Interludes 1 / 2

[Isilel]

On 9/20/2024 at 1:29 PM, king of nowhere said:

how did we miss spotting felt as a ghostblood spy, anyway?

 

Oh, there absolutely were theories that he might be a Ghostblood. I mean, he conveniently had been a scout while Ghostbloods were looking for Urithiru and trying to prevent anyone else from finding it, then he was suddenly part of the expedition to Shadesmar? And we knew that he had first appeared in MB1?

I myself have written at some point that if there wasn't a Ghostblood standing ready for a hand-over once Shallan trapped Kelek, or to take over if she failed, then this whole operation had been unbelievably incompetently planned. And I named Felt as one of the possibilities, IIRC.

But as has already been pointed out, there was this WoB that seemed to preclude it. However bizarre the idea of an over 3 centuries old worldhopper deciding to live as a soldier on Roshar without some ulterior motive seemed. 

No, what all of us have truly missed was the notion that a Seon might be deceptive.

I thought that Shallan and Co. leaving Ala behind "because return to PR wouldn't be good for it" was rather contrived, but I now assume that Ala itself convinced them of this. But leaving the dagger behind as well still makes no sense to me... Wouldn't they have wanted to show it to Navani? Unless Felt was just given a second one? 

[+Oltux72 he/him]

4 hours ago, Wyndle88 said:

We also see not everyone can pick up on the change in Vessel of Odium instinctively even if they are highly Invested like Hoid. 

1. Adonalsium himself created primordial Sprens on Roshar along with Dawnsingers.

2. These spren include spren of Wind and Storms. This storm Spren did not have sentience and did not have Stormlight giving ability.

That is basically impossible. Too many life forms of Roshar need Stormlight. They have evolved gem hearts to store it. And they are old. They show signs of evolution. Shallan deduces the relationships among greatshells in that manner. They have left fossile evidence. The big gem stones found in mining operations come from greatshells.

The high storms distributing stormlight must be a phenomenon millions of years old.

[alder24]

23 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

That is basically impossible. Too many life forms of Roshar need Stormlight. They have evolved gem hearts to store it. And they are old. They show signs of evolution. Shallan deduces the relationships among greatshells in that manner. They have left fossile evidence. The big gem stones found in mining operations come from greatshells.

The high storms distributing stormlight must be a phenomenon millions of years old.

You're right, Highstorms predate the Shattering (so light distribution most likely too), but Roshar is just around 12,000 years old, not millions of years old. There are no fossils on Roshar (Vasher said this), there are naturally existing gemstones deep in the stone, but also those buried by crem over years. 

Spoiler

coltonx9

Do the singers predate the highstorms?

Brandon Sanderson

The singers and the highstorms are-- The highstorms-- Let's say no. Trying to decide which one came first. They were created, right? But the highstorms were created as part of Roshar, as well. The highstorms predate humans arriving. Highstorms predate the Shattering of Adonalsium.

Idaho Falls signing (Dec. 29, 2018)

 

Spoiler

Questioner

What's the source of rubber on Roshar?

Brandon Sanderson

It's not very exciting, it is a tree. It's not an actual rubber tree, it is a Rosharan version of the tree. I actually had to think about this, cause silk doesn't come from the same place that silk comes from. And then, I'm just going too far. Silk I can at least talk about and I can name it seasilk, but for rubber I'm just like, it's a rubber tree. We'll just make it rubber. It's not petroleum based. That's gonna be a hangup on Roshar, that they don't have petroleum reserves in the same way. They are a planet that has only been around for 12,000, 13,000 years. And beyond that, there's the whole crem thing. They do have some sources of petroleum that are biological, or I guess it's all biological, but it's not, yeah. That's gonna be a problem for them, let's just say. Access to large petroleum reserves is not a thing you will find there.

JordanCon 2021 (July 16, 2021)

 

Spoiler

[...]

Neuxue

Are the diamonds naturally occurring?  

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, but most are going to be-- They aren't-- all gemstones are naturally occurring, but most of, many or most of, the gems they are getting they are getting from creatures that grow them, not from the rock. Though there are mines on Roshar, you just have to-- most of them are on the leeward side of mountains, where the crem isn't being deposited.

Neuxue

So, diamond mines are about tectonics--

Brandon Sanderson

It was a created planet, keep that in mind.

Shadows of Self London UK signing (Oct. 19, 2015)

 

Spoiler

Questioner

In this world, assuming that [Roshar] is as old as it appears to be, wouldn't it be that the creatures that have gemhearts in them, as they die their body would rot away but leaving the gemstone? So wouldn't fossil beds exist with layers of gemstones in them from the passing of the ages?

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah, that's why-- yes.

Questioner

That's how they mine them?

Brandon Sanderson

They do mine them. What you've got to remember is, in my opinion these things are going to collect in certain ways in certain places.

Questioner

Densities and stuff.

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah. But yeah. Because there's no tectonic activity on Roshar, so.

Questioner

Just the buildup of crem over time slowly covers things.

Brandon Sanderson

Mmhmm.

Oathbringer Chicago signing (Nov. 21, 2017)

 

 

5 hours ago, Wyndle88 said:

4. At a later time Odium arrives in the Rosharan system probably chasing Wit who was known by the Heralds ( original occupants of Ashyn) by a different name.

Odium came to Roshar specifically to Splinter Honor and Cultivation, just like he Splinter 3 different Shards before - he isn't hunting Hoid. Fused also know Hoid. 

5 hours ago, Wyndle88 said:

6. Humans has a population boom and starts taking more land. With more souls praying to them as Gods, Honor and Cultivation becomes the 'Gods' of humans. 

7. Thus a God who reached later in Roshar became the God of the original population of Dawnsingers manipulating the passion of betrayal from Honor and Cultivation who was more benevolent to humans like they themselves align more with.

We don't know a lot about this, so it's hard to say anything for certain, but Leshwi words strongly suggest that it was Dawnsingers who first offended or betrayed spren, forcing spren away from them and towards humans. This most likely contributed heavily to the switch of gods. RoW ch 109:

Quote

“Sorry…” Leshwi said. A joyspren burst around her, beautiful, like a blue storm. “Sorry? Venli, they’ve come back to us! They’ve forgiven us.”

 

5 hours ago, Wyndle88 said:

9. When multiple POV characters get caught in the highstorm, they see a Face who is the Stormfather and another being of massive proportion walking inside the storm

Those beings (several of them, not one) are just spren.

Spoiler

GreenRover

During the storm that Kaladin was in with Shallan in book 2; those two massive walkers we saw--are those Parshendi, Unmade, or spren?

Brandon Sanderson

Spren, with the caveat that might not mean they aren't Unmade, because that's not an either-or.

Legion Release Party (Sept. 19, 2018)

 

5 hours ago, Wyndle88 said:

10. Odium would certainly win the Contest of Champions. Dalinar would get hold of all the Honorblades, manifest Tanavast as a Blade and Unite it with all Honorblades. 

Tanavast is dead, the Stormfather is his/Honor's Cognitive Shadow, Honorblade are just a drop in the ocean of power which is the Shard of Honor. Manifesting the Stormfather as a Shardblade might kill him (Dalinar hurt him a lot when trying to do that in OB), and it would be almost impossible to just merge him with other blades (Honorblades are still self-aware) - and that would achieve nothing anyway. 

Spoiler

[...]

Hoser

Did Tanavast survive Honor's splintering?

Brandon Sanderson

Tanavast is dead. Good question. However, that is as of the start of The Way of Kings.

[...]

Steelheart Seattle signing (Oct. 14, 2013)

 

[king of nowhere]

19 hours ago, Isilel said:

 leaving the dagger behind as well still makes no sense to me... Wouldn't they have wanted to show it to Navani? Unless Felt was just given a second one? 

Most likely felt was given a second one. The ghostbloods have those kind of resources.

[Michael Portz he/him]

Ooohh...totally forgot about the assumption of me from after reading Lost Metal ... context was a discussion around her brother Dlatil and her and something about Iyatil "running amok":

Quote

Dlavil held his tongue, his eyes inscrutable behind that cursed mask. TwinSoul hated being unable to get a full read on the man’s expressions, but Dlavil—like his sister who ran amok on Roshar—wore a mask that he never removed; it was grown in to the point that it was practically part of his skin."

 – The Lost Metal: A Mistborn Novel (The Mistborn Saga Book 7) von Brandon Sanderson
https://lesen.amazon.de/kp/kshare?asin=B09MBS37W9&id=6krym7lkgjgp7dj4nyxlvnrkcm

My assumption was:

Quote

I took it for granted, that this sister must be the masked Ghostblood from SLA. So far she did nothing which aligns with my understanding of “running amok”, so we can expect her to do this in SLA-5 IMHO.

Added: Iyatil it is.

This does not bode well for the Ghostbloods activity on Roshar and the realms 

Edited September 25, 2024 by Michael Portz
Giving more context

[+robardin he/him]

5 minutes ago, Michael Portz said:

Ooohh...totally forgot about this assumption of me from after reading Lost Metal ... context was a discussion around her brother Dlatil and her and Kelsier saying something about Iyatil "running amok":

This does not bode well for the Ghostbloods activity on Roshare and the realms 

Yeah, knowing that TLM comes after SA5, there are numerous hints there that something big went down and it was bad and Iyatil was perhaps near the center of it (or else has gone rogue during it, or in its wake).

What appear to be refugee Horneaters in Shadesmar; recently arrived Iriali and chouta vendors (same people?) in Bilming; Ghostblood Skybreakers in Elendel; and Roshar being a system that could possibly be included ("if you count...") in a list of "primary systems we can't visit without extreme danger", apparently linked to something about accessing the system via "perpendicularities".

[StanLemon]

Having Felt's comment cemented my thoughts that Iyatil's branch is behaving far more ruthlessly and underhanded than the rest of the Ghostbloods would approve of

[morcey2]

24 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Having Felt's comment cemented my thoughts that Iyatil's branch is behaving far more ruthlessly and underhanded than the rest of the Ghostbloods would approve of

Not a lot to add, but I'm wondering if the "Ghostbloods" Mistborn Era 3 is going to heavily involve a Ghostblood Civil war between the Scadrian and Rosharan branches of the organization.  Ever since I saw the difference between the way the two are run, I've thought that may be the case. 

[Nesh he/him]

6 hours ago, robardin said:

Skybreakers in Elendel

I think we have a WOB that they weren't Skybreakers, but I'm having trouble finding it at the moment.

[+Oltux72 he/him]

1 minute ago, Nesh said:

I think we have a WOB that they weren't Skybreakers, but I'm having trouble finding it at the moment.

We have a WoB that says that nobody but Hoid has left Roshar with an intact Nahel Bond. That says less than you think, because to have somebody with the powers of a Skybreaker, you do not need to transport a Skybreaker and his or her spren. The spren alone would do, if you form the bond at your destination.

[Nesh he/him]

1 minute ago, Oltux72 said:

We have a WoB that says that nobody but Hoid has left Roshar with an intact Nahel Bond. That says less than you think, because to have somebody with the powers of a Skybreaker, you do not need to transport a Skybreaker and his or her spren. The spren alone would do, if you form the bond at your destination.

Well, the fact that they weren't glowing also makes me doubt that they were any kind of Raidiant.

[Display-Names-Are-Stupid]

6 hours ago, robardin said:

Yeah, knowing that TLM comes after SA5, there are numerous hints there that something big went down and it was bad and Iyatil was perhaps near the center of it (or else has gone rogue during it, or in its wake).

What appear to be refugee Horneaters in Shadesmar; recently arrived Iriali and chouta vendors (same people?) in Bilming; Ghostblood Skybreakers in Elendel; and Roshar being a system that could possibly be included ("if you count...") in a list of "primary systems we can't visit without extreme danger", apparently linked to something about accessing the system via "perpendicularities".

Where was the reference to Iriali? I must have missed that! 

[Nesh he/him]

Just now, Display-Names-Are-Stupid said:

Where was the reference to Iriali? I must have missed that! 

The Newspaper Editor makes a mention of gold haired people who live in Bilming.
 

“Was it those people with the golden hair living on the east side? They’re some kind of fairy creature; I know it”

[+robardin he/him]

1 minute ago, Display-Names-Are-Stupid said:

Where was the reference to Iriali? I must have missed that! 

The editor of the Bilming tabloid newspaper, Sentinel of Truth, mentioned "those people with the golden hair living on the east side" who she suggested were "some kind of fairy creature".

This right after Wayne had entered the building with the paper's offices while eating a new street food called "chouta".

To me that meant Iriali late of Roshar had dropped in at Bilming and set up chouta stands, LOL.

As for the non-glowing Skybreakers, that was only a vague hint, but it was an "activated" group sent by Kelsier to assist Steris as "eight men and women in nondescript clothing" whose leader inquired first, "you are certain this is legal, the mass sinking of private ships?" and only agreed to help do so after the governor stated it was by his authority to act in the city's best interests, and to pay for losses incurred to the owners... Who then launched into the air. And whose leader had the Ghostblood tattoo.

Steris assumed they were Coinshots, and maybe they were, but not "official" ones who were already accounted for. Hmm.

The question about legality seemed Skybreaker-ish, that's all I had to go on. Why don't they visibly glow? Well, who said they're still powered by Stormlight? If they are flying based on having had some of that Dor-in-a-Jar stuff, maybe that doesn't leak out as quickly?

18 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

We have a WoB that says that nobody but Hoid has left Roshar with an intact Nahel Bond. That says less than you think, because to have somebody with the powers of a Skybreaker, you do not need to transport a Skybreaker and his or her spren. The spren alone would do, if you form the bond at your destination.

Really? I'd like to see that one!

[alder24]

27 minutes ago, Nesh said:

I think we have a WOB that they weren't Skybreakers, but I'm having trouble finding it at the moment.

The WoB:

Spoiler

Matias_Leibo

Are the Coinshots that helped Steris with getting people out of the flood zone, and who seemed rather concerned with whether she was following the law, actually Skybreakers?

Brandon Sanderson

Ah, hehehehehe. So, we'll just leave that one. So, how about this. At this point in continuity, a Skybreaker could not easily get off of Roshar. In fact, by this point in continuity, I believe (you can't hold me to this one too much) the only Radiant who's managed to get off of Roshar and maintain powers is Hoid. I believe that's the case. Hoid is weird. He also has lots of knowledge. He used a specific method to get... yeah, anyway.

Don't hold me to that, but I think by this point he is the first to get out of system. Off-world doesn't really count because you can go to Braize or Ashyn. 

YouTube Spoiler Stream 5 (Dec. 2, 2022)

 

17 minutes ago, Nesh said:

Well, the fact that they weren't glowing also makes me doubt that they were any kind of Raidiant.

5 minutes ago, robardin said:

Why don't they visibly glow? Well, who said they're still powered by Stormlight? If they are flying based on having had some of that Dor-in-a-Jar stuff, maybe that doesn't leak out as quickly?

They can't take Stormlight off-world for all we know. And the Dor indeed doesn't make people glow - Armal and other Metalborn in the Set's village drank the entire jar of Dor and none of them were said to be glowing. 

Even if they somehow had Stormlight, they can hold so little of it in their bodies that they wouldn't be visibly glowing - Kaladin did this all the time during WoR to hide his abilities. 

[+robardin he/him]

Do we really need to spoiler WoBs ... in an all-Cosmere spoiler forum? LOL

So, Brandon apparently nixed those guys as being Skybreakers, while also being delighted by the suggestion (as by someone picking up on the cue), by stating that "at this point of continuity [presumably meaning TLM, which is after SA5], the only Radiant who's managed to get off of Roshar and maintain powers is Hoid". (Also caveating repeatedly that "you can't hold me to this too much.")

But that's pretty specific wording. The only Radiant. Because it's difficult to escape the Rosharan system with a Nahel bond to a spren that is deeply Cognitively tied to that system.

Well, what if these were not Skybreaker Radiants, with Nahel bonds?

What if they were Skybreaker squires, and somehow that squiring doesn't require as much physical proximity as we've seen the Windrunner squires requiring?

Like, what if a Skybreaker Master could "formally transfer" his squires to a designated proxy Master, like Kelsier or another Ghostblood, with the Spiritual Connection nature of Skybreaker squiring continuing to grant the Surge of Gravitation (it seems only full Skybreakers of the Third Ideal can use Division, based on what Nalan says to Szeth), something that can operate at any distance in the Cosmere, if the squire can obtain the Investiture?

(Note also that Szeth is working on becoming a Fourth Ideal "Master" in WaT... Just sayin'.)

[Qviqve]

In my head they were (are) Skybreakers. That hint for an authority to confirm that what they are going to make is legal got my attention. 

When I read the WOB, kinda felt disappointed however... could be there another explanation?? 

The wording is tricky so maybe there is room for theorizing 

• "a Skybreaker could not easily get off of Roshar". To me this means that it could be possible, but difficult, and we know that the GB tend to achieve the difficult part of the things (such as take and refine Dor from the CR in Sel). 
• "I believe (you can't hold me to this one too much) the only Radiant who's managed to get off of Roshar and maintain powers is Hoid"... but we know that by RoW the Skybreakers are aligned with Odium... does it mean that they are no longer Radiant Knight and become something else?
• Do we know if the Honorblades can get out of Roshar? Could something have happened to Nale in WaT, and his Honorblade being taken by the GB? By the epigraphs of WaT we know that the Wind and Heralds have vanished, so this could be a possibility

Quote

Regardless, the events surrounding the cleansing of Shinovar are of specific relevance, and I am doing my best to record what I can discover of the Wind’s own words regarding them. Though, now that the Wind and Heralds have vanished, I have only two sources who can speak of these events.

They are my witnesses.

—From Knights of Wind and Truth, page 5

The Iriali are travelling around the Cosmere and we have seen them have some kind of knowledge about Connection-ish trickery (Preservation Orb, Dor pipelines, etc...). They may have found the way to maintain their Connection with the spren.

Dyel interlude lecture Spoiler:

Spoiler

In the Dyel interlude, his mother is a Radiant and is trying to get out of the planet with her spren.

 

[+Oltux72 he/him]

3 hours ago, Qviqve said:

• "I believe (you can't hold me to this one too much) the only Radiant who's managed to get off of Roshar and maintain powers is Hoid"... but we know that by RoW the Skybreakers are aligned with Odium... does it mean that they are no longer Radiant Knight and become something else?
• Do we know if the Honorblades can get out of Roshar? Could something have happened to Nale in WaT, and his Honorblade being taken by the GB? By the epigraphs of WaT we know that the Wind and Heralds have vanished, so this could be a possibility

That won't do. Wielding the Honorblade (we would have to assume that you can get squires) does not require oaths. Nor can they be Heavenly Ones in human bodies for the same reason. Nor can you explain this by somebody performing hemalurgy on a Heavenly One.

They are showing the ability and the oaths. Hence they have some other arcane ability and happen to be legalistic by coincidence, or they are bound to a Highspren and have sworn at least the second oath.

At the risk of repeating myself: The only way I can see to satisfy that condition without exporting Skybreakers is that you bond the Highspren on Scadrial by Scadrians. That, to be honest, is almost the only sane assumption anyway. One freakishly tall person (by Scadrian standards) with exotic looks is credible. But not a whole group is not.

[+robardin he/him]

1 hour ago, Oltux72 said:

That won't do. Wielding the Honorblade (we would have to assume that you can get squires) does not require oaths. Nor can they be Heavenly Ones in human bodies for the same reason. Nor can you explain this by somebody performing hemalurgy on a Heavenly One.

They are showing the ability and the oaths. Hence they have some other arcane ability and happen to be legalistic by coincidence, or they are bound to a Highspren and have sworn at least the second oath.

At the risk of repeating myself: The only way I can see to satisfy that condition without exporting Skybreakers is that you bond the Highspren on Scadrial by Scadrians. That, to be honest, is almost the only sane assumption anyway. One freakishly tall person (by Scadrian standards) with exotic looks is credible. But not a whole group is not.

No, the Honorblades did not grant "squiring".

Quote

Ray745

You have stated that each Knights Radiant Order gets their own unique ability, for lack of a better word, due to the combination of their Surges. For instance, you have stated this ability for the Windrunners is strength of squires. My question - is this due to the Nahel bond, or just inherent in the Surges combining. Would a non-Radiant get these abilities from the Honorblades, or would they be out of luck due to no Nahel bond?

Brandon Sanderson

Good question! The unique abilities have more to do with the powers interacting, same as how Twinborn will often manifest some odd side effects of the powers interacting. But there are limitations. For example, Jezrien didn't actually have any squires, as none of the Heralds did.

General Reddit 2016 (Oct. 4, 2016)

Just as well - can you imagine Vyre squiring up Regals or singers who could wield TWO surges (even more than the Heavenly Ones)?

And I did propose one possible mechanism for Skybreakers in Elendel in TLM: that they had no spren bonds but were "long distance squires". We have seen that Windrunner squires require being close to "their Windrunner" to gain Surges, but we don't know that that's also true, or as true, for Skybreakers.

As for being "freakishly tall" by Scadrian standards, that's really an Alethi thing. They could be Skybreakers from elsewhere on Roshar. Shallan also finds them "freakishly tall" and she's from just one country over!

And "becoming a Skybreaker on Scadrial itself" is just as problematical as a Skybreaker from Roshar getting away from Roshar in the first place: it's the SPREN that is bound there, the Radiant is then tied down by having the spren JB-Welded into their soul. The spren not being able leave on its own is the big limitation.

If some kind of "perfect gem inside an aluminum box" thing is worked out between RoW and TLM that allows sentient spren to leave, then why wouldn't that also work to let their Radiant leave with them?

So I'd say that that WoB that says "as of this point in continuity" they haven't figured that out yet, would preclude bringing unbonded highspren to Scadrial.

[alder24]

16 hours ago, robardin said:

Do we really need to spoiler WoBs ... in an all-Cosmere spoiler forum? LOL

It's a spoiler for length, not for spoilers.

16 hours ago, robardin said:

Well, what if these were not Skybreaker Radiants, with Nahel bonds?

2 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

At the risk of repeating myself: The only way I can see to satisfy that condition without exporting Skybreakers is that you bond the Highspren on Scadrial by Scadrians.

Well, there is another option. Renarin is hard to define as a true modern Radiant with his bond with an Enlightened spren. He's something new, outside of the Radiant orders established by Ishar. What if those are "Skybreakers" bonded with an Enlightened Highspren? Mraize does want to cooperate with Sja-Anat and bond one of her spren, so maybe Ghostbloods eventually succeeded and Sja-Anat convinced Highspren to be Enlightened and they bonded with some of their agents?

The height can be explained by a simple perception trick combined with healing. Or they were originally from Scadrial, they bonded spren on Roshar and returned to Scadrial - we're talking about Ghostbloods members, they can be from everywhere.

RoW ch 54:

Quote

"When Glys and I bonded, we became … something new."

 

Spoiler

Questioner

So, the establishing of the Knights Radiant followed up the Surgebinders. So I had a question about Renarin - Is he closer to the modern day Radiants power-wise, or the pre-Knights Radiant Surgebinders?

Brandon Sanderson

Renarin?

Questioner

Because he's weird right?

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah, he is weird. Is he closer to pre-Knights Radiant Surgebinders or to modern Knights Radiant? I'd say closer to modern Knights Radiant, is what I would say... but it's a tough call.

Footnote: The questioner seems to be distinguishing between the formal establishment of the Knights Radiant by Ishar, and Spren-based, Honorblade-copied Surgebinding before then.
Prague Signing (Oct. 26, 2019)

 

Spoiler

Questioner

One. Can there be Nahel Bonds with more then ten types of spren because we have ten Orders.

Brandon Sanderson

Meaning, are there other possible spren that could form other Orders of Knights Radiant that are not the ten? This is theoretically possible, but that is basically what you could argue is happening to Renarin. So now if you want to say... if you want to throw out the exception of spren who were one of the ten who got changed, then this is theoretically possible but right now currently wouldn't work.

Tel Aviv Signing (Oct. 18, 2019)

 

17 hours ago, robardin said:

What if they were Skybreaker squires, and somehow that squiring doesn't require as much physical proximity as we've seen the Windrunner squires requiring?

I think it's highly unlikely for Skybreaker's squires to work differently than all other orders. Squires require proximity and why would Skybreakers be different? And such strong connections rarely span distances that large. Yumi ch 21:

Quote

"You could be from somewhere farther out, I guess, but Connection on this level rarely spans that distance."

 

6 hours ago, Qviqve said:

but we know that by RoW the Skybreakers are aligned with Odium... does it mean that they are no longer Radiant Knight and become something else?

They are still Radiants.

6 hours ago, Qviqve said:

• Do we know if the Honorblades can get out of Roshar? Could something have happened to Nale in WaT, and his Honorblade being taken by the GB? By the epigraphs of WaT we know that the Wind and Heralds have vanished, so this could be a possibility

Yes, they can be carried out of Roshar, no, they can't grant powers to multiple people, they don't grant squires - one person holding a Honorblade gets powers, nobody else. There was a whole group of people with powers in TLM.

[+Oltux72 he/him]

34 minutes ago, robardin said:

No, the Honorblades did not grant "squiring".

Indeed. We would need to assume that the Ghostbloods, having Connector Ferrings, are very good at manipulating bonds. Squiring seems to be the default with the Nahel bond. Sixth of the Dusk could do a similar thing with Sak.

37 minutes ago, robardin said:

Just as well - can you imagine Vyre squiring up Regals or singers who could wield TWO surges (even more than the Heavenly Ones)?

Well, Aesudan could make squires, so they basically can if they really wish to.

38 minutes ago, robardin said:

And I did propose one possible mechanism for Skybreakers in Elendel in TLM: that they had no spren bonds but were "long distance squires". We have seen that Windrunner squires require being close to "their Windrunner" to gain Surges, but we don't know that that's also true, or as true, for Skybreakers.

Doesn't the training scene at the Purelake show that their squires work like everybody else's?

 

39 minutes ago, robardin said:

As for being "freakishly tall" by Scadrian standards, that's really an Alethi thing. They could be Skybreakers from elsewhere on Roshar. Shallan also finds them "freakishly tall" and she's from just one country over!

Felt is consistently described as a small man. Alethi would likely be monstrousy tall on Scadrial.

 

41 minutes ago, robardin said:

If some kind of "perfect gem inside an aluminum box" thing is worked out between RoW and TLM that allows sentient spren to leave, then why wouldn't that also work to let their Radiant leave with them?

So I'd say that that WoB that says "as of this point in continuity" they haven't figured that out yet, would preclude bringing unbonded highspren to Scadrial.

It may very well work for Radiants. The Ghostbloods, however, have no reason to enable Skybreakers to leave or to tell anybody outside the Ghostbloods how this works. But they do have a very good reason to get Surgebinders outside Roshar in their service.

[+robardin he/him]

3 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

[Sentient spren captured in a perfect gem placed in an aluminum box] may very well work for Radiants. The Ghostbloods, however, have no reason to enable Skybreakers to leave or to tell anybody outside the Ghostbloods how this works. But they do have a very good reason to get Surgebinders outside Roshar in their service.

So, IF that method were possible (and that was just me repeating a common fan theory), the GBs would still need some willing highspren to enter the gems; probably not such a tall order, given they seem to have been able to convince Ala the seon to join them of their own free will.

I doubt that a coercively trapped highspren would be open to forming a Nahel bond with a Ghostblood agent!

[+Oltux72 he/him]

41 minutes ago, robardin said:

So, IF that method were possible (and that was just me repeating a common fan theory), the GBs would still need some willing highspren to enter the gems; probably not such a tall order, given they seem to have been able to convince Ala the seon to join them of their own free will.

I doubt that a coercively trapped highspren would be open to forming a Nahel bond with a Ghostblood agent!

What we have seen so far in the preview chapters is quite compatible with Shadesmar becoming a war zone. Wars tend to produce refugees.

[Ninth of the Night]

I am fully convinced those were Skybreakers. We can at least say for almost certain that they weren't Coinshots. Otherwise Brando probably would have just told us they were, but he somewhat dodged the question.

There must be some way for certain Skybreakers to get off world at that point, I don't know what, hopefully we get an answer by the end of WaT. Regardless I'm not gonna believe they were anything else until it's confirmed one way or another.

Sorry this post isn't really adding to the conversation, just stubbornly stating my unshakable opinion lol