teknopathetic

IMO, I disagree that saying that both brothers being deceived by the Real Stormfather is functionally the same as only Gavilar being deceived by a Stormfaker. This is because as i see it, Dalinar's last big lie to confront is the lie he tells himself about his brother not being as honourable as Dalinar has assumed. Multiple times Navani has tried to broach this subject, and Dalinar is unable to confront this issue. Dalinar blames himself for letting the great proto-bondmsith Gavilar die. Dalinar believes that the embodiment of honour had been guiding Gavilar. But what Dalinar needs to confront is that Gavilar was a two-faced monster. Adding in that the Stormfather is a two-faced monster in addition to Gavilar being a two faced monster really pulls us away from the Gavilar reveal and the emotional work Dalinar needs to do concerning Gavilar. Additionally, If Dalinar and Gavilar were both lied to and deceived in the same way, this gives Dalinar yet another reason to be an apologist about his brother. Dalinar will have to say to Navani "Gavilar was just like me; he was deceived just like me. Gavilar cant be blamed because the Stormfather tricked us too". We need a way to have Navani say "Dalinar, you are not just a 2nd son filling the shoes of your dead brother; Gavilar sucked. He was not honourable. YOU ARE HONOURABLE". Navini's ability to confront this is severely undercut if Dalinar is making the same mistakes as his brother and has been bonding a somewhat evil Stormfather. Instead, if Dalinar learns that Gavilar's vices attracted the attention of an entity that was not the actual Stormfather, then Dalinar and Navani can have a real and frank discussion about who Gavilar was and why Dalinar's drunkenness did not result in the death of a great and unifying man. Dalinar will learn that Gavilar had the opportunity to bond the Real Stormfather [who is nominally sending visions as per his oath to Honour], but Gavilar instead was pulled in by something as corrupted as the Stormfaker. And by learning this, Dalinar will see that he isn't just the 2nd son version of the brother he failed to protect. And while I totally agree Gavilar was Gavilar's worst enemy in regards to his corruption and eventual death, Dalinar needs a way to confront this and to realize that Dalinar is wrong to consider his brother a good king cut down in his prime. Knowing that Gavilar was drawn more to an opportunistic Stormfaker over the honourable Stormfather will let Dalinar confront his misconceptions about his brother, and will finally allow Dalinar to understand his own life, and to actually be present and be able to support Navani when it comes to the abuse she had been suffering through.

I think a Stormfaker would change things for Dalinar. This would help him reach character growth concerning the fact that his brother was a huge jackass. It would help Dalinar connect with Navani over how abusive and strange Gavilar was being too. If Dalinar finds out that Gavilar was being tricked and wasn't really on the path to bondsmithing nearly as much as Dalinar thought, and that Gavilar's greed and ambition actually wasnt really of honour after all but of someone like ishar, then we get the chance for some real emotional confrontation on the level of Dalinar confronting his relationship with who Evy was. And Dalinar needs to confront who his brother really was both for his own sake, but also for his wife's sake too.

Damn. I think you are correct. This makes a lot of sense.

This may be too dark of a thought, but I wonder if any mixed children have been born in t he last 4000 years between desolations. I mean, if it is possible, you think it would have happened at least once in the interim. Unless you need mate-form or another form for that to work between species.

I am hoping Ambition comes back and is the Big Bad.

We are likely going to get some Ba Ado Mishram eventually, and if she returns then the rules regarding Dead Eyes might change. We seem to know that deadeyes didn't happen before Ado was trapped, so maybe they can be repaired after she is released. What seems likely in my mind is that Adolin figures out how to revive deadeyes once Mishram is released. The process wont be automatic but all the effort Adolin has put in will pay off.

I do admit that your spoiler makes things less likely, but I also think Hoid betraying Dalinar could have stopped being top-of-mind for that character anymore and also could have helped create a bigger wedge between them.

I think Hoid will be Todium's champion. I dont think original Odium would have done this, but Todium has seen the opportunity. Surely Odium can offer Hoid something that he wants. Add that to all the minor betrayals from Hoid to Jasnah and Hoid's "I would watch this world burn" comment, and I think we have a pretty foreshadowed solution. Hoid can't kill and basically cant be killed, so the battle will come out in a way that the contrsct didn't expect.

I wonder if the mists are some form of Solid ---> Gas sublimation. If other metals could be sublimated and ingested, would there be a different effect? That would ... i guess .... avoid causing any impurities in the metal. The sublimated metals would likely freak out when exposed to oxygen though, so that makes the whole process pretty hard to pull off. Cadmium, zinc, and magnesium have relatively lower sublimation temperatures. I am not an expert in this, but people who work with space-craft keep track of which metal perform best within a vacuum, and this is as aspect. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Materials_for_use_in_vacuum

I wonder if temperature would have something to do with it? Here is a very laymen overview of what I mean. To make some metals stronger, the metals can be heated to higher temperatures to create impurities that cause hardening (since 9/10 times people want a harder metal). However, this change might be seen as "perfect" or "imperfect" in terms of investiture since the structure has been changed somewhat. Additionally, there is also another property called the "ductile-brittle transition point" temperature that looks at how much energy a metal is able to absorb at a specific temperature. Steel for example is much more brittle at lower temperatures. So the temperatures that the metal have experienced before/during refinement could effect the metal, as could the temperature the metal is at when "burned". I wonder if refinement and ductile-brittle would have any effect? And if so, would the goal be to make harder or softer or more energy absorbent? This also makes me wonder what might happen if someone burned a different phase of metal (gas/liquid/etc). Could there be a different effect if the individual managed to survive the attempt?

I completely agree that whatever the relationship was between the Singers and True Spren was different than a Human Nahel Bond However, we do know that the spren were more attracted to the bonds that spren could have with humans over the bonds they had with Singers. I think this implies there must have been something similar going on. Venli’s conversation with the stones says that Nahel Bonds with Parshendi are new, but that new things come from old things. That to me implies there was some sort of relationship going on in the ancient past.

The fact that Leshwi says “they’ve forgiven us” in reply to Venli having a True-Spren bond implies that true-spren bonds had happened in the past.

Now it may just be a fluke that Leshwi knew a Radiant-type True spren so well in the past, but what if it isn’t a coincidence? What is Leshwi isn’t an odd case in caring for a Sentient-Type Spren in the past. We know that Odium has never made any more Fused since the original set. I used to assume Odium did not want to make more fused as that might weaken him, but what if Odium cannot make more Fused because there were no longer any Parshendi with the proper connections. Would it be possible that Odium can only make Fused out of Singers who either had a currently had a Sentient-type spren bond, or those who had a previous connection to the surges given by sentient-type spren? So my theory is that Odium created the Fused out of the Singers who lost their Sentient-Type True Spren connection after the spren had abandoned them Obviously this bond was not exactly like a human nahel bond, but there is some sort of proto-relationship here This also may explain why some Fused brands are rarer than others. It is that there were fewer of that type of spren around for any Singer to have been bonded with in the past (much like Inkspren currently for Radiants) Based on Leshwi believing her spren had been alive post fusing, I think after the Spren left the Singers, Odium was able to create Fused out of the connection that was left behind. Odium cannot make new Fused until he has Parshendi with intelligent-type spren connections to the surges again Edit: Possible Example: 1) Some Parshendi before the humans arrived could shape the earth, dip items to form tools, and sing into existence large buildings. Perhaps this was granted by some sort of association with Peakspren. Perhaps only one surge-equivalent was granted, as we know humans were seen as better bondholders by the spren. 2) The Peakspren are then lured away to human leaving the Parshendi unable to use the "surges" as it were. There may be some Parshendi that could still find spren, but many Parshendi are disaffected and upset about the spren leaving to go be with humans. Whatever the relationship at first with humans, it seems that nahel-surges are not the first thing to happen. Nahel-Surges form later in the war as far as we know. 3) Odium connects these Peakspren-Parshendi and creates the Parsheni that can slide through Earth. Odium can do this due to the previous connection these Peakspren-Parshendi had to a surge granted by the Peakspren. 4) The spren are extremely offended by what that the Parshendi have done, and the spren decide not to bond with Parshendi anymore. The spren likely keep this promise until Venli appears.

I wonder if we might start getting TV Writer Yoki Hijo. Perhaps the 16 most artistic people might start becoming invested.

The theory that Cultivation is setting up new vessels has been around for a long time. It would make some sense that a dragon like Cultivation would want her shard to go to a dragon like herself. So maybe Cultivation turned Lift into a dragon because of shard-succession, and we are soon going to see Lift get her actual boon of dragonboon. it would be interesting to know if Dragons could pop in and out of visions like Lift does. Seems likely.

Came here to say this as well. We have been promised to have something come of Puuli's "origin island" beliefs, and it would be great to see that come to pass in another interlude. As for others I would want: Sja Anat Rysn Todium Cultivation Ash Venli's mother Ishiik (purelake interlude guy) Dabbid 16

It seems like the core is actively charging itself since it actively pulls in a massive amount of energy and does not seem to release this energy anywhere we can see. To me that sounds like a created device, and that means either a shard or Adonalsium placed this artifact here. What it is charging up to do is anyone's guess, but I think Ambition left a couple "ambitious" artifacts scattered around before she finally succumbed to her wounds.

Possibly a lot of Honorspren are killed by one of Navani’s warcrime anti-light weapons, and Sig isn’t able to rebond his order. Surely a lot of spren are about to be killed and it’s going to be harder to find a spren to bond with (especially in orders that do a lot of front line battles)

Sigzil says he bonded Aux in a place full of “obsidian”, so maybe Sigzil bonded Aux last minute as he was running through Shadesmaar. My pet theory is Aux isn’t from the planet Roshar, but was living somewhere else in the Solar System.

Super Sus that the first Zellion just happened to bring his people to a planet where Shades wouldn't be a problem. And to a planet that is heavily invested with no known source causing it. And that had no perpendicularity meaning it would be extremely hard to find on one's own. My crack theory is that this planet is actually some sort of charging device that Ambition left before she passed away from her wounds. The first Zellion knew of it, and was either directed or influenced to head towards it and make a new home. Ambition is charging something up there, and eventually ambition's people will get to use it. Brandon has said that Ambition would be a black magic the gathering deck, and that screams "resurrection device" to me. What would be more ambitious than creating your own sun-charged device that would eventually allow you to resurrect? And the people living on that planet would need to be pretty ambitious at the start to make living their work. We learn that the Deepest Ones are mountain sized monsters on Threnody, and then we learn that this new planet has Mountain sized features that don’t make sense. Hmmmm. HMMMM

I also thought Ambition. We know Ambition fled and survived for a bit after she was mortally wounded. Perhaps this sun and planet are some artifact she left behind for some reason before she was finally killed? The First Zellion learned of this somehow and brought the Threnodite people back there to a planet that would not be overcome by the Shade issue (perhaps something Ambition foresaw?) My gut would say that this planet and star are some kind of resurrection device, but I have no proof of that. It seems to be an artifact that is pulling in investiture at a crazy rate over and over again, and it doesnt seem to be releasing that energy anywhere. To me, it seems like this artifact has been charging for 1000s of years...and anything being intentionally charged must eventually have a use. Ambition for late-game villian!

Does this book imply that Nomad was the leader of the Skybreaker for a time? My mind keep thinking “was Nomad a Skybreaker herald?” He joined a new order and became its leader before some catastrophic event took it down? And lastly, seems like Nomaf may have met Aux somewhere strange. Nomad draws attention to the fact that he met aux in a world made of obsidian. Sure, that could be Shademaar because of the obsidian connection, but to me it made it seem like maybe he met Aux on Ashyn or Braize. I just don’t think Nomad would consider Rosharan Shadesmaar to be “another world”. Lastly, I am honestly annoyed that in a book entirely about someone having held a Dawnshard, Brandon decided to never mention which one he held. I felt as a reader I had been promised this by the narrative, but it was intentionally withheld from me for some meta reason.

Anyone else get the feeling that Nomad met Aux off of Roshar itself? Maybe Braize or Ashyn? The way Nomad described meeting Aux on another world made of obsidian seemed odd to me. I know Shadesmaar was described as obsidian, but I really don’t think a Nomad would consider Rosharan Shadesmaar another world. We also know that Nomad has at least been to Ashyn, so it is possible Aux was living on a different planet in the Rosharan system.

Shallan is my favourite character actually. Right at the start going through her chapters and delving into all the mysteries was incredibly fascinating to me. Her chapters are my favourite in TWoK because you get to delve deep into the world and the eldritch mystery of the lore. Also, I have a big heart-on for anyone that tried to cheer up others even when their own experiences could be absolutely crushing. I find that to be quite a strength of character. My Shallan love goes deep. I read her as if she should be believed, and that's how I found all these hints about Shallan and her mother. --- Side note for Shallan fans (or people who want to see why people like Shallan) I am really digging the Lost in Rosier re-read podcast since both of the hosts love Shallan as well and it is great to see people dig into what makes Shallan a compelling and sympathetic read.

I thought the yellow was on the other planet, and the yellow was managing to pierce the shroud (making the planet visible like a star).