Mid-Range Game 67: 'Twas the Night Before SA5

[The Unknown Medallion he/him]

4 hours ago, Winnie the Pookla said:

Why is it that I keep waiting for Kas to claim Brandon in his next post and it never happens?

I find drinking coffee rather abominable, so I'm happy to vote there.

I've been expecting it for a while since Aman died (and before).

4 hours ago, Kasimir said:

But if you want something formal, have the thing I wrote C1 and edited intermittently for if I ever needed to save myself from the exe, @Winnie the Pookla.

 

---

SAVE FOR IF I NEED TO CLAIM:

They were suspecting him, now. Kasim looked at the gathering SE players, concerned. He didn't know most of them. Hadn't played Sanderson Elimination, really, for too many years, though there were those early games with the names no one knew now: Hael, Doctor, Jain, though Araris was still around. Not everything was lost, in this world.

They didn't know him, either. Perhaps that was why they suspected him. Easier to question the stranger in your midst, and he hadn't played with most of them. Not since he'd had to focus on graduating that semester, and then the RSI shoulder injury and—

"You're one of them, aren't you. The ones causing all of this," one of them hissed. The names ran together in his head.

"Siao liao, I'm trying to stop them as much as you are," Kasim began.

But the accusations came in. 

"Who's WildKarrde?" someone asked.

A corner of the edifice of fiction crumbled.

"Probably before your time. Played with Araris's gen, apparently."

"That's forever ago."

Mailliw73 hit post. 

"Long Game 5: Noble Secrets" blinked to life in the thread of the Sanderson Elimination subforum. He sat back and watched as players showed up in the thread.

"I've recovered," said @Kasimir. "So I doubt I'll fall sick and miss the game again. Guess this is my first sign-up instead!"

"He did some kayana things. Shot Araris in the face C1 and killed a Village Seeker. Totally why you don't do that sort of thing." 

Another corner of the edifice of fiction crumbled.

"Yeah," said Kasimir. "You'd've to be around to see it. Winter'd balanced the game based around estimates of how devastating E!Wilson would've been which was Not The Best Idea. And Wilson's still fried as a fish about it, by the way."

">>" said Wyrmhero.

"Hey, it was your fault. You told Gamma he should totally do that random unspecified thing he wanted to do."

"And I was supposed to know he wanted to shoot Wilson in the face on C1?"

"And steal her Elim team from her, don't forget that."

"Araris returned the favour in that space game, from what I hear. I don't see why he holds a grudge."

"I'm not mad," Kasimir said. He totally was though. Had spent hours doing GCE Physics ten year series to calm the heck down. "But Christ. I can't believe you murdered me on N-freakin'-1. I had such a good character arc with Sonder! I was enjoying the RP!"

"Araris was the one who murdered you," Wilson said.

"Fine, I can't believe you let your freakin' teammate murder me N1 yet again! And this game of all games! God, what's with Araris anyway?"

"Also that Rosharan warcamps duel. Shardblade-wielding Karrde versus Aman, and Aman wiped the floor with him."

"Way I heard it from Kas, Karrde was pretty close to taking on Aman, but Sart got involved and Sart was Evil."

"Yeah, better you than me," said Kasimir, sagely. "Taking on E!Aman? No thank you. Nowhere near drunk enough for that."

"It was a very close thing," El lamented. "I had to keep PMing everyone to remind them of the facts."

"Like I said, I'd druther fight an angry Wilson. And that is about as appealing as wandering through a preserve of bears with meat strapped to my body and having slathered myself temptingly with honey. Or wandering into a wilderness of hungry Bengal tigers. Or..."

"Wait. Who's Kas?"

"What do you mean who's Kas? Who's Karrde? I don't remember a SE player by that name."

Yet another corner of the edifice of fiction crumbled. The structure staggered beneath the weight of reality, the weight of illusion dreamed into existence by curiosity and a writer's craft.

"Dragonsteel?" Kasimir winced. "I'd love to go, but it's in the States man. This sort of thing never hits my part of the world, and travel is a nightmare. Maybe if I ever did the grad school thing..." He laughed at the idea. Stupid thought, now. Too old, too locked in to do it. They always wanted you fresh.

Fragments shifting. Reality settling into place, reasserting itself.

There had never been a  @WildKarrde . Fragments of experiences from various SE players, snatches through the eyes of others, a heavier handful from Kasimir, gathered together, woven into the framework of a life that never existed.

What is collective memory, other than the stories we tell ourselves?

As it turned out, SE players had their own shared stories, after all.

There must be these things: laughter, friendship, hope, memory. These things give us a little light. These things make us last.

The house of fiction crumbled in various places beneath the weight of what was, beneath the weight of events, beneath the weight of history.

Brandon Sanderson removed the disguise he'd used to get closer to the SE players and watch what they'd been doing. Probably wasn't going to do the fake wizard beard thing again.

"I'd prefer not to be banned from the convention," he said, mildly.

(N.B. Listen I would write this less magical realism but it doesn't feel respectful to RPF this and I don't think any amount of fake beard is gonna explain how Mr Sanderson is an ancient grouchy sleep-deprived sweary Asian man living on painkillers okay just cope guys I sure had to.)

And there it is.

So I think Coffeecat/Silber is certainly the best bet. Sorry not sorry.

Unfortunately, I don't think there's any way to rule out Coffee being the SK, and if they flip blue then it doesn't help us finding the remaining elim, but it's certainly worth exing the clear evil. We either win or we're in the same nearly winning situation we are right now.

[Araris Valerian he/him]

In the world where coffee is the SK, as long as Kas self-protects then that forces the elim to give us a green flip, which can't hurt anything.

[The Unknown Medallion he/him]

1 minute ago, Winnie the Pookla said:

In the world where coffee is the SK, as long as Kas self-protects then that forces the elim to give us a green flip, which can't hurt anything.

That's my thought process, yeah.

[Kasimir he/him]

3 hours ago, Winnie the Pookla said:

In the world where coffee is the SK, as long as Kas self-protects then that forces the elim to give us a green flip, which can't hurt anything.

Fair. I do want to point out though that in the world Coffee isn't the SK, the actual SK is going to be putting the brakes on this exe as best as they can.

Because the second we successfully exe Coffee, they lose. Us exeing E!Coffee here is their losscon. I do think the reactions here can be worth analysing or at least illuminating.

3 hours ago, Ookla the Bald said:

I've been expecting it for a while since Aman died (and before).

And there it is.

Oh?

Edited December 19, 2023 by Kasimir

[Aeoryi she/her]

I'm fully expecting to die here btw

I would make a good SK target, or the elims might go after me lol

[Kasimir he/him]

11 hours ago, Winnie the Pookla said:

In the world where coffee is the SK, as long as Kas self-protects then that forces the elim to give us a green flip, which can't hurt anything.

Does the exe precede the kill though? I feel like Aman and I have been asking this question ad nauseum/ad infinitum and don't ever recall Mat saying anything about this one way or another.

@Ookla the Destined please.

Edited to add:

Sorry, nevermind, he did answer it, I'm tired.

The SK kill will still go through. @Winnie the Pookla  @Ookla the Bald and essentially, it does boil down to a major Lurching IKYK which...sigh. I will try my best. But yeah, I'm also still convinced Coffee is the best answer here. Am waiting for Neil to get online in light of Illwei's anomalous response but believe this is helpful for the suspect pool overall if we have to go into a further cycle - probably more so if Illwei decides to apply the brakes here.

---

As a non-game relevant aside, as many SE players know, I survived an abusive relationship and spent a few years after that in recovery. Part of this was behind the AG8 clusterchull with Aman and I hitting each other's triggers hard. I say this as a statement of fact that I understand and acknowledge gaslighting and emotional manipulation are part of the game, and that different players have different limits/moral principles, but kindly back the f off because I will never not be triggered by people who resort to gaslighting and emotional manipulation referring to me as 'their hero' to score game points. I want nothing to do with this, such people, or respect from such people. It disgusts me on a visceral level.

I am still incandescent with rage about this, and I will refuse to further interact if this last boundary is disrespected.

Go emotionally manipulate and gaslight elsewhere or at others in the thread. But do not, ever, dare to presume to refer to me as 'your hero' cynically - I want nothing of this taint.

Edited December 19, 2023 by Kasimir

[Aeoryi she/her]

49 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

As a non-game relevant aside, as many SE players know, I survived an abusive relationship and spent a few years after that in recovery. Part of this was behind the AG8 clusterchull with Aman and I hitting each other's triggers hard. I say this as a statement of fact that I understand and acknowledge gaslighting and emotional manipulation are part of the game, and that different players have different limits/moral principles, but kindly back the f off because I will never not be triggered by people who resort to gaslighting and emotional manipulation referring to me as 'their hero' to score game points. I want nothing to do with this, such people, or respect from such people. It disgusts me on a visceral level.

I am still incandescent with rage about this, and I will refuse to further interact if this last boundary is disrespected.

Go emotionally manipulate and gaslight elsewhere or at others in the thread. But do not, ever, dare to presume to refer to me as 'your hero' cynically - I want nothing of this taint.

I'd actually go to the IM if it continues btw- that's what they're here for. 

[Kasimir he/him]

1 minute ago, Aeoryi said:

I'd actually go to the IM if it continues btw- that's what they're here for. 

You have no idea how much cursing/venting on this the IM has been listening to. 

[Aeoryi she/her]

3 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

You have no idea how much cursing/venting on this the IM has been listening to. 

I've once ripped up paper to alleviate rage from lg97

[Kasimir he/him]

7 hours ago, Aeoryi said:

I've once ripped up paper to alleviate rage from lg97

Aeo, with all due respect, I would like you to take a moment to consider the appropriateness of comparing frustration over a forum game to dealing with—even now—ongoing and lasting trauma from surviving abuse. I am better now than years before but this doesn't mean I can't specifically have that trauma triggered. I don’t think it’s an appropriate comparison and I don’t wish to continue this conversation further.

Edited December 19, 2023 by Kasimir

[Aeoryi she/her]

28 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

Aeo, with all due respect, I would like you to take a moment to consider the appropriateness of comparing frustration over a forum game to dealing with—even now—ongoing and lasting trauma from surviving abuse. I am better now than years before but this doesn't mean I can't specifically have that trauma triggered. I don’t think it’s an appropriate comparison and I don’t wish to continue this conversation further. 

Yeah. I'm sorry. I don't tend to have the greatest capacity when tired, and it especially shows in posts like those.

Tbh I don't think this is the time nor the place for this.

Edit: Anyways, I'm going to move discussion back towards game related stuff

Pathwalking:

sk!coffee:

Spoiler

5-1-1 c4

4-1 c5 OR 5-0 c5 

2-1 c6 OR 3-0 c6

c7 lylo

e!coffee:

Spoiler

Game over

v!coffee:

Spoiler

5-1-1 c4

2-1-1 c5 or 3-1-1 c5

2-1-1c5: lylo

Spoiler

If SK gets lynched, elims likely win

If elim gets lynched AND elim hits village SK wins

If elim gets lynched AND elim hits SK: village wins 

If village gets lynched: elim win

3-1-1

Spoiler

Similar to above

 

 

edit 2: 

There you go Coffee. I've considered the likelyhood of you being village.

Also yes my head is hurting- signing up for 3 games at once is not good for my health. Probably will be on this thread in decreasing increments, and if somehow I am alive by c5 and the game isn't over yet, I'll just get a PH probs, because I do not have the capacity for this game and a game on MU and the BT

I've stayed up well past midnight (even arguably until morning, pulling all-nighters) to get this game going, so yeah it's probably time to take a break (as of I writing this I have not gained an hour of sleep in 50+ hours- meds are a powerful resource). It's gotten to the point where it physically hurts to look at a screen, so yeah

As also per usual, I won't be on at eod tmrw so gl

Anyways, time to sleep.

Edited December 19, 2023 by Aeoryi
Added pathwalking (and now part about sleep)

[Coffeecat she/her]

Is blue text for outside of game stuff? I don't know I want to differentiate this from the me that is playing the game. I apologize kasimir, I know it doesn't really help but an apology is the best I have. I'm going to refrain from posting after this since I see that the way I play, especially loosing games, hurts you. 

[neil the beguiled]

well this explains things. is this why you questioned me earlier, kas? i suppose hindsight is 2020 but i should have reasoned something was a little off. oh well.

CoffeeCat

[Aeoryi she/her]

3 hours ago, Coffeecat said:

Is blue text for outside of game stuff? I don't know I want to differentiate this from the me that is playing the game. I apologize kasimir, I know it doesn't really help but an apology is the best I have. I'm going to refrain from posting after this since I see that the way I play, especially loosing games, hurts you. 

It's in the SE rules:

Quote

All out of game discussion should be in blue once the game starts. This applies to everything that is unrelated to the game, mostly pertaining to real life events/situations that affect your ability to play or that you wish to share with the other players. Site issues like the server going down and being unable to access the site or a site update creating problems in other parts of the site that affect the game would be blue-text as well. If it pertains directly to the game itself in any way, keep it in black.

Lying about real life or site issues that are in blue text is forbidden. Using blue text for in-game discussion as a way to prove you’re telling the truth is also unacceptable.

Also Kas I just realized the SK might not show resistance to an elim lynch because they don't know who the elims are lok

[neil the beguiled]

eh i mean they still can have their theories, and its probs still better for an sk to keep elims alive in general at that point. like yeah they dont *know* the elims but for wincon reasons they want them alive? if that tracks?

[Aeoryi she/her]

4 minutes ago, neil the beguiled said:

eh i mean they still can have their theories, and its probs still better for an sk to keep elims alive in general at that point. like yeah they dont *know* the elims but for wincon reasons they want them alive? if that tracks?

Yeah

[neil the beguiled]

13 minutes ago, Aeoryi said:

Yeah

yea

[Illwei]

If coffee is evil then where's the other wolf on his wagon is my question.

[Aeoryi she/her]

1 minute ago, Ooklil the Wei said:

If coffee is evil then where's the other wolf on his wagon is my question.

there's 3 elims probably illwei

[Illwei]

5 minutes ago, Aeoryi said:

there's 3 elims probably illwei

Yes thank you for that observation there is also one sk

[Aeoryi she/her]

Just now, Ooklil the Wei said:

Yes thank you for that observation there is also one sk

The SK doesn't know who the elims are but like how are they going to pull coffee out of that hole

[Illwei]

1 hour ago, Aeoryi said:

The SK doesn't know who the elims are but like how are they going to pull coffee out of that hole

Since you're at a loss on how to save yourself the game as the sk I'll give you some ideas:

1) voting with Kas at the start was a bad move, instead you should have pushed back hard on Kas for pushing coffee without a cc

2) once Kas did cc you have the option to cc, explain your proof you're the real bs, and say something like "idk what kinda gambit this is, I was going to let coffee cover but now Kas is also claiming and it's a mess" and push harder on kas if you think coffee is the last elim

3) you can also try advocating that since it's hard to tell who the real bs is here that we should kill outside of the bs claims and see who's alive tomorrow. Tell the village that we still have a chance tomorrow if we hit a villa because worst case we're at 2-1-1 and it'll be easy to find the elim there with so little people. Follow up for tomorrow is that most likely the elim will not kill bs because he will be next, and then it's basically a win for you as long as you can stay alive and kill either the elim if a villager Is exed, or hope to hit someone the elim doesn't if the elim is exed

Glad to be of help

[Kasimir he/him]

2 hours ago, Aeoryi said:

Also Kas I just realized the SK might not show resistance to an elim lynch because they don't know who the elims are lok

2 hours ago, neil the beguiled said:

eh i mean they still can have their theories, and its probs still better for an sk to keep elims alive in general at that point. like yeah they dont *know* the elims but for wincon reasons they want them alive? if that tracks?

This - again, relative credences, right? Coffee and I aren't of the same alignment. This is clearly a V/E or V/SK situation here due to the nature of the role and counterclaims. In an E!Coffee world, the SK knows their walking wincon is right there on the train, because they know one of us is Evil rather than the SK.

Theorising Illwei for other Elim here fwiw. 

Edited December 19, 2023 by Kasimir

[Illwei]

Kas thinking I'm the last elim here is both a point for why he's village and a point for why i want to kill him but nothing really matters til after coffee flips so

[Aeoryi she/her]

46 minutes ago, Ooklil the Wei said:

Since you're at a loss on how to save yourself the game as the sk I'll give you some ideas:

1) voting with Kas at the start was a bad move, instead you should have pushed back hard on Kas for pushing coffee without a cc

2) once Kas did cc you have the option to cc, explain your proof you're the real bs, and say something like "idk what kinda gambit this is, I was going to let coffee cover but now Kas is also claiming and it's a mess" and push harder on kas if you think coffee is the last elim

3) you can also try advocating that since it's hard to tell who the real bs is here that we should kill outside of the bs claims and see who's alive tomorrow. Tell the village that we still have a chance tomorrow if we hit a villa because worst case we're at 2-1-1 and it'll be easy to find the elim there with so little people. Follow up for tomorrow is that most likely the elim will not kill bs because he will be next, and then it's basically a win for you as long as you can stay alive and kill either the elim if a villager Is exed, or hope to hit someone the elim doesn't if the elim is exed

Glad to be of help

Ah. Okay. Got it.

How long is your doc?