Isles of the Emberdark Reading Discussion

[AquaRegia he/him]

17 hours ago, Bluepanther512 said:

Are there any physical descriptions of Starling besides her pink eyes and albino skin that I missed?

 

Edit: And her silver manacles

1st page:  "tizzy of white hair".

[Nesh he/him]

7 hours ago, Arkangel said:

Not necessarily. Shards play the long game. I fully expect the Autonomy conflict to extend into Era 4.

The fact that there's an Autonomy Avatar on First of the Sun, is probably at least part of the Scadrian interest in the planet, and then the Rosharans are interested because the Scadrians are.

Edited March 24, 2024 by Nesh
Posting glitch

[Arkangel]

2 hours ago, Nesh said:

The fact that there's an Autonomy Avatar on First of the Sun, is probably at least part of the Scadrian interest in the planet, and then the Rosharans are interested because the Scadrians are.

From the reading:

Quote

“We are accustomed to impatient masters.” Vathi’s voice was smooth and confident. “We have survived their tests for millennia.”

The male laughed. “Your masters, the gods who are islands?”

This makes it sound like the Scadrians are skeptical of the local religion, clearly finding it laughable. They may not know that Patji is a Shard (or part of one in this case). You'd think, at this point, they'd take more stock in religion as they've had a few based around real magical entities.

[Nesh he/him]

14 minutes ago, Arkangel said:

From the reading:

This makes it sound like the Scadrians are skeptical of the local religion, clearly finding it laughable. They may not know that Patji is a Shard (or part of one in this case). You'd think, at this point, they'd take more stock in religion as they've had a few based around real magical entities.

To be fair to the Scadrians, all their gods have been human at one point.  They don't really have the context to believe in an island god, well, outside of the Ghostbloods anyway.  Granted, that's based on their Era 2 knowledge, so I could be completely wrong.

[Rorzikel]

Or they might know and consider them/Patji too weak to be compared to "true" gods of full Shardic strength. Lots of invested entities are called gods, from spren by the Horneaters to the Returned on Nalthis, but most of them can't change the orbits of planets or create sapient life.

Edited March 24, 2024 by Rorzikel

[Dofurion]

3 minutes ago, Rorzikel said:

Or they might know and consider them/Patji too weak to be compared to "true" gods of full Shardic strength. Lots of invested entities are called gods, from spren by Horneaters to Returned, but most of them can't change the orbits of planets or create sapient life.

There is also the possibility that Patji has never finished forming, that is, that no one has yet ascended to be the avatar as such

[alder24]

1 hour ago, Arkangel said:

From the reading:

This makes it sound like the Scadrians are skeptical of the local religion, clearly finding it laughable. They may not know that Patji is a Shard (or part of one in this case). You'd think, at this point, they'd take more stock in religion as they've had a few based around real magical entities.

What if they no longer consider Avatars and Shards as gods anymore, or they have their ways of dealing with them and opposing them? Patji even as an Avatar might not be a challenge to them in the future (Anti-Investiture might kill him up for example).

 

50 minutes ago, Dofurion said:

There is also the possibility that Patji has never finished forming, that is, that no one has yet ascended to be the avatar as such

No, he was the one who responded to Hoid's 2nd letter from OB. Patji has been a fully formed Avatar for a while now.

[Isilel]

Intriguing to say the least. I wonder why dragons have human priests and what they can do in answer to prayers. Are they half-fain, given that they have 4 limbs in human form and 6 in dragon? Some kind of mediators between fain and not-fain?

I am all there for the Firefly and  exploration vibes! And finally seeing Silverlight. I had really hoped for an exploration narrative in "The Lost Metal" back before it came out...

It is nice that more non-standard humanoids are being introduced too.

Isn't it a bit odd that the only way back to Dhatri is via space travel, though? Shouldn't Willshapers and Elsecallers be able to get people over from the Cognitive without a perpendicularity?  And wasn't it strongly hinted in one of Nikki Savage adventures in TLM or BoM that a gadget exists that can do the same? Not to mention Aon Tia?

Naturally, I am also interested in the First of the Sun developments and the Scadrian/Rosharan Cold War, but I hope that Sixth joins the ship, rather than the reverse.

[Argenti he/him]

Will you be changing the title of the thread "Secret Project Five Reading Discussion," or will you be changing it to Emberdark?

Edited March 25, 2024 by Argenti

[LewsTherinTelescope]

On 3/23/2024 at 3:51 PM, JPGU said:

I also want to comment that it seems strange to me that both of Star's parents were albinos, so were they related or are they simply two dragons from different families that were born with the same special condition and then became a couple?

We don't know whether she's related to either of the previous albino dragons, do we?

[Dofurion]

8 minutes ago, LewsTherinTelescope said:

We don't know whether she's related to either of the previous albino dragons, do we?

Well, the story itself tells you that Frost, until Starling's birth, only knew two other albino dragons besides himself, and Starling herself calls him uncle (although this could be a nickname) so it's a strange topic. Especially if we consider that what we knew about fainlife is that everything was white (white trees, Sho Del, etc.) and since dragons are also from that ecosystem, it is rare that they have colors and even rarer that they have superstitions about albinos.
Note: I wonder if they also have melanos?

[JPGU]

4 hours ago, LewsTherinTelescope said:

We don't know whether she's related to either of the previous albino dragons, do we?

Well, that was the interpretation I gave to the fact that Frost mentions only having known two and what Starling says: "She knew some, unlike her uncle, saw her albinism as a flaw. A sign of misfortune, come from what happened to her parents..."

 

I interpreted that to mean that Star's parents are the other two albino dragons, but now that you mentioned it it is true that it is not confirmed and it could be that I simply misinterpreted it.

[LewsTherinTelescope]

1 hour ago, JPGU said:

"She knew some, unlike her uncle, saw her albinism as a flaw. A sign of misfortune, come from what happened to her parents..."

Yeah I can see that interpretation, fair enough. I do think her being related to at least one would make sense, but as you pointed out it would be kind of odd if both were (though not impossible, for sure). The other option is that neither were and she was what people take as the sign of misfortune.

Fun side note: When Hoid makes an illusion of a dragon to show Kaladin what they look like, it's a pearlescent one

[Arkangel]

1 hour ago, LewsTherinTelescope said:

Fun side note: When Hoid makes an illusion of a dragon to show Kaladin what they look like, it's a pearlescent one

Hoid's "default" appearance (if Hoid even has a default) has white hair. Do we think there might be some meaningful connection between Hoid and the "white" dragons?

[Argenti he/him]

47 minutes ago, Arkangel said:

Hoid's "default" appearance (if Hoid even has a default) has white hair. Do we think there might be some meaningful connection between Hoid and the "white" dragons?

Oh, I like that idea. Maybe it's like investiture fallout? Like the red trees in Chernobyl. 

[+Oltux72 he/him]

On 3/25/2024 at 12:29 PM, Isilel said:

Isn't it a bit odd that the only way back to Dhatri is via space travel, though? Shouldn't Willshapers and Elsecallers be able to get people over from the Cognitive without a perpendicularity?  And wasn't it strongly hinted in one of Nikki Savage adventures in TLM or BoM that a gadget exists that can do the same? Not to mention Aon Tia?

1. Either method would need fuel
2. That they are able to do so does not mean that they are willing to do so
3. Nor does it mean that such people exist on a backwater world
4. Nor do we know the side effects of losing your perpendicularity, respectively the means this happened by

[Arkangel]

8 hours ago, Argenti said:

Oh, I like that idea. Maybe it's like investiture fallout? Like the red trees in Chernobyl. 

I was thinking more along the lines of Hoid sharing his "special Investiture" (to reference Sunlit Man) around the Cosmere. Brandon did say he dated a dragon once.

[Nef]

I find it interesting that the Radiant was a Skybreaker rather than a Windrunner. It was partly a scouting mission so one might expect that a Windrunner would have been the obvious choice.

Given what we find out in Sunlit Man, makes me wonder about the Windrunner order in the future.

Edited March 27, 2024 by Nef

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

On 3/25/2024 at 7:29 PM, Isilel said:

Isn't it a bit odd that the only way back to Dhatri is via space travel, though? Shouldn't Willshapers and Elsecallers be able to get people over from the Cognitive without a perpendicularity?  And wasn't it strongly hinted in one of Nikki Savage adventures in TLM or BoM that a gadget exists that can do the same? Not to mention Aon Tia?

Naturally, I am also interested in the First of the Sun developments and the Scadrian/Rosharan Cold War, but I hope that Sixth joins the ship, rather than the reverse.

I think it's pretty clear on the why. The ever-honorable Rosharan's don't want to risk those filthy Scadrian's getting ahold of any Surges. So they've restricted or even outright banned public off-world distribution or services, keeping all that good stuff for their own benefit.

[Nesh he/him]

I find it interesting that Starling is Hoid's apprentice.  I wonder if Frost's... strained relationship wit Hoid has anything to do with her banishment.

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

1 hour ago, Nesh said:

I find it interesting that Starling is Hoid's apprentice.  I wonder if Frost's... strained relationship wit Hoid has anything to do with her banishment.

I don't think the timeline matches up for that. The letter happened in Stormlight Archive, which as a whole takes place around Era 2 Mistborn. Starling's banishment happened 50 years before Emberdark. So unless the Southern Scadrians have already figured out Space Travel years before Wax was even born, I don't think that is why.

It's already said that Frost is 'frosty' with Hoid because he's meddling with other worlds, with Adonalsium's design. Though if Hoid is indeed involved in the circumstances of Starling's banishment, then it's definitely not gotten any better.

[BinarySecond]

Why is everyone in the Cosmere obsessed with chickens though?

[+Oltux72 he/him]

7 hours ago, Nesh said:

I find it interesting that Starling is Hoid's apprentice.  I wonder if Frost's... strained relationship wit Hoid has anything to do with her banishment.

Frost seems to be quite influential, having a palace, a throne and personal priests. You are raising an important question. Who dared put his niece in shackles? Do dragons have a government powerful enough to do that? If so, what was important enough to antagonize Frost?

And we have a lot of open questions:

1. How does the crew know that she is a dragon? Has she told them?
2. How come they have prejudices about dragons? Does that mean that Yolen has come out of seclusion?
3. What has happened on Threnody?
4. Why does Xisis sink low enough to own a ship crewed with misfits?

On 3/25/2024 at 1:14 AM, alder24 said:

What if they no longer consider Avatars and Shards as gods anymore, or they have their ways of dealing with them and opposing them? Patji even as an Avatar might not be a challenge to them in the future (Anti-Investiture might kill him up for example).

And even more fundamental, why has the avatar not reacted to Scadrians enroaching on the autonomy of First of the Sun?

[Arkangel]

5 hours ago, BinarySecond said:

Why is everyone in the Cosmere obsessed with chickens though?

They're so versatile and go well in a lot of different types of dishes. Pound them flat, crumb/batter and fry them for a crispy sandwich, toss them in a spicy curry sauce over rice, grill and slice them up over a salad, throw them into a creamy, cheesy pasta....

Edit: If one ate an Aviar, would one gain a measure of its power? Has Brandon been asked this before?

Edited March 27, 2024 by Arkangel

[Argenti he/him]

1 hour ago, Arkangel said:

Edit: If one ate an Aviar, would one gain a measure of its power? Has Brandon been asked this before?

You would not.
 

Spoiler

Questioner

What happens if you eat an Aviar?

Brandon Sanderson

Normal things happen; you would not gain the powers. You would be a cruel person because Aviar are not of animal intelligence. You would not gain the powers

Skyward release party (Nov. 6, 2018)