Twinborn Combos

[Voidus]

double-ferring for me would probably be gold/steel.

I still think a double steel twinborn is pretty much unbeatable.

[Zaropti]

double steel is a powerful combo, But how bout if you was an arena fighter agents other twinborn what combo do you think could even stand a chance of beating a gold/gold?

[Voidus]

Double steel could fairly easy, if you kill them fast enough then it doesn't matter how fast they heal, alternatively it would make it very easy to capture them.

[Zaropti]

How about vs a Steel/Iron(with a good store)? Even with enhanced speed I have my doubts ya could outrun a bullet and nomatter what you push at that person they can easily push it back on you no problem.

[Voidus]

Well the whole point of having a double steel is that you can compound so you can tap to any level of speed you want. Although it depends on how much your reaction speeds up with it, besides it's very difficult to shoot someone who is moving around you erratically at around 400 km/h

Edit: A steel/Iron could work too, but really the Iron just enhances your pushing abilities a bit, not sure that it would be that useful against a double gold.

Edited March 29, 2012 by Voidus

[Zaropti]

Steel/Iron vs Steel/Steel. As it is in the book we know Wax couldn't take Miles in a one on one. Killing a gold/gold seems impossible in a one on one fight as it is without being able to stripe the goldminds off of them while still trying not to take damage back. If it came down to a pure hand to hand without weapons pewter could do it but with guns and other weapons I do not see much standing up to that match. Even if you do trap them in something they could always do like Miles with the TNT to break free. Now a hell of a duel that could go on till they pass out from exhaustion would be two gold/golds fighting but then again it would really get boring to watch after so long.

But excluding gold/gold from a fight what chance would somebody have vs a duel chromium? A person so amazingly lucky everything they do is a jackpot and so lucky your gun would jam trying to shoot or weapon will break or things always miss by a hair or when going in close for a punch you end up tripping over your own feet and falling prone right for their shot?

Edited March 29, 2012 by Zaropti

[Voidus]

The problem with a double Chromium is that you'd never be able to tell how the luck would manifest, you might still get shot in the head, but also win the lottery at the same time I do agree that there is no tactic you could use against them successfully still, double steel steal everyone elses metalminds and then shoot them.

[Aradel]

Feruchemy acts to protect the user from hurting themselves with their own power. Therefore your body is proportionatly strengthend to handle the stress of high-speed movement.

There are two limitations to hitting things while Steelrunning.

First, feruchemy protects the user internally to deal with internal force.

In Steelrunning, the user's body is is toughend (especially the ligaments, tendons, and other musculature) to deal with the stress of rapid movement. Some of the toughness carries over to protect the user from external impact, but shielding from blunt trauma is not the same as strengthening ligaments to not rip themselves free from the bone.

Second, you have to be careful how you hit someone at normal speed. If you don't know how to hit someone properly, you could hurt yourself more than you hurt them. Going back to my earlier point, if you hit someone wrong while steelrunning, the immense impact could do permanent damage.

I can see steelrunners learning a form of martial art to maximize the damage they can deal before hurting themselves.

Also, I noted earlier that being a thug/steelrunner would overcome the drawbacks by enhancing strength, endurance, durability, balance, reaction time... It's definitly my favorite twinborn ability.

Ever notice how the metals that give you more bang for your buck tend to have the steepest limitiations? Steel is like that. Sorry Void.

On the other hand, you could become the first to join me in the thug/steelrunner camp.

Edited March 29, 2012 by Goradel's Nephew

[Voidus]

I still think that a double steel would be incredibly useful, not necessarily at hand to hand combat as you would probably break bones and tendons as you mentioned, but you could still take peoples metalminds of the, before they are aware of you, if you compounded enough steel it would basically be a bendalloy bubble that only affects you and has none of that deflection going on, you could still zip around the battlefield shooting people at point blank.

But yes one of my second choices of twinborn is a Pewter/Steel although I alternate between that and a bendalloy/pewter they would do similar things but I think that for pure combat a thug-steelrunner would be one of the most useful.

[Zaropti]

Pewter/Steel does sound like and amazing combat combo. How about if your fighting other allomancers the disabling power a Chromium/Steel twinborn seems like one hell if a combo, Specially if your Hazekiller trained and the enemy relies heavily on their allomatic powers.

Edited March 30, 2012 by Zaropti

[Windrunner]

First, I wonder why the Terris, as a people, are so different from the rest of Scadrial. If their SDNA is so different, they can't have the same origins as other Scadrians.

I don't think that having different sDNA means that they have to have different origins from the rest of Scadrial's people, although it is possible. What if Preservation waited in the early days for one group to distinguish itself, and when the Terrismen did, he gave them Feruchemy so they worshiped him. Or perhaps it was the other way, and the Terrismen worshiped Preservation so he gave them Feruchemy. They actually seem as if they were kind of his chosen people.

Another, less likely possibilty, is that in the very early days anyone could be born a Feruchemist. Once the people figured out that Feruchemy was genetic, then they could have started breeding with each other, like nobility almost, and they eventually created their own distinct population. I don't think this happened though, because then the Terrismen would have ruled, instead of being confined as herders in the north.

[Voidus]

Pewter/Steel does sound like and amazing combat combo. How about if your fighting other allomancers the disabling power a Chromium/Steel twinborn seems like one hell if a combo, Specially if your Hazekiller trained and the enemy relies heavily on their allomatic powers.

Doesn't get rid of feruchemy but still would be incredibly useful having chromium or nicrosil as your allomantic ability would always be useful, I imagine that both would be in very high demand.

[Aradel]

I don't think that having different sDNA means that they have to have different origins from the rest of Scadrial's people, although it is possible. What if Preservation waited in the early days for one group to distinguish itself, and when the Terrismen did, he gave them Feruchemy so they worshiped him. Or perhaps it was the other way, and the Terrismen worshiped Preservation so he gave them Feruchemy. They actually seem as if they were kind of his chosen people.

Another, less likely possibilty, is that in the very early days anyone could be born a Feruchemist. Once the people figured out that Feruchemy was genetic, then they could have started breeding with each other, like nobility almost, and they eventually created their own distinct population. I don't think this happened though, because then the Terrismen would have ruled, instead of being confined as herders in the north.

Now that I think about it, the Worldbringers were the leaders of the Terris people before TLR. Hasn't Brandon said somewhere that the Worldbringers and Worldsingers are very similar? Early organizations that seemed to be more knowlegeable about Shards than they should for the time period. Is it possible that the Shards brought small groups of people with them when they came? Freinds and family maybe? Ati didn't get corrupted by his Shard immediatly.

If they did, the group would mingle with the normal population and leave descendants who're just a bit different in their genetics. Since the Terris have historically kept to themselves, it would be a good explanation for why they're SDNA is different.

[Zaropti]

Maybe they were picked for their humble origins to be holders of that power and preservation's touch helped them to remain a humble people rather then have the power corrupt them and make them into power hungry warlords bent on taking over their powerless counterparts in the world?

[Voidus]

Now that I think about it, the Worldbringers were the leaders of the Terris people before TLR. Hasn't Brandon said somewhere that the Worldbringers and Worldsingers are very similar?

Can't find any quotes on this and I can't remember anything like that, I might just not have read it but I'd be very interested to see that.

[Zas678]

That is true, but it wasn't recorded. I believe it's a tidbit from the Alloy of Law Release Party that wasn't recorded.

[CrazyRioter]

I came up with a theory that Hoid is responsible for both groups.

[ulyssessword]

If I understand the powers correctly, Tin/Tin would be a very powerful combination, if used like this:

1. Flare/burn (allomantic) tin, enhancing your perception of everything.

2. Store (feruchemical) tin, reducing the sensitivity of your senses.

This would give you the enhanced, magical abilities of Allomancy (see through mists, see in the dark, many of Spook's tricks), without most of the drawbacks, as you store the more mundane aspects of this through Feruchemy (which is more limited).

Spook could read lips, sense the path of an incoming sword by sound, and many other tricks that simply increasing acuity and sensitivity could not account for. Storing all of the excess sense would maintain those advantages, without getting the disadvantages of hypersensitivity.

[Eric]

Reading lips is a skill, and sensing the path of an incoming sword by sound is just a form of echolocation, kind of like how blind people tap a cane to get a sense of their surroundings. Both are learned, not granted by Allomancy. Seeing in the dark is just increased sensitivity to ambient light. The only one of those that would work would be seeing through the mists. Personally, I think that's good enough of an edge when people don't expect it, so I agree that it would be a useful tactic on Scadrial.

[ulyssessword]

Reading lips is a skill, and sensing the path of an incoming sword by sound is just a form of echolocation, kind of like how blind people tap a cane to get a sense of their surroundings. Both are learned, not granted by Allomancy. Seeing in the dark is just increased sensitivity to ambient light.

I don't have any evidence against the first two (though they seem like oddly specific skills to have spent time learning), but seeing in the dark is specifically granted by Allomancy, and not by Feruchemy IIRC. When Sazed enters a dark area (steel ministry cavern?), he remarks something to that effect.

[Eric]

Spook monologues on page 127 of HoA that he's trying to be useful after the guilt of leaving his uncle to die. Finding and honing skills that suit his talents is the perfect method to do so with. (It also says he can "see on a dark night as no other human ever had", which doesn't necessarily mean he can see in pitch darkness.)

In the Steel Ministry building, Sazed tells Marsh he'll need a lantern because Feruchemy doesn't let him see in pitch darkness and that trying to see in very low levels of light would drain a tinmind rapidly, but there is no mention of Allomancy allowing you to do so. Sazed notes that Inquisitors must not need light to see, but we know the reason for that isn't the tin.

Edited April 12, 2012 by Eric

[Raven Wilder]

I thought of an interesting combo I'm pretty sure no one's mentioned yet:

Tin Misting/Iron Ferring.

It's awfully situation specific, but I can think of a pretty neat use for these powers. First, the Twinborn drains their weight into their iron metalmind until they're almost weightless. Then they launch themselves into the air; maybe they strap themselves to a kite, get hurled from a catapult, or have a Coinshot Push them up. Anyway, thanks to their extremly low weight, they'll be able to go up really high and drift back to earth really slowly. And, while they're spending all that time up in the air, they can burn tin, letting them see everything for miles around in incredible detail. Cartographers would love them.

Heck, it would be hilarious if a future novel set during Allow of Law times has a team of explorers out in the Roughs, and they've got a dozen Skimmer Ferrings bobbing around in the air, drawing maps of what they see, while a bunch of Coinshots run around on the ground using Pushes to keep them from falling.

P.S. As for how future novels could have Mistborn in them, I got two words for you: genetic engineering.

[master]

It's awfully situation specific, but I can think of a pretty neat use for these powers. First, the Twinborn drains their weight into their iron metalmind until they're almost weightless. Then they launch themselves into the air; maybe they strap themselves to a kite, get hurled from a catapult, or have a Coinshot Push them up. Anyway, thanks to their extremly low weight, they'll be able to go up really high and drift back to earth really slowly. And, while they're spending all that time up in the air, they can burn tin, letting them see everything for miles around in incredible detail. Cartographers would love them.

while I'm no expert or anything, weight has nothing to do with how fast you fall. its the drag caused by the air that decides it. I believe its mentioned in alloy itself.

Edited April 14, 2012 by master

[Kurkistan]

while I'm no expert or anything, weight has nothing to do with how fast you fall. its the drag caused by the air that decides it. I believe its mentioned in alloy itself.

Terminal velocity is a function of weight and surface area. Decrease weight while maintaining (or increasing: parachute, anyone?) surface area and you get a lower terminal velocity.

[CrazyRioter]

only if your weight is low enough for air resistance to become a large factor.