duladen

I interpreted Dusk’s description of the “peculiar cast” and “unnatural air” of their voice as speaking to the rhythms. So I assumed they were a Singer. But I admit it’s not much to go on.

What about the other Gavinor? That lump of flesh that Navani thought was a sleeping child. Will it just... slowly rot away? Gain sentience?

Singers will settle in Iri, since the Iriali are gone and they previously tried to negotiate for that land. Shallan/Adolin's baby will be super pale, considering they will have never seen a real sun. Religion is going to be all kinds of f*@ked up. The Singers and Fused will mostly worship Retribution, maybe Listeners too. Dalinar is going to have a Kelsier-esque status, although mostly negative. I think due to his infamy, perhaps a cognitive entity might form as a counter to the Blackthornspren. Navani will be revered by everyone that lives in Urithiru. I was going to guess the Fused would mercy-kill those among them that are way far gone with anti-Voidlight... but that doesn't exit anymore, does it? Would anti-Warlight work? Are we calling it Warlight?

This is exactly my take. Heck, Gavinor wasn't even involved for much of the confrontation. The whole point is that Dalinar could never win the contest as constructed, because Odium would never agree to one that he could lose, so Dalinar had to find an alternative. The identity of the Champion mattered less than Dalinar's decision to "walk away". I wish there had been more done in previous books to set up the "walking away" but there is a bit, and it was heavily foreshadowed throughout this book. All that being said, I did cringe when Gavinor was revealed...

A solidly good book. In my personal rankings, I'd put it middle of the pack below Wor/OB, above RoW, equal or slightly below WoK. Loved LOVED Adolin's storyline. Loved Renarin and Rlain. Loved Kaladin and Szeth. Loved seeing lots of theories confirmed and Death Rattles resolved. While the rest of the Spiritual Realm sequences were amazing from a lore/answers perspective, I felt the whole process dragged. There was just SO MUCH for Dalinar to witness. Pacing overall felt really strange to me. Very disappointed that we didn't get more BAM, didn't learn the "price" of using Dai-Gonarthis, and didn't even meet the Dustmother. Disappointed we didn't see Taln fight. Disappointed we didn't see Chasmfiends vs Thunderclast. Disappointed we didn't have more El. I thought Sig's failure was going to be more profound, and also Moash was a flop. The debate and the Listener trick were both kind of meh. I was not excited at the reveal of Gavinor Champion, but it ended up not really mattering so I think it was actually well handled. The contest was essentially a big fake out, and I think enough was done to set up that there was never going to be a way for Dalinar to win other than the sacred right of "peacing the F*@k out". Overall, there was a lot to like. Obviously things not to like. But in the end, I think Brando stuck the landing and I really like how the world has been staged for the back half.

Sure makes me think of…

Wouldn't Nohadon technically be a cognitive shadow in this situation, too? Tanavast's body would have vaporized upon Ascension, so I suspect that if he abdicated Honor to live as a human again then he formed a new body much like the Heralds have new physical forms created each Return. That leads to the question... if this theory is correct, then which cognitive shadow merged with the Stormfather? The one left behind to hold Honor or Nohadon himself?

Just to add onto this, because I think these are excellent points: Dalinar and Navani Ascending to share the Shard of Honor is a really interesting parallel/juxtaposition to Taravangian having his personality bifurcated (the divided one) in order to hold the Shard of Odium.

Uli Da (Ambition) is the Sho Del. Ian (WeiryWriter) on Shardcast had a long standing theory that Edgli (Endowment) is a dragon.

Probably Koloss More seriously: isn’t there a WOB about African animals in the Roughs? Maybe it’s elephant or rhino hide.

Kaladin leading a peaceful group therapy session for Szeth and the Heralds in Shinovar. If it is the Heralds, I assume the "Horneater" would be Chana and the "Makabaki" could be a few of them... I think Nale, Taln, and Ash are all described as looking Makabaki?

Like super extra dead

Not sure Kel is getting any Lerasium without Sazed’s very explicit consent.

Malignance is an awesome idea.

Is there a word for getting really into exercise or some other hobby in the wake of a breakup? That’s probably the answer (kidding…)

All the discussion of giving up the power, makes me think one or more of these will be true 1. Honor gave up the power; perhaps feigning his madness and then stapling his cognitive shadow to the Stormfather to hide his escape. "Our shame" could be because this step was basically him breaking his oaths/agreements (to the Heralds, to Odium, to the people of Roshar) 2. If Dalinar picks up the power of Honor, he will give it up. Maybe to Kaladin, maybe to Taravangian in an attempt to give context to the divine hatred. I wonder also if that could be like a Shard-level version of Vasher giving all his Breaths to Denth and then taking advantage of that moment of vulnerability. I'm also thinking that since Dalinar and Navani are visiting the Spiritual Realm with their minds but not their bodies, he can avoid having his physical form vaporized as he Ascends. Then, when he's ready to give it up, his soul can be stapled back to his body. I assume he'd be like a Returned in this scenario. My god can you imagine how caked up he'll be? 3. Taravangian will be convinced to give up Odium (I think this least likely) I really REALLY want to see some Radiant vs Allomancer fighting. I need it. Agreed the pink crystal is roseite. No better guesses on the other things...

Agreed Lift does not make sense. But I don't think the answer is just Sja Anat's children. Mraize says "We thought we might need our newest recruit to nudge him into it, but that wasn’t necessary." I think that implies a human recruit. I suspect The Mink, Yanagawn, or that guard that's no longer looking for a spren.

I believe so, yes. Didn’t Mraize imprison Lift in an aluminum cage in RoW?

Let me no longer hurt! Let me no longer weep! Molli! Baba Black Sheep holds my sorrow and consumes it!

I think they follow him because he’s Bondsmith bonded to the Stormfather. ”Give it to me. Now. I need it.” Sure reads like a demand to me…

Your initial comment was that Dalinar’s crisis of legitimacy would be a result of Gavilar’s return. I think Oltux’s objection was reasonable. This line of thought about humanity deserting him feels completely orthogonal to the discussion. What is this new reasoning? Why would humanity desert Dalinar? What reasoning is there to expect that Dalinar will demand the Shard as you have described?

What the heck is Shallan’s next move? I love Navani. Yall noticing that there always seems to be gloryspren and lifespren around her? Also, a couple times there’s been casual mention of her “dismissing” other spren - happened before the meeting and happened this chapter too. Her Sibling bond is really interesting. Domesticating spren is an interesting compromise. Bippy must be protected at all costs. Was the Neturo family stone “vibrant red-orange” when the draft of this flashback first came out? Is it a gem stone? What’s going on here?

I believe there is still a distinction here. Storms are of Honor, but Honor is not called The Storm - we're fully agreed there. The Void is of Odium, and while I agree with you that Void is not Odium's intent, Odium is quite literally referred to as the void into which all emotion is drawn. There is a MUCH more explicit equivalence between Odium/Void than there is between Honor/Storm. Regardless of the disagreement on that point, I agree that the combination of the two would not be War. We don't really know what it would be... something that combines bonds and passion. Perhaps "Conviction" or "Righteous"? "Ardent"??

Largely agree with all your points but just want to note that Odium is referred to as the Void. From the Eila Stele:

Is the bouncer Ulam or Ulaam?