alder24

The setting simply changed, now they all play "floor is lava" everyday which I think is hilarious a very interesting setting to discover for a modern society, as now they all have to adapt to the fact that the ground burns them and all water will likely evaporate. But I agree, the Shroud was cool. It's sad it's gone now. Because Nikaro told her to make her own choices in his world. You really dislike her that she went shopping when she didn't have clothes at all and had to wear some weird things? You made this argument earlier, that's why I bring it up. I was angry at Nikaro for not even having a thought to take her immediately to a shop to buy her clothes. At least he could have told her how to properly wear those clothes. This wasn't a problem in her world. I was also frustrated at Nikaro for allowing her to sleep on the floor for so long, instead of giving her his bed - he didn't need any bed! I said it in a different thread already, this wasn't her character arc. Her arc was about being Yuki-Hjio, who has responsibilities and has to sacrifice herself, or Yumi, who can choose for herself and simply be happy. Yumi dying in a sacrifice would destroy 400 pages of her character development, and all of the times where she learned to choose, to be happy, to love, to have friends and to be Yumi - all of this would be in vain and she would be back to page 1. Hoid emphasized that she wanted to be real and stay, and that was to complete her character arc. She already made a sacrifice, she was sacrificing herself every day for 1700 years, one more sacrifice wouldn't matter.

Kelsier does it now. Maybe not sharing but hijacking. I agree that's a lot of power that Hijo have, or maybe we still don't know what Connection can do as Dalinar does barely anything at all with this. I think Hoid actually translated their years to Rosharan years to make it easy (not confirmed), so it would be like ~1900 years. We don't know how long a year is on this planet, so it might be that a year is the same as on Earth but has fewer weeks in it (unlikely).

They don't look like that. They are weak CS, need investiture to stay in that form, unlike Fused and Heralds. Inspired maybe, copied no.

It's possible he brings back their Identity, but I think his perception reinforces their personality, overwriting the will of the machine and allowing them to stay like that, as now there is someone else that remembers them as they were, that knows who they were and who they are. I think this is more likely than bringing back their Identity somehow.

Oh right, I keep forgetting about it.

Where did this 700 come from? I know Fused were earlier than Heralds but why by that much? Thanks, I found it. He still changes timeline so it isn't set in stone yet:

Yumi by staccking so much rocks in her first chapters was able to attract a real spirit that was trapped by the machine. Painter also attract spirits attention by going after that dangerous Nightmare and saving the kid. This spirit ask Yumi for help and connected them together.

7000 years. RoW ch 80, 82 epigraphs: Right. We need to know how many years Warbreaker is before WoK. At one point he said 300 years or so, later hundreds and was happening at the same time as AoL, but AoL now is in between SA 5 and SA 6 so we don't know it anymore. It's at least 20 or so years before WoK as Adolin trained with Zahel.

Right, I've misread it. I agree with that theory, but don't have rep to give you anymore. I dislike this rep limit so much! Every time I read a book that was already out for a few months in English I have dozens of posts to give rep to but can give only 20 per day! It runs out so fast.

Now we know every Nightmare and Yumi was a CS before destruction of the machine. I disagree only about the double CS part, she didn't die again. I think this was simply stretching into the Beyond (the shroud was physical, it would look different when fading into the Beyond than what we've seen so far - it's more similar to what's Nightblood's smoke leaking out of it looks like, it still fades into the SR), combined with Nikaro attracting her like she attracts spirits with stacking rock, and using perception to shape her a physical body like all painters do with Yumi's conscious decision to stay and be physical. At that point she was ready to sacrifice herself, as that was the sole purpose of every Yoki-Hijo, and she was Yoki-Hijo. Because of that she thought she needed to fade and was going to do that. However Nikaro attracted her and made her realize that she can be just Yumi, she can be happy for herself and she has a choice - that was the entire arc that Yumi went through - be Yoki-Hijo or Yumi, in the end she chose to be Yumi. Additionally, it's very likely that despite her soul's investment, it's the machine that kept her connected to either PR or SR, which all CS need to have, otherwise they will fade into the Beyond like normal souls. This connection was severed but Nikaro reestablished it with him and his painting, giving her a choice. We know - Rashek and Vin. Edit: not that they died as CS, that their souls were so invested that they could stay. CS likely have the same choice again, if their body was killed, or they fade into the Beyond like normal souls when their connections to PR or SR was removed, like Kelek said. Now I think about it, killing the body of Returned would fade their soul like a normal soul (their body is the connection to PR, and they don't have connection to SR which would sustain them), so this example of Vin and Rashek is wrong. Better example then is Jez, who just faded. I fully agree. To add more, the spiritweb stays in SR almost forever, even when a person dies and goes into the Beyond. It's still there. Yumi's spiritweb is still the same before and after the epilogue, that's what Nikaro attracted. They have personality - that's Liyun - usually overridden by the machine when in the Shroud, but once hunting their personality comes back slightly, as the machine doesn't control them that much. But it was said the identity was gone, Ch 39 (notice uppercase I):

Technically Shades were first, maybe all Shards just copied it. But tbf they all would know this is possible even before the first CS was made. The power knows.

I think the answer to why they are Cognitive Shadow is a bit technical. To add to Treamayne's response, for a CS to exist they need to be anchored to all realms. And this connection was granted by the Father Machine. As soon as it was destroyed, this connection was severed and all CS quickly faded into the Beyond. Because each Nightmare had to feed 13 times or so to become really dangerous, I think that normal, unfed Nightmares were relatively low invested, possibly even below Returned. Only the machine kept them as CS. RoW ch 92 epigraph:

Navani wants to share the knowledge with scientists, not everybody. Fused will keep it to themself and never give it to people or Singers, as that would give them a weapon to kill them. No we're not. We have a nuclear winter. If everyone has nukes (this assumption is stupid for multiple reasons, but your thread, your rules) it takes just a few people who are willing to use it and don't care about consequences. There are potentially millions of people ready to die for some extremist cause. Give them nukes, they will blow as many people as possibly just because they can. Give sociopaths nuke, some will use it. In your scenario you literally can't prevent them from doing that. There are people who will shoot other people when they want to commit suicide, give them nuke, they will vaporize entire cities. And some will just blow up empty fields and forests for fun, because they can and they have nukes. You can’t stop those people no matter how hard you try. Depending on estimates, you need just a 100 of them with 1 Mt nuke. That’s why this assumption is just weird. Once you give everyone nukes it’s over. You can’t have any police or control after you gave people WMD. You have to prevent them from getting them in the first place, which is very doable, and your arguments against that are just bad in my opinion. A vacuum tube isn't easily accessible. I want to point out that it was called "a Thaylen vacuum tube, from the Royal Institute of Barometric Studies" (RoW ch 97). This sounds expensive and exclusive, only few could afford it, only when Thaylen agreed to sell them. If Thaylen seals them off, nobody can make anti-light. Tuning forks were a state secret for who knows how many years, Anti-light won't be easily accessible. Side note: this vacuum tube makes no sense for me. Shouldn't the light be attuned to its tone via SR not PR? In that case vacuum would make no difference.

I think it was the other way around. Heralds' madness, which was due to them being Cognitive Shadows for thousands of years, became noticeable and people attributed it to Ten Fools. This probably caused some recurrence effects, where people's perception of Ten Fools worsened Heralds’ madness, and this strengthened people's perception about fools, which worsened their madness and so on.

Yeah, that makes no sense. I think this has to be connected to identity. Maybe if you blank your own identity, all your connections are blanked too? But connection is like a string connecting two things, on your side it's keyed to you, on the other it keyed to that object - blanking your own identity will unkeyed it from you, not that object. You have to somehow unkeyed it on the other side. I have no idea how to "unkey the land". You can't just give it aluminum medallion... Or just like with nicrosil, Feruchemy and medallions differ when it comes to connection. Maybe with medallions you can have a blank connection but with Feruchemy you can just store it fully or mostly?

R.I.P. Mercy world So sorry to hear that.

I think this is more complex than that. Yes, as @Treamayne said the bond was already there, specifically in the Spiritual Realm as it's timeless. However this is not the sole reason. This blade represents far more. It would mean he would become a lighteyes, and he already distrust them because of Roshone's actions. At this point Kaladin didn't hate lighteyes that much, as Amaram in his mind was still an ideal and fair lighteye. But I think the line "If he took that Blade, he'd become one of them" isn't about becoming a lighteyes but a Shardbearer. He just witnessed all his friends, kids half his age, people Kaladin swore to protect, being slaughtered in a blink of an eye, without Shardbearer even noticing them. This blade represents not only all of those it killed, but also the conflict between his father and him - the difference between mindless killing and protecting. Till this moment Kaladin was fighting to protect, not to kill. He held moral high ground and was true to himself. If he were to take the Shardblade, he would become what his father feared - a killer. Person who slams into enemy's ranks and slaughters hundreds of them without even looking at them, giving them no chance to survive. That's not what Kaladin wanted to be. He was too honorable and had morals preventing him from picking it up. His spiritual connection to Syl only helped him feel it more. But yes, to answer your question, his bond with Syl was present in SR. It was always there.

I wouldn't be surprised if she has an aura of colors around her, but people on Roshar simply don't notice it because they don't recognise it. Also Dawnshard's effects are similar, not the same. She doesn't have to have it. But with Radiants don't showing any visible effects of investment I was more or less talking about color and sound recognision, the same things Rysn showed. Right, which supports my position that Radiants and Mistborn are similarly invested. Right. That's why I'm skeptical about Radiants of 5th Ideal being so much more invested than those of 1st one. Maybe there is a difference, but I think it would be a relatively small difference, not something huge. They definitely wouldn't be as invested as Returned, not to mention Heralds. I would say they would be more than Era 1 Mistorn, but on the same level as Lerasium Mistborn, like Elend. Good catch, I didn't remember the draining happening there. I think the difference is that Yumi is giving spirits while Cusichesh is taking. But that doesn't really change anything. We still don't know what mechanism Cusichesh is using. It doesn't really tell us what Yumi is doing. I would say that rather than forming a bond with spirits, she attracts them by stacking stones, which anchors them to PR and this makes them grateful enough so they are willing to manifest in PR by Yumi's request. But to manifest they need investiture, and this drains Yumi. Whether Yumi as Yuki-Hijo is always bonded with every spirit or she is just invested with Virtuosity's investiture to the point where she can interact with them is another question. Yuki-Hijo for me seems more similar to Horneater's Sighted or Singers than Radiants.

Don't do that. I apologize if I was too harsh. Share your theories if you want, it's always fun to discuss. Criticism is simply a part of it.

He confirmed it in 2017, look at the WoB. Per another WoB, "you're not supposed to be able to guess it", that's because she lacks description as you've mentioned. No, Khriss is confirmed to be a native from Taldain's Darkside. She is a scholar, she has no reason to lie about it. She isn't a Feruchemist. She is way older than Catacendre, as the White Sand novel takes place relatively early in the Cosmere timeline, the earliest of all books. M:SH ch 2.2: So unfortunately for you Khriss is confirmed to be from Taldain and the mystery Terriswomen is confirmed to be Lemex's nurse. Please avoid double posting. If you want to add something more to your post, click edit option at the bottom of your post:

She isn't Terris. She's from Taldain and calls it her homeworld and was a main character in the White Sand novel. And just to point out, Terriswoman doesn't mean Feruchemist. You mean this WoB? Look at the footnote. There was a mystery Terriswoman in Warbreaker, which is Lemex's nurse. We still don't know what her name is and where she is right now. My bet is on Aslydin, Demoux's spouse. She is a member of 17th Shard and has "her own work throughout Cosmere". Both her and Lemex's nurse were providing medical attention which I think is a clue. Where she is now is unknown, maybe Roshar as everybody seems to be interested in it?

Fair point. You mean Rysn? She does. Look at the last WoB of that post. She was invested because she had sworn 2nd Oath (I will be free). Stormlight. And Stormfather direct intervention. She could only stay for minutes, Stormfather allowed her to ride the Storm and persist for hours. He invested her. RoW ch 116 Is there any clear confirmation that Radiants of higher Oath are more invested when it comes to their soul? Yes, but one method to become a CS is to simply be highly invested. There is a threshold. How much invested we don't know. I think it's reasonable that if you're as invested as Returned, you will stick as CS. But that's just one option. I think they might already be considered as weird CS. They aren't, they are something different, but this might be close enough to prevent them from becoming CS. What? Could you elaborate more? My point was that not everyone on Threnody was that highly invested to become a highly invested CS. So something else is happening there, investing them when they're dying.

Right. I simply wanted to point out that the government can restrict access to the tech so people simply won't throw nukes in every bar fight as you implied in the first post. In my opinion you've vastly overestimated accessibility of both Harmonium and Trellium. This doesn't mean that there wouldn't be any criminal organizations ready to put money into it and make one, but it won't be that common. And I've found this quote, so I'm throwing it here to end this.TLM ch 4

For Taravangian it would be a chance to make new terms, this time favorable to him, and prepare a better champion. He was very displeased with the terms of the contract. Well, few WoBs and Hoid himself mentioned that he is breaking agreements and now lacks protection - I guess he has to pretend and look as if he isn't breaking them, so Odium wouldn't perceive that and be able to do something about it. Odium knows he's involved but not to what degree, as long as it stays that way, Hoid is fine.

Good thing that Awakening can detect inactive investiture. Just build a big radar station in the middle of the city, problem solved. In Era 4 of course. Then they would be stupid as this Atium would be used against them. But this is off-topic. Rashek only needed to control the amount of Atium on the market. By getting their pilot license... What the heck are you talking about.? Where did you get "every day" from? What is this? Are we talking about the same thing? You're getting a license for acquiring a limited number of Harmonium devices, like 3 primer cubes, all of them have a trackable serial number. You go to a specific shop licensed to sell Harmonium devices, they sell you 3 devices and note this on your license. You go home, the police stop you on your way for routine control, they ask if you have a Harmonium device with you, you say yes, you give them license, they check it and check the state of devices and their serial numbers. You go home. You use them. One of them breaks down or is depleted. You go back to the shop, give it to repair, they send it to the manufacturer who fixes it and sends it back. A routine federal control comes once in a while and checks the state of your devices, checks how they are managed, stored, used, maintained, or if somebody tried to open them and access Harmonium. Everything is fine, You go on with your life just fine. Or if you want to limit it even more, only renting Harmonium devices. You need a license to rent a device, you need to state the purpose and the time period, they check you and give you them and after the time passes you have to give it back. Of course they are subjected to random controls. Or better - ban all use of Harmonium, allowing only federal officers to use it. Just like you don't give battleships to random citizens, you don't give airships to random Scadrians. Nobody said that the Malwish tech had to be accessible to everybody. Actually we've never seen a Primer Cube being depleted. Investiture comes from Mistborn, not from Harmonium. It does. The Basin can't get Harmonium from Malwish. The Malwish government controls it. End of the story. He was part of the airship crew on a mission. Again, Hunter's mission. Literally a military officer. How do Malwish use it? There are almost no Metalborn, they don't need Primar Cubes. They use it for ships - which are owned by unknown entities. We don't know what Malwish politics looks like at all. For all we know every ship could be owned by the government. We know nothing. That's a pity that Malwish stopped selling cubes to the Basin, proving my point. We know who got Wayne's fortune - an overworked single mother. Do you think she will start walking around with 10 bodyguards, or simply appoint people to take care of this business? For now Ghostbloods are too small to do anything about it, which Kel admitted. And he knows how dangerous the power in a wrong hands can be. Set literally proved it. She retreated, giving back the world to Harmony. If Trellium was so easily accessible, how is that possible that only Set members had access to it? Why not random people in the streets? Do you really think that Trellium will just lay on the ground for random people to pick it up, considering how Atium was made in era 1? Even Brandon in the WoB used the term "investing" for the lack of better words. That "anarchist" made long preparations to leave a government ready to take control after TLR death. Good thing that neither point 1 or 2 prove him wrong. And Ghostbloods still don't share anything with non-members. They don't trust random people, they won't give information like that to the public. I'm talking about the US. Congressmen can gain access to sensitive information but they can't disclose them to the public. That's why I said "people in power will know". And just because they can access information doesn't mean they want to or that they will understand it. The outer cities for now seem to be a bit separated from the government. Lerasium isn't information. And who knows if his "democratization" of power doesn't include only Ghostbloods members. This is a real possibility. You don't see him throwing jars of Dor to random people. Random people having nukes in their pockets isn't what he wants. He wants to protect Scadrial and this is directly against this policy. You don't give WMD to random poeple.