The Rhythm of War

[StrikerEZ]

3 hours ago, What's a Seawolf? said:

As much as I'm still a little hesitant on Eshonai flashback chapters and focusing on the Listeners in general

I’m just curious, why are you hesitant about the next book focusing on the Singers? (the Listeners are just a group of Singers, like Americans are just a type of humans, by the way)

Personally, I’m super excited for the increased focus on the Singers. I don’t really have time to go into a lot of why I’m excited right now, but I’ll gladly type it out later if you want me to.

[galendo]

7 hours ago, StrikerEZ said:

I’m just curious, why are you hesitant about the next book focusing on the Singers? (the Listeners are just a group of Singers, like Americans are just a type of humans, by the way)

Personally, I’m super excited for the increased focus on the Singers. I don’t really have time to go into a lot of why I’m excited right now, but I’ll gladly type it out later if you want me to.

I wouldn't say I'm hesitant about the next book per se -- I don't know nearly enough for that -- but there are a few reasons why I could see someone be worried:

1) Venli is a recent main character.  Kaladin, Shallan, and Dalinar have all been mains since the first book.  Venli got a brief introduction in the second book and only ascended to main status partway through Oathbringer.  She definitely hasn't earned a place in my heart yet.

2) Venli is apart from the other main characters.  Remember how boring parts of Shallan's story got in WoK?  I liked that sequence, and even I got bored with some of the Kasbal stuff.  Characters off on their own don't have anyone to play off of.  Shallan had Jasnah, thankfully.  Venli has...Moash?

3) Venli is a replacement character.  If the fact that we're still getting Eshonai's flashbacks rather than Venli's isn't enough of a reminder, remember that Venli wasn't a planned main.  Personally, the Eshonai-for-Venli swap grated on me enough during OB (I still think it the worst decision in the book) that I'm not looking forward to reading more of the same.

4) Other than Venli and Rlain, can you even name one living Singer off the top of your head?  The only two I can even think of are the mostly-sane Fused lady who made a deal with Moash and the little girl from the band that Kaladin befriended.  I have characters whose stories I want to see in book four.  The Singers' aren't among them.

Well, I'd better stop this list before I get into things that personally bother me but probably don't irk others (like, for instance, that I generally dislike amnesia as a plot device, and the Singers are basically a race of amnesiacs).  Or things I wish I were getting instead (personally, at this point I'm way more interested in Rlain's background rather than Eshonai's).  But there are plenty of reasons why someone might not be looking forward to book four.  To say nothing of the inherent dangers of time-skips.

[Jace21]

1 hour ago, galendo said:

1) Venli is a recent main character.  Kaladin, Shallan, and Dalinar have all been mains since the first book.  Venli got a brief introduction in the second book and only ascended to main status partway through Oathbringer.  She definitely hasn't earned a place in my heart yet.

This a a fair point, but we didn't know Kaladin in WoK either and he turned out alright. Likewise I actively disliked Shallan in WoK put much preferred her after WoR so I don't see being unfamilar or her not having a place in my heart as something to really worry about.

1 hour ago, galendo said:

2) Venli is apart from the other main characters.  Remember how boring parts of Shallan's story got in WoK?  I liked that sequence, and even I got bored with some of the Kasbal stuff.  Characters off on their own don't have anyone to play off of.  Shallan had Jasnah, thankfully.  Venli has...Moash?

Kaladin and Dalinar didn't interact until the end of WoK though, but they had their own individual supporting cast. I can't see why Venli would be any different, she isn't just going to be left completely alone for an entire book.

1 hour ago, galendo said:

3) Venli is a replacement character.  If the fact that we're still getting Eshonai's flashbacks rather than Venli's isn't enough of a reminder, remember that Venli wasn't a planned main.  Personally, the Eshonai-for-Venli swap grated on me enough during OB (I still think it the worst decision in the book) that I'm not looking forward to reading more of the same.

Venli has been the intended character since "fairly early on" in the outlining process for the series. This is not a recent development.

Not liking the Eshonai/Venli twist is fine, but I wouldn't worry that Venli is being shoe-horned in at the last minute.

1 hour ago, galendo said:

4) Other than Venli and Rlain, can you even name one living Singer off the top of your head?  The only two I can even think of are the mostly-sane Fused lady who made a deal with Moash and the little girl from the band that Kaladin befriended.  I have characters whose stories I want to see in book four.  The Singers' aren't among them.

Thude! Nailed it.

You will see other character in book 4. Kaladin didn't disappear in book 2 and Shallan was still a main character in book 3. I agree it annoying that we won't get some flashbacks until the back half but we were always going to have to wait to see some of the stories.

This book we will continue the story of the existing characters, admittedly with less page time, but we will also learn a bunch more stuff. What Venli will do, what Rlain is doing, what happened to the Listeners, Singer/Listener culture, info on the Fused/Unmade, Kalak and Willshapers etc. are all things we could learn about in this book, which are awesome.

We are unlikely to focus purely on the "amnesiacs" when we have Venli, Listeners, Rlain, Fused etc, so hopefully that won't be an issue. And things like Rlains backstory are likely to be addressed too, if there is anything to learn, just not through flashbacks.

I understand your concerns, but it does seem like you're looking at it very negatively. Brandon has done things I have disagreed with before but he always comes through.

[galendo]

1 hour ago, Jace21 said:

This a a fair point, but we didn't know Kaladin in WoK either and he turned out alright. Likewise I actively disliked Shallan in WoK put much preferred her after WoR so I don't see being unfamilar or her not having a place in my heart as something to really worry about.

Sure, but comparing Kaladin to Venli is a bit disingenuous.  Kaladin is, IMHO, the best character and character arc that Sanderson ever created.  Venli falls very much short.  Different stroke for different folks, though; I liked Shallan in WoK a lot more than I did in WoR.

Quote

Kaladin and Dalinar didn't interact until the end of WoK though, but they had their own individual supporting cast. I can't see why Venli would be any different, she isn't just going to be left completely alone for an entire book.

This is largely true; but I'll note that Dalinar and Kaladin were both acting (albeit mostly indirectly in Kaladin's case) with Sadeas, and that helped make it feel that they were part of the same story and events.  Plus, let's face it: Kaladin and company carried WoK.  The Kaladin/Bridge Four interaction was strong enough that anything Dalinar was just a bonus.

Quote

Venli has been the intended character since "fairly early on" in the outlining process for the series. This is not a recent development.

The only WoB I've seen on this was vague.  Some people have taken it to mean early in the outlining process for Stormlight; on the other hand, I strongly suspect the swap was early in the outlining process for Oathbringer.

Quote

You will see other character in book 4. Kaladin didn't disappear in book 2 and Shallan was still a main character in book 3. I agree it annoying that we won't get some flashbacks until the back half but we were always going to have to wait to see some of the stories.

Sure, but Venli's just isn't one that I care about.  I probably would have cared about Eshonai's if she were still around, but I just don't have the emotional connection to Venli that I did to Eshonai.  I mean, I didn't have a massive amount for Eshonai, but I literally wouldn't care if Venli got killed in her first scene in Oathbringer.  (I mean, I'd still gripe about it as a wasted plot-line and questionable decision, but only because I really didn't like Venli's scenes in OB.  Every single one just felt like it was planned for Eshonai and then Venli was awkwardly fit in instead.  Just my opinion, though, and I accept that somehow, for some reason, others feel differently.  I just don't see it.)

Though if Venli died in her first scene, only for Rlain to take her place, I'd probably be dancing in the streets.  So execution is everything.

Quote

This book we will continue the story of the existing characters, admittedly with less page time, but we will also learn a bunch more stuff. What Venli will do, what Rlain is doing, what happened to the Listeners, Singer/Listener culture, info on the Fused/Unmade, Kalak and Willshapers etc. are all things we could learn about in this book, which are awesome.

This is almost certainly true, and is a good thing.  (Not sure where you're getting ideas about Kalak from; and Listener culture doesn't seem to matter much anymore, not to mention I feel I learned everything I really need to know about it already in WoR; but I agree that for the most part this is solid conjecture and something I'm looking forward to.)

Quote

I understand your concerns, but it does seem like you're looking at it very negatively.

Honestly, the above reasons aren't even my main concerns with book four, though they are concerns.  I was mostly just replying to StrikerEZ's question about why someone might be concerned specifically about having Venli as the focus character for the book.

Quote

Brandon has done things I have disagreed with before but he always comes through.

This is also true.  Well, I thought that Well of Ascension was sub-average, that Warbreaker had...issues, and that the Wax and Wayne novels probably should have stopped with the first one, but mostly I've been quite happy with what he's written.  Oathbringer was a disappointment, but only because I had such high hopes for a Stormlight book.  So yeah, I'm pretty sure that book four will likely maintain Oathbringer levels of quality; it's just that, after WoK and WoR, I can't help wishing for so much more.

[Jace21]

20 minutes ago, galendo said:

Sure, but comparing Kaladin to Venli is a bit disingenuous.  Kaladin is, IMHO, the best character and character arc that Sanderson ever created.  Venli falls very much short.  Different stroke for different folks, though; I liked Shallan in WoK a lot more than I did in WoR.

Oh absolutely, I love Kal. My point was that going into book 1 there is no emotional connection there, it is the writing that made us like him. Venli hasnt really had much page time yet so I am witholding judgement until she has.

23 minutes ago, galendo said:

The only WoB I've seen on this was vague.  Some people have taken it to mean early in the outlining process for Stormlight; on the other hand, I strongly suspect the swap was early in the outlining process for Oathbringer.

Valid interpretation, I read it more as being in the wholenseries outline. Either way though, I agree with Brandon thay Eshonai would have been too similar to other characters but that's just my opinion.

26 minutes ago, galendo said:

Sure, but comparing Kaladin to Venli is a bit disingenuous.  Kaladin is, IMHO, the best character and character arc that Sanderson ever created.  Venli falls very much short.  Different stroke for different folks, though; I liked Shallan in WoK a lot more than I did in WoR.

This is largely true; but I'll note that Dalinar and Kaladin were both acting (albeit mostly indirectly in Kaladin's case) with Sadeas, and that helped make it feel that they were part of the same story and events.  Plus, let's face it: Kaladin and company carried WoK.  The Kaladin/Bridge Four interaction was strong enough that anything Dalinar was just a bonus.

The only WoB I've seen on this was vague.  Some people have taken it to mean early in the outlining process for This is almost certainly true, and is a good thing.  (Not sure where you're getting ideas about Kalak from; and Listener culture doesn't seem to matter much anymore, not to mention I feel I learned everything I really need to know about it already in WoR; but I agree that for the most part this is solid conjecture and something I'm looking forward to.)

Kalak is pure speculation on my part I admit. But he is the Herald of the Willshapers and he is in or has been in contact with Nale. Since Nale is now with the listeners and could easily meet Venli, Kalak showing up and meeting the newest member of his order doesn't seem beyond the realm of possibility. But like I said, just speculation on my part.

I think Listener culture will be hugely relevant, Venli teaching the normal singers about it was her last line in Oathbringer after all. If/when a non-Odium aligned group of Singers forms, their traditional culture should increase in importance. Even more if Thude and the others survived and show up with Rlain.

I agree with you for the most part on everything, I guess I am just less worried in this case.

[StrikerEZ]

11 hours ago, galendo said:

I wouldn't say I'm hesitant about the next book per se -- I don't know nearly enough for that -- but there are a few reasons why I could see someone be worried:

1) Venli is a recent main character.  Kaladin, Shallan, and Dalinar have all been mains since the first book.  Venli got a brief introduction in the second book and only ascended to main status partway through Oathbringer.  She definitely hasn't earned a place in my heart yet.

Yeah, that’s completely fair. Venli completely won me over during OB, though I could see why others might be hesitant to read her story in the next book.

11 hours ago, galendo said:

2) Venli is apart from the other main characters.  Remember how boring parts of Shallan's story got in WoK?  I liked that sequence, and even I got bored with some of the Kasbal stuff.  Characters off on their own don't have anyone to play off of.  Shallan had Jasnah, thankfully.  Venli has...Moash?

I’ll touch more on this later in response to part 4, but just because Venli will be the focus doesn’t mean that your favorite characters won’t get heir moment to shine (think Kaladin in WoR or Shallan in OB).

11 hours ago, galendo said:

3) Venli is a replacement character.  If the fact that we're still getting Eshonai's flashbacks rather than Venli's isn't enough of a reminder, remember that Venli wasn't a planned main.  Personally, the Eshonai-for-Venli swap grated on me enough during OB (I still think it the worst decision in the book) that I'm not looking forward to reading more of the same.

I definitely don’t think that Venli was a last-minute swap. The two are so different from each other that their stories simply would not have worked if Eshonai had survived instead of Venli. I’ve talked extensively about this in other threads, but I think we’ll just have to agree to disagree (I think we might’ve already had this debate).

11 hours ago, galendo said:

4) Other than Venli and Rlain, can you even name one living Singer off the top of your head?  The only two I can even think of are the mostly-sane Fused lady who made a deal with Moash and the little girl from the band that Kaladin befriended.  I have characters whose stories I want to see in book four.  The Singers' aren't among them.

I feel like a huge part of Venli’s arc in the next book will probably be building up an anti-Odium resistance among the Singers. That will probably give us plenty of characters for Venli to react off of. Plus, I’m sure it’ll all culminate at some point with Venli meeting up with the rest of the gang as well, presumably in the epic finale. I’m sure Khen and some of the other Singers that survived the Battle of Kholinar will also be involved with Venli’s arc as well.

Anyway, to each their own. You can not like Venli as a character, and I can like her as a character.

@Jace21 already said a lot of this, but I feel like I should make my comments as well.

Edited February 9, 2019 by StrikerEZ

[Nymeros]

Sadly, I dont believe any book title in the Cosmere will top the Way of Kings....It's just too majestic and epic.

This...this nice though. Not only does it reflect the magical Rhythms heard by the Parsh but also could reflect the central theme of the book. Would love a deep dive into the character roles and routines as they adjust to the prolonged conflict between the allied humans and Parsh.

[+Oltux72]

39 minutes ago, Nymeros said:

Sadly, I dont believe any book title in the Cosmere will top the Way of Kings....It's just too majestic and epic.

Rhythm is too long and Greek. You need something Anglo-saxon there. Sound of War. Beat of War. Song of War.

[Ciridae]

Dalinar and the Stormfather know about Venli resisting Rayse, I think they'll try to contact her rather sooner than later.

I think RoW will be the book where it finally clicks for Dalinar that he has to unite not only humans but all sapient races on Roshar.  Kaladin has figured it out, sort of, and I'm sure Venli will see it too and interact with the main cast eventually. I don't think anyone has to worry that we won't see enough of team Honor. 

I would enjoy an infiltration/subterfuge/silent rebellion plot line for Venli a lot, but I don't see how she could do that right under the noses of the Fused in Marat if she's also practicing Surgebinding. So she has to go somewhere else, maybe with her Thaylen singer crew. 

Also is Timbre going to speak only in rhythms? It's pretty cool, and Venli seems to understand her just fine but I'd rather have actual dialogue. 

[galendo]

19 hours ago, Jace21 said:

Oh absolutely, I love Kal. My point was that going into book 1 there is no emotional connection there, it is the writing that made us like him. Venli hasnt really had much page time yet so I am witholding judgement until she has.Kalak is pure speculation on my part I admit. But he is the Herald of the Willshapers and he is in or has been in contact with Nale. Since Nale is now with the listeners and could easily meet Venli, Kalak showing up and meeting the newest member of his order doesn't seem beyond the realm of possibility.

Sure, but by the time Kaladin had about as much screen time as Venli's had, he was my favorite character.  Venli doesn't even make the top ten.  Probably not even the top twenty.

Quote

Valid interpretation, I read it more as being in the wholenseries outline. Either way though, I agree with Brandon thay Eshonai would have been too similar to other characters but that's just my opinion.

I sort of agree with this, in that Eshonai uniting the Parsendi would be somewhat like Dalinar uniting the Alethi, but I don't really see how swapping in Venli's going to make that much of a difference.  It's still going to be the same "secretly unite a group of ex-parshmen against their Fused overlords" plot that we'd have gotten either way.  The only advantage of Venli over Eshonai is that if and when the group that Eshonai sent into the canyons meets up with Venli/Eshonai, they'd probably be distrustful of Venli where they wouldn't have been of Eshonai.  That's something, but not enough to justify the swap, IMHO.  (Though, again, execution is everything.)

Of course, if Brandon takes Venli somewhere that he just couldn't have taken Eshonai -- something like killing Timbre and turning on the Fused only to set herself up as queen lapdog to Odium, then I might reconsider.  But I somehow doubt that Venli's story is heading in that direction.  From what I can see, Eshonai's story is still alive and well, just without its main star.

Quote

I think Listener culture will be hugely relevant, Venli teaching the normal singers about it was her last line in Oathbringer after all. If/when a non-Odium aligned group of Singers forms, their traditional culture should increase in importance.

If anything I think the new Parshendi need to create a new culture.  The old culture was a very different beast, based around a very justifiable fear of their gods and a very justifiable desire to discover new forms.  But now their gods have returned and handed out like candy the forms that the previous culture strove for so long to find, and I just can't see how the old culture would have survived the new world even if its practitioners had survived.  The old culture just doesn't seem relevant anymore.

Quote

Even more if Thude and the others survived and show up with Rlain.

Oh, Thude!  Eshonai's general!  You know, when you first wrote "Thude!  Nailed it.", I thought it a misspelling of "Thud!  Nailed it.", as in, "You've hit the nail on the head!".  Guess that goes to show how well I remember most of the Parshendi.  Not that we necessarily know that he's still living.  I mean, probably, since we haven't seen a corpse...but it's a bit hard to argue that a bunch of ill-formed, ill-equipped Parshendi survived the Highstorm/Everstorm combo when a full Shardbearer in a form of power met her death there.  Eshonai's death continues to create, if not full plot holes, at least plot instabilities.

Quote

But like I said, just speculation on my part.I agree with you for the most part on everything, I guess I am just less worried in this case.

Yeah, I think we mostly agree, outside some few details.  It's not even that I'm worried exactly, it's more that I'm trying to mentally prepare myself for an Oathbringer-quality book when what I really want is another Way of Kings.

13 hours ago, StrikerEZ said:

I’ll touch more on this later in response to part 4, but just because Venli will be the focus doesn’t mean that your favorite characters won’t get heir moment to shine (think Kaladin in WoR or Shallan in OB).

Oh, yeah, I'm sure they will.  They'll just get less screen time than they would otherwise.  With how many plots got short shrift in Oathbringer (Sadeas' murder, Szeth's side switch, Teft's Radiancy, etc.), I'm not sure that pulling even more time away from the main cast is a good idea.  Especially immediately following a time-skip.

Quote

I definitely don’t think that Venli was a last-minute swap. The two are so different from each other that their stories simply would not have worked if Eshonai had survived instead of Venli. I’ve talked extensively about this in other threads, but I think we’ll just have to agree to disagree (I think we might’ve already had this debate).

Yeah, we've gone over this before.  No use rehashing old arguments here.

Quote

I feel like a huge part of Venli’s arc in the next book will probably be building up an anti-Odium resistance among the Singers. That will probably give us plenty of characters for Venli to react off of. Plus, I’m sure it’ll all culminate at some point with Venli meeting up with the rest of the gang as well, presumably in the epic finale. I’m sure Khen and some of the other Singers that survived the Battle of Kholinar will also be involved with Venli’s arc as well.

This all seems very likely.  It's just that they're (mostly) not characters we already know.

10 hours ago, Nymeros said:

Sadly, I dont believe any book title in the Cosmere will top the Way of Kings....It's just too majestic and epic.

True this.  Sometimes I think the entire series should have been called The Way of Kings rather than The Stormlight Archive, especially given the pervasive role the eponymous book plays in-world.

10 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

Rhythm is too long and Greek. You need something Anglo-saxon there. Sound of War. Beat of War. Song of War.

I actually think it's the "War" part that's the problem.  Something like "Rhythm of Remembrance" would be good.

[+Oltux72]

7 hours ago, galendo said:

I actually think it's the "War" part that's the problem.  Something like "Rhythm of Remembrance" would be good.

Mismatch. Rhythm of rememberance is better because you combine two learned words. Yet of you want the impact of "Way of Kings" you need to use simple, old words.

[Use the Falchion]

Rhythm of War...I like it! I gets "war" in the title like Highprince of War was supposed to, so I like it better than Song of Secrets. I kinda wish it wasn't an X of Y format, but I can live with it (especially if he keeps Book 5 as Stones Unhallowed). 

[Winds Alight]

I like the title very much and wouldn't mind if it stays.

I'm also excited about more listener culture and more Venli. I like her more than I liked Eshonai. Eshonai started off likeable and more "typical" for a fantasy protagonist, but she wasn't special in any way, at least I didn't get any such vibes during WoR.
I didn't like Venli at all in WoR, but in OB, she quickly grew on me and now I'm looking forward to see more of her and Timbre and her role in the coming books.

[+Oltux72]

If the Fused have months, will they reintroduce all Forms of Power?
They must know how to transform Listeners into them. So not using that power would be stupid, wouldn't it? What would a possible drawback be? They might challenge them for command, but they are too few to retain supreme command over all of them anyway. And as much devastation as possible is good.

[+Child of Hodor]

Venli won me over because of her spren, Timbre. Timbre is so cute and earnest and Venli protects her from the Fused and Odium over and over again. Venli also expressed some remorse which made me empathize with her. 

"How can you keep a Voidspren captive?"  Timbre pulsed to Victory within her.  

[Winds Alight]

16 minutes ago, Child of Hodor said:

Venli won me over because of her spren, Timbre. Timbre is so cute and earnest and Venli protects her from the Fused and Odium over and over again. Venli also expressed some remorse which made me empathize with her. 

"How can you keep a Voidspren captive?"  Timbre pulsed to Victory within her.  

Venli's interaction with Timbre was also the main reason why I came to like her

 

[galendo]

But the Timbre interactions would have been better with Eshonai, iMHO...well, we can agree to differ, I suppose.

Still, remind me what earthly reason Venli had for sheltering Timbre at the risk of her own life?  It seems that it would be the equivalent of, I dunno, risking your life to save a rat that was crawling on your sister's corpse.  It just doesn't make sense.  Eshonai would have had a reason to save Timbre, but I just don't see what motivation Venli had.  (Scenes like these are why I feel that Venli was a hot-swap.  This seems so much like an Eshonai scene, but unfortunately Venli's there instead.)

[Goatbringer]

On 2/6/2019 at 10:10 PM, Pathfinder said:

the traditions and oral history of the listeners

I really like this idea, not necessarily that each SL book will be named after an in-world book, but rather an in-world story. Lots of cultures on our planet have a rich history of oral and storytelling traditions, and it would be really cool to see this reflected in Brandon's choice of a title to be inclusive to that different culture, since that's one of the main forms of conflict in the books.

The Listeners being the original inhabitants of Roshar and the humans being the invaders reminds me a lot of the European settlement of North America. The Europeans came in with their advanced technology, their germs, their weaponry, their idea to 'civilize' the 'savages'... the native people were almost decimated by the colonizers and it feels like only now in Canadian/American history are we coming to terms with the absolute devastation of that action. It seems like it's the same thing is happening on Roshar - the guilt associated with being the descendants of murderers and colonizers, but still having to fight. GAH I love SL so much! 

Anyway, long story short - I would really like to see that included: an alternative medium of transmitting history being seen as 'on par' with books. Does it make sense? I don't know. But I like it. 

[+Child of Hodor]

On 2/13/2019 at 3:57 PM, galendo said:

But the Timbre interactions would have been better with Eshonai, iMHO...well, we can agree to differ, I suppose.

Still, remind me what earthly reason Venli had for sheltering Timbre at the risk of her own life?  It seems that it would be the equivalent of, I dunno, risking your life to save a rat that was crawling on your sister's corpse.  It just doesn't make sense.  Eshonai would have had a reason to save Timbre, but I just don't see what motivation Venli had.  (Scenes like these are why I feel that Venli was a hot-swap.  This seems so much like an Eshonai scene, but unfortunately Venli's there instead.)

Because she's not a monster and she doesn't trust the Fused. Her first encounter with the Fused was them killing her friends, she doesn't particularly like them. The Listeners revered and valued spren. It's instinctual. As you said, she saw it floating around her sister, on some level she may feel it's her last remaining connection to Eshonai. The first time she protects Timbre it is from the Fused that just killed her once-mate. She didn't want him to destroy anything else.

Eshonai and Timbre have similar personalities, Timbre is a little explorer zipping around rooms, peering in drawers and such. I don't think they compliment each other like other radiant pairs.

Syl is cheerful, Kaladin not so much.

Wyndle worries constantly, Lift acts without thinking of the risks.

Shallan uses wordplay all the time and abstract thought/Art, Pattern is a cognitive manifestation of mathematics and is very literal in his interpretation of words. 

I like Eshonai a lot and was sad she died, but I think the Timbre - Venli pairing is more interesting. 

[CrazyRioter]

To be fair, we don't really know a lot about Timbre's actual personality, other than what we can extrapolate from Venli's observations (and the fact that she apparently ditched her job in Shadesmar to go looking for a listener bondmate). She hasn't even had any proper lines.

But yeah, Brandon's said he replaced Eshonai with Venli because a character that starts out more deeply flawed was more interesting, and I can definitely see the logic in that.

Edited February 23, 2019 by CrazyRioter

[Winds Alight]

I have one complaint about the possible title.
So far, we have WoK, WoR, OB, and now RoW. There's going to be a lot of confusion.

[+Invocation]

11 minutes ago, Winds Alight said:

So far, we have WoK, WoR, OB, and now RoW. There's going to be a lot of confusion.

That's half the fun.

[equinox]

7 minutes ago, Winds Alight said:

I have one complaint about the possible title.
So far, we have WoK, WoR, OB, and now RoW. There's going to be a lot of confusion. 

Book 5 needs to be KoW! Ahhh... OB doesn't fit. Which letter was it again, that doesn't ruin symmetries in Vorin names?  I guess we can't do anything about it... 

[ScavellTane]

Technically, Oathbringer is only 'O'.

[equinox]

2 minutes ago, ScavellTane said:

Technically, Oathbringer is only 'O'.

Oh... Right!  Thank you so much!