Trusk'our

Even though Hemalurgy technically doesn't care about shape, the metal focus of the system is pretty much always turned into spikes for ease of use. But I had an idea. What if you instead made it into a wire? Think of it like this; you have the main portion of the "spike" which holds the majority of the Investiture in it. There is a wire of the same metal as the main body melded into it, which can be used to pierce a desired bearer of the spike. This way you can have a large storage for Investiture while only having a small point that needs to be inserted into the spike bearer. This would be impractical for any situation that required mobility, but there are still ways that you could use it. This would allow for someone to have a very large amount of Investiture stapled onto themselves via Hemalurgy while not having to worry about dying once the spike is removed (it would only superficially pierce the skin of the bearer, meaning that the injury would be nothing worse than getting a shot) or the spike's charge decaying (the main body is stored inside a large cut of meat preserved in alcohol solution). One way in particular that would be interesting to me is to use this for medicinal purposes. You could store a lot of Investiture inside the "battery" portion and then use the wire to let it touch the recipient's Spiritweb. The massive amount of Investiture could help the person overcome even the most virulent of diseases or could make it easier for someone to store health via F-gold. You also might be able to pierce multiple people at once with the same "spike" since you could have multiple wires coming off the same main portion. Don't exactly know what it could allow, aside from maybe letting them use the same Feruchemical power to store their attributes (it depends on whether they weaken the quality of their stored attributes when they do this or whether the strength of the Feruchemy only matters when tapping. If it merely comes down to the speed that they can store, five bearers storing 20% would be faster and easier on them than one storing 40%)? In any case, what do you guys think? What possibilities could be achieved with this new kind of "spike"?

That's true, but Elantrian's Aons take time to draw, and every second counts in battle. That's not to say that AonDor is bad in battle- after all, Raoden used it fairly effectively- just that when compared to what the Radiant does it would be a bit slow. Of course, with proper preparation that becomes a non-issue since the Elantrian can make AonDor shortcuts ahead of time, sort of making a prewritten code for them to use easily. The other big issue is that I have is that Elantrians aren't used to battle. That counts for a lot. The Elantrian is going to make rookie mistakes that the Radiant wouldn't make because the Radiant, though almost certainly much younger, is going to have more experience in that area. It doesn't matter if you've lived eight-hundred years, if you've never been in a war or major fight, you're simply not going to learn the things that those who have done that would have learned. But, if an Elantrain put their mind to it and prepped themselves extensively enough with AonDor augmentation and warded the area they were going to fight the Radiant and whatnot the Elantrian would win hands down- there's just way too much that an Elantrian can do given enough Investiture and time, and there's not limitation to the number of Aons they can theoretically draw and what those Aons can do if properly drawn (though that assumes they also dont' have to scrounge for Investiture, such as if they were on another world). That's my take on it.

Absolutely. Still, in terms of raw strength (in terms of muscle power), Vin was at a disadvantage. She just made up for it by being far more skilled or more clever.

Thanks The KB (good idea for an abbreviation, btw) should have a slightly higher advantage than Ham would. Hammond is an athletic human who also is a Pewterarm. An athletic KB would almost certainly have a higher base strength, making them proportionately stronger compared to other Pewterarms. Specifically against Vin, yes, the KB would have an advantage in physical strength- she's a bit stronger than the average Mistborn of her time (likely due to her taking in small amounts of the Mists when she was a child) but Vin did almost die when she was getting bear-hugged by a Pewterarm assassin in tWoA, so in raw muscle strength she'd be weaker than even a non-KB (but presumably athletic) Pewterarm.

I don't think so; Feruchemical pewter works by making your muscles bigger. If the muslces of the Koloss-blooded are built to have more power inside each pound of muscle they have compared to a human, a Koloss-blooded Brute would be more effective when tapping in terms of raw strength for the amount of attribute tapped. Most likely. It mostly depends on why they're stronger, but I believe it has to do with their genetics more than magic. Basically, they have more muscle and that muscle is a bit stronger than a normal human's, so they'd have an easier time storing muscle mass. Specific numbers. Percentages are used for ease of finding out what the Feruchemist is actually storing compared to what they normally have. Think of it this way. A Feruchemist who can lift 100 lbs. stores 50% of their strength, which equals 50 Invested units. A second Feruchemist who can life 200 lbs. stores 50% of their strength and stores 100 Invested units. Does that explain it? Also, as for storing, I don't think that the Koloss-blood would be able to store more Investiture than a human with the same bulk. They'd just get more use out of the attribute they tapped because the muscle mass that they get is able to exert more force. EDIT: yay! 1,500th post!

Okay, good point. The term "power" is a bit vague. I suppose I mostly meant combat power were he to face other Invested entities in battle (cause that's the most fun ).

Interesting match up. Well, it's going to depend on a number of factors, just like any other fight. Let's assume that it's the standard 5th oath Radiant- okay, yeah, not standard seeing as almost no Radiant gets to that point. So they're a very powerful Radiant. Radiants are more combat oriented in their mindset than Elantrians; most Elantrians just want to do their own thing, but Radiants must progress a great deal (and gain lots of experience) to achieve the 5th oath. That's not to say that Elantians couldn't study and train for such a confrontation, just that most Elantrians probably won't, at least not to the same extent as a Radiant would. Additionally, a Radiant's powers are quicker and easier to use than an Elantrian's, and their blades and plate make great counters against direct Elantrian assaults. Now, Elantrians have far, far greater potential than any Radiant, save maybe for an Unchained Bondsmith; the Elantrian can draw Aons ahead of time to shape the battlefield, they can craft complex illusions, they can Soulcast objects, they can transform creatures, they can teleport, can craft AonDor infused magical objects, they can do many, many more things. Basically, if an Elantrian has enough time, determination, and Investiture, they can do pretty much anything short of dethroning a Shardic Vessel. So most of the time, the 5th oath Radiant wins against the standard Elantrian due to their easier to master powers, Shardblade, Shardplate, and battle experience. But if an Elantrian really wants to win, they win.

First meme I've made Ever-so-slight Mistborn TFE and Undertale spoilers:

I do not believe that is what that quote says. It says that the Linchpin spike doesn't have to be the same type of spike as the spike that provide F-gold. That means that a Linchpin spike can be from more than one type of metal, meaning that what it contains isn't as important as either its placement or the Intent of the placer. Second, the Linchpin spike can be the spike that provides healing, which means that Linchpin spikes should be able to provide powers and act as a coordinator for the other spikes.

Interesting. Personally, I think it could work, though Identity Contamination may prevent it (if Brandon ever considers it, that is). If it does, you could perhaps use F-aluminum to blank your spike's Identity to make it possible. There would also be the Identity of the Nicrosilmind to consider, which would hold both the Identity of the Hemalurgist and that of the spike (which the Hemalurgist would no long have once the spike was removed), though Blanking the spike's Identity would once again make this a non issue. So, I think it's possible, though you'd probably have to deal with Identity Contamination first and you may face similar restrictions to the creation of multi-powered Medallions, where you could only wield a medallion with a few powers put into it at any given time. Still, it's a good idea. Good work and welcome to the Shard

Interesting. You know, I was always under the impression that the eye spikes grant physical Allomantic power plus the "natural" Steelsight due to Realmatics, and that the Linchpin spike also grants a power, it just happens to also coordinate the other spikes. So, do we know that those spikes don't grant powers, or is it an educated guess? Also, I don't know that the Linchpin spike could hold Identity or Connection (at least as the main portion) as it is in the Physical Quadrant of where spikes can be placed on an Inquisitor. That's a good point about Marsh's mental and emotional wellbeing, not just his physical abilities or knowledge and experience. I guess it would be comparable to Rashek, though Marsh is a lot more selfless and determined than Rashek was. Still, I don't think Marsh would hesitate too much to fight if it came down to it.

I thought that Wax could use his see-through-the-wall trick because his powers were, ironically, too weak to target the non-metal walls and only got to peek at the metal on the other side. Under normal circumstances, someone like Marsh or Kel wouldn't be able to see through the wall because their Steelsight is too complete and therefore blocks their vision of the other side of the wall.

In TLM Marsh was pretty weak. He had used up most of his Atium and was in a weakened state. But what about after he had gotten more Atium and no longer had that weakness? Honestly, I really wanted to see some of Marsh as a super powerful butt-kicking force for good, what with him being forced to carry out Ruin's will in tWoA and HoA. But we didn't get that. Okay, we know that he has about three and a half centuries of experience using his powers. He has at least twenty-two Hemalurgic spikes that grant him Allomantic iron, steel, pewter, tin, bronze, brass, copper, zinc, duralumin, and Atium, and he also has access to Feruchemical gold, steel, pewter, Atium, and as TLM points to, probably Feruchemical duralumin (leaving seven mystery spikes left). We also know that Marsh has access to Compounding and clearly knows how to use it. He knows about Hemalurgy and is familiar enough with it to at least knows the Bind Points used to give people Metalborn powers. Marsh has access to Cosmere-wide knowledge. So, what kind of power level are we talking about with him? What kinds of Cosmere-wide entities do you think he could face and win? What would beat him?

Well, I do remember that Kaladin mentions being able to change windstreams or pressure to a degree when he guides his team to land outside of Kholinar city in OB. I don't have the book on me right now but I'd recommend going and reading that chapter to see. Basically, Windrunners are capable of effecting atmospheric pressure as well as gravitation. They can make pockets of more survivable air pressure for people they fly around. Does that answer your questions?

I don't know, though if necessary, you could use the tuning fork method of drawing out the contents of the spike, then change it to anti-Invetiture, and then put it back. Maybe. Or perhaps that isn't necessary, and you can find a way to just take the whole spike and separate it in a vacuum and then subsequently swap it to anti-Invetiture. That's certainly a possibility, though I doubt you'd need to place it in any specific bind point since you don't need it to grant a functioning power, you just need it to touch the soul of the person it pierces so as to make the two substances annihilate each other. Pretty much everything is, as most like to point out Well, I think that it may be that you only need to learn Ruin's Tone, as it seems that the Investiture inside most (with the exception of Godmetals and possibly duralumin) spikes only Connects you to that Shard, so the Tones involved very likely only involve Ruin. I imagine using a method similar to how Navani changed Voidlight into anti-Voidlight, though that is only a guess. The process very likely could turn out to be far more complicated, as we've only seen such a thing happen once on a very small scale. That is a very possible outcome- the Investiture in a spike has an Identity, so probably would resist change more than a Blanked form of Investiture. If you could get Identity-less spikes that might solve the issue, though again, this is only a guess.

Windrunner seems obvious. . . at first. We've seen Kaladin deflect a Highstorm briefly to protect people, after all. Plus, they (and Skybreakers) could fly you up away from the storm to safety. Other Orders could protect too though. Willshaper and Stoneward could bury you beneath Roshar's stone to keep you safe. Elsecallers could send you to Shadesmar to stay safe, though that may end up becoming more dangerous than the storm in the long run. Elsecaller and Lightweaver could create bunker to keep you safe. Dustbringer could carve out a cubby to hide in more easily that just with a blade. Bondsmith, so long as they're Bonded to the Stormfather, just tell the storm to go around them (could also open up an easier path to and from Shadesmar than Elsecaller if needed). So, I choose Bondsmith if they're the Stormfather's Bondsmith. Otherwise, I choose Windrunner due to their flight, pressure manipulation, and natural inclination to protect.

Yeah, I was worried you were suggesting that for a moment but didn't want to assume you were saying it. The powers are prewritten. The spikes merely move them from one place to another, so you couldn't just turn A-Pewter to A-Steel, for example. Maybe someone with the correct knowledge could do something like that for a Mistborn, but if it's even possible it must be hard. Otherwise, the Steel Inquisition probably would have used it by now (though I suppose we don't have a lot of evidence for it not happening). I think that an eye spike can both grant the vision and the powers- Marsh started off with eleven spikes and he had the four physical Allomantic powers, the four mental Allomantic powers, A-Atium, F-gold, and one extra (maybe he doubled up on a power?) If this is the case, wouldn't his eye spikes have to also grant him powers in addition to Steelsight? EDIT: Well, I don't want to double post, so I'll just add these extra ideas on here with an edit. 16. Coinshot-ammo stow away: pretty straightforward; if a Kandra becomes a Coinshot they can pull their metal projectiles into their body. They aren't likely to hurt themselves unless they accidentally break their bones, so this method could keep their Coinshot ammo at the ready to shoot their opponents without them having the opportunity to Steelpush or Ironpull it before the Kandra expels it through their skin. 17. BIG Allomancy stores: Allomancers don't technically have to have their metal reserves inside their stomach, just inside their body. A Kandra could store lots of beads of metal around their body to burn when needed. Or they could just absorb a large ingot of whatever metal they wanted to burn. As an added bonus, they could have an aluminum compartment inside their body to secure a metal reserve from Leechers and they could open it inside their body with modified muscles to immediately replenish their reserves without needing to swallow any more. 18. Metalborn body mass: A Kandra could use Feruchemy in any of three different ways to allow them to regain lost body mass when needed. A; they use F-bendalloy to store digested food that they can tap later and gain mass (depends on whether F-bendalloy actaully stores all the food or just the digested nutrients). B; the Kandra could use F-gold to "heal" to a state that requires more mass than what they actually have on them (Kandra are great at manipulating their Cognitive Aspect, so this would very likely work), though it would require a lot of health to get what they most likely needed. C; the Kandra could give themselves tons (literally) of muscle mass, then store the excess mass inside a Pewtermind. When the Kandra needs some extra mass, they let up on their storing a bit and regain some of the lost muscle. They dissolve that muscle and turn it into whatever else they need. 19. Weight reduction: A Kandra could use F-iron to store some of their weight when crafting a really big body, allowing them to become larger than what would normally be possible. 20. Grappling terror: If a Kandra were ever to get into a wrestling match, they could push small blades and spikes through parts of their body to pincushion their opponent. They could also become goopy and mold around their opponent to get a better grip, or perhaps just amoeba-style eat them. Does anybody else have ideas to pitch in? I'd love to hear them

Steelsight can potentially be used to let an Allomancer see into other rooms through the walls (Wax used this trick when pursuing the Marksman in SoS), but for individuals (such as Steel Inquisitors) that use it to fully outline the world around them they can only see as far as an eye could normally (Vin was able to temporarily blind a Steel Inquisitor with pewter dust to the face in TFE). But does it have to be that way? We've seen that Spook was able to ignore his eye bandage in order to see the world around him. Perhaps if a someone with Steelsight were very, very skilled (or a Savant) they could use a similar trick to have an x-ray like vision of the world around them.

That's a really smart idea- you could have a Metalborn get captured and have their metal reserves Leeched away, but then a portion of those stores become accessible soon after, allowing them a surprise burst of Allomantic strength. Love the idea! Also, good point on the Kandra. . . actually, I think this could be a great addition to my 101 Kandra Tricks thread, if you wanted

We've seen from Navani in RoW that a person can change the Tone of a piece of Investiture to become an anti-Investiture. But what if this were done with a Hemalurgic spike? Since the spike tries to stapple its contents onto the Spiritweb of its bearer, I think you could turn the spike into a cheaper, more flexible soul-destroying weapon that a Raysium blade. It's way, way, way easier to get ahold of the necessary components to craft an anti-Investiture Hemalurgic spike, and the actual shape doesn't matter- you could make anything from a sword to a spear to a bullet with not Gemstone to worry about during the weapon's construction.

So, like attributes having different effects when in different Bindpoints? Or do you mean that a spike with naturally give different powers based on the recipient's Bindpoint? Here's a few more I came up with. 11. Arm cannon: MeLaan had a knife embedded in her arm so that she could tear her arm off to reveal a hidden weapon. So, what if a Kandra with a big enough body decided to do something like that- only they used a modified firearm with similar firepower to The Big Gun? Never bring a knife to a gun fight 12. Toxic blood/skin: it doesn't technically have to be blood. The Kandra could coat their skin with toxins as well if they wanted or grow venom producing organs for injection. They could use this for combat or assassination, but could also use it for defense while Worldhopping to places with dangerous predators that would normally be able to cause them serious harm or death (won't get more specific than that because this is the Mistborn thread). 13. Pheromone control: Kandra are fully capable of changing their "smell", which probably means that they can change what pheromones they release. They learn to use this to effect the behavior of insects and other critters, possibly creating a natural bug repellent or doing the opposite and sending a horde of ants to sack somebody's property. A more interesting potential for this trick is that Kandra could mimic specific pheromones that humans respond to. There are a few different known (or at least believed in- some scientists are skeptical when it comes to pheromones and human interaction) ways that pheromones could effect human behavior to the Kandra's benefit; a Kandra could release pheromones made to make others more attracted to them, the Kandra could use pheromones to help with cooperation (specifically it is believed that the pheromone androstadienone does this between human males). The effects of any pheromone manipulation for humans would probably be weak, but it could give the Kandra an edge in social interactions. 14. Sharing unique body parts: Kandra are capable of memorizing the pattern of any organ, muscle, or other body part they digest. A skilled Kandra, such as TenSoon, could craft unique body parts that work better than normal (improved eyes, ears, muscular density, etc.) and share them with other Kandra. This could allow older more experienced Kandra to share some of their unique insights to sculpting bodies with other Kandra. 15. Anti-freeze chemicals: there are animals that have a built-in resistance to death from freezing (scorpions, some insects, and some amphibians), even when embedded in ice. Kandra could easily replicate this and use it to better traverse fridged environments without suffering from frostbite.

Ah, so they could have a single spike with multiple powers/metals involved and they shift it around to get different powers at different times? That could be pretty cool. I like this one too- while basic in principle, it has quite a bit of merit and could prove useful in a huge variety of ways. Anyway, I'll post some more ideas tomorrow, but I'm feeling a bit to beat to handle it today- sorry guys.

Alright, fair enough. What if they send the cells into a catatonic state, similar to how tardigrades can hibernate for almost a hundred years without injury? The Kandra could reconnect occasionally to make sure the cells get fed, watered, oxygenated and whatnot. Or. . . ToES spoilers Yes, they do. I don't know if I communicated that idea very well- what I meant was that the Kandra would send little tendrils from their body out to crawl through the walls and spy into other rooms while still being attached to the Kandra and its nervous system. It would be like a web made of the Kandra's own body with the Kandra's main "self" being at the center of it all. The whole detaching part wouldn't strictly be necessary, though it would be cool if they could pull it off. I mean, they could crawl like a slug, but you're right that it probably wouldn't be the best form of locomotion. Perhaps they have an extra small set of bones hidden inside their normal body which could be thrown off with the rest? Then they'd have a higher chance of being able to escape competently. Eh, that's true. It's really not a good strategy in most cases. It would be more of a last resort when the Kandra is facing something that really will kill them if they stick around and fight, so they'd have some kind of way sneak away (though other, probably safer tactics exist). I liked to imagine it similar to Marasi's powers; useful, but only in very, very limited circumstances. But it could be done if needed.

I don't think you'd necessarily die, though you'd gain all the downsides of Savantism while not burning (or tapping)- for example, if Spook were to have become a pewter Savant from his spike and then lost it, he'd probably be so physically incapable that he'd need assistance just to do basic things. Or maybe he really would just die.

That could be pretty interesting. That means if the Hemalurgist gained enough power through Overmastery they could remove the spike and still retain some of their power.