[OB] Full Book Reactions / Full Spoilers Thread

[Guest]

@Starla Well it is highly implied and I have no idea how else they would have escaped a Kholinar full of listeners and Fused.

Edited November 22, 2017 by SLNC

[Kurkistan he/him]

It's also possible that they had some amount of time between Kaladin getting Shadesmar'd and when they lost their powers. It's also also possible that Kaladin being right there—albeit in Shadesmar—was sufficient to count as them being close to him.

Edited November 22, 2017 by Kurkistan

[Starla]

@SLNC I thought that at first, but then wondered why they wouldn't lash everyone to the Shattered Plains oathgate if they can surgebind. Kaladin could use gravitation after the second oath, and they've been practicing, so it should be possible if they have stormlight. Maybe there were too many people to carry.

@Kurkistan Interesting theory about keeping a connection to Kaladin when he's in Shadesmar. It's not truly another place. I guess he would have travelled out of range after a few days, but it might have worked for long enough to get them out of Kholinar.

I was also wondering why they travelled down toward the sea in Southern Alethkar. It seems like a random place in the middle of nowhere. 

[straits]

9 hours ago, AngelEy3 said:

I'm a little disappointed in all this anti-love triangle talk. Hasn't anyone here ever been even remotely involved in one? Nobody has experienced not being sure of what you are feeling? Or who around you might be better for your future or your goals? No one has been attracted to two people at the same time for differing reasons? 

It's inherently divisive because in the triangle, someone is going to get trod on. In this case it was Kal, and Adolin might be in trouble if he keeps exacerbating Shallan's condition by fraternizing with Veil and accepting her as real. 

It's definitely a real and, to many, relatable phenomenon, but that doesn't make it good or enjoyable.

[WhiteLeeopard she/her]

4 hours ago, Starla said:

Also, how sad that little Gavinor has haunted eyes. I wonder how much he will retain of what happened at the palace. Perhaps this sufficient trauma for him to attract a spren. ("You get a spren! And you get a spren!...") 

He'll probably remember nearly all of it . 3 or 4 years old is enough to remember and to have a huge impact for the rest of his life. I knew a child that had a turbulent childhood until 3 years, then lived with his second aunt's family, who loved him very much and gave him stability. But it still took him at least 5 years to stabilize. Even then it was obvious he was never going to be a "normal" child. 3 years is enough to affect the rest of your life, even if its through memories of memories. 

[Hiadin Haloun he/him]

8 hours ago, manugutito said:

They had to get their Surges from somewhere if they were to use them destroy their old planet, I guess. We only know of three Shards that give access to Surges, although that doesn't mean there can't (couldn't) be others. I think we only know of four Shards killed by Odium, however (Ambition, Devotion, Dominion and Honor). Sel is not destroyed, so that one is discarded (or maybe Elantris happens before SA?). Or maybe Roshar's humans come from Threnody's Fallen World? (Although this is a destroyed continent, not a planet, but again, I can't recall if Shadows... comes before SA or after).

All we know is what Mr. T released.  I think the humans came from sel. My reasoning is the shin.  The man who runs the lighthouse is shin by description, but he is korathi by religious affiliation.  The first humans were given shinovar as a haven/settlement.  Odium followed close on their heels, and he has been trapped on Roshar since.  I don't buy that the humans originally worshipped odium.  But the singers thought he was because he came with the humans.  Remember Sanderson wrote Rashik as an evil man for two books straight. We didnt realize the truth till book 3.  The truth you are told early on is not always the truth of the cosmere just someones perceptions.

[thejopen27 he/him]

Finished on Sunday evening, after a couple days to reflect:

Dalinar meeting Odium in the vision, Dalinar meeting Cultivation in the Flash-back. I loved the Cultivation scene. I thought the flashbacks weren't quite as powerful as WoK or WoR but the Cultivation/Nightmother scene where he asks for forgiveness is really powerful. 

Kaladin meets his family, brother, Kaladin arguing with Jasnah, the memory (not flashback) scenes, I did not like his end fight with Super-Amaram. I thought it was a bit too much. I liked all his interactions with Azure

Azure! All the Kholinar stuff was great, including the Hoid story of the Girl with the Scarves. I loved how he turned it around from Shallan's negative telling. It seems to tell of Humanity trapped in Shinovar outside of the Stormlight and going out into the rest of Roshar.

Shallan was tough to read, in a good way, like how Kaladin was tough to read in WoR.  I didn't like the split personality thing, but it works to get her to her end. I did like when she fought the Midnight Mother.

I loved the Jasnah-Renarin confrontation, I loved Szeth and Lift and Nightblood, I loved the Ash-Taln scenes, I loved the Brandon-Avalanche, Unity! also Unity?

I called the Dawnsingers=Listerners/Parsh, and that they were native and at first welcomed humanity before being corrupted by Odium. The humans probably started the war though. I thought the secret behind the recreance was underwhelming (maybe because I guessed it separately, not that that was THE secret though)

Tanavast seems to have been fading into Honor by the end. Rayse seems very much still in control. Those letters from Shards to Hoid were fun. I don't know the first, but the others must have been Autonomy and Harmony.

I loved all of Venli's stuff, I was shocked Eshonai was really dead, but I think it's better because it's Venli. I think Brandon may have intended it to be Eshonai but changed his mind. It's clear Odium doesn't care about the Singers but is just using them as means to an end. The Singers are the true owners of Roshar, but Odium still needs to be stopped and I anticipate the future books involve Dalinar and Venli seeing common ground. Venli is a Willshaper and her spren I would guess is a Lightspren/Reacher. (Exploration, Adventure, Resolve, and building relationships).

I did not like reading Moash chapters but I understand why they're there and we got interesting insights into the Fused. Jesrien! (called it, oh and also Tezim=Ishar [who is up to no good and I think is working for Odium] and that Dova is a herald!) Is Moash going to be the new Champion of Odium? It feels like it. 

I'm not 100% sure what's going on with Malata. I was wrong about the Skybreakers. The Stone Shamanate and the disease on the Purelake got put on the back burner. Some light set-up for future Jasnah book (a mysterious illness, a lonely child-hood) Szeth went Ice-skating, I thought Szeth would reject the Skybreakers and become a different order. Nale is still crazy and broken, just differently. I think Shallash will become a Radiant of a different order (Dustbringer? Malata doesn't seem like a central character), still wondering what's up with Rysn, I still think she becomes a Radiant. 

I did not realize at first the consequences of the end. Odium has chosen the contest of Champions and his trick of turning Dalinar failed. I would guess book 5 ends with the contest of Champions and Odium is rebound. 

[splinters]

I finished OB on Sunday, but it took me a few days before I was able to get here. I'm a periodic lurker and very rarely post, but this book got me pretty excited.

Initial reactions:

Dalinar's backstory leading up to him being confronted by Odium was heart-wrenching. I really thought for a second that Dalinar would become an incredibly powerful and evil Blackthorn--maybe even bond the thrill unmade (don't remember its actual name off the top of my head). I had some serious heart palpitations during this scene, and it didn't help that my son was having a minor surgery at the time. His first battles gave me the chills--especially when he was about to kill Gavilar and when he chased down that archer. When he showed himself to be a horribly neglectful father, it made me sick (especially since I was wondering if that had lead Renarin to bonding an Odium spren). Also, his excommunication scene was pretty powerful to me too.

Teft's story was really heart-wrenching. It is too bad that becoming a KR doesn't help with psychological issues (I wonder why the bond doesn't help? I mean we do know that at least a large portion of psychological issues are heavily related to chemical imbalances in the brain.

Szeth and Nale both are experiencing symptoms that commonly occur to people leaving cults (anyone else here watch the path?). Having grown up in a fairly controlling religion, I totally understand why neither of them trusts their own judgment and why it would be easier to simply obey _____. Nale reason for Odium makes sense with the whole divine mandate from conquest argument, but it is still stupid. And although I understand why Szeth doesn't (thank you Nightblood!), I think the biggest plot hole was why he chose to follow Dalinar, and why nobody seemed to have a problem with the assassin in white as head body guard of Dalinar. The best reason I can think of is because his death seemed so important to Mr. T and because of the way he fought in WoR.

Lift+Szeth+Nightblood=best threesome in any Sanderson book yet.

Does anyone else think it is crazy cool how Lift was able to hack Dalinar's visions and that she was able to make it through the Thrill to Dalinar without any issues? I wonder what her exact relationship with the cognitive/spiritual realm(s) is/are.

I really liked where the plot took Kal. I think it was a big deal for him to learn to be confident in himself. I mean, he was acting like and storming hanging out with lighteyes! That's a big deal! I'm also happy that Brandon didn't push him into swearing his next ideals... I really didn't feel like he was quite ready yet. I also don't think that his 4th ideal is quite as straightforward as "I accept that I can't save everyone, because I'm not a god."

Shallan was wonderful in much of this book. She continues to be one of the most interesting characters to me. I loved her development in the first half of the book and her in the battle scene. I really missed her banter with pattern in the last half of the book though. I am also unsurprised that she decided to go with Adolin. Although, I personally think all three of them should just get together. I mean Shallan could handle it, Adolin seems a bit gay/bi, and Kal could use a little extra love. But I think something like that would be a bit of a stretch for Brandon. Really glad he included a gay couple in this book and that it isn't a big deal (even though it is really sad that one of them dies).

I really didn't see much development from Adolin, other than getting to know just how obsessive he is about his clothing. I mean he is a high prince and he knows how to sew? I was also happy to see his relationship with his shardblade/spren grow. I'm hoping that he becomes a cousin to a KR and not a KR. It would make for a richer world in my opinion.

I loved all of the cosmere stuff. I can't believe that we got to interact with characters from so many worlds and magic systems in one book. And props to hoid for gathering up that cryptic spren. It seems to me that he would fit in the best as a lightweaver as he seems to be very self-aware, and already has abilities very similar to that of light-weaving. It is also the least limiting of the orders (that we know of), and if anyone can figure out how to travel out-of-world with a spren, it would be him. I also liked his interactions with Shallan. It seems to me that if Shallan were millennia old, then she would be like him.

Jasnah-F&ck! She is totally the most badass character in these books. Kal and Dalinar may be warriors, but she just downed so many people without even trying. As a scientifically minded atheist/show me the proof type of person, she really stands out to me and I wish there were more of her in these books.

Some small things that I want to learn a lot more about:

Szeth training with all the surges.

What is Aether, and how did the washer woman get it out of clothing.

The island of Aimia

Spoiler

No wonder Hoid is so peeved with the survivor for closing the perpendicularity on Scadrial--that is where they get all their food in the cognitive realm ( I don't think anywhere else has canned food do they?).

Perfect gemstones that are common in the cognitive realm.

The fact that rock and Lopen are part parshendi (how does that even work?? They doesn't have gemhearts do they?)

Also I want to hightlight how cool it is that Brandon is so inclusive as a writer and also remarkably progressive. He included: A gay couple, multiple people breaking gender norms, heretics, atheists, Renarin (who is on the spectrum), multiple people without limbs, addiction, paralyzed people, etc. I think these types of things are too commonly overlooked by authors. It really adds to his world building.

 

[Kelsier96]

On 14/11/2017 at 0:08 PM, Leyrann said:

On one hand, I agree that it's nice to have a non-Radiant in there, but on the other hand I want to see him revive Maya, and I don't think that's going to happen without him becoming a Radiant (Edgedancer to be precise).

Why Edgedancer?

[Leyrann]

Just now, Kelsier96 said:

Why Edgedancer?

Because Mayalaran, in the Cognitive Realm, is described the same way a Cultivationspren (like Lift's Wyndle) is described. We also had a WoB for confirmation already, and in the Mayalaran thread (which is somewhere on the first page) it's also been discussed that Adolin has done a few Edgedancer-like things where he focuses on details over the greater picture, which we know by WoB is an Edgedancer thing.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Kelsier96 said:

Why Edgedancer?

Fits his personality and actions, plus his Blade is a mostly-dead Edgedancer spren. Would fit.

[IllNsickly he/him]

Ok... Finished.. Damnation Employment even interfered with the AUDIOBOOK. Storms...

Dalinar is my favorite character. Hands down.

"I shall fear no Evil, for I am the meanest (insert favorite colloquialism here) in the Valley."

Introspection is a Bastard. Though, I dig Cultivation's 'Big Picture' plan; Relieve His Burden for now, allow Him to grow. Then... Reality Hammer, STRAIGHT TO THE FACE. Awesome growth mechanism. I am honestly amazed that it didn't backfire.

'You cannot have my pain.' The Oath that hits me the biggest. There was more stuff said, but my first listen I didn't hear much right after this. Storm me if this wasn't his Oath.

Teft, with his 'Even if the One I Hate is MYSELF' yep big ol feelers.

UNITE THEM. I am a bit torn right now... I am sure it has nothing to do with the Alethi or the Radiants. My suspicions are now either; the Realms (which we saw) or the Races on Roshar (4? Perhaps 5?) Humans, Listeners, Crustaceans and Aimians (both flavours). Not dropping Hybrids in the list because, well, I'm not.

I like Shallans growth here. Later in the book we see her change personas mid sentence (Shallan, Veil, Radiant) almost fluidly. Definitely a start at Merging, says I.

On Bridge 4 producing high proportion of Radiants. When a Broken man inspires a group of Broken men to be Better, you should not be surprised when those men... Glow...

Jasnah is exactly what I expected her to be. This is a Woman who has weathered some serious Storms. Whatever the business was with Amaram, her Father was Storming ASSASSINATED ~40 yds from her, someone has been trying to assassinate her for ?? Years. And then, when she finally accepts a Ward, her trust is betrayed (this is a Principle thing). Oh yeah, Sword through the heart, Shadesmar tribulations... And then plays Professor in the middle of the biggest battle we have seen since A Memory of Light. Jasnah's blood type is (Awesome+). Lift has a few Realms worth of catching up to do.

Highmarshall Azure. We are on book 3 of 5 (10.) I feel like her introduction here is perfect. That is all.

Venli's Redemption Arc. Just like I wanted to see. Gravy, with no lumps.

Moash...... Well, someone had to take Venli's place....

Elhokar. I am sad. I SCREAMED at him in WoK 'YOU ARE BETTER THAN THIS!' The very scene he begins to show it, Exit Stage Left. Sadface.

Renarin... 'And he nodded.' Dude knows his head and spirit are not jiving. This man is NOT weak. He knows that he is a massive liabilty. He knows his cousin is ready to eliminate the threat he represents and ACCEPTS it. 'Strength before Weakness.' Renarin is Dalinars Son, in Will and Spirit, if not Physically.

Adolin. Steadfast, Solid, Dependable. When he feels inferior or unnecessary, he is contemplative... Unless he sees a need for action. Then he is his Fathers Son. Minus the Thrill. I am in the 'Don't become Radiant' camp with Adolin. I want to see him help Mayalaran (?sp) heal from her Recreance wounds, but not to the point of Nahel Bonding. At least not in Arc 1... I want more internal stuff from Adolin.

Does anyone else hear Balacavalata from Dr. Who saying 'NO!! Mayalaran!!' When Adolin calls his Blade Maya? I know I did..

Mraize is still Demandared in my reckoning. Bit parts, minimal screen time with highly suggestive backdrops... Yep, Demandared.

Szeth is perhaps the most devastatingly Broken character to date on Roshar. We NEED his backstory.

just my pennies on the pile.

I definitely need a solid read through, E-Book style and another Audible go.

I am not talented as an author, so I do not critique, I simply enjoy. 

 

[Khyrindor he/him]

Well, I finished the book. I skipped reactions for part 4, cause I had to keep going. 

Man, was that a journey. Well, done, Mr. Sanderson. I'm going to reread all of  SA soon so I can dig out secrets and determine which book is my favorite. I'm suspecting Oathbringer.

I wasn't able to binge this book, and I didn't snag in a reread of Part One (cause I got Part Two a week early), so I can honestly say this book has been my journey for months, since the beginning. It was an amazing few months, digging through the pre-release chapters with all of you, and then having to avoid spoilers for the last two weeks.

This amazes me above all: Brandon's ability to keep me guessing and keep me wrong. After all these years I thought I knew all his tricks. How naive I was. I let myself think multiple times that I knew what was going to happen. Firstly with Part three when I predicted Kaladin and Shallan were going to activate the Oathgate and bring in Jasnah and the other Radiants to save the day. We know how that ended. A beautifully painful scene that left me truly worried for our cast. I'm impressed with Brandon's ability to make me start to like Elhokar, though I'm quite upset that he was just one word away from being the hero he dreamed of being.

The next bit that surprised me was in the climax. And it was the complete opposite. I was completely sure that Dalinar would painfully let himself be Odium's Champion and figured he thought that Kaladin would be able to defeat him in that. Luckily Brandon pulled the rug out from us, and finally have someone other than Kaladin save the day. This really was Dalinar's book. Having so many Radiant Orders standing United will be a highlight for me, I think. An amazing picture.

Another thing I loved about the book is that each character is fleshed out in unique and interesting ways. Backstories, hopes and dreams, flaws, and strengths. Rock stuck out to me first: I swear he is the only thing that holds Bridge Four together. Then we see his family, heartbreaking and hopeful at the same time. His story culminates in killing Amaram to save Kaladin, sacrificing his own morals for that of his Bridgeleader's. A little theory I concocted is that he may grow to be another Bondsmith, though I'll have to see if this stands up in the reread.

Teft was also amazing to me. It showed us many important things in world, and skills at Brandon's writing. Teft's self-hate and shame controlling him right till he swore the third Oath. His spren was so patient with him. And his chat with Kaladin towards the end: "We lift the bridge together, Teft." So many good quotes in this book.

That's all for tonight. My hard copy should be here within a few days, so I'll write down more cohesive thoughts when I can leaf through to scenes I've doubtless forgotten.

 

 

[Dragonangel]

So, does anyone know why Sadeas started hating Dalinar so far back in the day?  I mean in the first flashback, Sadeas said that he didn't know if a rockslide would kill Dalinar and low and behold, later a rock slide tried to kill him.  Why so much hate when they were working together for the kingdom?

[manugutito he/him]

9 hours ago, Hiadin Haloun said:

All we know is what Mr. T released.  I think the humans came from sel. My reasoning is the shin.  The man who runs the lighthouse is shin by description, but he is korathi by religious affiliation.  The first humans were given shinovar as a haven/settlement.  Odium followed close on their heels, and he has been trapped on Roshar since.  I don't buy that the humans originally worshipped odium.  But the singers thought he was because he came with the humans.  Remember Sanderson wrote Rashik as an evil man for two books straight. We didnt realize the truth till book 3.  The truth you are told early on is not always the truth of the cosmere just someones perceptions.

The lighthouse owner is a good argument. However, I suspect that anyone without an epicanthic fold will look Shin to Alethi people.

Also, since Elantris is post-Splintering of Devotion and Dominion, with (I guess) Odium having already left the Selish system, the timing gets a bit confusing. Not all of Sel's humans leave for Roshar? If Sel is not destroyed (there are people living there after Odium left), why do they say Roshar's humans destroyed their old world?

[Fulminato he/him]

52 minutes ago, manugutito said:

The lighthouse owner is a good argument. However, I suspect that anyone without an epicanthic fold will look Shin to Alethi people.

Also, since Elantris is post-Splintering of Devotion and Dominion, with (I guess) Odium having already left the Selish system, the timing gets a bit confusing. Not all of Sel's humans leave for Roshar? If Sel is not destroyed (there are people living there after Odium left), why do they say Roshar's humans destroyed their old world?

honor, devotion e dominion aren't the only shard odium killed and splitered. there is another shard odium destroyed. perpapsh the original world of rosharan human was the planet that shard inhabitant

[Necessary Eagle she/her]

7 hours ago, splinters said:

Really glad he included a gay couple in this book and that it isn't a big deal (even though it is really sad that one of them dies).

Drehy doesn't die. He shows up at the end with Gavinor.

[manugutito he/him]

1 hour ago, Fulminato said:

honor, devotion e dominion aren't the only shard odium killed and splitered. there is another shard odium destroyed. perpapsh the original world of rosharan human was the planet that shard inhabitant

I argued that posibility before in a previous answer to Hiadin Haloun:

20 hours ago, manugutito said:

They had to get their Surges from somewhere if they were to use them destroy their old planet, I guess. We only know of three Shards that give access to Surges, although that doesn't mean there can't (couldn't) be others. I think we only know of four Shards killed by Odium, however (Ambition, Devotion, Dominion and Honor). Sel is not destroyed, so that one is discarded (or maybe Elantris happens before SA?). Or maybe Roshar's humans come from Threnody's Fallen World? (Although this is a destroyed continent, not a planet, but again, I can't recall if Shadows... comes before SA or after).

I don't know if there is a fifth Splintered Shard, however. 

[Edgeborn he/him]

On 11/14/2017 at 4:31 AM, Leyrann said:

I know he doesn't have to be (I personally don't really care one way or another; I think both make for a good story), but the best fighter + the best combat Surge would allow for even more awesome fighting, no matter how you put it.

 

On 11/14/2017 at 4:32 AM, SLNC said:

And would introduce an incredibly overpowered character, who would reduce the suspense in every combat scene he is involved in.

 

I disagree, I think we're going to experience a lot more overpowered characters soon, simply because of how stupidly powerful the Fused are. With the Unmade bonding to men, we could have more monsters like Amaram walking around, and he almost killed Kaladin before even adjusting to his new power. However, there is another possibility that leaves me intruiged: what if Maya returns to sentience WITHOUT bonding directly to Adolin? He could end up wielding a shardblade just as pure as Syl, but without surges. I have no idea what that would mean, or what kind of benefit it would lend him (since the only advantage Syl has outside of surges is her ability to change forms, and Adolin definitely likes Maya as a sword) but it would doubtlessly be an important step towards reconciliation. Also, people keep saying Adolin would have to be broken to become a Radiant but he's got such a perfect life, you completely forget his dad was a raging warlord and alcoholic, and Adolin was stuck seeking his approval for years after his mother died while Dalinar drunk himself almost to death. Adolin may have moved past that now that Dalinar is better, but seeing someone you love destroy themselves will always leave scars, and I'm willing to be Adolin's dedication to dueling and love for the sword (Maya) came out of that desire for Dalinar's approval.

[Edgeborn he/him]

OK SO THE LETTERS FROM PART TWO. I've seen a lot of speculation on them, and according to the Coppermind and general theory, the second was written by Autonomy  (Or someone representing them) because Brandon has confirmed all the letters are from shards we know, and the third is obviously Sazed, the first probably Endowment. HOWEVER, I think the second letter instead comes from Trell. EVIDENCE: Trell's "faceless immortal" from BoM consistently referred to Trell or the general leaders the Set followed as "us" or "we." The second letter follows this pattern, though it does seem to be penned by something other than the shard, saying "you have spoken to one who cannot respond." This leads into my first theory about Trell. Trell is diametrically opposed to Autonomy, instead being the shard of unity or conformity, making everyone under its power the same, bound in a sort of hive mind. It explains the "faceless immortal," because Trell simply brought the beggar into their fold, making his mind a part of a larger whole. It explains why the one Hoid wrote to "cannot respond," as he wrote to the Shards original holder, but their consciousness has been blended with the minds of everyone under Trell's power. Furthermore, the letter also mentions "our many realms." This supports the idea that Trell is connected with the Scar (red band of stars across the sky in the Cosmere, connected because the threat to Scadrial is shown also as red smoke by Sazed.) The Scar is in reality all of the worlds and systems Trell has conquered. A looser connection, but it makes more sense when you think about it: wouldn't Trell, shard of conformity or unity, want everyone to be under his control, to be the same? Therefore, he/she/they would expand and expand, and now Scadrial is their obstacle. That conquest is also referenced in Obrodai, the world "we have claimed," suggesting a world that fell rather than succeeded. I immediately remembered that Brandon was/is planning a series where the main character is destined to destroy the world, and that seems pretty conveniently paralleled, as Obrodai sounds to be somewhere of great significance that Hoid is being warned away from. The main characters role in destruction there could be giving in to Trell. It all makes sense and fits together, if anyone notices flaws, please let me know so I can try to address them.

Edited November 23, 2017 by Edgeborn
Fixing grammar/improving clarity

[Angsos]

Splinters, there's an unpublished story Aether of Night. Somewhere on the 17th Shard there's a thread or forum about it.

[Blacksmithki]

5 minutes ago, Angsos said:

Splinters, there's an unpublished story Aether of Night. Somewhere on the 17th Shard there's a thread or forum about it.

Also they get used in the unpublished, non-canon (but not to say none of it will get used) "liar of partinel"

[WhiteLeeopard she/her]

10 hours ago, Dragonangel said:

So, does anyone know why Sadeas started hating Dalinar so far back in the day?  I mean in the first flashback, Sadeas said that he didn't know if a rockslide would kill Dalinar and low and behold, later a rock slide tried to kill him.  Why so much hate when they were working together for the kingdom?

I don't think Sadeas hated Dalinar then, its possible he was envious that the Blackthorn was a force to be reckoned with, but I suspect Sadeas mainly admired Dalinar at that point. The rockslide comment was a compliment from Sadeas. In his own way . 

[Khyrindor he/him]

3 hours ago, Edgeborn said:

OK SO THE LETTERS FROM PART TWO. I've seen a lot of speculation on them, and according to the Coppermind and general theory, the second was written by Autonomy  (Or someone representing them) because Brandon has confirmed all the letters are from shards we know, and the third is obviously Sazed, the first probably Endowment. HOWEVER, I think the second letter instead comes from Trell. EVIDENCE: Trell's "faceless immortal" from BoM consistently referred to Trell or the general leaders the Set followed as "us" or "we." The second letter follows this pattern, though it does seem to be penned by something other than the shard, saying "you have spoken to one who cannot respond." This leads into my first theory about Trell. Trell is diametrically opposed to Autonomy, instead being the shard of unity or conformity, making everyone under its power the same, bound in a sort of hive mind. It explains the "faceless immortal," because Trell simply brought the beggar into their fold, making his mind a part of a larger whole. It explains why the one Hoid wrote to "cannot respond," as he wrote to the Shards original holder, but their consciousness has been blended with the minds of everyone under Trell's power. Furthermore, the letter also mentions "our many realms." This supports the idea that Trell is connected with the Scar (red band of stars across the sky in the Cosmere, connected because the threat to Scadrial is shown also as red smoke by Sazed.) The Scar is in reality all of the worlds and systems Trell has conquered. A looser connection, but it makes more sense when you think about it: wouldn't Trell, shard of conformity or unity, want everyone to be under his control, to be the same? Therefore, he/she/they would expand and expand, and now Scadrial is their obstacle. That conquest is also referenced in Obrodai, the world "we have claimed," suggesting a world that fell rather than succeeded. I immediately remembered that Brandon was/is planning a series where the main character is destined to destroy the world, and that seems pretty conveniently paralleled, as Obrodai sounds to be somewhere of great significance that Hoid is being warned away from. The main characters role in destruction there could be giving in to Trell. It all makes sense and fits together, if anyone notices flaws, please let me know so I can try to address them.

Trell is almost certainly related to (or an aspect of) Autonomy, at this point.

[splinters]

@Angsos and @Blacksmithki, thanks! I’ll have to read that.