Robinski

I mean, it depends what kind of feedback you're looking for, or how strong an idea of plot and character arc you have. For example, over the years, we've seen a lot of people submit a handful of chapters and then go away and address feedback before coming back with more. What ever feels comfortable and useful to you, we'll read it, within reason of course

Heya. Well, I wasn't going to let this pass without at least having a quick gander over it. This will in no way be an in-depth critique, but I don't like to not contribute anything when someone has gone to the trouble of submitting. 1. What is hurtling towards the next year? Not the month or Ca, surely? 2. How do we know the first of the year is unperturbed, it hasn't arrived yet? I feel there is a mixing, or possibly twisting of metaphors here. And there is "Then, the day before the first of the year arrived" 3. It's referred to that 774 is the leap year; in that case, surely it's "couldn’t remember the crowds being this wild, nearly out of control in 770," BUT only if the cycle is 4 years. And yet it must be, because it is also stated that 775 is a normal year. To put it another way, would the reader not assume that the cycle was four years, as that is what is hard-wired into the human head, thus leading to confusion? 4. "Hurdle’s Day was every three years" - Okay, I suggest you mention this before throwing years around, to avoid confusion. 5. "But the crowd held" - This sounded to me like the crowd holding against a charge. I felt it sounded like the fighting had already began. Suggest maybe 'kept its tension in check' or something like that. 6. "She shuttered at the thought" - The word is 'shuddered'. I can't find any definition of 'shuttered' that makes sense here. 7. "She couldn’t help but have a dry mouth at the sight" - Awkward phrasing. 8. "who had been unsuccessfully attempting to weasel him into laws" - (a) it's more conventional phrasing for someone to weasel out of something. I don't see how you weasel someone into something. 9. "and is turning Th into his slaves!" - Them. is the country, is it not? So, he'd be turning 'the people of Them.' or the Them-belese into his slaves. 10. "Printing presses were a growing source of information, but they were still relatively expensive to mass produce" - You wouldn't mass produce the printing press, surely. You don't need as many as something like spoons or shoes, which could be said to be mass-produced. Surely a whole city would only need a handful of printing presses to saturate it with flyers. 11. "he could repeat history for a fourth time" - Repeating history for a fourth time, to me, would be him (or anyone) overthrowing Cr for the fifth time (i.e. overthrown once, then repeated four times). I think repeating 'his feat' for the fourth time could be looked as him overthrowing a ruler (any ruler) and taking control of a country for the firth time, but in history, he has only overthrown each country once. 12. "The cougar queen" - ROFL. Really? So, like Courtney Cox? 13. "No doubt the spy who had stole the dictionary" - typo: stolen. 14. "where the assassins had know his identity" - typo. 15. "A gasp, ripped from Ir’s mouth, was echoed across the entire room" - This is good showing of the significance of the Fe, which I think is worked back through earlier chapters. 16. I'm conflicted by the BK's speech. On the one hand, this is exactly the information that I have been wanting about what his plan is. I mean, I'm premising this is his plan: it sounds plausible as the sort of thing that his plan would be. On the other hand, I'm just not sure why he's telling everyone this information. Okay, I know why he's doing it, to try and shortcut to the tension in the city, but would he really lay bare so much of his plan? Dunno, I need to keep with this to see 17. I really, really like the description of her chopping the onion, and how it implies (I think) her thought roaming to other places while she goes through the automatic motions. Just one detail "A push of her knife sent a cascade of tiny onions into the yawning wooden bowl beside her" - she has not produced a lot of tiny onions, these are pieces of onion, the onion itself having been chopped up. Yup, I think this is better than what I read before. I can see the edits in terms of the explanation of what is going on, which is very welcome, and Ir's emotional reaction to the situation. A few drafting things, but not bothering with those at this point, really. Good job

Sooo, here we go (page 1) - I like the title of the series, and the title of the book is very engaging. It conjures a very definite and particular image of what the story will be. - Interesting to have quotes as an epigraph. I can't remember reading another example of that on RE in the time I've been here, although my memory isn't that good. Lots of other epigraphs, but not quotes (which I think maybe have fallen by the wayside in general publishing, but like any fashion, everything comes back around!). - Specificity - picturing the scene or action: In the first sentence proper (a) leaning again the wall sounds casual, but the character is reaching (it turns out), so, I think it would be better if they were pressed against the wall, would evoke better than 'leaning' the sense of effort; (b) layers of what? I can't form a picture; (c) "spluttering coolant system" - a coolant system is going to be an expansive thing: a pump of some kind mounted somewhere; tubes running to different components, or a motor, or engine, i.e. whatever it is that the coolant system is intended to cool. My point being, TD cannot grab the whole coolant system, only a part of it. The lack of specificity makes the scene hard to picture. - It's kind of weird that they built a wall to keep out a contagion, but maybe that depends on the form the contagion takes. In the present scenario IRL (which I admit I pictured), a wall would keep out infected people, but not an airborne contagion, unless the wall was airtight. Why does the wall need to be cooled? I find that disorienting. If it's just a wall, it doesn't need to be cooled, surely. - Because of my disorientation, and not really having a clear picture of the scene, I'm not immediate engaged by the situation. The description of the Al ("...looked more like rope") is the first bit that really engages me. (page 2) - The description throws me off, because I didn't get that TD was an Al. I didn't think that was clear. So, I thought it was a description of another race, so I didn't understand that is was TD that was pressed against the opening. - Mood and tone - I'm not getting a great sense of tension or dread at the thought of this contagion breaking free. The description is quite matter-of-fact, describing details, but not reeling me into the emotional stakes. I feel that it's reading a bit like they're changing a tyre. - "The worst think about people, is that when they don’t understand something, they assume it’s easy" - (a) typo; (b) I don't think this is true as a general rule. Sure, it's probably sometimes true, but IMO just as often people would assume it really, really difficult. I don't understand Newtonian mechanics (not properly, I've never taken the time to read/think about it), but I certainly don't think it's easy. I don't understand Turkish, and it doesn't sound easy. - Who is TD talking to? - "you push a button" - Yeah, I bit that it would be a very small proportion of any population who would think spaceflight is 'easy'. Sure, they'll take it for granted, but I don't think it ever would occur to anyone in that mindset top think that the process that made it happen was easy, which is how I read the comment. - What is a 'san'? Is it another race? We've had a description of TD, but not the 'sab'. - "cp suit" - This name made me laugh, but then it's referred to as a hazard suit, which seems like a more likely name that 'precaution' suit. (page 3) - "jerked their head towards" - There are instances of he/his, which threw me off, as I think you said TD was non-binary? - Why does the wall need to be so cold? How can he touch it? Okay, 'humanoid' parts would solidify and shatter at such temperatures, but I guess Al can tolerate that? But Sab cannot? - "didn’t mind the cold, but this was a bit much" - So, they do suffer from cold. - So, I guess the vapour is not poisonous to Al? Also, I presume the vapour as staying at floor level because it's heavier than air, but, is the guard not still going to be terrified and run off? I'm picturing a scene where I'm standing with poisonous gas swishing around my ankles. I am not hanging around there. - "going to finish the Al extinction myself" - Why does the Sab guard care about the Al extinction, or doesn't he? (page 4) - "stabilizing one side" - They're tightening the conduit back up, right? Fastening it back to what it came loose from? 'Stabilizing ' does not seem like the right word to me, it seems vague for describing what is happening here. - I struggle to believe that a properly engineered station would have conduits that could pull apart. What forces were acting on the sections of the conduits that were enough to separate by force? It cannot just have been (artificial) gravity, can't it? That would be some really shedding workmanship. And, TD was saying the they designed the station? I'm now thinking less of their abilities as an engineer, unless this was a workmanship problem. "not warped enough" - Again, I'm wondering how it became warped, what force warped a metal(?) spice/connector. - Get in? I assumed they were on the outside, and that the wall contained the contagion. The phrase 'containment walls' implies this, I think. But, in fact, it's the Al that are contained? And the Sab with them? - 'spacewalk' - one word, IMO. - "I’m going to say no" - I'm finding TD's tone quite sarcastic and not especially likeable. That's fine. The book I'm reading has no likeable characters in it (okay, maybe one), but it's really good. It's Grimdark epic fantasy, so that's not entirely unexpected, although not mandatory. However, I'm not sure if that its the intention with this character. So far, they've basically been all sarky with a guard who clearly is their intellectual inferior, and doesn't know much about anything. That doesn't take a lot of talent. (page 5) - "especially Al" - Don't understand this bit. Especially by an Al? - "how they all felt about it" - LOL. - CLANG: "figuring out who tried to break the containment wall" - I don't think it was implied anywhere previous that this was a deliberate act. I think there's some foreshadowing / clarity required in the early lines to show that it's an act of sabotage, which would greatly increase the stakes (which still need to be made clear). - "had built it much too well to just fall apart like that" - But it didn't fall apart. I don't think the language is clear here. The bold section is phrased in a way that sounds like TD is accepting that it did fall apart, but that it not what the wider internal monologue it saying. I think if you delete 'like that', then we're back to where I think we're supposed to be, in that they are saying it didn't just fall apart, it couldn't. - "short list" - of candidates, right? - "would lock every Al in a separate chamber" - I've get no sense of setting or scale. I feel like I barely know that they are in space, on a space station. Are they orbiting a planet? How big is the station? How many are aboard it? How long have they been aboard? Why are they aboard? All of these question feed into the stakes which I noted are lacking, or at least unclear, IMO. How many Sab are there relating to the Al? I don't want a long explanation, but the hard task at the start of a story is to establish all this framing stuff with an absolutely minimum of world-building, OR to have an opening scene that does not relay on any of that stuff, so it can feed in gradually as needed. - "carbon-based life" - not the first instance, but compound adjectives like this need to be hyphenated. - "It was the rare silicone based kinds, kind, that was in trouble" - Why the faltering here? I don't think it adds anything, and in fact, is it not 'kinds' plural? TD has referred to Sab-kind, separating them from Al-kind, but then they said that more than one race was in danger. So, there are at least two silicone-based 'kinds', are there not? (page 6/7) - There is a lot of new world-building information around here, introducing races and characters and concepts. The problem I have is that, because I don't really have a strong sense of the stakes, or of personal character stakes, I don't really care about any of these people or races. So, I've got too many questions - "had nearly forgotten being a null mind" - I'm not clear on what this is, from this context. - Why would a lowly attendant know where the general was? Why would they expect that the general was going to remain there for any length of time? - "hideous consideration from the Sab in attempts to make the space livable" - Confused: how is a winged statue a slight on the Al? - "3R" - Again, TD is shown to be superior to those around them, since they are 'clever' enough to know the exact location, which the It does not. It makes them look inferior, which plays on my dislike of TD's superior attitude. I guess that it's maybe intended to show TD's competence, and it's a good way of doing that, but add to that their attitude towards others, and it produced the problem I'm having. (page 8) - "was likely already talking to the General" - Oh, is that how the It knew where the General was? I didn't pick up on that. - "It felt obscene" - Ahhh, now this is good. Here is an emotion other than intellectual superiority and scorn. This feels more involving, IMO. "a mouth unused to the effort" - This too, very good world-building in very few words. (page 9) - "rested a hand on the take" - typo. - I feel like the narrative here is much more intriguing and involving than the first four or five pages around the incident with the wall fault. I struggled with clarity there, but here, with the description around the tanks, I am learning so much more of interest about the Al, their set up, their situation, than I did at the start. The narrative feels more natural, more comfortable around here. - "We need to leave" - Really good dialogue leading up to this point. Great showing instead of telling. I'm much more on board now. I wonder if the difference is that we are learning things through dialogue in the second half of the chapter, and it feels more natural than the more telling early part, which wanted for clarity, IMO. (page 10) - "No" - No what? "I haven’t asked yet" - Haven't been asked what? I'm confused by these lines. - "giving in the to impulse to escape" - typo. (page 11) - "It was time to find Ar" - This ending does not pack a huge punch, BUT, it's enough of a promise that we are moving on, taking direct action, for me to be happy with it, and to read on. Overall I think clarity is my main issue with this draft. It took a while before I understood what was going on, and there were various instances where I was struggling to picture the scene, or parse the events taking place. Another difficulty for me was the lack of investment in the stakes. TD (and the guard) are in a really tense and dangerous situation, but it never really felt like that to me. I think the reasons for that were TD's blasé attitude to the situation, and their grouchy dialogue, which distracts from the 'action' and dissipates any tension. You mentioned that you like Hard SF, but were not going to write it, but, we then dive straight into a fairly specific engineering/mechanical process. One possible approach would be to have less specific description in problematic places (e.g. where I had a problem with the conduit 'pulling apart', if you said that the conduit joint 'failed', it wouldn't matter so much how it failed (although, I might still be curious). For me, I want much more character involvement at the the start of the story, to be gripped by personal stakes, and given a strong , relatable personality before getting much of any world-building to have any chance of caring about the fate of whole races. I can't help feeling the story is rushing into the world-building before establishing the character and the innate tension of the underlying situation at a basic level. How does TD feel about the extinction of their own and other races? What family do they have to lose? What will the impact be on the people, but also the planet / solar system / galaxy? Why should I care about any of this? In short, I think there are significant issues with the first part of the chapter, whereas the second part is much stronger. I understand why the first part is there, but I think if anything the narrative could be simpler, more straightforward. Give the reader a chance to get their head round the world. What are the top three most important elements for the reader to understand, and maybe concentrate on delivering this simply and clearly? Interesting story though, and I am intrigued by this 'alien' race, which has some really interesting characteristics. Thanks for sharing

Hi Sarah, I'm keen to read this, and apologies for the delay. I think I'm going to head over to the resubmitted Chapter 1, if that's okay. Hopefully, it will give a slightly different perspective. Although, that's a big word count difference! Oh, and not at all worried about the subject matter.

...what Silk said. As is typical with hard word count limits, you'll see there is some discretion to go say 10% over without anyone giving it much of a second thought*. If you absolutely have to go longer, good form is to ask if anyone would mind reading a longer submission in a given week, and to try to avoid doing it on a regular basis. (* Does not apply to publisher submissions!!!)

Hey, @sniperfrog, welcome to RE. I’m always excited to read any new voice, also, it’s amazing what you can glean (I think), even from someone’s posts, about their basic prose, so I don’t have any worries on that front. My own background is related to construction as I’m a Civil Engineer by training, and a transport planner by profession, so there . I’m looking forward to reading your stuff. We don’t sugarcoat the feedback, but you’ll be used to that in construction!

Hey, that's my bad, I only posted them last night, so I'm sure you had revised the chapter already. Still trying to get caught up! Cool, yeah, it would be like having a really intense scene but cutting all the fighting which doesn't often work right at the start of the story, IMO. It would put a lot of weight on your descriptive skills, but I think they are there to begin with.

There were things I enjoyed about the first section, and my favourite moment in this chapter was the point at which I realised that the old woman was Al from the prologue, which you lose of course by cutting it. This set me to thinking if there was a way to keep something of the prologue and retain the moment of recognition.

Comments. (page 1) - LOL. I'm still not sure I have quite got the tone of the story down. This opening is very humorous, but there are other bits that are quite dark. Nothing especially grim as such. Still, this opening is well done: made me chortle. (page 2) - Good opening. I get a good sense of the heat. - Okay, so first page of the novel proper...there is a lot of joking and winking going on here. It's all very casual. A pulls the same 'gag' twice (sort of) in withholding info from his companions in order to make a joke, but he's doing that from the reader too. Feels to me like he's trying really hard to be the joker, and not being funny, really only managing annoying. There's a fellow on a stretcher with a bad head injury, lost in the desert (with limited water?), and he's is joking around. I'd be ready to give him a slap if I was one of the others, I think, certainly after any length of time. (page 3) - "You could have just said that in the first place" - Yeah, I'm with H. - Good description of A's upbringing, in comparison to the others. nicely done. (page 4) - I like the line about A being jealous of F carrying the stretcher, but why would A not relieve the female in the party if F is a massive brute, shoe presumably is stronger than H? Then, he tells H to shut up?! Seems a touch on the homophobia side to me. I don't know how else to read it. - I...what? The joking with H, okay I get it. Is she a ly-a-whatsit too? - "The heat actually was quite bad" - Massive understatement. You've spent a number of pages establishing the heat, so this line falls flat for me. (page 5) - I think you can cut down the number of instances of A's name in the second half of the page. I think there are too many. If there is only one man being referred to, 'he/him' will do fine. - The dialogue around here is quite boring, IMO. For one thing, if they are all really hot and exhausted, seems to me they would not waste words on inane statements. All the words, especially all the spoken words, should be doing work adding to plot, character, setting, etc. So, for example the "My thoughts..." line adds nothing, IMO. (page 6) - Four uses of 'had' in two lines is overdoing it, I think. Can easily cut 'some'. - "head rested on the wall behind him" - 'resting', IMO. - "It seemed an ominous sign to A" - (a) 'seemed' is a very passive and vague word, and therefore not very engaging; (b) We know we are in A's POV, so you don't to tell the reader it feels so to him, we know that intrinsically. - The recap of the ambush is okay, but action like that is always going to sound a bit dry when recounted later. I was almost skimming. I'm not suggesting you play out the attack, I don't think that would be a good idea, and would mirror too much the prologue. I just wonder if there is some interesting and innovative way to convey the same information that is more entertaining. - "seemed they had majorly underestimated" - Because we are in A's POV, and because he comes over as a borderline annoying adolescent, I'm going to grit my teeth and pass over this word. It can work in dialogue, of course, because characters can say whatever they want, but I think you have to be careful about using it in narrative. Okay, if it's used ironically, for example, fair enough, but IMO, narrative should be effective, elegant and entertaining, also, authoritative. I think readers want to be convinced of the writer's depth of knowledge of, and skill with, language. I don't think 'majorly' conveys that, TBH. - "Was this the same storm, following the bandits as they marched by in the night?" - Eh? How could that be? How did they get so far ahead of it if it is the same storm? (page 7) - "Thanks for the water before. It really meant a lot." - I feel that this is overplayed. It was just a drink of water, was A not going to offer it? Okay, you expand on the simple statement a bit, but since the nature of relations in this platoon is not established beforehand, we don't know if the sharing was a big deal or not. If they all bullied A, then him turning around a sharing water is massive, I agree, but if they are all friendly and cooperative, sharing water would be expected. - If he didn't......what? Frustrated at this being withheld. - "Someone was out there." - Passive: 'There was someone out there.' or better still, if you put it in dialogue or internal monologue 'There's someone out there.' - "He quickly pulled his sand goggles over his eyes and covered his mouth and nose with his sleeve" - Surely, he would do that before he went out, since he has experience in this environment. - "he realized with apprehension that whoever it was" - Not required. Let the reader interpret the tension in his realisation. - "He then realized that he didn’t really care." - (a) Same as the point above. It's his POV, this is unnecessary; (b) vague, suggest delete. The word 'really' adds absolutely nothing to this sentence. (page 8) - "But he didn’t think it was a bandit anyway." - Superfluous. - "Don’t worry, miss" - Missing comma. - "She’s your girlfriend" - Crude, #dislike. (page 9) - Something has been bugging me in these eight pages, and I have not been able to lay my finger on it: I think I just have. I mentioned before about not really feeling anything for the characters in the prologue, and that has largely true. The same issue arrises here. I've been finding A annoying, and don't really have much reason to feel anything for the others. What is there in them for me to invest my interest in? they are soldiers, in the desert, got ambushed, struggling to get out. I know nothing about their situation, what their motivations are, their life goals, their beliefs and the stakes in the world at large. So, what is bugging me though about what I've read so far? There is peril, tension between the characters, that should carry me a certain distance into the story. I realised at this point that this feels like a short story. In a short story, it's often the case that you don't get a great deal of character buildup, or world building, because there simple is not the space to do it. Here, we delve straight into action, and I'm expecting the events of the story to be the largest part of its substance (as in a short, often). However, the events themselves are not that surprising or unusual; they don't real me in a snag me. The things happening to date in these first eight pages are pretty much exactly what I would expect to happen in this situation. No surprises, no intrigue, no mystery, not to the extent that it snags me enough to draw me into a novel. - "was more of a true brown" - Hmm, racial coding proximity sensor alarm. How do you define 'true brown'? That could be shaky ground. - "snapped out of his reverie" - I don't think he was in a reverie, he was engaged in conversation with the group, which is not my definition of reverie. (page 10) - "scrape off the scales" - Hmm, I'm no expert on field cooking, but the meat would cook quicker if it was skinned first. Also, is the skin not going to be really tough? I'd have though they'd need to skin it before eating. I wonder how a bush-tucker expert would prepare......... oops, not going there. - "Behind him, the fire blazed as F blew on it" - it does not sound to me like the fire was going down. Unless they were lighting it from scratch, I don't think blowing on it will do anything. If it's burning enough to cook lizard, I reckon all they need to do is add fuel, not air. - "pinched a tiny bit of meat in his fingers" - The skin will hold to together. - "Oblivion,” she wheezed" - Oh, at this point I realised that this is probably Al from the prologue? - SOOOOOO, this right here is the first thing about the chapter that has piqued my interest. I agree that this is something you would want near the end of the chapter, however I'm thinking that it takes too long to get to this point (9 pages). I feel like what you have in the first nine pages could easily be compressed in, say, six pages. (page 11) - "She breathed out a protracted sigh, becoming limp. And then she didn’t breathe again." - Considering how good a lot of the description is, this is very weak and undramatic description of someone dying, IMO. - "It happened whenever anyone died." - I thought this was over-explained. I think it's pretty obvious what's going on. I'm not saying don't explain it, but I think you can give the reader more credit for understand that the old lady is passing, and fill in the more obvious details. - "After three years of fighting and dying" - This sounds like he's been dying, which he hasn't, I presume. - "for a few moments of memoriam" - RI really dislike this phrasing. The latin phrase is 'in memoriam', and I think it would read much better to replace 'of' with 'in'. - "collecting in around itself" - Typo: extra word. (page 12) - "now easily as big as she was, likely bigger" - Be specific, we don't care where it's slightly smaller or slightly bigger than she is. Be certain about details that don't matter, IMO. - "It physically hit into A" - IMO, these words are redundant, they don't add anything, the sentence is clearer without them. Also, 'hit' is a kind of lame word in this context. 'It smacked into A'. I mean, it has to be physical, really don't need that. - "He watched" - this sounds very passive, like he is removed from it, not actually experiencing it at all. - "it had all surged into him" - Kind of wordy, and jumbled, IMO. - The description of the critical moment doesn't work that well for me, for the various reasons noted above. This is about the only instance of description in the chapter that hasn't hit the mark for me. I think it can be more urgent, pack and bigger punch, through more effective word choice and clearer, shorter description. - "Besides that, it was reminiscent of M and his infamous genocide" - hard to feel much about this as I don't know anything about it. - "And I don’t feel Tel" - Why would he? I don't understand this line. (page 14) - "She had a quiet dignity to herself in death" - grammar. - "Sunrise" - Dawn, surely? Or twilight, i.e. when the sky lightens, but the sun is not visible above the horizon. Sunrise (or sunset) is defined as the period where the line of the horizon interrupts the sun's disc. - "They had stayed awake the whole night, apparently." - We know it's apparent, we just read it. Really don't need this. - "What an eventful day" - Today or yesterday? - "Suddenly, he spotted something" - IMO, this is redundant. The quickest anything can happen is by writing it on the page. Saying it happened suddenly does not make it happen any quicker for the reader. OVERALL I won't repeat my comments about the earlier sections of the chapter, as they are all noted above. The last few pages after the appearance of the 'old women', didn't really land for me. They should have been dramatic and exciting, wondering at the soul light going into A, but somehow that bit felt flat for me. I just don't think the description of it did the moment justice. Also, the reaction of the characters, all three of them, we really flat and unsurprised, almost emotionless. I think this needs more work, especially the ending. Thanks for sharing. I hope these comments are helpful

Nope. I finally kicked the habit last year, after I think seven years in a row? Having said that, it's a great resource for forming the writing habit, I think. Good luck!

I'm afraid the thing about to appear does not feature M a great deal, but she is in it. Another teaser!!

Ooh, I do like opening the first file from a new author. 'Every day is Christmas Eve' to quote a well known UK movie podcast (the Empire Magazine podcast). Welcome again, GingerReckoning (love that handle. I am excite to read!! And love a map, just love a map (page 1) - Great first line. I like it. Loads of questions bubble up. I has a nice punch. As I have no real gauge of your style, or the quality of the prose, at this point, I'm tempted to launch into full LBL mode (Line by line comments on grammar, punctuation, word choice, etc.) I just love to do that, but it takes time. I'll try and rein it in. I appreciate that not everyone wants that, and it sometimes (depending on the author) adds a lot of time to the critiquing. We'll see. Suffice it to say that, here, the second sentence is not a complete sentence grammatically Clearly, rules are made to be broken, however in doing that you need to have a clear intent, otherwise, readers (and critiques) will get frustrated, and editors/agents/slush readers will simply dump your MS and go onto the next one. Taking the first line, I'd go: "The night of the Chaos started with a party, as many disasters do." (I suggest 'as' because 'like' does not land softly on the ear, IMO.) - Don't worry, I'm not going to write 178 words about each line - Confused: so, is she the most powerful woman in the world? Unclear, IMO. Because she would not suppose this if she was the most powerful woman, she would know it for a fact. - "Months of a protesting populace" - passive. - "had double-teamed her, seemingly, " - (a) If you're writing fantasy, I would strongly recommend not using modern phrases, as it undermines any sense of setting that you create through world-building. Imagine watching Game of Thrones and Jaime Lannister says 'Let's double-team that dragon.' (b) This is her POV, she knows what has happened to her and what she is feeling. Using vague words like 'seemingly' in this context is very disengaging for the reader. - "He could at least pretend to have regal bearing. She certainly did." - I guess this means she is pretending to be regal. Not completely clear. It could mean she has a regal bearing, or it could mean she is pretending to have a regal bearing. - About a page in and I think your prose is decent, is uncomplicated, and therefore flows pretty well. that's good. The dialogue too is believable. I thin maybe (early days, too soon to judge really) there is a tendency for all the characters to sound the same, because of their speech patterns. A strong means of characterisation is to think about different ways or rather habits that each character has when they speak. One might use no contractions at all, another might use them all the time. If they are of different nationalities, the way in which a visitor from another country speaks the local language may be different in some way. - "twenty years past her prime" - LOL. Define prime please. I'm not nearer knowing what age she is really. Okay, she has grey hair. Maybe she's 60? Let me tell you that, the older you get, the more your definition of 'prime' changes - "eleven years old" - Ah, interesting. I did not get that immediately from his first line, but I can see it now. I'd maybe simplify his first line, maybe something like 'Why are you two (always) mopey?', because I think youngster use fewer words (and usually, that is to their credit!). - "His long brown hair was styled tonight, though it was usually just a jumbled mess" - This doesn't do anything, maybe even confuses the sense. I'd make this two sentences for clarity. 'His brown hair was style tonight. Usually, it was a jumbled mess.' - FIRST PAGE COMMENTS - Okay, so, I've got three characters, I know they're going to a party, and it seems like an official function of some kind. There is civil unrest, and there is going to be a disaster. This seems to be a very powerful woman, but I don't know what kind of power that is. The issue I have is that I don't know there are psychic power until I get to Page Two. That needs to be clear right up near the top of Page One. Also, there is going to be a disaster, BUT, I've forgotten that by the time I'm half way down the page. Fair enough, but I wonder if the lack of further mentions or dire portents erodes the impact of that first line. (page 2) - The name 'Kar...' made me smile. It does tend to specify the tone of the work as having a lighthearted feel, which maybe entirely what you're intending. - Repetition of 'since' in same sentence. I've seen such word repetition in mainstream published works but, to me, it's kind of clumsy, and doesn't flow nicely unless it's a dramatic device, which it isn't here. - "They were the future" - This line here strikes me as very important and worthy of appearing in the first half of Page One. Also, it define the relationship of these three, and confirms the presence of magic/powers which is equally if not more important. This paragraph should be much higher up, IMO. - Also: issue. If these two boys are her apprentices, how do they get to be important members of the quorum? I think these things are mutually exclusive. Apprentices, by definition, are in training and therefore not fully qualified to act in the field they're training in. I don't see how they can participate in 'running the show'. Okay, I can see one way. If the quorum membership had previously been decimated by some disaster, there might be a crippling shortage of people with powers to sit on the quorum, forcing the leadership into promoting these two. The thing is, if you're going to promote a junior like that, usually they would drop the apprentice tag, I think. - "“Yeah! Joseph said" - Typo: missing inverted commas. - "Ah. So they had arrived" - Has the carriage stopped? I missed that. - "She couldn’t claim this eagerness to her training" - I'd say this should be 'claim it for her training' or 'attribute' it to her training'. - SECOND PAGE COMMENTS - Interesting: continues to flow well. Narrator is somewhat unreliable in withholding info she know from the reader. I don't feel much threat, a bit of tension. The jury's out on tone at the moment, and stakes. Motivation seems clear enough, protect the people. (page 3) - If it's something 'big' surely it would not only be the partygoers who were at risk. - "earth-shattering" - Yes. This underlines my point about stakes and threat, I think. Also, there is a difference between 'earth-shattering' and 'Earth-shattering'. - "the whole future of the world hung by a thread" - Okay, 90% of all stories written seem to be about the whole world being in danger. It's kinda boring. Stakes need to be personal as well. Yes, we can have a backdrop of end of the world if we have to, but character stakes are more compelling, and can be more original. End-of-the-world is the low-hanging fruit of stakes. It's too easy, too ubiquitous. At the very least, the mode of destruction should be original, the means of the end should be inventive, and should be front and centre so the reader can evaluate the threat and be scared of specifics. E.g. (1) The world is going to end on Thursday; (2) Monitoring stations confirm that the San Andreas fault will be ripped apart by a massive earthquake and the western seaboard will fall into the Pacific on Thursday (Sorry, @Snakenaps, it's just an analogy!!). - "on the other side of the street as the partygoers" - from the partygoers. - "They shouted and chanted" - Who did? - "She had originally tried to crush the protests" - Whoa, whoa, whoa. This rocks my whole perspective of the premise. I feel it's set up that Al is a force for good, but crushing protests smacks of authoritarianism. Crushing the right to free speech, bad; engaging with protestors to hear them out and debate them*, good. (Okay, maybe not standing in the middle of them, but meeting with their reps at least.) (page 6) - "We’re heads of state" - I'm struggling with this. For one thing, really, there can be only one Head of State, in this case it would seem to be the leader of the SG, which is Al. It's been stated in her internal monologue that she was the one chosen. Also, these two being heads of state is kind of ridiculous, as they seem to know next to nothing. - "start the ******* cycle again" - Hmm, interesting. - "gods; They wouldn’t even know how to run a country properly without our help" - (a) This is not correct semi-colon usage. There's one before this too. I'd suggest not trying anything fancy with punctuation. Editors don't want to see fancy from a first time author. Keep it simple, IMO. These are two separate sentences. (b) You've lost me completely here. These two have done nothing to convince me that they know even the first thing about running a country. Plausibility is important. If something is implausible, like this (IMO), you need to have a really good explanation or justification of how this came about. Nobody in their right mind would choose these two to run a country and, if I was in the population, I'd be protesting too. It's not about power, it's about leadership; statesmanship; politics. (page 8) - "they got stuck" - Not very evocative of the horror of this situation. - "he saw them" - Who? What? Confused. (page 9) - "there was no reason to kill these people" - Hmm. I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop. J's POV is unreliable, right? The way I see it, the people of arguing for, protesting about and willing to fight for their freedom, and this room is full of a bunch of rich aristocrats that the people seem to see as abusing their influence and position? Don't get me wrong, I don't hold with bloody revolution or the excoriation of rich people just because they are rich, but what I'm expecting to happen is that G and J discover at some point that they are on the 'wrong' side. - "forcing all the heat he had just drawn from the air into the metal" - This is directly and offensively attacking the automaton. How is this different from using telekinesis? I don't see the distinction. - "hitting the heated portion of metal and causing it to cave in" - Neat idea. Quick thinking, but still seems to me like attacking with abilities. (page 10) - "He then quickly took care of the other automaton" - Who did, G or J? Unclear, IMO. Also, the auto goes down very easily. This is quite dismissive, considering they are fifteen feet tall. - "He’s trying to take out the old regime" - This implies a former regime to me, not the current one. - "But do we really need to stop them from making a republic?" - Yes! Good. This is good. M?C has doubts about the instructions he's been given. I'm pleased about this (see above), but...(see conclusions*). (page 11) - "finishing off the automatons" - Again, this sounds quite blasé, casual, easy. - "it was all a distraction" - Oooh, nicely done if this is the case. - "had gotten off" - Grammar: gotten off what? This form is inelegant, rough-sounding. I guess it kind of works with J's youth though. (page 12) - "He lighted next to the stage" - I'd say 'alighted'. - "He drew with his finger on the wall, somehow leaving a glowing purple line, as if finger painting" - Clunky grammar and phrasing, missing word at least, but this whole line can be simpler, easier to read. - See, when they are sitting in a carriage chinwagging, and you say the end of the world, it doesn't resonate. It resonate more here, in the heat of battle, especially since there has been a twist, also good. I still don't think this lands as effectively as it could do though, if we were more invested in the characters, the world, personal motivations, etc. For example, if J had an older sister who was getting married tomorrow and his father had just bought his own fishing boat, finally after years of striving, and there was a brave new alliance across the continent to promote peace and prosperity, and then the general is trying to 'blow it all up', the end of the world means more, has more weight. Here, we don't know the world, or the people, so the stakes don't really pack the punch you would want. The qualification that I would put on this is that, given we are right at the start of the story, there must be something more going to happen. Clearly, it will not be the end of the world, or the book will be very short, but this event might transform the world into something different. So, in summary, I'm kind of on the fence and interested to see what happens. - "though he laughed madly" - So, not emotionless then...but wait, "monotone and flat" - these things seem inconsistent, contradictory. - "And you never will,” The general" - 'the general', no CAPS. - "What was he talking about?" - New paragraph, IMO. (page 13) - "burst like a melon" - Excellent image, totally conveys the pressure in his haead. - "fell over himself" - Not quite sure what this looks like in this context. I get 'falling over himself to be helpful', but in a combat situation, fell over self seems vague to me. - "relaxed" - This sounds kind of...well, relaxed, as in not urgent and vital as I think maybe it should. It sounds more like he's paralysed. - "You will see" - Nicely maniacal dialogue from the general here. That's good. (page 14) - "Including herself" - Huh, weird. - "She was leaving them forever" - Huh? But she said she was dead. If she's not, why would she leave? - "than you did in this one" - They fought for a cause they believe in, how did they not have dignity? OVERALL Good style, clean and easily readable, which is no small achievement. I would say there is room for refinement, of course there is, there always is, but I think this is a really solid start in terms of style. Where I felt the overall effect of the prose / narrative could have been stronger was in 'drawing the picture' and giving me an image of the setting to imagine. I had a loose image, but only in very basic blocking terms. It's not yet a strong, colourful, sensory impression, IMO. The major issues that I have is that I don't really feel anything for characters, not much anyway; a little maybe. This is a really common problem in 'new' authors, IMO. Going straight into a fight before I am in any way invested in the characters, their motivations and their success, means that I don't care about the outcome of the fight, or whether the characters live or die, succeed or fail. In this case, I do feel that I've got to know a little about the characters in the few pages before the fight starts, the problem is that I don't get enough of their motivations, hopes and dreams. There are some decent personal details: finding a boyfriend for G, for example. But the little that I do get about their aims, I'm not sure I agree with it (as noted above). So, by the fight, I am still in the position where I don't care enough about the outcome. I think that needs more work. The thing that I think maybe you have done is show that J doubts whether he is fighting on the right side. Or at least he is maybe starting to doubt it? I think that needs to be better developed in this prologue(?), if my take is right. That the existing regime is bad (for the people), and that J perhaps agrees (or all come to agree) with the motives of the general, although not his methods of giving power to the people. The fight has its good aspects, and there are moments that feel compelling, IMO but, there comes a point at which the autos are just crushed and it's very easy, making the enemy seems tame and weak. Similar is the case for the general, who is just knocked over, although he does have a last laugh moment, it seems. The use of the magic powers is sometimes quite inventive, but it does not seem to cost the user anything. I appreciate there are some limits, which appear to involve linking to the gods, and yet I don't understand the limits. Okay, you say these are the all-powerful magic users, but by the powers not having limits or costs, it makes the magic seems to easy, I think. I enjoyed quite a bit about this, and I'm interested to read the next instalment, which I will now do!

A message primarily aimed at our new members, of which there are several in the last few weeks. When submitting, please label all of your files with your username. It just makes it easier to keep track, especially when there are multiple files attached. You'll appreciate the wisdom of this if you are here for a while. For example, I have an RE file on my Mac that has 1,621 files in it (folders per submitter, of course), and you'd be surprised how often being able to track back and check earlier comments or passages of a story comes in handing (for ongoing projects). You will also see that regular members are in the habit of including the submission date in the file name, which again helps when there are many weekly submission progressing through the same work, and submission of revised versions of previous chapters.

Welcome, @ima willshaper, and also @sniperfrog (tagging you in case you don't see this thread). And formal welcome @ginger_reckoning! Well done, you've passed the initiation test, which is finding this thread <cough>. Hey, @Silk, can 'we' pin this thread? (And by 'we', I mean your good self, of course, since I don't think I have pinning privileges.) (p.s. There is a scurrilous rumour that I am a writer also, although precious little evidence in the public domain recently to support said rumour.)

Hey GR, I'm really interested to read your stuff. I think I will go straight to Version 3, so you get a cleaner 'first time' view of that from me. No point in me reading the old version, methinks. Cool maps! Love a map.

Finally got here, apologies for the delay. Here are my comments, not having read the previous version. (page 1) - Line 1: interesting, engaging. - Line 2: very wordy and busy. There are seven 'verbs or actions' (one of them's a noun: journey) in this sentence, and I think that is what makes it come over as disjointed. I feel that you could just as easily say 'On the brightest night of their journey, O finally told S where they were going and why.' - The repetition of 'monsters' felt awkward to me. I do like imagery around here. - Since it's a short, I'll go LBL. "puffed tobacco in a long pipe", IMO. Also, seems to me he would sit down then puff the tobacco. - "uncomfortable..." - LOL. Nice line. - "a soul is immeasurable in its worth" - My head wants the phrasing to be simpler, like, 'a soul's worth is immeasurable'. I think it's a recency / primacy thing. In summary, the 'rule' that the most memorable parts of a sentence, or paragraph, are the start and the end. - Not sure there would be a fireplace. They are camping out, right? So maybe fire pit? (page 2) - "he drew his wand out from his pocket and pointed it among the stars" - (a) suggest deleting 'out', doesn't add anything, IMO; (b) I feel that pointing is at one specific location, whereas 'among' suggests various location. Could he point it at the night sky? Something like that. Again, though, lovely imagery. - "turned her old faster than nature" - phrasing tripped me up. I think 'made her old' would be more immediately understandable. 'turned' sets me up for a noun, I think. Like 'turned her hair grey'. In fact, 'had aged her faster' would the the clearest form, I think. - Double 'had' is always awkward. Right, but awkward. 'They'd had names' avoids the double had. - Oh, I thought it was meant that the lost children had names. - "Names were not spoken for fear of the things what knew their price" - grammar, or typo 'that'. Also, thing that knew their price...what? I feel that this form is usually accompanied by some terrible result. E.g. 'for fear that the terrible things would eat them.' - "They did not even have to be true names" - But if that's the case, then Sm and Dr would be just as dangerous. Any sort of label would be use as dangerous, surely? And Olb, that's a name. So, is he more powerful? There seems to be a contradiction here, because narrative implies none of them is using a real name. - Really nice description of how the protects herself against each external 'force'. Well done. The bit about the holsters is a bit wordy. What I would say in general is that there is a degree of wordiness that does tend to get in the way of clarity, sometimes. I suspect you could take 7-10% of the words out with refinement of narrative. - "Her eyes never quite..." - Nice idea again: many nice ideas, but wordy. "and for that he could never quite find it in him to conjure words". 'find it in him' adds nothing to the sentence, IMO. So much clearer if it was 'he could never conjure the words to bridge..." I won't mention this again. I'm sure you get my point. - "He’d sown that" - What? He'd sown the gap between them? I'm confused by this paragraph. It's reaching for a nice image, but I don't think that image is clear. I can see where it's going, but I think simpler would be better, still with the same image, just fewer conjunctions. (page 3) - "It was no good to die to the things" - I don't understand the grammar. - "somewhere a way’s away" - tautology: 'somewhere' and 'a way's away' mean the same thing. Delete one of them. - "because of all the ghosts what were milling about still" - Okay, is the narrative going for a old timer, uneducated tone, a la Old West sort of vibe? That would account for earlier instances of 'grammar'. The thing is, I don't think it's consistent in that tone, and sits somewhere in between, to the point that these (isolated) instances of 'uneducated grammar' seem out of place to me. - "and they came back an hour later" - Jeez! I guess they're not in a hurry, or the river is really far away. - "divined their next route" - I feel that journeys involve one route from A to B, and it's almost never a case of picking a new route each day. I'd delete this. (page 4) - "make as much of a fuss as he was able, just to rile up D" - I don't follow the grammar. Oh, wait, on third read I get it. Suggest the above addition for clarity. - So, I'm three pages in and I no pretty much nothing about the stakes involved. There are dead children, okay, and I've been told straight out that they're going to save the world. I mean, okay, those are the ultimate stakes, but at the same time, they're very, very generic. I don't get the feeling that the team is all that invested in the stakes. - "stare at them without a child’s malice for a long while" - This implies that child's malice is the norm, that children default to being malicious, but I don't think that's the intention. I would agree that it's normal for a child to stare at something strange without malice, but that's not what this line says. I'd say that something like 'stare for a long while in that way children do, without the least bit of malice.' is clearer. It's primacy and recency again too: 'malice' is the important word in the sentence, IMO, and would resonate more if it was at the end. - The description of the abyss is excellent. Really well done, totally felt like I was there, clothes snapping in the wind. Super. One minor detail, the speed: it screams across the plains (implying really fast movement, but then it's making slow progress. Those two references seem contradictory. (page 5) - "angry at walking so much" - I'd say. 'for' sounds like an apology (from small). - How did Sm run away on blistered, bleeding feet? How on earth did she run and run?! This is impossible with feet covered in bleeding blisters, IMO. (page 6) - I don't know what keeled means. Never heard it as a verb. - Description of the dead house is excellent. The little details (like the well and the dreamcatcher) totally summon the whole image in my mind. Nice job. (page 7) - "tantruming" - not a verb. If I came across this in a bookshop while browsing, I'd put the book back. I know there is excellent president, and completely appropriate context for making words up or taking liberties with language, but there are other instances where there is no need for it. IMO it adds nothing, and smacks of being a shortcut. - Nostalgia for an upside-down cross? Really confused. - "C-click" - Love it. Very 'on tone'. - "Iron...night" - This bit here is really, really good writing, IMO. - "Each arm was as long as Dragoon was tall" - Notwithstanding earlier comments, a good solid edit, refining language will make this a very sharp story, language-wise. I think efficiency of phrasing is a watchword in this story, and some of it is very good indeed, and yet there are other bits that seem way wordy. For me, this is in between, but 'arms as long as D was tall' has a clearer rhythm, scans better, IMO. (page 8) - "Sickly...sockets" - Fantastic. I love that. The line before it seems a touch cluttered. If it ended at 'tissue', I'd be happier. I'm not sure what to do with 'to pump. fl. musc.' - For me 'bolted' is a word that means 'ran away'. - "Licking...blood" - Again, this is A-grade grimdark description. I'm impressed. - The 'second' shot is actually the third, is it not? - For me, "by the thousand" implies the plural or rather the multiple (of thousand) and you don't need the 's'. In this form (by the...) it is usually the singular that is used (e.g. dozen). - "who tried to run for her" - 'to her' is more compelling, IMO. 'for her' has two possible interpretations (i) run for her to get to her, but also (ii) run on behalf of her. 'run to her' is unmistakable, I think. - "caught her in his clutches" - tautology, I think. 'caught' and 'clutch' are doing the same thing. You could say 'clutched her' and it would be just as effective. (page 9) - Another nicely phrased section, the scattering, but I'm not sure what 'to time' means. Like 'in time', 'across time'? I'm left a bit puzzled by what otherwise was a great line. - "Eventually O decided that it wasn’t worth the trouble" - This made me doubtful. I feel like you take that decision before you start digging. Pretty much everyone knows how hard digging is, even with implements. To me, you make that call before you start digging, especially with your hands, before you do the damage. - "what was left of her" - none of the things he's taken are part of her, so she's all still there. This phrase rang 'inaccurate' to me. - "He wondered if he had known her long" - This phrase implies to me that he 100% considers that he does know her, and it's just a matter of how long. However, the analysis that follows implies that he thinks he doesn't know her at all. I don't think the two are consistent (with each other). (page 10) - "It took the rest" - the rest of what? - "D's piece" - It took me a couple of goes to get the sense of 'piece' here, in a kind of modern, gangster sense. I thought it was out of place. Also, did D not have two pistols? - "A long time after..." - define long time. Ten hours; ten days; ten weeks? With nothing concrete in the story in terms of time frame (and I am no objecting to that), when a reference does crop up, it's hard to get a sense of it. - "the land began to shift out of" - This sounds like the land is moving from one environment to another: kind of disorienting. (page 11) - "The man walked over" - Over the river? Huh. Jesus? - "Frost edged...trailed...frost" - Yet another engaging image, but the repetition is awkward, IMO. 'The frost came from the ghosts which trailed frost.' The last bit is surplus to requirements. - The man came and sat, nothing happened, then they walked together. This bit seems like it doesn't add anything, but because the man sat, them suddenly walking threw me off my stride. - "If they over looked the men’s way" - grammar: I don't understand this. Typos? - "O told him his alias and everything that had happened until now" - Why would he do that? Why does he accept the man's presence so easily? I don't get it. Confused. (page 12) - I'm puzzling over this man a fair bit. I can't picture the image of his weapon. Enough detail was provided that I felt I should recognise it, but I've got nothing. And bright clothes? Bright how? Really clean (white), or bright colours? As soon as you said his name was 'A', I thought 'This is death, the grim reaper. Or maybe the devil.' - "Thousands of them" - Ghosts, right? - How does Sm know that she's the only one who can hear the hum? I don't remember this being mentioned when there were three of them in the group. - Also, seems to me that Dr was the only one who really showed any emotion, and that was fear. Now that she's gone, the remaining characters seem kind of emotionally blank. I don't know how they feel about what's happening. Sm goes missing. How does Ol feel about that? (page 13) - "scratched-on columns" - I could not figure this until I read the crossing part, but I think if you said 'parallel scratch marks' it would be way clearer. A column, to me, has thickness, but the scratches in a five-bar gate are just line, IMO, not columns. - Epicentre, I think, is a moveable think, and insubstantial thing, the centre of a storm, an earthquake or some other force. I do not think a fixed physical thing, like a desert or a trashcan (for example) has an epicentre. it has to be something that radiates a force, I would think, and I don't see a desert doing that. - "started to make for the dais" - What dais? Where did the dais come from? So, they've arrived somewhere? Confused. - "He’d barely gone thirty feet before he fell to his feet" - Knees, right? (page 14) - "And the deer bolted after the monster" - Wait, what? The monster was coming at Ol, when did it run away? So disoriented. - "pressed its barrel to her temple" - Why? Why is anyone in the story doing any of this? Why is she furious? I've got not emotional baseline, no centre or anchor to judge anyone's actions of motives against. I don't know what's happening, why it's happening, or why anyone is doing what they're doing, or why they came in the first place. There's no motivation, and it's difficult to process anything that happens because of that. There continues to be some very nice writing, nice images, and expressions, nice prose that has connected with me, but without motivations, without stakes, I'm afraid it won't pay off in any sort of meaningful way. - "spoke its true name" - How does he know that? Another instance of something happening for...reasons. Reasons I can never know or understand. (page 15) - The transformation into an elephant is so sudden it felt insubstantial to me, very easy, almost casual. Again, I don't feel the stakes, I don't fear for Sm. - "she'd gone" - tense confusion: suggest 'she was gone'. - "Turned out it was a pelt, not fur." - So? Some animals have pelt, some have fur. Seems irrelevant. - "Beneath was something a few steps removed from human" - But the beast was already removed from being human. - What is 'orbal'? - "curved out from along its arms" - tautology. 'jutted and curved out' is too, but I can see how those two terms each add something slightly different to the description, which from along doesn't. - "and dive-bombed the creature" - modern term spoils the tone, IMO. - "It was swatted out of the skies for its trouble" - (a) passive; (b) casual. - "A steady rapport of gunfire" - typo: 'report'. - A takes quite a while to come into the fight and start shooting, it seems to me. - Also, stakes. Okay, there's fighting, but why, what's going on, what is the creature trying to do? Without any POV internal monologue, or dialogue, it's all very figurative. Figurative stories can work, of course, but I think intent and motivation have to be crystal clear. As noted before, I don't really see much in the way of motivation for any of the characters. There are no personal stakes, just the world ending, but the world is always ending. I think many of the best stories do not revolve around the world ending, but the personal stakes of the characters. - "mustering through Ash’s onslaught" - typo? Mustering means assembling, so I don't really get the sense of this. (page 16) - great description of Ol feeling his wounds. - "The JT had to be finished." - But it is finished, surely? Sm went through the gate. Do they all have to go through the gate? As noted before, I don't really understand what they're trying to do, and why, or what constitutes success. - "They smiled decaying rictus grins and reached for his eyes with fingers formed into clamps." - Great image, very scary. But, I think this is an excellent example of Primacy and Recency, and putting the right word at the end of the sentence, and the whole section. I think the effect is much more chilling if this is rearranged a bit, like this: 'They smiled decaying rictus grins and, with fingers formed into clamps, reached for his eyes.' This way, the stakes in the sentence, and the full horror lands right at the end. - This section with Sm feels very passive; I feel distanced from it. I don't get to hear the people speaking, I am simply told what they said, like I'm not there, but only hearing about it afterwards. - "She said she didn’t know, but that the woman she was with wanted the world to be saved." - (a) If she doesn't know why she's there, what am I supposed to think? (b) This is Dr, right? It sounds like she's still there with Sm, suggest 'had been with'. - "gripped his wrist in her own" - wrist has nothing to grip with. What are they doing? Are they just shaking hands? Presumably 'hand' can replace 'wrist'. Or, are they doing one of those cheesy barrier handshakes? That would be super cheesy, and how would Sm know to do that, she's no warrior (from the evidence of the story). - Creepy image at the end of the section here. Nice surprise, unexpected. But, 'had her by the stomach' sounds weird to me. (page 17) - "They piloted the meat to the invader" - Eh? What on Earth...? None of these words go together. 'pilot', okay, steered, guided, fair enough, I can live with that. But what meat are we talking about? I don't know what's going on. And what is the invader? Oh, the beast, creature, shaggy thing, okay. - Who is they? Last occupant? how can they just flip the beast over, it was massive, was it not? What and who are they? I don't know what's happening. - Eh? - What is neg-inf? - Eh? OVERALL I know stories like this get published. There is some very good writing in it, and there are bits that I think need fixed from a drafting perspective. My main issue is that I never felt any character motivation, and I never understood the stakes. It never felt like the end of the world, and if it was, so what? None of the characters seemed to have any reason to live, or die. Apart maybe from Dr. Ultimately, I don't like getting to the end of the story and feeling confused, disoriented and not feeling any emotion or attachment to it or the characters. I don't know if anything I've said is in any way helpful, but I hope some of it is. Good luck with it.

Agree. Hard agree. Thirded.

Comments. Chapter 19 1) Seems logical to me that we would get the image of the sky after the shutter were opened. Also, 'the start of the season of rain' I presume? Not the whole of the season. 2) Nice description of the season, and all the little traditions. Nicely done, and very nicely segued into Ir's activities. There is one issue. See opens the shutters, but Ir and Sue appear in the scene, but there is no reference to Ir going to Sue's house, although there is mention of her being outside. The blocking is the issue, it's not joined up and is disorienting, IMO. 3) Ir vs. Sue - all the tension is gone, it seems. The breakdown of the relationship between the sisters was a real strength of Draft 2, but it seems to have gone. Sue does not harbour simmering resentment. I know you've said that you have issues writing conflict and tension, but seriously, an author has to have that ability. Those components are essential to a good story, any kind of story in any genre. If your palms are sweating as you write it, probably means you're doing it right. But that you have too write it. 4) "The musicians fired for incompetence" - You've got my comments on this concept already. I just don't believe it would happen. I think it's more likely they would be demoted in some way, but anyone with any understanding of music, would not fire their musicians after introducing a new component that doesn't work, IMO. I mean "Pe berated for incompetence" - this doesn't make sense to me. Pe has had no control over this situation at all, not input to it. So, let's say that this is irrational fear on Ir's part. I think I would have less issue with it if that was called out, maybe something like 'Ir shook her head. Perhaps she was being irrational about the consequences of her own failure. Why would any of the others be punished when it would so transparently be her fault? She would be the laughing stock, but all their reputations still would be tarnished.' Dunno. These are my feelings. 5) Oh, Sej has appeared. So, they are at Ir's house? It was Sue's presence then that was confusing me, and probably just me conflicting Draft 2 and 3, because I think Sue had left the house already by this point in Draft 2(?). Anyway. Don't pay me no never mind. 6) "Her entire family and friends followed her to the palace gate" - Yeah, I will always find this too much. Even if it was just her family, I think I could tolerate it, but it's just too saccharine for my tastes, but then I like Grimdark, so no surprise probably. 7) "she felt a piece of her family’s armor reawaken" - I don't understand this. It's Ir's armour, the family just gives it strength. I just don't think it's a very clear analogy, or metaphor, or whatever it is. 8) There are a lot of good description in the chatper, I think. The tension of the musical performance is conveyed well, I think. I think what is missing is plot. The chapter very much has an arc in and of itself, in the form of Ir's first musical performance. And, it's nicely conveyed, good emotions of nervousness, family support, togetherness of the musicians. And maybe these things come into play later, the thing is I suspect you could cut this whole chapter and not really notice it in terms of the plot. Every chapter should affect, influence or colour the plot in some way, I feel. 9) Yes, cutting the first POV (Ir's) when Mar plays the first notes, that's very well done. I just wanted more plot in this first part of the chapter. I'm not even sure it would take that much, maybe just a reference to the Rev spy possibly being present in the audience, and a thought about where this deployment of her skills might lead to. Remember to foreshadow future events. You can drop a big, fat reference to something happening in the future in terms of her wondering, or being concerned about it. 'Where might all this lead?' What was the point of her playing with the musicians anyway?'; that sort of thing. 10) "In his peripherals" - Ahem. Peripherals in this sense are computer components like scanners and printers, etc.: peripheral vision is peripheral vision. You could just as easily say 'at the edge of his sight' and not have to deploy and strange buzzy modern phrasing that throws me out of the story. 11) "and the slavering influential." - Slavering, influential what? Missing word, methinks. 12) "but that could come with time and training" - Uncertainty is not compelling: suggest 'would come'. 13) "The BK played the long game." - Okay, there is something deeply weird going on in that is seems her is referring to himself as the BK in the POV. Is there any reason in his own POV that he cannot be thought of as Az? Clearly, he knows his own name, so surely it would not be unnatural. 14) "those who had put their careers on the line" - As noted, I don't buy this. Maybe 'put their musical reputations on the line'. 15) You've nicely captured the elation of a live musical performance. (I have been there, although it's been a few years. It's a feeling that is very hard to beat, right @Silk?) Chapter 20 1) "I am amazed a chef of your caliber doesn’t like beer" - ROFL I don't spend enough time praising the positive. So, here goes. Throughout the book, IMO, the character voices are incredibly strong. Each has a distinct voice that shines through their dialogue and description. I moan about a lot of things (I don't suppose you've noticed that ), but that's one aspect I only very rarely find myself wanting to comment on. Nice work. 2) "S and T weren’t scheduled to show" - I'll drop in again that the tension of Ir's family situation seems (much) less in this Draft 3. 3) Hmm. I can't remember from Draft 2 if Til and Sue turned up for dinner when J was there. Setting that aside, there is reasonable tension in this scene, but not as much as there might have been, IMO, because the relationship between Ir and Sue are better in this draft than Draft 2. This is compounded when Sue introduces herself and Tal to J, in a way that is quite plane, and therefore seems normal and polite. I would expect anger from Sue, her storming out of the house, and railing against J, at least saying something bitter or not being willing to speak to him. For these reasons, the scene seems weaker than it could and should be, to me. 4) "Sorry" - I'm really struggling with this 'declawed' Sue. She was so much fiercer and more--I think--more believable as an angry revolutionary in Draft 2. I'm sure she was. I can't imagine Draft 2 Sue apologising. She didn't, did she? 5) "breathe a sign of relief" - typo. 6) "If I may offer a word..." - This whole paragraph: J is very wordy and his grammar is untidy. I know it's dialogue, and maybe he's nervous, but still, needs polish, IMO. Also, 'attacking back' is retaliating. 7) "It’s just another thing to worry them.” Encourage them, she meant, but didn’t want to say" - I struggled a bit with this, as I don't see what the project would worry them, particularly, or why (or rather how) it would encourage them. I don't think the potential implications of the project, or the legends (horror stories) of the Fey are sufficiently ingrained in the story to carry the required weight here. 8) I'm not convinced by the ending of the chapter. (a) Ir seems to me to be too forgiving to hold a grudge against J like this; (b) I really don't get what she's so angry about. he was trying to do a good thing. This plays back into point 7), above. (c) Is the northern project not supposed to be a secret? Maybe it never was, and maybe it's just not in this draft. I like how there is discussion of it though, I just need it to resonate a bit more in term of its in-world significance (see below). Overall The slice of life is well written as always. I think probably it could still be pruned a bit, refined, streamlined. Then I get into various issues with Sue's attitude, which seems to be more uneven than I remember, going from passive to aggressive in no time flat. I think it is good that the barrier and the Fey are coming into things more, but I want the cultural significance to be clearer, maybe through more explanatory thoughts from Ir around the references. Something like 'She couldn't believe J had brought up the subject of the barrier. Okay, Sue and Tal had, but he had encouraged them, talking about that hateful place. The children would be up with nightmares for nights to come, maybe some of the adults too.' And each time the barrier is mentioned earlier in the story, just some kind of thought that underlines its nature, what it represents to the people of the region, its history: laced through the narrative.

Harping on is what I do best, as you know

Seems to me that maybe it'd be more useful if I dive straight into Version 2, so that I'm unbiased by the comments here (which I haven't read), and 'immune' to the changes made. So, I will do that.

It's like reading a Robinski 'joint', except that would be driving a talking Had the same issue in Draft 2, in places. In other places, it was fine. I think it's just an editing thing. #iagreewithmandamon, big style. Yeah, and don't be afeared of it being a longer chapter. I felt the musician background with a bit too detailed. This feel like the sort of stuff that the author needs to know, but the reader does not. But, if the chapter ends up being 5,500 words, or it's 2 x 3,000 words, no complaints from me either way.

Hah, I am only wildly behind on the this thread. Comments: Chapter 17 1) "surly strings" - Excellent. I like the description here in the opening. Well done, and sets the scene nicely, emphasising his sour mood. 2) "stone fortress...stone by stone" - That's a lot of 'stone'. Could say 'block by block' (for example) to avoid the excess. 3) Nice simile with the minnows. The usual analogy is that minnows are small and harmless, not worth the hassle, but I like how you've tweaked it. Also... 4) Nice display of his magical ability. It's been many chapters since we saw it last, so this makes a nice reminder of (part of) his power. 5) I'm not doing LBLs, really I'm not, but..."with the cold calmness his facade demanded" - The cold calmness is the facade, surely? This sounds like tautology to me (sort of). 6) Another LBL, but really, I have to stress this. The lack of some form of separating mark between the POV sections makes me trip hard over the switch which occurs right at the page break. To some extent this is a typesetting thing, BUT, imagine an agent or publisher reading your MS and tripping over this...'Wait, what, M's birthday...What's happening?' I strongly recommend developing the habit of inserting a section break (like ' *** ' or maybe ' # ' between your POV sections to avoid this disorientation in the reader. 7) "would not only mean the loss of C" - I don't think I agree with this. I don't remember the contract saying anything about her having to be successful at the tasks assigned to her. And, "and, for the musicians, their careers over" - not sure I agree with this either. It seems overdramatic. They might take a while to recover, but a musician could still get a job in a band or orchestra, even if only sitting at the back. 8) Pedant alert: I would say that a doorway is always open, it's the door the opens and closes. 9) The language in the first library paragraph is rather untidy: "introduced them to those surrounding the table" - clunk. 10) But...I like the tension introduced immediately to this encounter in the form of the spy potentially being present. Good job. And then the actual spy is right there!! At first, I thought this was weird, too sudden, but because it's unexpected, I think maybe it works. Very good tension certainly, and Ir's stress, her dilemma, is convincing. 11) "Don’t switch sides" - I don't understand this line. There's no chance of Sue changing sides, that must be completely obvious to Ir, and nothing in what Sue said suggested that's what she was going to say. Oh, from reading on I think I get that Sue meant for Ir not to change sides, but...hmph. Difficult to align my emotions correctly having finished Draft 2 already. 12) The stuff about her falling, again, it makes no sense to me, and should not make sense to her. Why would the BK set her up to fail when he needs her to be in the position he has put her? It's not logical and I think Ir is smart enough to see these thoughts make no sense (IMO). 13) Yeah, her emotions at the end of the chapter feel forced. I accept her being stressed about the upcoming concert, but all the musicians being under threat doesn't play for me. It feels like forced tension: artificial stakes. I could go with Ir feeling stressed about not performing adequately, and not being able to fulfil her real purpose for the BK, and therefore him terminating her contract, but not the bit about all the musicians' careers being over. Damaged, yes, the progress, reputation and earning being set back, probably, but not the end of careers. Chapter 18 1) "However, with nine days left..." - This is not a new section, is it? I'm basing it on the line break. Starting it with 'However' is not good. 2) "kneading endless amounts of bread" - You knead the dough, of course, not the bread. It's the old 'What do you put in a toaster?' joke. 3) "when she came in at a song" - I'd say 'when she joined in a song', or, you could say 'At which bar she joined a song', which is better, because it implies growing musical knowledge on Ir's part in that she knows to use the term 'bar'. 4) "If she didn’t blend in seamlessly with some of the best musicians in the province, the restaurant wouldn’t be finished, everyone from Carcella’s would lose their salaries, and the musicians" - As noted before, I don't think these stakes are believable. 5) "More than that, however, was their sense of humor" - More what than that? More reassuring than that, more valuable than that? Word missing here. 6) "played off of" - I'll comment on this till my last breath. I remain 100% convinced that you will not see this form used in professionally published literature. It's clumsy on the tongue, inelegant and unnecessary. 'remark that J played off' is perfectly clear and adequate. 7) "It was incredibly fascinating" - This seemed a bit over-much to me. 8) "who went around in the evenings and lit all of the sconces and candles until the palace" - How do they light the streets of Bor? Is this not common practice? 9) "Did she actually help..." - What else would she be doing? How could it not be a help? I don't understand this thought. 10) "fell a foot from her face where it cascaded off of the rooftop and splashed onto the stone ground" - I mean, just tell me it doesn't sound cleaner, smoother, better. In fact, personally, I would replace it with '...cascaded from the rooftop...' Also, there is value in being more specific, making the words work harder in terms of description, e.g. '...cascaded from the rooftop to splash on the stone path.' for example. 11) "not because of its lack of popularity, but its sheer exclusiveness" - Phrasing. This says that the BT is unpopular. It say it has a lack of popularity. But that's not true. I'm sure it is very popular with the segment of society that can afford to patronise it. Suggest replacing with 'not from a lack of popularity, but...' I'm sorry. I've lapsed into LBLs, but you know me well enough by now to know that I struggle to read past this sort of thing, and I WILL bust your chops about it, early draft or not 12) "that the BT made up for its lack of color on its exterior with a rainbow collection of artwork" - Top style tip (that I stole from the Death of 1,000 Cuts podcast). Don't describe what is NOT there, describe what IS there. As in 'the BT made up for its monochrome exterior with a rainbow collection of artwork'. Actually, I well 'collection' is a bit week. Suggest something like 'coruscating rainbow of artwork', something with more pizzaz. 13) "she would never be wealthy or influential enough to be allowed admittance" - Oh, oh, miss, miss! Please let this be a loooooong foreshadowing of a day, maybe in Book 3 (at least) when Ir has risen through society to the point that she can afford a membership of the BT bathhouse. That would be soooooo awesome 14) "anyone else considered worthy for bathing in the sewers" - grammar/phrasing: this doesn't make none sense, under mine opinion. 15) "lackluster but serviceable houses" - NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!! This is not Ir's voice, IMO. The passion that she has for her family, IMO, has always included a very, very special and strong image of the family home as the centre of her world. I do not believe that she would ever think of it in this way. Modest? Sure. Serviceable? Maaaaaybe, but she has too much love for the place to think of it as lacklustre, IMO. 16) "Ir followed the thrust of her nose" - Cows don't have noses. I don't see it makes any difference if Pe is a therio or a...what's the word? Cows must have snouts or muzzles or something other than noses, don't they? Oh, they've got muzzles, it says here... https://sites.psu.edu/rclambergabel/tag/scorecard/ 17) "It was much cheaper to hire your neighbor, who was capable of following given instructions without needing his own army of servants" - I don't know what this means. I don't see what it adds. Cut it, IMO. I get the point that people with carriages are super wealthy. It's not a concept that needs a lot of explanation for the reader. If you explain obvious stuff, the reader will think you think they're dumb. 18) Whoa there. Ir gives only a partial name, but Pe states the whole name. I was going to throw a flag on this, BUT, I then remembered that Ir sees the name that the being considers to be their true name, I think? (See, I've been paying attention ). The thing is, would a being not consider their true name to be their full name? Why would they consider a truncated version of their full name to be more true that than the full name? Seems counterintuitive to me. 19) "Pe began leading the way towards the palace" - Compare: 'Pe led the way toward the palace." Directness is more compelling, flows better and is easier for the reader to follow, IMO. 20) "he surely already knew of" - Knowing of someone, is not the same as knowing their name. The point here is that the BK surely already knows the bankers name. (Sorry, in full LBL mode now, but dang it, just, because. 21) Hmm. Cut the last two lines and finish the chapter on "Why were name so important?" This is a much more compelling end to the chapter than going back to the performance, which the reader has been beat over the head with for the last several chapters(?). This is more important plot-wise, the knowing of names. I think it makes a much better, more tense and intriguing end to the chapter. Overall Good chapter. I can't remember how these scenes were shaped in Draft 2, but I thought this read through well.

Ah, yes, the old 'Can you outrun a lion?' joke.

Lol. That's hilarious. How may, though?

Of course, you really must survive teaching first. At least get all the boobytraps planted around the classroom (in case anyone turns up in person), and make sure the snipers are in position. Yeah, I weakened, but I'm trying to do this critiquing 'lite', where I don't get drawn into line edits, so that I can keep pace with RE stuff. I mean, I have no excuses when there are two subs a week ATM, pretty consistently. Seems that when I concentrate on my writing, I struggle to critique, which was not always the case. #alwayslearning