Amanuensis Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 8 minutes ago, The Wandering Wizard said: Ashbringer Shining Any takers We might need you to stay on Ash, Wiz, because Steel hasn't shown up yet. Drake, Silho, and I would need to move off Biplet and onto Sart, if anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wandering Wizard Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Just now, Shining Silhouette said: But like why? I've been good this cycle I swear I kept my chaos in check Honestly that's what is concerning me. I haven't seen much of the Kaos Silho that I remember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shining Silhouette Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Just now, The Wandering Wizard said: Honestly that's what is concerning me. I haven't seen much of the Kaos Silho that I remember. Bip Wiz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biplet Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 5 minutes ago, Shining Silhouette said: But like why? I've been good this cycle I swear I kept my chaos in check I'm scared that if I vote in self preservation I'll get shot no matter what I do, and I've sort of given up over here lolol I didn't expect anyone to follow me I read you a little more elim than TJ, for the second reason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sart Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 (edited) What the... Bip Edited February 7, 2023 by Sart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrakeMarshall Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 (edited) I just want to go on record and say, the reason I village read Matrim is that his low-key annoyance at my refusal to use a kill feels genuine. 7 hours ago, Orlok Tsubodai said: How does this account for worlds where the two new voters (yourself and Steel(?)) are not confirmed villagers? Ideally, we need our voting set to be a subset of those who voted last time, or a superset with the addition of one or two players. Swapping players in risks e.g. losing one eliminator vote from TJ not voting, but bringing one in because you are now voting, and giving us no ability to distinguish between you being an eliminator or the eliminator being one of the the rest of the group. I want to point out, that if you don't trust Steel then it's kind of all a moot point, because isn't Steel the one reporting today's Tie Guy result? It doesn't really matter if Steel is included in the scan or not because if Steel is evil then Steel won't necessarily truthfully report the scan results Likewise, your Tie Guy scan yesterday isn't completely reliable, since technically you and Araris could both be evil bros together, and the elims could have a troll to have trolled Bookwyrm. Or if you're village but a troll trolled your Tie Guy scan I'm not even sure I know what that would do. Uncertainty is a thing we're gonna have to account for. 6 hours ago, Amanuensis said: That said, @DrakeMarshall @Shining Silhouette and @Steeldancer could all vote Sart instead of Bip. I think I'm fine with it Why Sart tho? I'm okay with it in theory but I don't see how its any better than Bip. Sart would basically be pure PoE yea? Do you have other reasons than that? I'm not sure how I feel about all of these vote switcheroos in the last couple pages and I still don't know how I want to vote. Vote Tally (I think) Ashbringer (3): Ashbringer, Matrim's Dice, Tani Biplet (3): Amanuensis, DrakeMarshall, Sart Shining Silhouette (2): Biplet, The Wandering Wizard Steeldancer (1): Random Bystander Kasimir (1): Channelknight Fadran Edited February 7, 2023 by DrakeMarshall updated vote tally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biplet Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 1 minute ago, DrakeMarshall said: Likewise, your Tie Guy scan yesterday isn't completely reliable, since technically you and Araris could both be evil bros together, and the elims could have a troll to have trolled Bookwyrm. Or if you're village but a troll trolled your Tie Guy scan I'm not even sure I know what that would do. Uncertainty is a thing we're gonna have to account for. Are we 100% certain that all scans for our hard-clears are 100% accurate? Like, this brings up a good point and now I'm getting paranoid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shining Silhouette Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 57 minutes ago, The Wandering Wizard said: Honestly that's what is concerning me. I haven't seen much of the Kaos Silho that I remember. *sigh* Wiz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wandering Wizard Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Just now, Biplet said: Are we 100% certain that all scans for our hard-clears are 100% accurate? Like, this brings up a good point and now I'm getting paranoid No, we can't ever be sure Though Bookwyrm's scan of Orlok should be correct unless Araris AND Bookwyrm were trolled. Or Araris and Orlok are evil together. But I quite village read Araris so I've been mostly ignoring this world. Any night action can be trolled and no one ever knows if they are trolled except you meme makers, unless you are trolled. So nothing can ever be 100% trusted, but you have to go out on a limb and trust something, otherwise we all would have shot each other to bits long ago. Still not certain why we haven't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrikerEZ Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 1 minute ago, Biplet said: Are we 100% certain that all scans for our hard-clears are 100% accurate? Like, this brings up a good point and now I'm getting paranoid The answer is that they are all completely unclear. Obviously I believe mine to be true (meaning I think me and Aman are both definitely village), but that doesn't mean you guys all have to trust that. And I honestly don't know if I trust all of these other claimed scans as well. With this being blackout, anyone could be lying about their role/scans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biplet Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Just now, The Wandering Wizard said: No, we can't ever be sure sorry should've said 100% certain within reasonable parameters of SE logic lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrakeMarshall Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Just now, Biplet said: Are we 100% certain that all scans for our hard-clears are 100% accurate? Like, this brings up a good point and now I'm getting paranoid Imo, there aren't any hard-clears in this game. The closest thing we have to cleared players is that there are some pairs of players (Striker and Bookwyrm) who claim to have scanned each other as village, but even then they could both just be evil. I don't think Striker and Bookwyrm are evil, but I kinda don't feel that they're hard-cleared either. Which, yes, is paranoia inducing I feel like everybody is mostly just accepting all of these clears as solid and that's also paranoia inducing for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wandering Wizard Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 1 minute ago, Biplet said: sorry should've said 100% certain within reasonable parameters of SE logic lol Yes some are If the actions line up with the scan then I'd say yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biplet Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Just now, DrakeMarshall said: I feel like everybody is mostly just accepting all of these clears as solid and that's also paranoia inducing for me AGREED OKAY I'M NOT GOING CRAZY I'M NOT ALONE Like this game is totally blackout and so much has felt like we're blindly trusting one player and doing everything we're told to do and?? I don't like it. We only have one confirmed elim dead and according to Aman it seems like that's the only one, right? But if we've got all these clears and scans and blegh then why do we only have one elim dead?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wandering Wizard Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Just now, Biplet said: Like this game is totally blackout and so much has felt like we're blindly trusting one player and doing everything we're told to do and?? I don't like it. We only have one confirmed elim dead and according to Aman it seems like that's the only one, right? But if we've got all these clears and scans and blegh then why do we only have one elim dead?? I think that we have more than one dead, but I'm more optimistic Devo, TKN, and Bookwyrm shouldn't be evil. Just because they've all been killed by the elims. Because I've never actually seen a WGG gambit that was roleblocked. Or even a WGG at all really. Only the idea mentioned in teams I've been in, but it was deemed to be too risky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biplet Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 (edited) Can we get an accurate vote tally? edit: that sounds like shade I didn't mean it to Edited February 7, 2023 by Biplet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrakeMarshall Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Also, I would argue that I am the most confirmed of the confirmed players tbh All of these players who have ostensibly been scanned as village are just contingent on the alignment of the scanner. An elim can pretend to be a scanner and pretend to have scanned an elim as village and it isn't very costly for them. There is no role or alignment flip to keep them honest, and there is not really a firm expectation of a specific info role distribution either, because this game clearly has an abnormally high number of them to account for the flipless nature of the game. Faking a clear via scans is frighteningly viable in this game, imo. Whereas Tani straight-up wouldn't claim elim as a dead villager, I don't think. So in order for me to be evil the elims must have decided to kill one of their own N1 which would be very weird. That would require a much more costly gambit from the elims than a faked scan would. Not to mention getting the elims to agree on such a costly plan so early in the game. And while I do like costly gambits, I wasn't even playing N1, so my love of gambits doesn't even weigh against me here. I legit think I am the most confirmed villager in this game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amanuensis Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 (edited) Ashbringer Quote Ashbringer (4/3): Ashbringer, Matrim's Dice, Amanuensis, Tani, Biplet (2): DrakeMarshall, Sart Shining Silhouette (2): Biplet, The Wandering Wizard Steeldancer (1): Random Bystander Kasimir (1): Channelknight Fadran Edited February 7, 2023 by Amanuensis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shining Silhouette Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 1 minute ago, Amanuensis said: Ashbringer Why was Ash selfvoting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amanuensis Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 (edited) Just now, Shining Silhouette said: Why was Ash selfvoting? He can't die to execution because of his role, so he volunteered to prove it for the tie. He also needs to be one vote ahead because his second role removes a vote from him. @Shining Silhouette would you be okay with voting Ash instead of me? Edited February 7, 2023 by Amanuensis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shining Silhouette Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Just now, Amanuensis said: He can't die to execution because of his role, so he volunteered to prove it for the tie Man this game is complicated Okay we have Ash lined up.... What ever happened to Archer/TJ? Weren't they in the picture at the beginning of the cycle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amanuensis Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Just now, Shining Silhouette said: Man this game is complicated Okay we have Ash lined up.... What ever happened to Archer/TJ? Weren't they in the picture at the beginning of the cycle? We are keeping them out of the tie as a control, since they were both in the last tie. If the new group has 0 elims we know both are elim going forward. If the group still has 2 elims then we know they're village. Though Sart voting Bip just tainted the pool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JNV Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Ok I missed a lot but it seems like you lot have this turns vote well in hand but I kinda forgot to post so Im just chiming in hi in case it wasnt clear yes Im that other PM Spider yes I scanned Matrim as clear and I trust that scan because the only person who knew I was a PM Spider and knew what trolling me would do was Amanuensis so unless its a Matrim Amanuensis Striker team then Matrims good cause like I was barely around why would they troll me over other convenient targets so hi Ill be around for a bit but it doesnt look like you need me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shining Silhouette Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 Just now, Amanuensis said: We are keeping them out of the tie as a control, since they were both in the last tie. If the new group has 0 elims we know both are elim going forward. If the group still has 2 elims then we know they're village. Though Sart voting Bip just tainted the pool. Smart smart. Now I understand why it was hard to find a Bip substitute. Ii suppose I'm fine with Sart? Idk this actually is pretty hard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amanuensis Posted February 7, 2023 Report Share Posted February 7, 2023 1 minute ago, Shining Silhouette said: Smart smart. Now I understand why it was hard to find a Bip substitute. Ii suppose I'm fine with Sart? Idk this actually is pretty hard You and @DrakeMarshall could vote Sart instead, sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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