Windrunner

I remembered that quote too but I couldn't find it anywhere. Do you know what interview it's from?

Nicrosil is the alloy, the base metal is chromium. I think that they have been found somewhere but aren't widely known. The Ars Arcanum mentions Terris people not knowing what they are doing when they store investiture, which is nicrosil, so they must have chromium as well. I think there's a quote that says the same, but I can't find it right now. If I have time later, and no one else has found it, I'll look.

Sure, no problem It's the only place in the book where her full name is mentioned. Those close to her call her Siri, and the others, like Bluefingers, call her Vessel.

So I just had a couple site ideas today, and I just wanted to put them out there to see if they're any good or not. I would like to preface with the fact that I'm not a computer coding guy. I have no idea how difficult it would be to make these into reality. Ok, my first idea is a countdown clock for Brandon's book releases. I've seen them on other sites before, and they seem fairly common and easy to make. This wouldn't be a constant thing, only when we have an actual release date for a book. All I know is that seeing a clock slowly tick down until a book is released always made me even more excited for the release (If that's even possible ). I think the biggest problem with this would be location, I don't see a place that it would fit in well. I've always seen them on sidebars before, and that doesn't appear to be how the main page is formatted. My other idea is the one I'm more uncertain of. I think it would be kind of neat if we could do a cosmere random fact generator. I've also seen these around and they've always seemed to be a lot of fun. This idea would be more complicated then the countdown clock though. I don't know how difficult it would be to build this. There's also the problem of getting enough random facts to use. Also, I'm not sure if we could find enough random facts that people would actually be interested in. If no one ever uses it, it would just be a waste of time. I guess it would really depend on interest in it. What does everyone think about this? Unfeasible or what?

I would agree with the Tears being Awakening's physical aspect if only color from them could be used for Awakening. Since any color could be used, I don't see there being any need to have created a fictional flower to be the physical aspect of the magic system. Color's the physical aspect not the Tears of Edgli. Do you see a reason they need to exist? I just assumed that their dyes perhaps wouldn't be used up as fast as regular color, providing a super-fuel like Lerasium and Atium. I just don't get what purpose they would provide if not Endowment's physical aspect, since they aren't required for the system to function like certain metals are. It's a good idea for them to have left in a backdoor to alter Nightblood's Command, but I'm not sure it's possible. Brandon says that the Command becomes the fundamental basis for the construct's personality, so it might be impossible to change. Complex commands also require more mental gymnastics, so 'Destroy evil when I draw' or "Kill people whose names I say following the word 'kill,'" might have been too abstract or difficult a Command for them to visualize. I hope "Nightblood" goes into more detail about how Nightblood was constructed.

I would like to announce that I was rereading Warbreaker (or should I say rerererereading?) and I just noticed that the name Siri is a nickname. Her real name is Sisirinah. It's crazy how you can keep going back through these books and finding more and more details you missed the first time.

I like this a lot. It makes a great deal of sense. Especially if Odium were to ever go to Nalthis, Hoid would want people there who could directly try to counter him, even to fight Voidbringers if possible. Good idea! This is always what I've thought as well. I think if the Lord Ruler had chromium he would have used it on Vin to remove her metals. It certainly would have enhanced his divine appearance but this is never mentioned. He didn't have much aluminum either, so I doubt he had chromium. And if he had no chromium he definitely had no nicrosil. Also if he'd been able to compound chromium, there's no way Vin could have beaten him. I guess that's what he gets for holding the Final Empire back. It would have been frustrating for him to know how to make the metal, but unable to get his hands on some.

Well neither does it disprove that they knew, I find it the more likely possibility. Most if not all (I can't remember why Zane spiked himself) of Ruin's spikings occurred after he escaped. I don't understand why the people of the Final Empire not knowing about Hemalurgy matters in relation to the people of Classical Scadrial, because Ruin couldn't control any of them so they had to have knowledge to make spikes. At least that's the way I see it. Hmm, do you have a Google+ (or whatever it's called) account. One of us could post a question for Brandon there about this to see if he'd answer about it during the hangout. If you don't just let me know and I'll do it. I was already intending to ask some questions anyway.

Thanks Peter! It's nice to know I'm going in the right direction. December can't come soon enough!

Welcome Sharbinder! I agree, The Way of Kings is the best. It was my introduction to Brandon's work and from the opening sequence I was hooked just like you. I actually carried that book around with me for like 3 weeks after completing it. Probably not the smartest thing in the world since it belonged to the library. I probably ended up with more fines the the book cost.

Hi Drainfree good to have you here! I hope you enjoy these forums as much as I do

Do you really believe that Ruin wasn't responsible for Spook's spiking? I thought there was a quote on this but I couldn't find it anywhere so it may be non-existent. Ruin is causing volcanic eruptions and earthquakes, I don't think it would be beyond his power to nudge the blade into the right angle that it would hit Spook at the right point. Inquisitors experimented for centuries to find new bind points and constructs but they failed miserably. If it was as easy as randomly stabbing a sword into someone I think they would have found a few. Anyway that point is irrelevant, as is the one about Marsh spiking Penrod. The way I see it Ruin spiked Penrod, he used Marsh as a tool. It's like blaming a gun for killing someone instead of the person who fired it. Marsh didn't need to know how to do anything with Hemalurgy he just had to be there for Ruin to use. Also Ruin had such plans for the city, he needed an agent to destroy it, and Quellion wasn't doing it right, he was wearing it down, not burning it to the ground it as was Ruin's desire. I think that it would be too perfect for someone to acquire a spike when just when Ruin needed a new pawn. Also the fact that the manor Quellion tried to kill Spook in not only had Allomantic metal, but the correct one for this "coincidental" spike is too unlikely in my opinion. There's also the fact that the man who stabbed Spook might have been crazy. His family was being held prisoner and would be killed if he messed up. I know that would be enough to unhinge me a little bit. This guy is so nuts that he stabs his buddy to try to get to Spook. In my opinion that seems pretty insane. You can believe that it's coincidence if you so choose, but for me there are way to many coincidences for this to have all worked out. I think Ruin was behind it. I meant knew what they were doing in a different way. As in, I take this type of metal, poke someone with it here, and then stick it here in someone else. I don't believe for a second anyone actually knew what was going on. Knowing what to do is different from knowing why it works. I'm going to go back to the gun again. If you handed it to someone and explained how to fire and reload, they wouldn't need to know why it worked in order to use it. None of the people here needed to be informed of the process, both Vin's mother and Marsh were controlled by Ruin, and I've already voiced my opinion on Spook above. The quote I'm referring to is the same one I've already posted on the page before. In my opinion, Brandon makes it clear that these spikes are known to allow you to communicate with a deity. It seems clear to me that they had to have had some renown. I can however see how you can read it differently.

I interpreted the people don't have to be killed by Hemalurgy quotes as they could be saved by modern medicine if they were stabbed like on the operating table. It doesn't seem likely that they would survive, only possible with the right treatment. Poking someone with a pin in the right place seems unlikely to make a spike, although I don't have any evidence for that. I guess it's up to your interpretation. We've never seen spikes that weren't placed in bind points, so we don't know if putting them elsewhere would still allow Ruin to communicate. I don't think it would, he needs to be able to tap into your Spiritweb. I don't think that an earring given from one person to another would give any portion of their sDNA away. We don't even know if attributes can be stolen from ears. All the times we've seem spikes made it's been through the heart (although that's not the only place), the ear seems minor to have something stolen. Also there's no evidence that you can steal just part of someone's attribute. Brandon says that spike size doesn't matter so even a spike the size of an earring would steal all of an attribute, not just pick up a tiny charge. Also, I really see the creation of a spike and it getting put in the right location as something that only happens when someone informed is involved in the process. Many people may not have Hemalurgically charged spikes, but in my mind there's no way the few that were created happened "under unlikely circumstances". The process is just too involved. Brandon said the people knew what they were doing, so Ruin probably told them somehow, got a madman to spike someone important to impart the knowledge of limited Hemalurgy to them. I do agree that there's no way they could make Hemalurgic constructs though, Ruin wouldn't have told them that.

Not impossible, but I personally doubt it. He refused to confirm how many Shardworlds there are for a long time, he didn't want to put a number on it in case he changed his mind. The fact that he put a number on it, implies to me that he has more or less plotted out all the the books he wants in the main cosmere sequence. If he gets a wild hair he can write about Splinter magics or whatever, but I just don't think he would have given us a number unless he knew where he was going.

Well we only know that they believe that they are reconstructing a soul, how can assassins destroy a soul anyway? Who knows what they're doing in cosmere terms. And Sazed wasn't trying to reconstruct a soul, he was trying to put souls back in bodies and the Emperor isn't dead yet. This soul thing sounds really like the stuff of the spiritual realm to me. Maybe we'll end up with a few more hints on what effect that realm has on personality. This is my reasoning behind the whole Splinter based magic system. Brandon said that there are ten core Shardworlds. There are other planets in the cosmere containing Splinters, or no Shardic Influence at all. I can't see any Shards not being on one of the ten core worlds where the story of the cosemere is told. There is magic on this planet so it seems there has to be some Shardic influence there. However, Brandon got this idea while on a plane ride back form Taiwan, after he gave this interview about the ten core Shardworlds. This whole story is based off this magic, so he obviously had this idea as a sort of tangent a unique side idea. Since it can't be part of the ten main worlds, which probably have all the Shards, then it makes sense that it is a Splinter based magic, at least it seems logical to me.

I think I phrased that poorly. I was wondering why Alendi, a man so plagued by trying to do the right thing, end up with earrings that had been used to kill someone? Did he not know? If so, who gave them to it? Was it the Worldbringers? The only idea I had is that Alendi hoped that he was talking to Preservation, or was just looking for some council, or someone divine to tell him he was doing the right thing. I'm sure Ruin would have been happy to oblige because Alendi was playing right into his hands.

I don't think you can compare Hemalurgy to Allomancy in that way. Allomancy is raw and instinctive and flashy. Hemalurgy is complex and subtle. People can subconsciously burn metal but you can't accidentally stab someone in the right place with the right piece of metal and then accidentally stab that same piece of metal into someone else at a different right point. It's too complex to be pure happenstance. These people obviously knew they were doing something, and had knowledge of what processes they needed to follow even if they didn't know why it worked. They wanted to communicate with a deity and knew how to do it. They may have only had the knowledge of how to do a few specific things, but they definitely knew something. I wonder how Alendi ended up with piercings that were spikes?

Actually Hemalurgy was known Pre-Ascension. I think Brandon might have forgotten about this, he explains it so well that he's obviously given it some thought and Piercings of the Hero are canon.

Hmm, I'm not following you. Are you saying that there is a physical aspect of the magic system that is separate from the physical (concentrated) aspect of the Shard that is used in the magic system? Because certain metals were required for Allomancy, but if color from the Tears of Edgli was necessary for Awakening Vasher wouldn't have been able to drain color from stone. What am I missing?

Nohadon wrote that book, the Way of Kings. The Radiants formed Orders around the tenets described there. I see only two possibilities. One is that in the past Surgebinding didn't require you to speak any Oaths, and somehow that was altered. There are problems with this though. Aaths are integral to Honor, and while altering a magic system is possible, it would be difficult and unlikely that humans would know how to do this, or be able to even if they did. The other possibility is that the Oaths always existed, and no one knew how to say them. Everyone who was a Surgebinder was a weak one like Kaladin before he said the Second Oath. Nohadon was inspired somehow by the Almighty to write this book, describing the Oaths that would need to be spoken. This has problems as well. Kaladin instinctively knew the Second Oath, wouldn't others in the past have known as well?

You can lash things to the sky, Szeth does it with a stone block. I think the key with Lashing is that it isn't really to an object but a direction. Szeth says he lashed himself to the wall, but what it really means is that he Lashed himself in the direction of the wall. Windrunners twist the spiritual gravitational bond, changing where down is. They don't have to have an object to do it towards.

I would like to announce that I'm terribly excited about the Emperor's Soul! When I heard that it was coming out this year I jumped right into the air. I was so sad we weren't going to get a cosmere book this year, but now I don't have to cross that bridge, thank goodness. This just about made my month. My only problem is that it doesn't seem that it will be available in hardcover, the only price listed is mass market paperback. But I can't complain, I'd take a new cosmere book if it was written on used napkins.

Okay I'm necro-ing this topic, so if people want to discuss this they have all the information at their fingertips. There's been an announcement for this novella, now called the Emperor's Soul. It will be published by Tachyon Publications in December 2012. Here's the link to the announcement. Also here's the summary from lyssie95 who heard part of it read at LTUE. Keep in mind that she says she wrote this a month after the reading, and that Brandon had only written two chapters at this point, so these details are subject to change. One important thing to remember is we now know this Forgery system isn't limited to just stone, if it can construct a new soul (spiritual aspect?) for someone. So right now the biggest things I want to know are how the symbols are constructed, and what Hoid wanted with the Emperor's scepter? (Containing the Splinter?)

Thanks for explaining that Zas, you did a better job then I showing that Hemalurgy is a magic system rather then a term used to describe powers accumulated from others. I was a little confused by the question, so that's why some of my replies may be a little strange. Now that I know what you're saying b4dave, I agree absolutely that many magic systems are built by accumulating the powers of others. I wouldn't say each world specifically though, rather some magic systems. If it's not built into the mechanics of the system I'd say you'd be better off trying to use Hemalurgy. But you're spot on about Awakening and Hemalurgy gathering power form others and I'd say you're right about Dakhor too. Dilaf says it took the deaths of 50 men to give him the ability to negate Aons.

So Forgery could replicate something as specific as a soul? No wonder Peter told us we knew too little to speculate on it. We didn't even know it could be done on something other then stone. Also did anyone notice the date? December 2012! So there will be a cosmere book this year.