Sparkrunner he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 (edited) Um not really... But we do have a doc You have shardbearers and you control the lynch. We have maybe two or three voidbringer kills before they are outed. Edited July 12, 2017 by Roadwalker
Hemalurgic Headshot he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 (edited) And aren't the Voidbringers exposed if they kill using their ability? Edit: In Stormform Edited July 12, 2017 by Hemalurgic_Headshot
Sparkrunner he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 Voidbringer Forms: Stormform: A Voidbringer in Stormform survives the first kill (including the lynch) that targets them, even if they have already survived a kill in Warform. In addition, each cycle, you may choose a player to attack with your lightning each cycle. If you do so, you are revealed as their killer and as a Voidbringer. Decayform: Each cycle, a Voidbringer in Decayform may target another player to roleblock. All of their actions fail, and their vote is not counted. Once per game, you may also choose to kill the target of your roleblock. They die one cycle after your roleblock on them.
DrakeMarshall he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 3 hours ago, Yitzi2 said: Your faction analysis is extremely flawed, and seems to be based on the assumption that the Ghostblood win condition is "knock out the other two secret factions", rather than the actual "knock out ALL other factions" (which means that the vanilla Parshendi and Alethi cannot win with them). Being part of a secret faction doesn't make you no longer an Alethi or a Parshendi, which is what you appear to be assuming. The Parshendi not in any secret faction have only one objective: the game has to end with one of us alive. Same thing goes for Alethi not in a secret faction. One Alethi has to be alive at the game for this group to win. Now, if all the Alethi are wiped out, the game ends, with a Voidbringer victory. Similarly, if all the Parshendi are wiped out, the game ends, with a Sons of Honor victory. That's very bad news for a Ghostblood. It means they lose. So it is 100% in their interest to preserver at least one Parshendi and at least one Alethi. Specifically, the Parshendi and Alethi that are themselves Ghostbloods. So it is actually impossible for the Ghostbloods to win without me also winning. It is also impossible for the Voidbringers to win without me also winning. Similarly, it is also impossible for the Ghostbloods to win without unaligned Alethi winning. It is also impossible for the Sons of Honor to win without the unlaligned Alethi also winning.
Hemalurgic Headshot he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 (edited) So, as it seems, it is in the majority's best interests to eliminate the Voidbringers or the Sons of Honor. Due to the Stormform kill self-reveal, it will be much easier to find Voidbringers than Sons of Honor. Additionally, I suggest Alethi make us of their PMs. Remember, this is a peace agreement underway, so don't be afraid to work with Parshendi, especially if they are unaligned. Don't mess with Ghostbloods or Voidbringers, okay kids? Edited July 12, 2017 by Hemalurgic_Headshot
Sparkrunner he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 Quote Now, if all the Alethi are wiped out, the game ends, with a Voidbringer victory. Similarly, if all the Parshendi are wiped out, the game ends, with a Sons of Honor victory. That's very bad news for a Ghostblood. It means they lose. So it is 100% in their interest to preserver at least one Parshendi and at least one Alethi. Specifically, the Parshendi and Alethi that are themselves Ghostbloods. So it is actually impossible for the Ghostbloods to win without me also winning. It is also impossible for the Voidbringers to win without me also winning. Similarly, it is also impossible for the Ghostbloods to win without unaligned Alethi winning. It is also impossible for the Sons of Honor to win without the unlaligned Alethi also winning. Quote So, as it seems, it is in the majority's best interests to eliminate the Voidbringers or the Sons of Honor. Due to the Stormform kill self-reveal, it will be much easier to find Voidbringers than Sons of Honor. @Drake Marshall what do the ghostbloods do if, say the parshendi ghostblood is knocked out by sons of honor or a lynch?
DrakeMarshall he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 Just now, Roadwalker said: @Drake Marshall what do the ghostbloods do if, say the parshendi ghostblood is knocked out by sons of honor or a lynch? I can't rightly say I know if there's only one or not. But I'm guessing what happens is... Their win condition becomes much more difficult. They'd have to win by first killing off all the non-ghostblood Alethi, and then by killing of all remaining parshendi (but keeping them alive until all the Alethi are dead, which would be a challenge because chances are the Sons of Honor are still alive). If they somehow pulled this off, they'd win alongside the unaligned Alethi, and everyone else would lose. 1
Seonid he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Author Posted July 12, 2017 Rules clarification, because apparently I really needed to do a better job communicating intent: The only way the unaligned Alethi can win is if an unaligned Alethi is alive at game end. The only way the unaligned Parshendi can win is if an unaligned Parshendi is alive at game end. Parshendi that are part of a secret faction count as Parshendi that must be killed for the sons of honor to win, but do not count for the unaligned Parshendi win condition. Alethi that are part of a secret faction count as Alethi that must be killed for the Voidbringers to win, but do not for the unaligned Alethi win condition 2
StrikerEZ he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 Okay, I think the safest bet for both the Alethi and the Parhsendi would be to try to use the lynch to try and weed out any Ghostbloods, because they're basically the mafia of this game. If we could get rid of them as quickly as possible, that would just leave unaligned and Sons/Voidbringers. Personally, I'm more likely to side with the Sons and help them out because I'm an Alethi, and the Voidbringers raise a very serious threat against my win condition. I think the best outcome for as many people as possible would be to to hunt down the Ghostbloods, then either the Sons/Voidbringers, since that would allow for the most people to win this game. Of course, then we'd also need to take out the other faction, since they would pose a threat to the regular Parshendi/Alethi...hmm.... If it comes down to it, I'm gonna have to side with the Sons to make sure no Voidbringers can take me out, but I think it'd be really cool if both unaligned groups could win, since that lets the most amount of players reach their win condition. 2
Hemalurgic Headshot he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 6 minutes ago, StrikerEZ said: If it comes down to it, I'm gonna have to side with the Sons to make sure no Voidbringers can take me out, but I think it'd be really cool if both unaligned groups could win, since that lets the most amount of players reach their win condition. And it fits the theme, you know, a peace treaty and all... 1
StrikerEZ he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 1 minute ago, Hemalurgic_Headshot said: And it fits the theme, you know, a peace treaty and all... Yeah, that's kind of what I was going for.
Sparkrunner he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 (edited) 10 minutes ago, StrikerEZ said: If it comes down to it, I'm gonna have to side with the Sons to make sure no Voidbringers can take me out, but I think it'd be really cool if both unaligned groups could win, since that lets the most amount of players reach their win condition. Don't side with the sons. I agree that the Parshendi and Alethi should win, however. Edited July 12, 2017 by Roadwalker ninja'd
StrikerEZ he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 6 minutes ago, Roadwalker said: Don't side with the sons. I agree that the Parshendi and Alethi should win, however. I know, I'm not gonna try to side with them. But in the end, my win condition is more important to me than others, sadly. Like I said, this should be a peaceful game, though the existence of factions that wanna kill a lot of people complicates things.
Sart he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 Sarit examined the Parshendi entourage. The good news was the Alethi delegation outnumbered them two to one. The bad news was each Parshendi appeared to be confident veterans of Warform. While there were some warriors among the Alethi, there was a significant number of diplomats among them. If fighting broke out, Sarit didn't like the Alethi odds. If only one of the Parshendi would turn into their rumored Scholar forms. That would make them much easier to talk to. He examined the warriors, and approached the most talkative one. "Kyner (Drake Marshall), I request that you turn into your Scholar form. To guarantee this, I will strip your armor away. Then you can be more observant, and be a leading force for peace. Does that sound agreeable?" Out of RP color is orange now. Here's my plan that should benefit both sides. We lynch a Parshendi today, preferably an active one. Due to Warform, they won't die, but they will be down an extra life. Therefore, Warform wouldn't be useful, so they can switch to Scholar form. @Seonid You don't die if you switch from Warform after losing your extra life, right? It would be suicidal for a faction to attack the Scholar, as the Parshendi can easily protect him through Warform. The Scholar can then report on roles and alignments of the Alethi. If they get it wrong, we can always lynch them, since they won't have an extra life to rely on. If they tell the truth, we then have a guaranteed cop in the Parshendi hands, who can start getting rid of the Ghostbloods and Sons of Honor. The loss of an extra life stops a betrayal. For this to work, we need an active Parshendi. Since @Drake Marshall has been active, I suggest him, but if the Parshendi have another candidate, that could be arranged. What do you guys think of this? Let me know. 4
Sparkrunner he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 1 minute ago, Sart said: Out of RP color is orange now. Since when? 2 minutes ago, Sart said: We lynch a Parshendi today, preferably an active one. Due to Warform, they won't die, but they will be down an extra life. Why not just have them switch to scholarform? Some of us were planning to do so anyway. You just sound like a Son of Honor. 2 minutes ago, Sart said: It would be suicidal for a faction to attack the Scholar, I don't quite see how... 4 minutes ago, Sart said: The loss of an extra life stops a betrayal. Another in Warform could just protect them. 5 minutes ago, Sart said: we then have a guaranteed cop in the Parshendi hands, who can start getting rid of the Ghostbloods and Sons of Honor. We would be doing this anyway without giving so much information to our enemies... I accuse @Sart of being a Son of Honor.
asterion137 he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, Roadwalker said: Some of us were planning to do so anyway. You just sound like a Son of Honor. I as a non-Sons Alethi wouldn't lynch a son of honor anyways. Lynching any Alethi, sons or not, on D1 isn't smart for us
Sparkrunner he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 Yeah it is. Your win conditions are incompatible.
Sart he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 12 minutes ago, Roadwalker said: Since when? Why not just have them switch to scholarform? Some of us were planning to do so anyway. You just sound like a Son of Honor. I don't quite see how... Another in Warform could just protect them. We would be doing this anyway without giving so much information to our enemies... I accuse @Sart of being a Son of Honor. Since now You don't have to do it, I just like the distinction between RP and discussion. I'm aware some Parshendi will switch to Scholarform. I want a Scholar that the Alethi know about, and can target if things go wrong. It's insurance. They will be protected by Warform. If a faction tries to attack them, they'll hit someone else instead. @Seonid Does Warform's redirect protect against the lynch? If the Scholar gives bad information, we can just lynch him This plan benefits both sides. The Parshendi get a trusted member of the village, who can detect Ghostbloods and Sons of Honor. The Alendi get insurance in case the Parshendi try to use their scanners to lynch a regular Alethi. It's a compromise that tries to benefit both sides.
Sparkrunner he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 What I see is you trying to get us to waste resources and our spare kill protection. If we find a son of honor or a ghostblood they will be exposed and voted on, never fear. 5 minutes ago, Sart said: I want a Scholar that the Alethi know about, and can target if things go wrong what is "if things go wrong" and why would targeting them help?
Sart he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 4 minutes ago, Roadwalker said: What I see is you trying to get us to waste resources and our spare kill protection. If we find a son of honor or a ghostblood they will be exposed and voted on, never fear. what is "if things go wrong" and why would targeting them help? What I'm worried about is the Parshendi going, "X is a Ghostblood, we need to lynch him." and then it turns out X is not a ghostblood. You guys can start blaming yourselves, and we won't know who to trust. Even if we attack or lynch one of you, we could just as easily hit another Warform, and waste our kill. With my plan, if you betray us, we kill or lynch the false Scholar. Thus, you have incentive not to lie to us.
Sparkrunner he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 I want to see what @Drake Marshall thinks before I say anything.
Steeldancer he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 Factions. Hm. Everyone has already outlined the different alliances. I am partial to rooting out the Ghostbloods first. The thing is, there are only 8 parshendi. That means there is a greater likelihood of hitting a voidbringer or ghostblood if we kill a parshendi, right? Wait. That makes no sense. It's probable that the percentages might be similar. So... do we alternate? No. That matches with the ghostbloods aims too well. Ok so I'll think about it a little bit and see if I can come up with any ideas for finding ghostbloods. 1
DrakeMarshall he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, Seonid said: Rules clarification, because apparently I really needed to do a better job communicating intent: The only way the unaligned Alethi can win is if an unaligned Alethi is alive at game end. The only way the unaligned Parshendi can win is if an unaligned Parshendi is alive at game end. Parshendi that are part of a secret faction count as Parshendi that must be killed for the sons of honor to win, but do not count for the unaligned Parshendi win condition. Alethi that are part of a secret faction count as Alethi that must be killed for the Voidbringers to win, but do not for the unaligned Alethi win condition Well this changes everything. New plan. We should probably kill off all the secret factions. 1 hour ago, Sart said: Sarit examined the Parshendi entourage. The good news was the Alethi delegation outnumbered them two to one. The bad news was each Parshendi appeared to be confident veterans of Warform. While there were some warriors among the Alethi, there was a significant number of diplomats among them. If fighting broke out, Sarit didn't like the Alethi odds. If only one of the Parshendi would turn into their rumored Scholar forms. That would make them much easier to talk to. He examined the warriors, and approached the most talkative one. "Kyner (Drake Marshall), I request that you turn into your Scholar form. To guarantee this, I will strip your armor away. Then you can be more observant, and be a leading force for peace. Does that sound agreeable?" Out of RP color is orange now. Here's my plan that should benefit both sides. We lynch a Parshendi today, preferably an active one. Due to Warform, they won't die, but they will be down an extra life. Therefore, Warform wouldn't be useful, so they can switch to Scholar form. @Seonid You don't die if you switch from Warform after losing your extra life, right? It would be suicidal for a faction to attack the Scholar, as the Parshendi can easily protect him through Warform. The Scholar can then report on roles and alignments of the Alethi. If they get it wrong, we can always lynch them, since they won't have an extra life to rely on. If they tell the truth, we then have a guaranteed cop in the Parshendi hands, who can start getting rid of the Ghostbloods and Sons of Honor. The loss of an extra life stops a betrayal. For this to work, we need an active Parshendi. Since @Drake Marshall has been active, I suggest him, but if the Parshendi have another candidate, that could be arranged. What do you guys think of this? Let me know. My my... What an interesting post. You want me to enter scholarform. Well and good. In fact, I'll tell you with zero strings attached that I had already put in an order to enter into scholarform yesterday, and discussed this with the other parshendi. And you want accountability? Fine. I've just told you, I'm already going to be a scholarform. That can be public knowledge now. But what in the name of Ruin makes you think that lynching me is a good plan for leverage? I'd much rather still have the opportunity to protect myself later, thank you very much. I also don't really like a strategy that stresses lynching actives above all else. So, tell you what. New plan. I'll still be a scholarform and all that. And I will report information to everyone. But we are going to lynch people who are actually part of secret factions. I am fully willing to help lynch Voidbringers if the Alethi are willing to help lynch Sons of Honor. And with that, I think Yitzi could very likely be a Son of Honor. EDIT: And if you don't believe that I planned to enter scholarform all along... Well I suppose you could ask the other Parshendi, because one of them already agreed to protect me while I was in scholarform yesterday. Or you could wait until I reveal a secret role I suppose. That should be proof, no? Edited July 12, 2017 by Drake Marshall
Sparkrunner he/him Posted July 12, 2017 Posted July 12, 2017 I think everyone from both factions should agree that lynching secret faction members is the best plan. In fact- if you are part of a secret faction why don't you reveal right now? I'm good with throwing a poke vote on Yitzi for now.
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