Ships!!!

[DramaQueen]

Let me know some of your favorite SA ships here in order to help with my seemingly infinite quest to find someone to talk to that ships Shalladin as I do! Also, give your arguments for why your ships are valid and should happen.

 

Here is mine: (quoted for length)

Quote

 

Adolin had a near-perfect childhood, as Dalinar is such a great dad. That's awesome for him and all, but Shallan had way too much crap happen in her childhood, and she is kinda mentally ill because of it. Adolin hasn't had to deal with stuff like that before, so he'll have no idea how to manage Shallan with her split personalities, her refusal to accept her past, etc.

Kaladin has only really known one person who has been able to make him feel truly happy, and that was his brother Tien. Shallan's smile, jokes, optimism, etc. remind him of Tien and make him happier and remember better times.

Yes, they are both broken, but in different ways. And, they confront their brokenness in different ways. Kaladin lets it show too much. He fans the flames of his darkness and lets it out constantly, unless that stream of negativity is blocked by something positive. (AKA Shallan.)

Shallan hides her darkness and pretends it doesn't exist, almost forgetting it, but it still grows until it almost consumes her and she has to retreat into a different personality to escape her brokenness.

As you can see, these are both unhealthy ways of approaching how to heal. However, they are also as near to complete opposites as they could get. If Shallan and Kaladin get into a close relationship (and romantic is pretty much as close as you can get) they will be able to work together to kind of meet in the middle with their methods of coping so that they are both dealing with it in healthy ways.

Some may argue that Adolin would be good for Shallan as he is stable, she may need something to lean on, a pillar to hold up the building as it undergoes repairs. If dealt with just so, she may be able to have a romantic relationship with Kaladin and a platonic relationship with Adolin, as Adolin is not the type to hold grudges over something so petty. If Shallan proceeds with her relationship with Adolin, however, Kaladin is likely to retreat into just being the guard, not really getting to know the people he protects. Not only that, but Kaladin should have a pillar, too. Adolin could help Shallan heal, perhaps, but who would help Kaladin? Who could help Kaladin but a person who reminds him of the joy and brightness that was Tien?

 

 

Feel free to give me your rebuttals, as well as your own ships! Also, please be aware that this is merely for fun, I am not doing this to cause grudges! It doesn't really matter to me who you all ship, I just find it fun to debate! (And hear other people's opinions on my opinion!)

If you clicked on this expecting it to be about seafaring ships/boats, go to this topic by @rosin_the_beau

Edited July 11, 2020 by RadiantDramaQueen

[Karger]

You triple posted.  Also ship it or rip it is a thing.

[DramaQueen]

23 hours ago, Karger said:

You triple posted.  Also ship it or rip it is a thing.

yep i realized that, but i can't figure out how to delete the other two.

where can i find ship it or rip it?

 

k i tried something, did it work?

[Karger]

30 minutes ago, RadiantDramaQueen said:

k i tried something, did it work?

Seems to have.

[DramaQueen]

Awesome, thanks!

Where is ship it or rip it?

[Nellac]

Here's the biggest flaw in this ship; Shallan's problems stem from her father's terrifying overprotectiveness, while Kaladin is the next most overprotective character we see in the book. Even if Kaladin was protective in a healthy way, it would always bother Shallan and remind her of her father. She flips out on Adolin for talking about trying to protect her. There's no way she could be in a healthy relationship with someone who's powers and, at this point, identity are integrally twined with his need to protect everyone around him, especially those he loves.

[DramaQueen]

3 minutes ago, Nellac said:

Here's the biggest flaw in this ship; Shallan's problems stem from her father's terrifying overprotectiveness, while Kaladin is the next most overprotective character we see in the book. Even if Kaladin was protective in a healthy way, it would always bother Shallan and remind her of her father. She flips out on Adolin for talking about trying to protect her. There's no way she could be in a healthy relationship with someone who's powers and, at this point, identity are integrally twined with his need to protect everyone around him, especially those he loves.

Okay, wow. That is an argument that I had definitely not heard or considered before. However, maybe that could be a part of helping each other heal? Like you mentioned, as well, though, Adolin felt like he should be the one protecting her, not the other way around, while Kaladin was more than willing to let her join in the fight. Yes, he is protective, but not in a way that I think would be unbearable to Shallan, especially if he manages to help her heal.

But, yeah. That could definitely be a huge problem haha.

[PiedPiper]

Dang it, I thought you were talking about boats and I got so excited, but also a little confused because I can count on my hands the number of boats specifically mentioned in the books (Skyward doesn't count; that's space and technology) and none go into too much detail on mechanics. Oh, well.

I guess, just to contribute, I appreciate Sazed and Tindwyl because they were sweet together and they spent their time doing cool nerd things, which I loved.

Also, Ship it or Rip it is Shardcast if you want to look for that.

Edited July 7, 2020 by PiedPeterPiper

[Frustration]

Shaladin is dead, and I love that. I'm perfectly fine if Kal lives the rest of his life without a love interest, real world people die single, it happens.

[Honorless]

These people need support more than they need romance. Romantic relationships are not needed to validate one's existence.

[theTruthshaper]

Let's hope this does not become like the old thread. I have stumbled across it like a traveler might stumble across nuclear wastelands. Shallan/Adolin/Kaladin is a huge wasteland where nothing grows because no weapons were spared in the great war.

 

Also, PiedPeterPiper I feel you, I thought this was going to be about Wandersail.

[DramaQueen]

21 hours ago, R J said:

These people need support more than they need romance. Romantic relationships are not needed to validate one's existence.

I definitely realize that, but a permanent romantic partner can often be the greatest support in the world.

 

20 hours ago, The_Truthwatcher said:

I thought this was going to be about Wandersail.

 

22 hours ago, PiedPeterPiper said:

Dang it, I thought you were talking about boats and I got so excited

Sorry to disappoint you guys, we can definitely talk about boats if y'all want to!!!

22 hours ago, Frustration said:

Shaladin is dead, and I love that. I'm perfectly fine if Kal lives the rest of his life without a love interest, real world people die single, it happens.

You are absolutely entitled to your opinion, but I personally believe that Kal needs a supportive person to make him become better. I will accept Shadolin if it happens, which it probably will, I'm just sharing why I would love to see Shalladin.

[The Awakened Salad]

5 hours ago, RadiantDramaQueen said:

where can i find ship it or rip it?

We also have a ship it or rip it forum game! It’s very dead though.

 

Edited July 7, 2020 by The Awakened Salad

[Frustration]

5 hours ago, RadiantDramaQueen said:

You are absolutely entitled to your opinion, but I personally believe that Kal needs a supportive person to make him become better. I will accept Shadolin if it happens, which it probably will, I'm just sharing why I would love to see Shalladin.

Yes, he does need a support role, I just think Syl does the job perfectly.

[Mistbornwithakitty]

I was actually just babbling about this to my mom earlier today.  She doesn't read any of the books though so this was very much the scenario:

Spoiler

But yeah, I have varying feelings on Kaladin/Shallan/Adolin.  I love them all, but while I preferred Shaladin for a LONG time, I'm still happy with where Mr. Sanderson took it. I think what happened was realistic in a sense.  I know I would've picked Adolin irl.  I need someone to bring me up, not a guy who's just as unstable as I am.  YET, it is fiction and I adore an enemies-to-friends-to-lovers trope with a fiery passion, so I wouldn't be opposed to them growing a bit and coming back to it.

But with Shallan married....I really doubt it guys.

Anyhow!  My favorite couple in the Cosmere is Elend/Vin.  Can't beat it in my opinion.  Will always be the scrappy little fangirl looking for my royal counterpart.    Not to mention their both badass and supportive of each other as heck. 10/10.

[revelryintheart]

My OTP is Moash x Death

[DramaQueen]

1 hour ago, Mistbornwithakitty said:

I was actually just babbling about this to my mom earlier today.  She doesn't read any of the books though so this was very much the scenario:

  Hide contents

But yeah, I have varying feelings on Kaladin/Shallan/Adolin.  I love them all, but while I preferred Shaladin for a LONG time, I'm still happy with where Mr. Sanderson took it. I think what happened was realistic in a sense.  I know I would've picked Adolin irl.  I need someone to bring me up, not a guy who's just as unstable as I am.  YET, it is fiction and I adore an enemies-to-friends-to-lovers trope with a fiery passion, so I wouldn't be opposed to them growing a bit and coming back to it.

But with Shallan married....I really doubt it guys.

Anyhow!  My favorite couple in the Cosmere is Elend/Vin.  Can't beat it in my opinion.  Will always be the scrappy little fangirl looking for my royal counterpart.    Not to mention their both badass and supportive of each other as heck. 10/10.

See, that is kind of how i feel with shallan/adolin, I'm happy as it is i guess, but i would be ECSTATIC if Shaladin happened. 

lowkeyhopingadolindiessoshallandoesn'thavetoleavehimdonthatemeplease

Elend/Vin is cute, I'd definitely love a guy who reads throughout every party haha. especially since thats what i do when i remember my book 

[DramaQueen]

1 hour ago, Frustration said:

Yes, he does need a support role, I just think Syl does the job perfectly.

I know some people ship him with Syl haha... to me that seems weird tho

and i do realize that you (probably?) don't mean that you ship Kalasyl, I just thought of that when I read your comment. Syl is a good support for sure, I don't even really have any comebacks at this point.....

[Use the Falchion]

I'm not the largest fan of Kaladin x Shallan. But I DO see the popularity of it. I always felt like the two may have the spark, but their individual problems would end up sparking a downward spiral for the other. Kaladin would fall into a depressive state and Shallan wouldn't be able to fully lift him out of it, which would lead to her disassociating/acting like everything is fine, which would lead to Kaladin either trying to do the same and failing or feeling completely ignored, either of which would make the episode last longer. Or Shallan would try to escape her own reality due to the consequences of her actions, and it would upset Kaladin because he takes on too much responsibility (even when he can't control it), and then if they were together, he'd feel responsible for Shallan's actions as well. If that makes sense. Add in what some of the above commenters said about Kaladin's overprotective nature and Shallan's utter refusal to be protected, and you've got conflict. I don't think they'd help each other because they'd talk past each other (until Shallan states that she felt imprisoned/like a slave in her own house, and then Kaladin would understand; but Shallan would have to go a lot farther to understand Kaladin, and I'm not sure she's at a state where she could put in the work). To me, both of them need a tethering relationship that inspires/forces them to be their best self. 

 It also reminds me of Zutara, and I HATE Zutara.

I ship Kaladin and Jasnah. I've said before that they have the power to help build each other up; and if Jasnah is into men, Kaladin is probably one of the best men on the planet for her. 

Jasnah is NOT a people-person, so could learn from Kaladin on how to inspire and lead, not just command and rule.* On the other side, Kaladin can finally grow those calluses his father talked about. She can help him speak the Fourth Oath - if it's the one most fans suspect it'll be - in a way that probably doesn't involve the tragic death of a family member or friend. 

Next you've got mutual respect. Jasnah is one of the most brilliant people on the planet while also being the highest level of nobility one can achieve on Roshar. But Kaladin clearly isn't afraid of talking to her like a person, unlike so many other people (Navani is her mother, Shallan her rebellious ward, Renarin and Adolin are cousins, Dalinar is her uncle/step-dad, and most other people she's involved with are scholars who aren't on her level or sycophants).** Meanwhile Kaladin has had many roles in his young years: Apprentice, soldier, slave, brigdeman, King's Guard/Royal bodyguard, and now mythical Knights Radiant. He's intelligent, educated (as well as any non-scholar man can be at least), handsome, passionate, loyal, and is in charge of one of the most progressive social groups on Roshar. Bridge Four has had in its members: Unkalaki royalty, a Kholin prince, a good amount of Herdazian cousins, an Azish man, more than a few Alethi darkeyes from various backgrounds, WOMEN, and a Singer. Bridge Four is turning into a microcosm of what the future of Roshar could look like (or at least what the Knights Radiant should look like). Kaladin has also saved multiple members of her family, either in person or with Bridge Four. And now they most likely have a common bond via Gavinor. It almost feels like Jasnah has too many potential points of interest with Kaladin to NOT explore the relationship. 

 

In terms of emotion, Jasnah could provide a stability that Kaladin doesn't really have in others (he can get his spirits lifted by Syl, Adolin, and Shallan rather than relying on Jasnah for everything) while Kaladin can provide a safe place for Jasnah to express her emotions without being inside her head, assuming Jasnah still has some secrets that Sanderson doesn't want her to share just yet. 

The three biggest complaints I hear to this couple are: sexuality, age difference, and religion.

In terms of Jasnah's sexuality, we can't code it one way or another just yet. So any speculation at this point is still on the table, and as such we shouldn't limit ourselves to one way or another. More than a few fans read Shallan as gay or bi-, and while Sanderson stated that they are free to imagine her as such (and he in turn has come around to thinking more along those lines), she wasn't originally coded that way. I've seen fans believe that Jasnah is on the autism spectrum, because said fans were on the spectrum, and they related to her in certain ways. She's not.*** Ergo, while Jasnah may end up being asexual or a member of the LGBTQ+ community, based on the information we have now there is no way of knowing and no harm in speculating either way.

The problems with age difference usually related to wanting different things out of different stages of life and power dynamics. So long as the two are equal partners within the relationship and want the same things out of it, there's no problem whatsoever. This happens all the time in real life. Gabrille Union is ten years older than Dwayne Wade. Hugh Jackman is 51 and his wife Deborra-Lee Furness is 64 and they've been married since 1996. 

Lastly is the religion aspect. Jasnah is an Atheist. Kaladin is agnostic but comes from a superstitious family. Overall I don't think Kaladin would try to convince Jasnah that the Almighty exists, nor would Jasnah try to sway Kaladin away from the possibility of there being some higher power (although Jasnah swaying Kaladin to atheism would be pretty interesting). So again, non-issue. 

 

Overall, I think Jasnah and Kaladin could really work as a couple, but they've have to put in the work first, and that's where the biggest problem is. I'm not sure how many pages or how much screentime Sanderson could afford to give in order for this relationship to happen. And sometimes people who have everything in common just don't have that spark, but I'd like to see Jasnah and Kaladin give it an honest try before moving on. So yeah, Jasnadin for the Win!

 

Other ships I like...although Lift and Gawx are cute and will probably be canon, I really like the idea of Lift and Renarin being together in the back half. In my head, I have a whole silly head-canon for how it would go: Lift hangs out with Renarin because of her Edgedancer oaths and all,

(RoW spoilers ahead)

Spoiler

and also due to the fact that they're both aberrant Radiants, and so they sort of get along. It's all part of Cultivation's plan, but that's a different theory.

Renarin soon finds out that she can't read or write, so he teaches her how to do so.**** Touched by his compassion and willingness to teach her with no ulterior motive, Lift gives a piece of her latest - and probably stolen - meal to Renarin. Renarin accepts, not knowing what that means for Lift, and soon Lift finds herself crushing on the prince. All of this goes over Renarin's head until later on, and after the time-skip they get together. The question later on becomes what each part brings to the table for the other. Renarin doesn't really provide "a home" the way that Gawx could, nor can Lift provide any sort of consistency or companionship to Renarin that he couldn't get from Bridge Four. Overall I think it's a cute ship, but I can't see beyond "cute" just yet. 

THAT BEING SAID, during the reading of Lift's RoW interlude,

Spoiler

I could also almost see Lift gaining a crush on Rock's eldest daughter. They're both about the same age, right? And they're both still discovering themselves and the world they live in. Maybe Lift realizes that she like Rock's daughter and they get together post-time skip.

 

*She could also learn from her uncle here, but I think Kaladin is a safer choice overall. 

**Granted, the lack of respect is why Kaladin saw Moash as a friend, and we all know how THAT turned out. 

***I asked twice: once at the Houston Skyward signing and again during his YouTube Q&A signings. It's the 9th one where he answers it I believe.

****I could also see Navani teaching Lift how to read and mothering the Reshi girl, leading to Dalinar and Navani being like Batman& the Bat-family and just adopting strays all over the place (Kaladin, Szeth in a sort of weird way, and now Lift).

Edited July 7, 2020 by Use the Falchion

[Hen]

Mostly I hope Tarah will come back for Kaladin (Taladin... kalarah... taladarah?). 

I have a lot of problems with shaladin. It’s mostly personal, I love Kaladin and I’m not a huge fan of shallan. My biggest real reason is Shallan doesn’t treat Kaladin very well. Most of it is sarcastic or teasing, but to a person like Kaladin those little remarks can add up and really hurt his self esteem. 

Shallan is perfect for Adolin. Someone who grew up courting women who were proper, and did what was expected, to have someone like Shallan in his life is perfect for him.

From the little we have seen of Tarah, She doesn’t seem like the type to take him for granted. He was head over heels for her in his own Kaladin way. She left because he couldn’t stop living for the dead, which is something he will probably overcome in Rhythm of war (considering the way the end of OB went). 

Mostly Kaladin needs someone who will be kind and loving toward him, someone like Tarah. Shallan is kind and loving in a different way, that’s just not the way Kaladin needs. 

[Mistbornwithakitty]

Wow @Use the Falchion....I have seriously never thought of any of that.  That's extremely interesting!

[Frustration]

17 minutes ago, RadiantDramaQueen said:

I know some people ship him with Syl haha... to me that seems weird tho

and i do realize that you (probably?) don't mean that you ship Kalasyl, I just thought of that when I read your comment. Syl is a good support for sure, I don't even really have any comebacks at this point.....

Why, why would anyone do that? How would that even work? Nevermind I don't want to know.

[DramaQueen]

Just now, Frustration said:

Why, why would anyone do that? How would that even work? Nevermind I don't want to know.

Yep, my thoughts exactly. Plus, Syl is somewhat childish? Like she acts really young sometimes, so that kind of makes it even worse.

[danex]

I love Shallan x Adolin myself, but if Shallan x Kaladin somehow happens I wouldn’t be sad. I do feel like Kal’s arc is setting him up for a new romance thing. Like if Tarah comes back. Or maybe Azure. Vivenna’s ( how do you spell her naaaame *anguish*) not had any romance that we’ve seen right? I haven’t read warbreaker in forever. Also someone mentioned Katara x Zuko earlier and....... I have opinions

Spoiler

Katara and Zuko totally should have happened, but also Zuko should’ve died when he got hit by azulas lighting in the final fight. They kiss as Zuko dies, everyone cries, zukos redemption arc gets that much better, the final episode has a little more weight because someone dies, and then Katara still ends up with aang. 

 

[IcaroRibeiro]

Adolin and Shallan