Long Game 104: The Flame of Tar Valon

[The Unknown Medallion he/him]

2 hours ago, DrakeMarshall said:

this is a very slight read but Kas says "elims tend to overcamp" and Gaea posts soon after with a response that feels very not overcampy

our babysitter, maybe someone needs to keep our madness in check >>

add chess and it's a deal

if I do RP it will indeed be as a part of the Amazing Technicolour Dream Ajah

quick, someone help me name my character

I recommend Cor Técnica. 

[xxGaea They/Them, Fae/Faer]

1 hour ago, DrakeMarshall said:

you generalized that "elims tend to overcamp" and at this point I assume that the elims kinda want to be seen not overcamping, they might want to do something to be on the Correct side of the line you just drew

maybe it's just coincidence about Gaea posting right after that and making more of an effort to see both sides of the question, maybe it's a bit uncharitable to call that evil indicative, but yeah that was my thought

27 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

...Fair. It's definitely possible it's a quick correction, but really my experience with that kind of reaction fishing is that it's more rare for Elims to take what they think is intuitively an anti-Village view - they're more inclined to be safe, and I think that both the set-up from everyone plus the way it was being framed incentivises (if reacting, I'm sure some could just as easily ignore it) going to the safety / don't claim side.

In my defense, I had already started typing up my thoughts, but got sidetracked researching lore about the various Ajahs to try and rp in character Even without that, I tend to take awhile to actually formulate and write my responses and thoughts since I get easily stressed out and second guess myself, lol

But also, I have this thread and my Ajah doc pinned and always open on my computer and will regularly check in to see if anything has happened, since there isn't much for me to do between terms

[OoklaApologist She/her]

1 hour ago, Kasimir said:

Are we actually literally allowed to make a public Google doc here for lulz?

Still thinking about this as a game idea. Maybe a secret society-flavored items game with spanreeds that open a google doc instead of a PM, and roles with a steal action can “take” pages of content?

[|TJ| he/him]

1 hour ago, KelsierApologist said:

TJ, he’s calling you a baby

Smh no, he's calling y'all babies. 

24 hours remaining in the cycle!

[Through the Living Hopper He/Him]

Alkarii Tay'TerTüne slipped into yet another alcove, his treasonous heart pounding. The man he had been following had already been followed! Alkarii hadn't even seen the person the wolf-man had just pressed against the wall, and he was one of the best at sneaking around.

Whatever was happening, it was much bigger that Alkarii had thought. The Black Ajah...

...was everywhere.

***

For the record, these conversation are definitely scaring me.

[Terrisman]

Thinking about this game a little more, we need to look out for someone who is totally laying low. From what I can tell, if someone avoids attention and doesn’t fraternice at all with any Black ajah members or other suspicious players he could slip under the radar and maybe get voted in as Amyrlin. You don’t need to eliminate anyone just avoid suspicion 

[Jo and the Bush all/any]

8 hours ago, xxGaea said:

After he stepped back, she carefully smoothed out her monochromatic dress with one hand as she listened to his explanation. "I suppose that makes sense, though it is illogical to make baseless accusations nonetheless. If everyone is making claims, I imagine that only makes it easier for this supposed Black Ajah to eliminate Aes Sedai that they believe pose a threat to them, does it not?"

She still had a few books nestled in the crook of her free arm, and she gestured towards them in response to his inquiry. "I am looking into similar cases to the present to see if there are any patterns. It may be beneficial to providing a first course of action, so I was returning to my quarters for silence."

She glanced around them, her head tilting slightly to the side. "If you are concerned for your Aes Sedai's safety, why are you not with her?"

Emmett grinned wide, an expression he had been told resembled that of a snarling wolf many times. When out if tho Tower, it was an expression that could scare anyone.  When inside the Tower, well, he had seen many times that the Aes Sedai and his fellow Warders were made of much sterner stuff. "The best defense is a fast offense. She and the others of her Ajah are together, discussing and keeping watch, safety in numbers. Those of us who are more, replaceable, are out on the hunt. Our Ajah is not compromised. Is your own so clean?" He had no idea if there were members of the Black Ajah among Zeroell's Sisters, but she had told him to leave that investigation to her.

46 minutes ago, ThatOneWorldhopper said:

Alkarii Tay'TerTüne slipped into yet another alcove, his treasonous heart pounding. The man he had been following had already been followed! Alkarii hadn't even seen the person the wolf-man had just pressed against the wall, and he was one of the best at sneaking around.

Whatever was happening, it was much bigger that Alkarii had thought. The Black Ajah...

...was everywhere.

That sense of being watched was still on him though. But if it hadn't been this person, who else was here? "Did you come alone?" She raised one eyebrow, but nodded.

He turned back the way she had come, and prowled down the corridor. "Who else is here? There's going to be trouble if you don't show yourself?" His eyes flicked back and forth. Lots of hallways, lots of alcoves. Where were they hiding?

**

I haven't seen anything in the thread that stands out to me yet. There's plenty of people I'd like to hear from, but I figure they'll get around to speaking once votes start flying. For now, I will make an announcement, because I'm curious about how people will react. I have been fighting for the nomination in my Ajah. I'm pretty certain I've convinced both of my doc mates to allow me to be our Sitter, rather than letting it be randomly generated. I don't think I have a chance at reaching the Amrylin Seat, nor am I convinced I'm the best person for the job in our Ajah, but I know I'm village aligned, and I think it would be fun to try, so I'm fighting for the position. Not like, tooth and nail fighting, because I do admit that others who are more didicated to the win would be better, and I'm mostly doing it so that I'm guaranteed to not be Executed on D1 like I was last game.

I also pasted the script of the Bee Movie/A Bug's Life into our Doc, and for TJ's sake, I recommend you all do too.

[The Wandering Wizard he/him]

15 minutes ago, A Jo in the Bush said:

I also pasted the script of the Bee Movie/A Bug's Life into our Doc, and for TJ's sake, I recommend you all do too.

Spoiler

 

[Through the Living Hopper He/Him]

Alkarii felt like his heart was going to burst. As the wolf-man prowled ever-closer, so felt Alkarii closer to death. He pressed himself further into the alcove, scrambling for anything. His cloak, a darker version than one that those of his Ajah normally wore, might have been enough, but "might have" got people killed in this Tower. 

Even in his frenzied state, he thought back to what the strange wolf-man had said. The only way someone would know if their Ajah was clean was if they were Black Ajah. But then it wouldn't be clean... Either way, he was lying, and lying prevented people from seeking knowledge. Alkarii did not like that, but though, he hungered to know what dying felt like, he was rather fond of being alive. As the wolf-man neared his alcove, Alkarii jumped up, grabbing onto the low and decorated ceiling and hanging there, covering as much of him as possible with the cloak while still being able to see. 

At least I'll have the high ground if I die. 

There, he sat and prayed to whatever god was out there, for the seconds that felt like eternity.

***

Sorry if I'm just adding details in to help me. I've never played this game before, so if I need to change what I'm doing, just let me know. 

Also, either way Emmet is lying, or at least he can't truthfully and knowledgeably say that.

[Jo and the Bush all/any]

4 minutes ago, ThatOneWorldhopper said:

Alkarii felt like his heart was going to burst. As the wolf-man prowled ever-closer, so felt Alkarii closer to death. He pressed himself further into the alcove, scrambling for anything. His cloak, a darker version than one that those of his Ajah normally wore, might have been enough, but "might have" got people killed in this Tower. 

Even in his frenzied state, he thought back to what the strange wolf-man had said. The only way someone would know if their Ajah was clean was if they were Black Ajah. But then it wouldn't be clean... Either way, he was lying, and lying prevented people from seeking knowledge. Alkarii did not like that, but though, he hungered to know what dying felt like, he was rather fond of being alive. As the wolf-man neared his alcove, Alkarii jumped up, grabbing onto the low and decorated ceiling and hanging there, covering as much of him as possible with the cloak while still being able to see. 

At least I'll have the high ground if I die. 

There, he sat and prayed to whatever god was out there, for the seconds that felt like eternity.

He passed by the first alcove, eyes and ears alert for the tiniest noise. He passed by the second, scanning over ever detail. He passed by the third, and it was empty. The fourth, and many more past that held only decorations and paintings. The sense of being watched hadn't diminished, but maybe he was mistaking it for something else? He folded his arms and looked back down the empty hall.

What was happening in this tower? Was he alone? Was some magic at work? "You're good, whoever you are." Was he just talking to the thin air? "I'm impressed." He walked back to where he had started, much quicker this time, glancing into every hallway and alcove one last time. "I don't know if you're friend or foe, and I suppose you can't know the same about me. So I'll leave it at this for now. Keep watching if you want, eventually you'll see me slay one of the Black Ajah, and we'll learn eachother's loyalties. If you're friend to our enemies, I'm sure you'll come out to help them, and if not, I hope you'll reveal yourself to thank me. Then, we can talk."

He waited to see if anyone came out of whatever concealment hid them. If they didn't soon, he'd just walk away.

**

14 minutes ago, ThatOneWorldhopper said:

Sorry if I'm just adding details in to help me. I've never played this game before, so if I need to change what I'm doing, just let me know. 

Also, either way Emmet is lying, or at least he can't truthfully and knowledgeably say that.

You're doing great so far! I'm certainly enjoying it. Do you want to talk to Emmett, or just keep following him? Or something else, I'm fine with whatever.

As for whether or not Emmett is lying, well, he's not concerned about that. Zeroell wants him to put up a strong front for her Ajah, so he shall.

[OoklaApologist She/her]

1 hour ago, A Jo in the Bush said:

also pasted the script of the Bee Movie/A Bug's Life into our Doc, and for TJ's sake, I recommend you all do too

Both? Those are two separate movies. I know because I’ve seen one

[Jo and the Bush all/any]

4 minutes ago, KelsierApologist said:

Both? Those are two separate movies. I know because I’ve seen one

Like the QF74 Dead Doc, it is a movie script labeled "The Bee's Movie", but if you read it, it quickly gets replaced with A Bug's Life instead.

Edited March 21, 2025 by A Jo in the Bush

[OoklaApologist She/her]

1 hour ago, A Jo in the Bush said:

haven't seen anything in the thread that stands out to me yet. There's plenty of people I'd like to hear from, but I figure they'll get around to speaking once votes start flying. For now, I will make an announcement, because I'm curious about how people will react. I have been fighting for the nomination in my Ajah. I'm pretty certain I've convinced both of my doc mates to allow me to be our Sitter, rather than letting it be randomly generated. I don't think I have a chance at reaching the Amrylin Seat, nor am I convinced I'm the best person for the job in our Ajah, but I know I'm village aligned, and I think it would be fun to try, so I'm fighting for the position. Not like, tooth and nail fighting, because I do admit that others who are more didicated to the win would be better, and I'm mostly doing it so that I'm guaranteed to not be Executed on D1 like I was last game.

On the contrary, in my doc, I’m not fighting for it. I know I’m the only one I can truly v clear, but I also know that I’m, in many ways, not the right person for the job. I wouldn’t make it through the game, or even the first few nights, without being stilled, and getting a seat is more important than being the nomination. I trust my candidate to act with prudence, and, as their doc mate, I can observe and read them in a way others cannot. Finally, if I do suspect they are elims, I will call for them to be stilled, and I will repeat that call, because I feel it is important to do so. I think we should choose the best candidate, and I am not that.

7 minutes ago, A Jo in the Bush said:

Like the QF74 Dead Doc, it is a movie script labeled "The Bee's Movie", but if you read it, it quickly gets replaced with A Bug's Life instead.

wait wut

you got me jo

Edited March 21, 2025 by KelsierApologist
spag

[Ashbringer he/him]

Okay. Underestimated how busy end of quarter would be, whoops.

On 3/19/2025 at 6:09 PM, TwinStorm said:

bloody, blood and bloody ashes, burn us, Light burn us, etc.

... that's where I got "burn me" from. I've started just saying that nowadays, it's a good one.

22 hours ago, Kasimir said:

That's actually a significant tempo issue, because we can't even directly control it: we have to engineer the votes to make sure that majority is not reached and that Black Ajah suspect has the least votes to get them Stilled and therefore exposed to the exe the next Day. That's a free kill at Night for the Black Ajah and is equivalent to dealing with a Thug, just more annoying than usual.

I do wonder if this will be more or less difficult if vote counts continue how the QF's vote counts were - namely, a lot of 1 votes.

21 hours ago, Kasimir said:

I've been told by numerous people that my mere existence as a Villager tends to do that to the Elims anyway ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Elim!me fears no Kas

Elim!me fears Meerkas 

21 hours ago, Kasimir said:

Can't say which is more likely off the top of my head - depends on reads - but in a game with multiple group docs, where the kills happen is really important and as long as he's alive, I'm gonna need y'all to make sure @Ashbringer actually shows up with NKA and that his NKA makes sense.

... okay on one hand, ow. On the other hand, yes that would be helpful to be reminded to do when it comes.

And it may be better than an Araris-detector this game! Depends how much we do learn.

 

There is maybe an in-between for claiming: after all the Sitters are nominated, the remaining pairs in each Ajah can claim their partner. That keeps mostly the separation from who's in what Ajah a secret, especially if there are two untainted Ajah orders.

Unfortunately, not a lot of time for something else, but I'm around.

[Terrisman]

2 minutes ago, Ashbringer said:

Okay. Underestimated how busy end of quarter would be, whoops.

... that's where I got "burn me" from. I've started just saying that nowadays, it's a good one.

I do wonder if this will be more or less difficult if vote counts continue how the QF's vote counts were - namely, a lot of 1 votes.

Elim!me fears no Kas

Elim!me fears Meerkas 

... okay on one hand, ow. On the other hand, yes that would be helpful to be reminded to do when it comes.

And it may be better than an Araris-detector this game! Depends how much we do learn.

 

There is maybe an in-between for claiming: after all the Sitters are nominated, the remaining pairs in each Ajah can claim their partner. That keeps mostly the separation from who's in what Ajah a secret, especially if there are two untainted Ajah orders.

Unfortunately, not a lot of time for something else, but I'm around.

Nobody has yet given me a good explanation why claiming would be beneficial . Do you have reason why you think we should do this?

@|TJ| was the distribution of Black Ajah random? 

[Ashbringer he/him]

41 minutes ago, Terrisman said:

Nobody has yet given me a good explanation why claiming would be beneficial . Do you have reason why you think we should do this?

The main reason that I can see, is it lets us see if the Elims are trying to take control of an Ajah. I.e if one-two players are killed during the night, and then the most trusted Sitter is randomly Stilled, that means the Black Ajah probably used their kills to gain control of the Green Ajah, and it would be really nice to know who that last Green Ajah member is/are.

There's also some advantages that can be gained by certain other Ajah interactions becoming public (ie someone not agreeing to use a power in a seemingly village way) but some that are beneficial to become private (White Ajah, or the fact that sometimes Villagers will just disagree)

Of course, there's the question of how realistic that scenario is. I haven't really run the numbers on whether it's advantageous to the Village to be claiming or not, and realistically it's an intra-Ajah discussion (with the caveat of if enough Ajah claim, the Elims probably can figure out the others, so the more groups that claim the more relevant it is for the others to). My idea was more avoiding claiming partners to become claiming Ajah groupings.

 

Edit: Also, the Black Ajah / Elims are random ish. Generally GMs make ~5 randomized distributions and pick one, but also GMs won’t usually make an Elim team of all new players or all experienced players, or in a game like this make them be all in one Ajah. (Sometimes they will, because that can be sneaky, but generally balance supercedes randomness.)

Edited March 21, 2025 by Ashbringer

[Steeldancer he/him]

3 hours ago, Ashbringer said:

The main reason that I can see, is it lets us see if the Elims are trying to take control of an Ajah. I.e if one-two players are killed during the night, and then the most trusted Sitter is randomly Stilled, that means the Black Ajah probably used their kills to gain control of the Green Ajah, and it would be really nice to know who that last Green Ajah member is/are.

There's also some advantages that can be gained by certain other Ajah interactions becoming public (ie someone not agreeing to use a power in a seemingly village way) but some that are beneficial to become private (White Ajah, or the fact that sometimes Villagers will just disagree)

Of course, there's the question of how realistic that scenario is. I haven't really run the numbers on whether it's advantageous to the Village to be claiming or not, and realistically it's an intra-Ajah discussion (with the caveat of if enough Ajah claim, the Elims probably can figure out the others, so the more groups that claim the more relevant it is for the others to). My idea was more avoiding claiming partners to become claiming Ajah groupings.

 

Edit: Also, the Black Ajah / Elims are random ish. Generally GMs make ~5 randomized distributions and pick one, but also GMs won’t usually make an Elim team of all new players or all experienced players, or in a game like this make them be all in one Ajah. (Sometimes they will, because that can be sneaky, but generally balance supercedes randomness.)

wait generally gms do what? Lmao usually I just throw RNG at it and tweak it a bit if necessary 

[DrakeMarshall he/him]

9 hours ago, Kasimir said:

I mean, let's be realistic, given the fact the NK finds me intensely attractive, I'm pretty sure we'll find out pretty soon one way or another. Though, you of all people I expect should be able to read me faster than the others.

...Or, I guess we could go another episode where you doubt my god-tier bro reads, that's fine with me too

Kas told u the truth and u stabbed him for it  no lies

(Not really bothered about it, but I have to keep ribbing Drake for the time he stabbed me because he thought I was too fast to V read him. Turns out I'm just that good when it comes to my bros  /lh /j)

get your bins away from me or I will smack you >>

honestly the Kas chill mode jokes are a little too on-point to look hard at evil Kas worlds right now 

...anyways, I only stabbed you a little!

10 hours ago, Kasimir said:

I vote u for Sitter of the Amazing Technicolour Dream Ajah unless more people join us

But I thought we were electing TJ while also voting to execute him

9 hours ago, The Unknown Flame said:

I recommend Cor Técnica. 

An interesting name, it has been duly noted.

Maybe I should somehow fuse all of the suggestions I get into a singular name.

[Ashbringer he/him]

20 minutes ago, Steeldancer said:

wait generally gms do what? Lmao usually I just throw RNG at it and tweak it a bit if necessary

… well, “tweak it a bit” is generally what I mean by it losing randomness 

But yeah, different GMs will have different styles. Some GMs have picked out specific Elims/player-roles before as well, you just can’t really count on it.

[DrakeMarshall he/him]

9 hours ago, xxGaea said:

In my defense, I had already started typing up my thoughts, but got sidetracked researching lore about the various Ajahs to try and rp in character Even without that, I tend to take awhile to actually formulate and write my responses and thoughts since I get easily stressed out and second guess myself, lol

But also, I have this thread and my Ajah doc pinned and always open on my computer and will regularly check in to see if anything has happened, since there isn't much for me to do between terms

...to clarify, do you recall if you saw the Kas comment while you were working on yours, or are you saying you'd already written that stuff?

Not tryna doubt one way or the other, I'm inclined to take it at face value. Just want to understand a little better.

8 hours ago, ThatOneWorldhopper said:

For the record, these conversation are definitely scaring me.

Yeah, that's fair. A lot of us are kinda crazy

Not me though, no siree, I'm super duper sane

[DrakeMarshall he/him]

8 hours ago, Terrisman said:

Thinking about this game a little more, we need to look out for someone who is totally laying low. From what I can tell, if someone avoids attention and doesn’t fraternice at all with any Black ajah members or other suspicious players he could slip under the radar and maybe get voted in as Amyrlin. You don’t need to eliminate anyone just avoid suspicion 

Yeah, I'd say this is good thinking.

Not everyone who lays low is doing it on purpose, so ideally I'd be hesitant to Still someone without additional reasons of some kind (...maybe just "I trust everybody else more" but that's still additional reasons). But it's not a bad thought to be a lil careful about letting inconspicuous Amyrlin candidates coast until they're the only options left.

[Kasimir he/him]

9 hours ago, Terrisman said:

Thinking about this game a little more, we need to look out for someone who is totally laying low. From what I can tell, if someone avoids attention and doesn’t fraternice at all with any Black ajah members or other suspicious players he could slip under the radar and maybe get voted in as Amyrlin. You don’t need to eliminate anyone just avoid suspicion 

If you're a non-entity, why would people remotely agree to vote for you as Amrylin or to keep you there? If you're so quiet I can't develop a read on you, this shouldn't be Amrylin territory - the Amrylin needs to be the player we have the strongest Village read on among the Sitters.

Null reads should be just as exeable or Stillable as sus reads.

34 minutes ago, DrakeMarshall said:

Yeah, I'd say this is good thinking.

Not everyone who lays low is doing it on purpose, so ideally I'd be hesitant to Still someone without additional reasons of some kind (...maybe just "I trust everybody else more" but that's still additional reasons). But it's not a bad thought to be a lil careful about letting inconspicuous Amyrlin candidates coast until they're the only options left.

Lmao we had diametrically opposite reactions. But also, Stilling doesn't exe them, it just removes their protection, and IMO you should be eminently Stillable if you're a null read - why should I let you stay protected from exe pressure if you aren't showing up and readable? The Black Ajah will never kill you so leaving you there isn't productive for the Village.

5 hours ago, Terrisman said:

Nobody has yet given me a good explanation why claiming would be beneficial . Do you have reason why you think we should do this?

@|TJ| was the distribution of Black Ajah random? 

Honestly considering an E!Terris world here, because this just fails to interact with Drake, and the emphasis on good explanation makes me think of new Elim evidential bar shifting. More throwing the read out here - I do not recommend D1ing Terris on his first game.

1 hour ago, DrakeMarshall said:

get your bins away from me or I will smack you >>

Get back in there!

Spoiler

 

1 hour ago, DrakeMarshall said:

But I thought we were electing TJ while also voting to execute him

Point, suggestion retracted.

9 hours ago, A Jo in the Bush said:

and I'm mostly doing it so that I'm guaranteed to not be Executed on D1 like I was last game.

Uh...Jo, you would never be in danger of being exed D1 as a returning player. Why are you worried about the exe specifically as compared to the Elim kill?

5 hours ago, Ashbringer said:

The main reason that I can see, is it lets us see if the Elims are trying to take control of an Ajah. I.e if one-two players are killed during the night, and then the most trusted Sitter is randomly Stilled, that means the Black Ajah probably used their kills to gain control of the Green Ajah, and it would be really nice to know who that last Green Ajah member is/are.

There's also some advantages that can be gained by certain other Ajah interactions becoming public (ie someone not agreeing to use a power in a seemingly village way) but some that are beneficial to become private (White Ajah, or the fact that sometimes Villagers will just disagree)

This, but also, just reads of behaviour based on information from within the Ajah doc. Again, I point out that powers don't matter if not used in a pro-Village way. Information and reads are usually much more important. A lot of players simply won't fire off their One Power in a constructive way and that's just a sad reality to do with the limited information we're working on when making our decision.

Sure, power roles have made gamechanging decisions before, e.g. good saves, or Ash smiting TUN, but there have been just as many that've fizzled. Making sense of kill decisions based on Ajah-mate info (rather than Ajah colour) is really helpful at trying to sensemake where the Black Ajah are on NKA. I've noticed in almost all doc games of this sort I've played so far, the Elims generally refused to kill in docs where they were, preferring to try to pocket their docmates instead. This was true of LG84, LG7 (my doc remained untouched for quite a while because we were infiltrated), and true of the LG84 rerun I ran in December, where the Elims kept killing in the clean teams, which the Village really should've taken as a sign.

Now that I've said it, of course they can choose to swerve or throw a curveball, but that's the nature of NKA for you. Some of it has to be combined with reads and tactical assessment.

And yeah sorry Ash, but I know you do tend to slip under the radar at times. I trust V!you on NKA, and I think getting you to NKA means we can work out if it's V!you or E!you.

I will RP after this I swear.

P.S. Anyone interested in an impromptu game to pass the Night?  

[Terrisman]

What does NKA mean

[Kasimir he/him]

2 hours ago, Terrisman said:

What does NKA mean

Night kill analysis. Ash is particularly good at it. It means looking at who the Black Ajah kill to make inferences about who the Black Ajah are.

On looking at my post again, I think there's an interesting situation/possibility where the Black Ajah could just fullsend: one member hell buses your team, secures the nomination for Amrylin, and then survives the deposition and wins on the basis of the hell bus. I think this should theoretically still be detectable and should be somewhat incompatible with them going all-in on the standard wincon this game but think it's worth keeping in mind that the subwoofer payoffs this game can actually be pretty good.

I will however caution that the Village needs to not paranoia-despose. Probably won't be around for this to be my problem by then though   

Edited March 21, 2025 by Kasimir
justification

[STINK he/him]

Rasmuht awoke again (?), wait, when did they go to sleep? They have an alarm? 

What's going on?