LG113: Day 1: Freedom of Speech

[The Unknown Character he/him]

Sometimes I'm like, why is Illwei asking these questions? These questions are so weird 

Then I remember that Illwei has played in other places and also wasn't a part of the whole approval process

[Wahrheitswächter He/Him]

25 minutes ago, The Unknown Character said:

Playing negative loyalty here is anti-village. I understand the desire to be more powerful, but come on. It's really only worth it for the Parliamentarian imo. Are you really going to complain about being forced to do something that is completely beneficial to the village? 

I think you missunderstand, if we use our action to increase our loyalty to make sure your plan doesnt loose us the Game N1, we can not perform any role actions, because we only get 1 action per Cycle. And I am not really convinced that the intel we gain from this is worth it tbh.

13 minutes ago, Asriel said:

@Illwei Both Hoid and Mystfall said pregame they wanted to be Elims. Is it such a stretch to assume that if given the chance they would skew the odds to shoot for the mavset-im role?

Edit: A role that is guaranteed to be an Elim?

They could either reduze the pool of available roles which in no way guarantees Mavset-Im or choose from a selected pool, there is no Guarantee that that Pool even contains Mavset-Im. So the ability to manipulate what they get is not very good and I would not base my Vote on this

Now RP:

"Don't pretend you aren't old Dvalk, we both know thats not true. And I dont like the appearancr of Odium either and I do not want to join his side, but you know, I fear a world where we remain in the coalition but these next few days evolve in a way that could be detrimental to Thaylenah, if the Contest is won, the Coalition gets Herdaz and Alethkar, but Herdaz is not the most important country and Alethkar is for vast stretches landlocked. Jah Keved, Iri, Rira and Babarthanam are all lost to us, even if we can keep Azir, who says that the other Makabaki Nations really stay with Azir, they could have recieved similar ofders to ours, there is a chance that we end up in a world where most Rosharan Ports will be closed to us, and that is something I truly fear.

@Ascended Grubberfly

[Mint11 she/her]

1 hour ago, Wahrheitswächter said:

I agree with Mint that especially the 3. Point is a horrendous idea. Because it stops the village from doing anything productive with hheir actions because your plan forces all of us to increase Loyalty

Despite everything going on Chise was slightly relieved to be understood. She had begun to feel like she was speaking in code.

 

27 minutes ago, The Unknown Character said:

Playing negative loyalty here is anti-village. I understand the desire to be more powerful, but come on. It's really only worth it for the Parliamentarian imo. Are you really going to complain about being forced to do something that is completely beneficial to the village? 

Here's another thing: Anyone who calls for a deposition after n1 is 100% an elim. That means that we have a choice between calling for a deposition tonight and never getting that info for sure. I'd rather have something than nothing when it's pretty low risk and has other positive benefits 

Chise shook her head. Even if she took Old Man Maker's initial words as true, which she did not, it was ridiculous to put the parlimentarian in a position where they would either have to waste their actions or otherwise reveal themselves, if they considered playing double agent to be the wiser choice. If any counselors were forced to be more staunchly loyalist now, it'd take them more time to convince the traitors later that they were on Odium's side.

Perhaps she could have conceded that this was the best time to force everyone's hand. They couldn't do it later. But she bristled at having others' freedom taken away so casually. She knew only too well how painful that was, no matter what excuses were made.

 

15 minutes ago, Asriel said:

@Illwei Both Hoid and Mystfall said pregame they wanted to be Elims. Is it such a stretch to assume that if given the chance they would skew the odds to shoot for the mavset-im role?

Edit: A role that is guaranteed to be an Elim?

"Well, that settles it. Fickle (Myst) isn't someone I'd expect to say that the traitors may not bring someone to their side."

[Mystfall He/Him]

21 minutes ago, Asriel said:

@Illwei Both Hoid and Mystfall said pregame they wanted to be Elims. Is it such a stretch to assume that if given the chance they would skew the odds to shoot for the mavset-im role?

Edit: A role that is guaranteed to be an Elim?

Oh I did.

Didnt work out though

[Asriel He/Him]

1 minute ago, Mystfall said:

Oh I did.

Didnt work out though

Sure…

[Wahrheitswächter He/Him]

1 minute ago, Mystfall said:

Oh I did.

Didnt work out though

I thought ypu wanted to survive D1, I dont think such comments will be helpfull in that endeavor

[The Unknown Character he/him]

6 minutes ago, Wahrheitswächter said:

think you missunderstand, if we use our action to increase our loyalty to make sure your plan doesnt loose us the Game N1, we can not perform any role actions, because we only get 1 action per Cycle. And I am not really convinced that the intel we gain from this is worth it tbh.

I perfectly understood you. I'm saying that  increasing our loyalty is good. There are very specific circumstances where decreasing loyalty is better, but increasingly loyalty is always good

I am. Plus, somebody's going to do it. It only takes one person to Motion, and even if I'm exed, I'm sure someone else will do it ( @Alvron, you listening? This is basically random chance at this point  )

In response to Mint's Myst vote, I don't like the way Myst backtracked after pressed on the Mavset not being in the game, but I killed them d1 last game so I'd rather not

[Asriel He/Him]

3 hours ago, WhimsyIsTheBestShard said:

Lord Falwin stands, thinking about the "events" that happened this morning. At least there was only one letter. Lord Falwin didn't believe in "Odium", of course. It was simply something that those anti-loyalists made up to scare us into submission. "I won't be fooled," he muttered under his breath. Even Fen seemed as if she believed it, and she wasn't exactly ignorant. Anyway, that's not to say the non-loyals weren't dangerous. They were. His legs started walking to another councilor. "Oh, hello! Pleasure to meet you! My name is Lord Falwin, did you know Odium isn't real?"

@WhimsyIsTheBestShard

Rbiren turns from the mirror, his robes swishing dramatically. “Lord Falwin! I have been wanting to meet you. But what do you mean when you say that absurd statement with such a straight face?”

[Mystfall He/Him]

1 minute ago, Asriel said:

Sure…

People can scan my role you know, if you have the role you can fact-check me on this

1 minute ago, Wahrheitswächter said:

I thought ypu wanted to survive D1, I dont think such comments will be helpfull in that endeavor

It may not, but I did try to be elim. 

12 hours ago, Jo and the Bush said:

I edited yours in.

That reminds me!

@Hoid Slayer and @Mystfall won the Boons! Hoid for his great Sign-up Post, and Mystfall for his engagement! 24 hours ago, they were given the ability to manipulate the odds for what role they could receive. (either by removing some roles from the pool, or by selecting from a small number of chosen roles). 

@TwinStorm received a Runner-up Boon, simply because I was struggling to choose between Twin and Myst for most Engaging. Twinstorm's boon allows him to choose his starting Loyalty.

I couldn’t rig it too much

[Ink and Embers Any pronouns]

2 minutes ago, Mystfall said:

Oh I did.

Didnt work out though

I'm equally dubious of Myst, for this comment (though I'm not really sure what the alternative would be that he could say) and of TUC, as I think a deposition would be unnecessary risk for information that's been manipulated already (and as the manipulation won't be revealed, only the result, it would require everyone to reveal their starting loyalty for it to show targets, which would give a lot of information to Elims. But also to village. I guess it's a balance?)

No votes for now; it's between the two

[Asriel He/Him]

2 minutes ago, Mystfall said:

People can scan my role you know, if you have the role you can fact-check me on this

Point.

[Mystfall He/Him]

Just now, Asriel said:

Point.

Now, if you don’t have the role then fair, but someone probably does. And hopefully I don’t need to say this but if you scan someone and they come up as Mavset-im or Elim. You should probably tell people(delaying to bait info from them is also viable)

4 minutes ago, Ink and Embers said:

I'm equally dubious of Myst, for this comment (though I'm not really sure what the alternative would be that he could say) and of TUC, as I think a deposition would be unnecessary risk for information that's been manipulated already (and as the manipulation won't be revealed, only the result, it would require everyone to reveal their starting loyalty for it to show targets, which would give a lot of information to Elims. But also to village. I guess it's a balance?)

No votes for now; it's between the two

I don’t know about you, but considering how much complaining I’ve done about not being Elim. If I lied and said I didn’t do my best to rig it, that’d be more suspicious. I expect Hoid did something similar 

[Illwei]

To say that trying to keep a positive loyalty prevents the Village from doing anything productive is a gross overstatement.

While there are a lot of actions that can benefit from being negative, please keep in mind that there are only a few roles that can change their own or other's loyalty more than the 1 that you can use with your action. 

If you have a negative loyalty please don't announce it. Feel more than free to not feel pressured to use your negative ability actions if you think it will benefit the team. But if you are in a positive loyalty I recommend not using cycles to lower loyalty so that you can use other negative abilities. 

I think the Rebsk is the biggest thing that you can try to control. ending without or with any votes is something under your control to a degree, so keep that in mind. 

The Minister can affect other's loyalties, The Royal Family, and while smuggler and banker can as well, I think theirs is less impactful. 

I will say, if you are royal family, please don't use your action unless it's essential. The only time I can imagine this ability being useful for the village is in a ExLo situation with one elim (outed) left, and you are trying to prevent them from deposing. 

Also I truly don't see how the questions I am asking are strange haha. 

 

I do think that TUC is a Villager here. 

I would like to see @Mat's thoughts on Myst before I say mine myself. 

[Archer he/him]

VC:

Hoid (1): Myst 

Myst (3): Asriel, Mat, Mint

Araris (1): Hoid

Asriel (1): Illwei

[Mystfall He/Him]

7 minutes ago, Archer said:

VC:

Hoid (1): Myst 

Myst (3): Asriel, Mat, Mint

Araris (1): Hoid

Asriel (1): Illwei

When did Mat vote me?

I can’t find it

[Ascended Grubberfly He/Him]

23 minutes ago, Wahrheitswächter said:

"Don't pretend you aren't old Dvalk, we both know thats not true. And I dont like the appearancr of Odium either and I do not want to join his side, but you know, I fear a world where we remain in the coalition but these next few days evolve in a way that could be detrimental to Thaylenah, if the Contest is won, the Coalition gets Herdaz and Alethkar, but Herdaz is not the most important country and Alethkar is for vast stretches landlocked. Jah Keved, Iri, Rira and Babarthanam are all lost to us, even if we can keep Azir, who says that the other Makabaki Nations really stay with Azir, they could have recieved similar ofders to ours, there is a chance that we end up in a world where most Rosharan Ports will be closed to us, and that is something I truly fear.

@Ascended Grubberfly

“shhhh! If you out my old age, no one will see me as the cunning youth wise beyond his years!”

Dvalk nodded grimly as Ralm finished his statement. “Choose humanity, or choose business. Or is humanity siding with the singers?”

Dvalk was not trained in the ways of the court. He watched others throw accusations and deflections as if they didn’t have to think. Too much for an ol— young untrained soul like him.

 

Illwei 

[Asriel He/Him]

12 minutes ago, Mystfall said:

When did Mat vote me?

I can’t find it

 

2 hours ago, Mat said:

Mystfall

More later

 

[Mystfall He/Him]

Just now, Asriel said:

 

 

Ah, thanks.

I was concerned for a sec that Archer was manipulating the votes through sheer gaslighting

[Asriel He/Him]

Just now, Mystfall said:

Ah, thanks.

I was concerned for a sec that Archer was manipulating the votes through sheer gaslighting

lol something to watch out for I guess

[Mystfall He/Him]

1 minute ago, Asriel said:

lol something to watch out for I guess

It’s usually not on purpose, so I’m not too worried about it

[WhimsyIsTheBestShard]

39 minutes ago, Asriel said:

@WhimsyIsTheBestShard

Rbiren turns from the mirror, his robes swishing dramatically. “Lord Falwin! I have been wanting to meet you. But what do you mean when you say that absurd statement with such a straight face?”

Lord Falwin is a very rational person, and never lets his emotions get the best of him. That said, he was under the impression that politicians weren't supposed to be so blunt. "Why? You have proof otherwise? I think everyone here knows that 'Odium' is Alethi propaganda and anti-loyalists are trying to scare us. I'll bet you were the one to put that letter there. Why, -" he starts walking away, "This isn't over, Rbiren!"

"Oh, you've done it now," Leb says when they are safely in their quarters. "I am going on top tomorrow, and we are voting Fickle"

Edited 11 hours ago by WhimsyIsTheBestShard

[Mystfall He/Him]

Will admit that I am concerned that it’s been 14 hours and there’s already 4 votes on me alone. 

[Asriel He/Him]

Just now, WhimsyIsTheBestShard said:

Lord Falwin is a very rational person, and never lets his emotions get the best of him. That said, he was under the impression that politicians weren't supposed to be so blunt. "Why? You have proof otherwise? I think everyone here knows that 'Odium' is Alethi propaganda and anti-loyalists are trying to scare us. I'll bet you were the one to put that letter there. Why, -" he starts walking away, "This isn't over, Rbiren!"

"Oh, you've done it now," Leb says when they are safely in there quarters. "I am going on top tomorrow, and we are voting Fickle"

Rbiren grinned to himself. It was too easy to offend these political types. All it took was one slightly rude comment. But really, he had wanted to talk to Falwin. He needed to change his outfit soon, before he killed Rbiren with that awful trench coat!

[Illwei]

8 minutes ago, WhimsyIsTheBestShard said:

Lord Falwin is a very rational person, and never lets his emotions get the best of him. That said, he was under the impression that politicians weren't supposed to be so blunt. "Why? You have proof otherwise? I think everyone here knows that 'Odium' is Alethi propaganda and anti-loyalists are trying to scare us. I'll bet you were the one to put that letter there. Why, -" he starts walking away, "This isn't over, Rbiren!"

"Oh, you've done it now," Leb says when they are safely in their quarters. "I am going on top tomorrow, and we are voting Fickle"

Can you clarify if this is a vote or not? Red text is usually reserved for voting. 

EDIT:

Village:
Whimsy - Asriel - TUC

Edited 11 hours ago by Illwei

[The Unknown Character he/him]

39 minutes ago, Ink and Embers said:

I'm equally dubious of Myst, for this comment (though I'm not really sure what the alternative would be that he could say) and of TUC, as I think a deposition would be unnecessary risk for information that's been manipulated already (and as the manipulation won't be revealed, only the result, it would require everyone to reveal their starting loyalty for it to show targets, which would give a lot of information to Elims. But also to village. I guess it's a balance?)

No votes for now; it's between the two

To be fair to everyone who is distrusting me for this, I'm pretty sure I'd still be advocating for a n1 deposition as an elim. It's useful information for both sides. I probably wouldn't be advocating raising your own loyalty as much if I was Elim though

32 minutes ago, Illwei said:

To say that trying to keep a positive loyalty prevents the Village from doing anything productive is a gross overstatement.

While there are a lot of actions that can benefit from being negative, please keep in mind that there are only a few roles that can change their own or other's loyalty more than the 1 that you can use with your action. 

If you have a negative loyalty please don't announce it. Feel more than free to not feel pressured to use your negative ability actions if you think it will benefit the team. But if you are in a positive loyalty I recommend not using cycles to lower loyalty so that you can use other negative abilities. 

I think the Rebsk is the biggest thing that you can try to control. ending without or with any votes is something under your control to a degree, so keep that in mind. 

The Minister can affect other's loyalties, The Royal Family, and while smuggler and banker can as well, I think theirs is less impactful. 

I will say, if you are royal family, please don't use your action unless it's essential. The only time I can imagine this ability being useful for the village is in a ExLo situation with one elim (outed) left, and you are trying to prevent them from deposing. 

Also I truly don't see how the questions I am asking are strange haha. 

 

I do think that TUC is a Villager here. 

I would like to see @Mat's thoughts on Myst before I say mine myself. 

The underlined was exactly my reaction but phrased better

It's just, a lot of the times you ask questions that I feel like are common sense to me, but when I think about them for a second I realize how they make sense to ask as someone who isn't as ingrained here as I am

4 minutes ago, Mystfall said:

Will admit that I am concerned that it’s been 14 hours and there’s already 4 votes on me alone. 

That is actually insane

I still feel guilty about last game, so I will vote with you to save you if I need to