weapon or item to break their fall if they lose their coin pouch and have no other metal.

What else do you guys think would be a good tool for Mistborn?

Edited March 28 by Trusk'our

[Radium he/him]

3 hours ago, Trusk'our said:

3. Aluminum vials/pouches: this would keep your metals safe from being Pushed or Pulled on, so no need to worry about losing them in combat. 

I've often thought about this, it would make sense come more modern times for allomancers to have such utilities. 

[Block he/him]

Allomantic Stick: This would be a very sturdy short metal pole that has some sort of claw mechanism on the end. A Mistborn, or really anyone who can pull/push on metal, would stab this inside of a building and then activate the claw mechanism. It would keep the pole locked in the building and then the Mistborn could have a place to pull themselves to. This could be useful if you were going to fight someone in an area that you know about beforehand. You could put some of these in the area and be better prepared. They would also work in the ground to be similar to the Allomantic highways in era 1.

[strmblsd he/him]

17 minutes ago, Block said:

Allomantic Stick: This would be a very sturdy short metal pole that has some sort of claw mechanism on the end. A Mistborn, or really anyone who can pull/push on metal, would stab this inside of a building and then activate the claw mechanism. It would keep the pole locked in the building and then the Mistborn could have a place to pull themselves to. This could be useful if you were going to fight someone in an area that you know about beforehand. You could put some of these in the area and be better prepared. They would also work in the ground to be similar to the Allomantic highways in era 1.

this is a great idea an add on to it could just be a small spike that could just be pushed to jam it into the side of something to sorta make a permanant pushable spot there

[Trusk'our he/him]

Just now, strmblsd said:

this is a great idea an add on to it could just be a small spike that could just be pushed to jam it into the side of something to sorta make a permanant pushable spot there

20 minutes ago, Block said:

Allomantic Stick: This would be a very sturdy short metal pole that has some sort of claw mechanism on the end. A Mistborn, or really anyone who can pull/push on metal, would stab this inside of a building and then activate the claw mechanism. It would keep the pole locked in the building and then the Mistborn could have a place to pull themselves to. This could be useful if you were going to fight someone in an area that you know about beforehand. You could put some of these in the area and be better prepared. They would also work in the ground to be similar to the Allomantic highways in era 1.

So climbing pitons, essentially. Or, perhaps Allomantic pitons would be a better name.

Seems like a pretty good idea to me. That way you get more control over your Pushing/Pulling power. 

[Quantus he/him]

Aluminum-lined hat to be immune to most levels of emotional allomancy.  

Aluminum dust/foil grenades to act as Investiture Chaff.

Aluminum-lined Mistcloaks.

 

[therunner he/him]

Bullet proof vest, or aluminum bullets are going to end them rather fast.

Aluminum lined vials so that they can hide the fact they are mistborn from Coinshots/Lurchers.

[Trusk'our he/him]

1 hour ago, Quantus said:

Aluminum-lined Mistcloaks.

A little aluminum is strategically placed is good, but wouldn't a cloak prevent their use of Iron/Steel and Emotional Allomancy?

6 minutes ago, therunner said:

Bullet proof vest, or aluminum bullets are going to end them rather fast.

Definitely true; some lightweight armor would be extremely useful. 

1 hour ago, Quantus said:

Aluminum dust/foil grenades to act as Investiture Chaff.

Ooooh, interesting. I wonder if an aluminum cloud would block Steelpushing or Ironpulling as well as Seeking, as it has some field like effects.

[Quantus he/him]

9 minutes ago, Trusk'our said:

A little aluminum is strategically placed is good, but wouldn't a cloak prevent their use of Iron/Steel and Emotional Allomancy?

 

I figured the hood could be lowered to use emotional allomancy or seeking, but raised at need for protection.  Steelpushing generally comes from the core so if the front of the cloak is open and doesnt disrupt the metalsight lines it should be viable, if something you'd probably need to train with specifically to move in without hindering yourself.  

[Block he/him]

1 minute ago, Quantus said:

I figured the hood could be lowered to use emotional allomancy or seeking, but raised at need for protection.  Steelpushing generally comes from the core so if the front of the cloak is open and doesnt disrupt the metalsight lines it should be viable, if something you'd probably need to train with specifically to move in without hindering yourself.  

You might have to be pushing or pulling on something in front of you for it to work though, because if you were pushing or pulling on something behind you the cloak would block it. That might not be worth wearing the cloak if you can only pull and push from one direction.

[Trusk'our he/him]

8 minutes ago, Quantus said:

I figured the hood could be lowered to use emotional allomancy or seeking, but raised at need for protection.  Steelpushing generally comes from the core so if the front of the cloak is open and doesnt disrupt the metalsight lines it should be viable, if something you'd probably need to train with specifically to move in without hindering yourself.  

Ah, I see now.

That would work much better than what I thought you meant. I thought you were saying to line the body and tassels of the cloak.

[Quantus he/him]

4 minutes ago, Block said:

You might have to be pushing or pulling on something in front of you for it to work though, because if you were pushing or pulling on something behind you the cloak would block it. That might not be worth wearing the cloak if you can only pull and push from one direction.

 

1 minute ago, Trusk'our said:

Ah, I see now.

That would work much better than what I thought you meant. I thought you were saying to line the body and tassels of the cloak.

I am also saying to line the back and/or tassels at an extreme of the design/idea, to shield yourself from a swath of non-cognitive abilities, (speed bubbles, leeching, duralumin backed pushes, etc) from your blindspots.  I do think it would take a lots of training to make it more helpful than hindrance, and the difficulty could easily be on par with those whip-swords that tend to dismember amateurs.  And also just a solid dose good old fashioned pulp/superhero acrobatics.  

[Trusk'our he/him]

34 minutes ago, Quantus said:

I am also saying to line the back and/or tassels at an extreme of the design/idea, to shield yourself from a swath of non-cognitive abilities, (speed bubbles, leeching, duralumin backed pushes, etc) from your blindspots.  I do think it would take a lots of training to make it more helpful than hindrance, and the difficulty could easily be on par with those whip-swords that tend to dismember amateurs.  And also just a solid dose good old fashioned pulp/superhero acrobatics.  

I think in an ideal situation it would be very, very difficult to train your Mistborn enough to make it more pro than con, but it could probably keep you safe from Allomancy and Leeching grenades.

[+hwiles]

My intuition would be that any special hardware that a mistborn serial killer (if that story still happens) would carry would probably be dedicated to leveraging the utility of having multiple powers. The ideas discussed here so far are fun and interesting, but they primarily would work just as well for a misting as a mistborn, which means that they could be used reciprocally, and...in my opinion, that would be the opposite of how a serial killer would choose to operate. They would WANT to be as exotic and difficult to emulate and counter as possible I'd suspect.

Like...Imagine a safe cracker flaring tin while using a stethoscope to crack a lock in a bank vault that continuously plays loud elevator music to induce sensory overload in tineyes, and their only being able to do it because they're also flaring Pewter.

Imagine freezing time in a narrow ring around oneself in close quarters combat by using bendalloy and cadmium bubbles simultaneously and then slowly and methodically lining up point blank shots on your targets while any incoming shots taken are range are hopelessly deflected!

How about using electrum and duralumin in a casino to figure out which table or machine you should use to win a jackpot!!!

Regardless of the fine details though, I think we can all agree than any smart mistborn serial killer will wear an aluminum foil hat because they aren't crazy. 

[Isilel]

A Mistborn can just burn copper to protect themselves from emotional allomancy, so would aluminium-lined headgear even be needed? 

I am also unsure that it makes sense for there to be casinos on Scadrial, given massive difficulty of preventing cheating. 

But as an aside, I really hope that hats never go out of fashion on Scadrial, because of emotional allomancy. I really like them as wardrobe accessory.

[Pineap-spider he/him]

50 minutes ago, Isilel said:

A Mistborn can just burn copper to protect themselves from emotional allomancy, so would aluminium-lined headgear even be needed?

Vin could still be manipulated by Breeze, A skilled undercover soother/rioter would totally be able to effect a mistborn, and you can't just constantly keep up a copper cloud, you'd run out of metal, no matter how slow it burns. I think an aluminum hat is just a good safety precaution.

 

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

I'm guessing we're sticking to mundane stuff only? No Unsealed Metalminds or Allomantic Grenades? If so then fair enough. Makes it more fun that way.

I think that a gun that relies solely on Allomancy to work is possible. What better silencer than a gun that doesn't use gunpowder? Granted they could just push a bullet themselves and not carry a deadly looking weapon, but a gun to point with might make it easier to aim. Line the outside with a little bit of aluminum and presto, a truly silent gun.

[Trusk'our he/him]

1 hour ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

I'm guessing we're sticking to mundane stuff only? No Unsealed Metalminds or Allomantic Grenades? If so then fair enough. Makes it more fun that way.

Yeah, that would be best, as those are pretty obvious answers, which requires little to no creativity. 

1 hour ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

I think that a gun that relies solely on Allomancy to work is possible. What better silencer than a gun that doesn't use gunpowder? Granted they could just push a bullet themselves and not carry a deadly looking weapon, but a gun to point with might make it easier to aim. Line the outside with a little bit of aluminum and presto, a truly silent gun.

Could prove quite useful, as you get better aim with far less sound.

3 hours ago, Pineap-spider said:

Vin could still be manipulated by Breeze, A skilled undercover soother/rioter would totally be able to effect a mistborn, and you can't just constantly keep up a copper cloud, you'd run out of metal, no matter how slow it burns. I think an aluminum hat is just a good safety precaution.

He did Soothe her on occasion, but I'm pretty sure that was early on before she learned to keep her Coppercloud up all the time.

Copperclouds do more than just protect you from Emotional Allomancy though, they also smother your Allomantic Pulses so it's far harder to Seek you. As such, it would be pretty foolish of a Mistborn to ever stop Burning copper when on a mission, and since it Burns so slowly I think having enough is going to be more or less a non-issue. 

[Longshot97 he/him]

5 hours ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

I'm guessing we're sticking to mundane stuff only? No Unsealed Metalminds or Allomantic Grenades? If so then fair enough. Makes it more fun that way.

I think that a gun that relies solely on Allomancy to work is possible. What better silencer than a gun that doesn't use gunpowder? Granted they could just push a bullet themselves and not carry a deadly looking weapon, but a gun to point with might make it easier to aim. Line the outside with a little bit of aluminum and presto, a truly silent gun.

I feel the need to point out that you would have less power. This isn't a huge thing, but it would prevent Mistborn from pulling a Wax and drilling bullets through walls and wood plans. Though, in hindsight, duralumin could serve.

I wonder if a person could construct an aluminum-lined gauntlet to have bullet-like ammunition to be ejected from the wrist. More convenient, less conspicuous, and easier (theoretically) to aim.

Though, the most intuitive aiming system would likely involve ammunition from the chest, like Wax's steel bullet trick.

3 hours ago, Trusk'our said:

Copperclouds do more than just protect you from Emotional Allomancy though, they also smother your Allomantic Pulses so it's far harder to Seek you. As such, it would be pretty foolish of a Mistborn to ever stop Burning copper when on a mission, and since it Burns so slowly I think having enough is going to be more or less a non-issue. 

This probably comes down to a matter of personal preference. Remember that debate Marsh and Vin had, on the merits of constantly Smoking (heh) versus Seeking?

Say...would an aluminum hat prevent Seekers from hearing Allomantic pulses?

[+hwiles]

8 hours ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

I'm guessing we're sticking to mundane stuff only? No Unsealed Metalminds or Allomantic Grenades? If so then fair enough. Makes it more fun that way.

...

I'm strongly inclined to agree; I'm thinking that northern scadrial is where we'll see the next mistborn if one ever pops up and, if they go rogue, they would probably not have access to hacked metalminds, medallions, or hemalurgic spikes that they don't make for themselves (think unabomber vibes...)

On that note, a person with iron, steel, tin, and Pewter would be ridiculously maneuverable in an urban environment at night. If they were also predisposed to flinging dynamite and cackling like a madman, they would be like if superman and the joker were polymerized together.

An aluminum garrote would be an obvious weapon of choice for a stealthy serial mistborn, and couldn't be used against them very effectively if the tables turned.

Their access to emotional allomancy will make them charming, but they'll probably be solitary by necessity; It's a small detail, but I would infer that they'll probably need to maintain a fake identity and be able to have some rudimentary access to disguising themself quickly (probably not to the extent Wayne does, but at least enough to keep different groups from sharing information on them effectively).

This should be going down 80's style, so Kevlar and/or lightweight body armor  should be available.

I wonder what they'll spend the hours on when they're not hunting people though...

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

3 hours ago, Longshot97 said:

Say...would an aluminum hat prevent Seekers from hearing Allomantic pulses?

That actually brings up an interesting phenomenon. If a Mistborn were to wear too much aluminum it'd mess with their powers. In fact they wouldn't be able to use any Speed-Bubbles since they'd pop just from aluminum being in them, and I'd say those are pretty crucial abilities for a modern day Mistborn. With Bendalloy they can activate a speed-bubble to instantly refill their other metals, they could even go for a rapid-fire Duralumin Burst. Combining it with Cadmium can grant them a decent shield and crowd control options. But too much aluminum would make them impossible to use.

Wearing aluminum on their chest would interfere with most powers that originate from there, such as iron, steel, bronze, copper, brass and zinc. So too much aluminum can interfere with a full half of their abilities at the very least.

A proper Mistborn assassin would need to know when to wear their aluminum, and how much to wear. I could see them stealing full metalminds to use as a less disruptive alternative, they wouldn't be Unkeyed so he couldn't Burn them and it'd get attention but hey it's an idea.

[Returned]

I've been trying to think of cool ideas, but my best ones have come out half-baked so far! Hopefully I'll come up with better ones than these two, but here are mine for the moment:

1. A reversible cloak with a metallic element on both sides, sort of like an emergency blanket. On the one side, a thin metallic lining (or bits of metallic thread, like embroidery or stitching) and on the other side aluminum thin enough to still be flexible. The edges of the cloak are weighted and stitched into the non-aluminum side in key places, and the whole cloak can be folded up with either side facing outwards. But as long as the non-aluminum side is facing the Mistborn they can push and pull on those edges to move the cloak in interesting ways, snapping it, spinning it, etc.

But the idea is that the Mistborn can unfurl it quickly, push it forward like a net to trap others, flip it around and cover themselves. Tactics would develop quickly to counter, but a net that blocks Allomancy as it approaches could be a handy tool. And a large-ish piece of fabric that could alternately be Allomantically manipulated or provide a barrier against same could be a pretty versatile item.

2. A metal box with multiple heavy springs inside, compressed by metal plates and held by metal latches. The box itself is reasonably heavy, but the springs can contain a solid amount of energy when compressed. The Mistborn uses Allomancy to release the appropriate latches and then the spring extends, pushing its metal plate forcefully outwards. The Mistborn can Push or Pull against that motion while the spring is extending and gets the effect of working against greater weight than the box or plates actually offer, even if the box itself is in midair. A bit bulky, and troublesome to reset, so not an ideal tool and maybe a bit disposable (of necessity). But I like the idea of carefully engineering of the springs and weighted plates to allow for emergency maneuvering or extra force at any time.

[Treamayne]

9 hours ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

I think that a gun that relies solely on Allomancy to work is possible. What better silencer than a gun that doesn't use gunpowder? Granted they could just push a bullet themselves and not carry a deadly looking weapon, but a gun to point with might make it easier to aim. Line the outside with a little bit of aluminum and presto, a truly silent gun.

4 hours ago, Longshot97 said:

I feel the need to point out that you would have less power. This isn't a huge thing, but it would prevent Mistborn from pulling a Wax and drilling bullets through walls and wood plans. Though, in hindsight, duralumin could serve.

I wonder if a person could construct an aluminum-lined gauntlet to have bullet-like ammunition to be ejected from the wrist. More convenient, less conspicuous, and easier (theoretically) to aim.

I don't think anything with the hand or wrist would be able to be aimed - steelpushes originate from center-mass. Wax's trick works because the gunpowder fires first, then he pushes after the bullet is in front of him (and his CoM). If you tried a powder-less firing from your wrist, you would throw your whole arm away from your centerline (left or right, as appropriate) as the bullet pushed against the outside of your device trying to leave the barrel. 

That said (White Sand Spoilers)

Spoiler

A zinkall is what you seem to be describing, but they are pneumatic. . . 

 

[alder24]

20 hours ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

I think that a gun that relies solely on Allomancy to work is possible. What better silencer than a gun that doesn't use gunpowder? Granted they could just push a bullet themselves and not carry a deadly looking weapon, but a gun to point with might make it easier to aim. Line the outside with a little bit of aluminum and presto, a truly silent gun.

A better idea - buttons. They are already using buttons, but this time make them covered in an aluminum layer in front, while their back is a normal metal. Because the metal back is from your side you can push them, while from the front they would be undetectable to steelsight because of the aluminum layer. A gun that relies only on steelpushes won't have much power, so instead of having a tool that you have to aim, thus alarming all your opponents that you're gonna shoot, just position yourself to face your enemy and push buttons - they won't see it coming, they won't see them with steelsight, they might not ever see them coming at night or in Mists.  Silent and invisible weapon - but can be only used against non-armored opponents as it won't have much penetration - bullets are faster than a steelpush, a real gun is still a must have.

18 hours ago, Trusk'our said:

Copperclouds do more than just protect you from Emotional Allomancy though, they also smother your Allomantic Pulses so it's far harder to Seek you. As such, it would be pretty foolish of a Mistborn to ever stop Burning copper when on a mission, and since it Burns so slowly I think having enough is going to be more or less a non-issue. 

The problem with Copperclouds is that you can't use A-bronze while burning copper, as it silences all pulses coming from the outside. Therefore an aluminum hat is still useful - you can burn bronze to hear what's going on around you, while being protected from emotional Allomancy. If you're skilled enough you can listen to emotional pulses a Soother or a Rioter sends and detect which emotion they are trying to influence, thus gain knowledge and act accordingly. TFE ch 21:

Quote

“There are great advantages to burning bronze, rather than just running around with your copper on. True, you Smoke yourself by using copper—but in a way you also blind yourself. Copper makes you immune to having your emotions Pushed or Pulled.”
“But that’s a good thing.” Marsh cocked his head slightly.
“Oh? And what would be the greater advantage? Being immune to—but ignorant of—some Soother’s attentions? Or instead knowing—from your bronze—exactly which emotions he is trying to suppress?”
Vin paused. “You can see something that specific?”
Marsh nodded. “With care and practice, you can recognize very minute changes in your opponents’ Allomantic burnings. You can identify precisely which parts of a person’s emotions a Soother or Rioter intends to influence. You’ll also be able to tell when someone is flaring their metal. If you grow very skilled, you might even be able to tell when they’re running low on metals.”

@Longshot97 has already mentioned this, but because I write a response first then read the next post, I wrote the same thing. But hey, I provided a quote!

11 hours ago, Returned said:

2. A metal box with multiple heavy springs inside, compressed by metal plates and held by metal latches. The box itself is reasonably heavy, but the springs can contain a solid amount of energy when compressed.

Springs you said? How about an Allomantic gun that uses a spring instead of gunpowder, like @JustQuestin2004 wanted earlier? Instead of pushing on a bullet itself, you pull spring to lock it and give it energy, then release a trigger and the spring pushes a bullet out while you push on it as well to give it more energy. It's not perfect, it would be better than normal steelpush, but you would need a larger spring, thus it would make noise. 

[Returned]

5 hours ago, alder24 said:

Springs you said? How about an Allomantic gun that uses a spring instead of gunpowder, like @JustQuestin2004 wanted earlier? Instead of pushing on a bullet itself, you pull spring to lock it and give it energy, then release a trigger and the spring pushes a bullet out while you push on it as well to give it more energy. It's not perfect, it would be better than normal steelpush, but you would need a larger spring, thus it would make noise. 

It's definitely a cool idea, and I think you could muffle the chamber with the spring to keep the noise down. My idea with the springs was to allow the kinetic energy of one being released and moving a metal plate to give more force to Push or Pull against, allowing things like on-demand Allomantic mobility even when anchors are unavailable, without needing to haul something heavier than your own body. The spring gun is definitely a less awkward and more generally usable idea though!