C_Vallion

For some reason it wasn't letting me copy/paste my LBLs in the previous message. So they're here: Pg 1: “cross-stitched” embroidered? “he heard D knock” how does he know it’s D? “he didn’t have much going for him…” Are you familiar with the three-pronged character development idea? That a character should be 2 out of 3 of competent, proactive, and sympathetic? If he’s going to declare himself incompetent, you’re going to want to make sure you’re really pushing those other two. https://writingexcuses.com/2014/03/30/writing-excuses-9-13-three-prong-character-development/ What exactly is D’s position? I don’t have a clear sense of it, but it seems odd for her to be striding in like she owns the place. “poured over” -> pored over Pg 3: “act fair…” Something about this seems off. Especially comparing it to treating the captive like a teenager. Teenagers will generally listen to the adult they’ve been assigned to as long as they aren’t out to cause trouble (thank goodness). An adult revolutionary has already proved that they are out to cause trouble and that they don’t recognize the authority structures that are set in place. Pg 4 I think a lot of the conversation through here could be trimmed down to the key details. Pg 5: I see the “letting go of the world” part (“letting images and words slide”), but where’s the “connecting himself to the Creator”? Are there scriptures or mantras or rituals that specifically connect him to the deity? Pg 6: D’s rebuttal at the end of the page doesn’t seem like an argument for S’s comment that “the creator would just know”. If anything, it seems to support his thought. If it’s a physical trait, it should fade. But if it’s supernatural, the actual passing on of physical traits shouldn’t matter. Her comments support the supernatural cause over the physical one. Besides, having a physical explanation doesn’t disqualify a supernatural one. Pg 7: The term powerwalking keeps throwing me off, because in my head it implies ladies in 70s workout clothes with little hand weights. Pg 8: I note this because it’s something I’ve been working on eliminating a lot in the past year (so I find myself noticing it elsewhere a lot more), but things like D’s “do you know where she is?” and S not really knowing, but not doing anything important before finding her anyway end up dragging out page time unnecessarily. There are a few detours like this that could be trimmed out to streamline things. Pg 10: Who is actually doing the interrogating here? Pg 11: I’m struggling to follow what we’re supposed to be learning/hoping for from this information. I keep grabbing on to random details, but there are too many to know what’s relevant and what’s not when we don’t have a good sense of what S’s driving goals are, how the interrogation is going to make progress in meeting them, or what information he’s hoping to get from her.

I'd agree that this is likely causing a lot of trouble. I am recognizing a lot of the troubles I was having at the beginning of PoP submissions, where the important things were all mentioned in passing, and vague side-stories were taking center stage. So you have my full sympathy for the amount of work in can take to get things in order. Feel free to message me to bounce ideas off of if you think it will be helpful while you're getting things in order. I know some of the messages we sent back and forth a while back were helpful for me in many ways, and I'm glad to return the favor if I can!

I'll pass on this week, but would like to claim a spot for the 14th if possible.

I like a lot of things in this chapter. It's nice to get everyone's thoughts about landing, and the various perspectives they have on the situation. Definitely makes me excited to see how the landing and what follows plays out. Pg 1-3 I’m torn about the names. I like that they’re similar to modern-earth names. It definitely creates the impression of having come from a world/culture the reader is familiar with, and I don’t have to struggle to figure out how to pronounce them in my head. However, being one letter different feels too close to the versions we’d see now to reflect intentional changes, and there wouldn’t be the blending of languages/cultures/etc. or hand-written census records to misread that would argue for it being accidental. Am I overthinking it? Yeah. Probably. But I’m weirdly fascinated by how naming conventions change over time (and why some names stick around spelled the same way forever), so it jumped out at me. Pg 3: “Though with D…” The clause split across paragraphs tripped me up a bit. “No sense reducing the structural strength” Good job, engineers. Space Sheep! Pg 4-5 I like the home-life scene a lot Pg 8: They aren’t just using some form of composting toilets to automate this? “…hit the fan.” *facepalm* Pg 9: I have questions about what they expect a “priest” to be if there aren’t any official religions left. Pg 11: Feast/Settlers. Nice. Now I’m curious as to how these are played. Pg 13 “Looks like that list was deprecated…” I’m not familiar with this use of deprecated. But I do appreciate the cringe-worthy continued existence of out-of-date e-mail lists. Pg 15 H seems to get physically forceful pretty quickly. The others were mostly just trying to figure out what was going on. J was getting a little flippant (which is the absolutely mildest appropriate response when someone’s about to ruin game night), but then, is fine? I feel like I’m missing something there.

Hooray! I'm glad it seems to have done some of its jobs well She's saying that her own feelings of standing there, (a little awed, a little disoriented, a lot exhausted) makes her sympathetic to people who assign supernatural causes to moments when the environment affects our senses/emotions in certain ways. Because her understanding of the gods doesn't have them interacting with people in that way. Ultimately, if Is- was walking into a spiritual/religious gathering in our world, and heard people talking about feeling some divine power among them or being one with some greater power or any of those phrases that get associated with that sort of supernatural-presence-feeling, her response would be along the lines of "I'm pretty sure that's the smoke or candles or shiny things or music, but I get why you might think that because it all pulls at physical/emotional strings, which makes me uncomfortable." There's a very good chance I'm referencing shorthand there for concepts that aren't as universal as I think they are.... I overthink this sort of thing a lot...I don't know if that ends up being helpful or hurtful (or neutral) in the long run. Ultimately, I don't want the reader to have to have the days of the week memorized (I mean. I have to double-check them...), but finding a way to signal that something doesn't need to be remembered is tricky. I meant to have Is- internalize a count of how many days out it would be above (especially since she's spent the past several days in the mountains and has probably lost any good sense of what day it is anyway) but then failed to do that. Do you think that would have helped? Trying to get across the point of something like: "His schedule's packed til Thursday, so probably wait until Monday." (because we all culturally know that no one wants to get a bunch of meeting invitations for a Friday after a long week) Without it coming across as: "His next three days are really busy, but then he will have the days off that we all set aside for family time and religious observances and will be available after that, 7 days from now, at the start of the calendar work-week" This is definitely something I still need to work on finding a balance for. I am better at catching it now than I was before, but it usually takes letting it sit for a few days before looking at the chapter again for a streamlining edit, but I didn't get a chance to do that this time around. Good to know this isn't holding up as well as it should (not clearly conveying why she distrusts H is definitely not helping either). Also, I apologize for any feeling of overexplaining below. I'm bad enough about that under normal circumstances, but want to make sure any disconnects that are coming from missed chapters are pointed out to make sure you're up to speed. She ends her previous chapter with the decision to get to Neri- to find a healer, but none of the details (that she's low on cash, that she's going to pretend to be a student, that she will need to find H specifically to actually find a healer she can trust, etc.) are mentioned before this chapter. I think a lot of what's being assumed to be recap is summary of off-page events. Because it seemed unnecessary to have a scene/chapter of her traveling through the mountains on her own planning things. Ultimately, the spell she tried to use healed the skin and muscle (though there's enough scarring to limit mobility), but some of the more internal damage didn't heal itself entirely correctly, and is what is steadily getting worse. (Chapter 19 goes through all of the specifics of what's going on there) No, it's a primarily-Mish- magic school. And if there are G enrolled there, they're learning far more than the laws are supposed to allow, which is where a lot of Is-'s conflict is here. Because all of the G- there seem to be openly preparing themselves to break the kingdom's laws. So are they criminals-in-training? She wants to change the laws, but at this point, they are still very solidly in place, and she is too much of a by-the-rules person to just ignore the muddy middle ground there. She's torn between what she sees as her duty to her father (and the kingdom) to support the kingdom's laws and her hope that they will be able to change the laws. She's trying to derail their current conversation. The page break right at this line isn't very helpful there, though, since that implication comes in the lines that follow. Ultimately, all of the G who are there know that they're in a sketchy place in the eye of Gilvrani law. Yeah, they can put some of their knowledge to use without breaking the laws, but many of the people who interpret the laws more strictly are still going to consider it criminal. L's point is that you don't sneak over the border to enroll in a school that teaches things of questionable legality just because you're good at those things or think they're fun. And if you do, it isn't going to take long to have the legal/moral murkiness shoved in your face to either get you in trouble or make you reconsider your choices. This one's not a catching up on chapters problem, and thanks for pointing it out. Seems like some of the implications I was hoping would come across fell short. Is-'s main concern is that if he's hiding potential-criminals, what else is he doing that doesn't sit well with the Gil- laws? Even if they do have the same goals in mind. It could probably use L giving a specific example of someone H is hiding who Is- would be thoroughly convinced is a criminal. Someone who had started out doing illegal magic for good reasons, and when the authorities moved in to deal with them, got violent or destructive. Someone who even some of the mages might take issue with. Thanks so much for the thoughts!

Yeah. This is one of the most important things I've probably learned in the long slog of editing. There are still definitely sections with unnecessary wordiness, but I'm far more likely to catch and fix them than I used to be. Glad that's visible I'm hoping this (and most of the other comments) are helped by the contents of the in-between chapters that were missed, as there seems to be a disconnect of what you're expecting vs. what has been set up to be here. I've tried to fill in some of those missing relevant details below. I'd be curious as to whether any of it changes your opinion on the chapter, or if you're still coming across just as many issues. The only reason she's even in the city (or this kingdom) is because she botched an attempt to heal a wound, and no one in her own kingdom would have the tools to heal it, so she needs to get it fixed before it gets bad enough to debilitate or kill her. The whole point of her coming to Neri- is to find Lord H to get someone to heal it (and to see what her uncle's death means for the political schemes that H and her uncle and father had going on). And by the end of the chapter she has found him but realized that he may not actually be the trustworthy solution to the problem that she'd expected him to be. In theory, her willingness to address her emotions at all here should also be visible character arc progress, since she's basically been dissociating from them through the past several chapters. This chapter is a three-day time jump from the last chapter we saw in her pov (at which point she had just had a harrowing encounter with the gods after killing a man and seeing her uncle killed), and this is the first scene set in Neri- so I thought we needed a little more here to show the shift in place/time from where she was before. It could probably be trimmed down, but I think jumping straight into the conversation on page 2 would be really disorienting. It's not a new arc so much as the opening of a new milieu section (to jump into M.I.C.E. quotient terms). Her being here is part of the arc of pursuing a change to the magic laws (this part of it requiring her to find Lord H and get answers and help). Well, at least the banter is interesting. Said banter *should* be progress in the "pursuing a change to the magic laws" arc by challenging Is's concept of the straightforwardness of what those changes would mean. Does any of that affect your understanding of where things seem like they should be compared to what you were expecting? Thanks so much for your thoughts!

Mostly I wanted to check in and mention that I really like the concept of this application of ...uh...toxic wood science? Unfortunately, beyond that, I don't really enjoy the style of humor. Too much time spent coaching high schoolers and having to deal with their giggling over random phrases they've decided to take as weird innuendo (makes reading this upon getting home almost exhausting). So I'm going to leave the more thorough reading/critiquing of this and future chapters to those more inclined to it.

Wow. Busy around here all of a sudden. Reading this while overtired was probably not helpful, but I had a lot of trouble finding a specific focus of it. It seemed to go in a few different directions, but it wasn’t clear to me how most of those directions tied into the overall story, except for the specific details related to the circumstances under her brother’s rule and what they’re trying to do about it. The introduction of the cloaked figure adds in the detail that the RA exists, and gives opportunities to show her history with the RA and her other brother, but the events around stumbling across him/her and the fight itself came a little out of nowhere, and didn’t have a clear purpose. I’d probably agree with the thought that jumping in a little later with her pov might be more valuable unless there’s a clearer goal she’s trying to achieve here. Pg 1. While I know next to nothing about punching bags, my random nit-picky thought on the first sentence is that a carpet big enough to be rolled up punching-bag sized seems like it would be pretty heavy. Why not just roll up some rocks in the middle or something? “didn’t sound like something she wanted to explain” -> “wasn’t something she wanted to explain.” ? This one jumped out because it seems like the extra wordiness/indirectness I often tend toward, and which shouldn’t be imitated. There are a few others of those as well, but another editing pass would probably help with that. Pg 2. “thinking back to the promise…” was that right before she left on this mission? Or is this a more general mission? The phrasing of it makes it seem like it was a longer time ago, (and therefore that they’ve been together for a while) but it’s a little ambiguous. Pg 2-5: A lot of the conversation here could probably be trimmed down. There are several points when it seems like a line that one person is saying is just there to prompt the other along to their next line. I know I’ve done this at times when I’ve been afraid of having one person talk too long at once, but it can end up feeling a little clunky/forced if it’s too evenly back-and-forth. Pg 3: There’s also some funny tense stuff going on here and there. Places where it should be past-perfect instead of just simple past tense. An extra thought transitioning from D’s question to Z’s memory would be helpful. Do we know anything about the Hul-? Shouldn’t S be able to feel Z’s emotions about that, though? Her conviction? What array of emotions/feelings are covered by the empathy magic? Pg 4: “Freedom Fighters” feels a little bland for the setting. This seems like a good opportunity to add some sort of myth reference or something similar as a world-building addition. Pg 5: “regular person” as opposed to…? For the urgency of needing to get out of their hideout in the previous scene, wandering around with a sketchpad seems odd. “got her glares for indecency” if she’s part of some sort of rebel group, shouldn’t she be trying to stay under the radar? Seems like she’s going out of her way to attract attention here. Pg 6: What’s J’s explanation for kicking them out of the pilgrimage houses? Also, where are they coming from if none of them are able to cross the desert to leave? Pg 8-10 The appearance of the supposed-RA and the fight seem to come out of nowhere, and the taunting/banter seemed a little odd. Isn’t she surrounded by a bunch of refugees? What’s their response when two people start attacking each other in the middle of the space where they live? Isn’t she concerned that he’s one of the people who lives there, just wearing a red cape and maybe trying to defend the people there from some armed woman who doesn’t even speak their language? Pg 11 “looked deep” I’d say so, if it “lodged itself in her right thigh” “…are young women.” Oh? Pg 12: I have questions about how Z got involved with this group if she hasn’t done anything to impress them. How far did they walk to get here? And how much blood has she lost in the meantime? They’re all pretty casual about the wound, which seems like it would have been quite significant. Did they remove the knife? Wrap it in any way? Or is it just bleeding all over? Pg 13: “You have to be, if you want to hang on to who you are.” I’m not entirely sure what this is supposed to mean. Going to echo the other thoughts that the dialogue feels a little out of place for the setting. Still more questions about Z’s involvement with the group, and what they’re expecting her to actually do. She seems a little naïve here as she’s asking D to spy on the conversation with S. I sort of expected D to refuse and accuse Z’s royal upbringing of making her assume she can just hand out orders to people.

Hello, All! This chapter was...a challenge. It's a full rewrite taking details from three different previous chapters, and while I like some of the new aspects of it, I will definitely need to let it sit for a couple weeks and come back to it before I can get it where I want it to be. I also didn't get to do my usual editing-for-flow passes thanks to a blizzard and a malfunctioning snowblower over the weekend. So I apologize in advance if it's a little more typo-full or clunky than usual. That being said: 1. Anything confusing? I know there are a few points that will probably run into WRS issues, since the last Is- chapter was submitted more than a month ago, and there's been a big location change in the off-page time. 2. Anything that feels like it goes on too long and could use some trimming? 3. Thoughts on how the characters are coming across? 4. Any specific points of engagement/disengagement? Thanks!

This is interesting to me because I liked the opening and Al a lot, but don't always enjoy hard sci-fi (I usually blame engineer-brain for overanalyzing the world's tech, but I think I just need to try more of it). Though I may have overlooked pacing concerns because I latched onto Al pretty quickly. I really like characters who can appreciate structure and protocol, and whose first thought upon running into a problem isn't to burn it all down. In case anyone who's read anything I've written hasn't noticed that already... (I blame my family tree for being full of engineers and military members). Not sure if that's helpful to mention or if it just complicates things more since I seem to be the odd one out on that front.

A lot of this is going to be in those part 1 chapters, but it's good to see it described in these terms. It will be a big help in thinking through what I emphasize when I get back to editing that section of the manuscript. Thanks!

Hah. Got me.

Overall: The opening was a little rough for me to get into, but I’m not sure how much of that was just not being used to some of the sci-fi tropes/concepts. I really like Al-, and can sympathize with his desire for routine (though his second scene had some things that seemed slightly inconsistent, which I called out below). The “observing beings” pov was also really intriguing, and makes me really interested to figure out what’s going on there. J’s pov was not quite as engaging for me, but it also wasn’t kicking me out of the chapter either. I very rarely just pick up a book without having someone recommend it these days (seems like the 24 hours in a day gets shorter and shorter every year), but if I was back at a stage of life when I had the time for such things, I would keep reading. At least for a few more chapters, to see what’s up with our planet beings. But I’d probably want something in those chapters to really grab me, since I don’t latch on to sci-fi as quickly as I do fantasy. Pg 4: The opening sentence feels a little wordy to me, and the “one of many” is non-specific enough to keep me from feeling grounded. “from the same source” : made by the same manufacturers? From the same planet? From the same star system? “this star”: the one of many, I assume? If it’s the star they’re aiming for, I think it might be worth naming it in line one. “ten times before” : meaning they’ve come to this star ten times before? I’d like a better sense of whether this is unusual or a routine thing. Ten times over what stretch of time? *also, side note, I have no idea how many of these things are more a result of me not reading much space-based sci-fi. Readers who are more used to it might not have the same grounding issues. I’m fine by the end of the first page.* Pg 5: This is all it takes for me to like Ag- I’m not quite sure why the thought of keeping the name has this reaction. I could see it coming after the realization that the planet might be inhabitable, but it seems like an odd jump here. Is “sus-ani” something most sci-fi readers would get right away? My immediate thought was to read it as a place, and it took a few extra seconds to figure out why it wasn’t capitalized. But again, might just be my lack of familiarity with the genre. Pg 6: almost-mythical* ? my brain wants to put a hyphen there, but that could just be me. I definitely sympathize with Al’s desire for routine. Pg 7: “just as uninhabitable as…” this being mentioned in paragraphs 2 and 4 on this page with really similar phrasing feels a bit repetitive. Especially since we know enough about what Al- wants to be paying attention to relevant details, and to not be hugely surprised when S. No- says it is habitable. Because story. I like the note of them having a bet on it. A small but very relatable detail. I don’t always like when there are pov-shifts mid-chapter, because I usually prefer clearer breaks, but I didn’t mind this one. I almost think the passive-voice in the first sentence helps with that for me? It makes it far clearer that we’re somewhere else than if we had some sort of “the observing bodies observed the encroaching lifeform…” opening. Pg 8: “more efficient…than direct research” as someone who has spent a lot of time contrasting the pros and cons of calculating the exact way to do something vs. “I don’t know. Try it and hope it doesn’t explode” I really appreciate this line. Yeah. I think the passive voice and sense of distance/non-specificity through here does a really good job of conveying that we’re in the head of some consciousness that doesn’t process things the same way most people do without being incomprehensible. 10 points to you. I’d say the one risk with that is that if there are details we are meant to hang on to, you’ll want to make sure those are called out a little more clearly, because the language definitely encourages an “I don’t entirely get what that’s saying, but that’s probably fine” feeling for me while reading. I also really like the description of trying to process the letters. Pg 9: “Let go of“ I guess “dropped” doesn’t quite make sense, but “nearly let go” feels funny to me. Dropping something feels like it has stakes because it could fall and break, but “nearly let go” conveys that he’s startled, but not really in a way that makes me concerned the way “dropped” would. I’m not sure if there would be a good equivalent to use. Also, something about Al’s determination to follow protocols made me think he wasn’t the jumpy sort, so this doesn’t quite mesh with my idea of him from before. Irritation that someone would break their routine to be right behind him when they should be somewhere else, sure. But needless rattling of things? “m—x” ? I assume this is some sort of term of respect, but don’t have a good indication of what it is indicating. Pg 10: I’d been about to mention that he seems a little less put together through here than I would have expected from the character introduced at the beginning. Then I got to where he mentions his nerves are fraying. I don’t know if it would help for that to come in a little earlier to get an idea of the reason for the shift in character? It hits me as a pretty big shift from competent and rational and set in routine and protocol to being jumpy and hesitant and uncertain (“I…I’m not sure…” doesn’t fit the protocol-obsessed Al- from the start in my head) I’m pretty sure the end of the second to last paragraph in this scene is word for word what we had back in the second or third page of the chapter. Can cut “her eyes” in the opening line of the next scene. The second half of the second sentence feels a little clunky to me. Also, “vision” gets a little repetitive in this paragraph. Pg 11: “Admin B grumbled.” This is one of the things I probably overthink in my own writing, which made it jump out, but if we’re in her pov, is she likely to call herself this instead of just using her name? Having the handler call her Admin B above would work if it’s just to introduce the full name/title. My first thought was that Admin B was another person standing here. Nice contrast between J and Al-‘s thoughts on floatiness Pg 13: Her comments on not knowing much about astronomy make me wonder what qualifications she has to be making these decisions… wouldn’t that be important? I also don’t have any sense of her apparent age either. Especially since swapping between “J-“ and “Admin B-“ give pretty different perceptions of the character. It was fun to finally read some of your writing after all this time, and I really enjoyed it . Thanks for sharing!

Good point. I'll have to look at how much I have about the message boxes in the earlier chapter. At the time, I hadn't planned to have it as central here, so it's quite possible that some of it can get shifted forward. Not in any way plot relevant, but I will take every chance to ramble about worldbuilding details that I'm given. So there. Feel free to ignore if you are now regretting your decision to bring the question up. There's also a little more about oath-functioning in chapter 20. which will add some color to some of this. For anyone else who is reading through, gore/amputation discussion below: He's definitely more of a secondary character (maybe even tertiary depending on how you count those things) but I wanted to make sure he had some amount of arc since he is by-necessity going to be pretty closely tied to most of the primary characters. Hopefully that feeling won't be quite as strong once I make the next Part 1 changes, which should tie the magic-laws plotlines and the assassination-attempt plotline and the Cag-threat plotline together more closely. Instead of just dropping the one and moving on, then dropping Cag- in out of nowhere. This is all entirely fair... I don't know if there's any good way to get around that, though, since the chapter recaps don't mention a lot of the secondary characters and details... I do have a synopsis I put together as part of my writing class in the fall, and could send over the part of that covering Parts 1 and 2, though, if you think it would be helpful. Good to know. Glad most of it was engaging despite the unavoidable confusion. I'll have to look at the opening when I revise this one and see if there's a good way to start the chapter a little more smoothly. Thanks so much to both of you for your thoughts!

Huh. I could have sworn I'd responded to this before now. Oh well. Was hoping that him seeing the cloak that he knew Is- had would come across as enough implication that he'd hurt Is-, but maybe not. Figures. I feel like I'm batting 1000 when it comes to side characters being more interesting than MCs. How in the world do I do that? There should have been more build-up about G, specifically, hating magic before this (what was there was WAY back at the beginning, and not very clear). This is a combination of being tense/grumpy/on edge plus general suspicion of magic plus irritation that she's casting spells on him without any real warning. He's also more flippant than others (other than Ro), so "damned mages" doesn't have as much heft behind it as it would if someone else had said it. Mostly just a way to distinguish between senders to make it clear that C (the queen's bodyguard. She's the one accompanying Ali- on her little messaging mission) and Ali- are passing the box back and forth on the other end. And it seemed more fitting for a quick note than her tending toward using R and Ali's full titles. This is important, and I'm glad it comes across, even if she doesn't make a lot of appearances (gotta keep interesting side characters around for spin-off short stories, right? *shrug*) Hah. That's actually one of the main things I was hoping would come across in here, since a lot of Part 3's chapters take place in M. Thanks for the thoughts! I'll get to @Sarah B's and @shatteredsmooth's later today.

@Silk I'll claim a spot on the 31st, but I'm going to sit out this week.

Welcome, @Mwindaji and @Mythranor! Good to have you here. Also, Mwindaji, I'll see your Zuko and Azula and raise you an Appa (he's my profile pic). Still working on teaching him to fly. Loved this series! And I'm way overdue for a reread on it. Thanks for the reminder, both of you.

I would probably say that Ala-'s main plotline through PoP is a relationship plotline, though that's also tied into his "trying to protect the duchy" plotline that runs through the series. I'm also planning to find a way to set things up early on to have it implied that Ras- and/or his political friends had something to do with the poisoning. Some of those pieces are in place already (Is-n's interlude and the assassin having ties to magic, some comments between Is and her father about the pro-magic faction potentially trying to force his hand into changing the laws) but there wasn't enough Ras- at all in this round of submissions to get that point across. Your related thoughts are welcome. In my mind, once the court has confirmed that he's supporting his mother's politics, it's going to be almost impossible to re-draw those lines. But you're right that it needs stronger stakes associated with it. Not sure if you remember the chapter from WAY back, where Ala- has an audience with the king to act as a witness to whether or not G- broke his oath in letting the assassination attempt happen. I'd toyed with the possibility of also calling in the guard who'd (unknowingly) given the assassin access to Is-'s equipment to apply the poison, and introducing that idea there, but there was just A LOT going on in that chapter, and I thought it would be overkill (pun not initially intended, but I'm leaving it). Also considered shifting that Accusation/Judgment/etc. to the Is-n interlude where they learn the assassin had magic ties. To have Is-n do the fire-spell casting that Ved- refuses to learn. But again, there was a lot in that chapter. So there's probably a poor nameless guard who let him/herself get drunk or distracted by a pretty face or both (or something else) on duty who will end up going up in flames, but I need to figure out where to fit that in. And also who Ved- would reasonably invite along for the experience as some sort of intimidation tactic. Since, most realistically, Ved- would probably be personally hurt enough by such a betrayal that he'd want to deal with it privately unless he had a reason to do otherwise. Either as a way of scaring Ala- or having Is-n cast the fire spell to avoid letting even the magistrates potentially see him having an emotion. ....hmmmmmm....

Hah. I must have logged on to my computer just as you hit submit. Should probably respond to the other chapter first, but oh well. Some of this is sort of intentional, in that it is meant to be the big thing that the wise-old-king was *wrong* about. But without much time spent among the court in Part 1&2, we're only really in the heads of people who aren't concerned about it. I'll have to keep that in mind, and maybe have Ala- a little more cautious on that front earlier on. Or have Ras- cautious about it, since Ras- should be painted as a Trustworthy Individual earlier on (instead of in this version, where he appears in like one scene and is almost never mentioned again). Yes. A map will definitely be necessary. There is a rough one, where I'd penciled in all of the nobles associated with the various holdings (though several of those names have changed). It's in the Summary doc by the chapter recaps at the bottom of the e-mail I sent out. But ultimately, yeah. T is a tactical invasion point. Or at least a good troop landing/rallying point. Lots of exposed coastline to land an invading force with a small population to defend it, and bordered by mountains along one side and a sizable river on another. Getting across the river/mountains to break into the rest of Gil- would be challenging, but they'd be able to hold T without too much trouble if they land a bunch of troops there. In theory. I need to run this past someone with more military strategy sense, since most of mine comes from board games and vague intuition. So. This is all basically the stuff I'd added in based on what I'm intending to add into part 1. Because in theory it means I might have less work on my next round of revisions (and I don't want to rewrite all these later chapters twice.) Ala-'s mom was vocally pro-magic, even before marrying Ala-'s dad to spite the old king. This was mentioned in one of the early submissions, but got cut. I intended to bring it in later then...forgot... oops. So there are a couple references to his mom's work, but definitely not enough to know anything about it. Again. Oops. So. Next part 1 revision: 1. Ras will almost definitely be gender-swapped (name as yet undecided). Because I don't have enough older female characters, and having more politically active women might help with the patriarchal feel you've mentioned. And because I want there to have been a stronger bond between Ras- and Mom. They had worked together on some of the initial politicking against the old king, and I think having Ras as mentor/political ally/maternal figure all in one to Mom will tie in better to Ras-'s tendency to see Ala- as a child to be protected. As well as having a bit of a guilt complex about needing to make things right even if the costs are steep. 2. Ala- will have intentionally stayed out of that side of politics because it falls too close to conversation about his parents' deaths, but after watching Is- nearly die because there was no magic available to save her, he realizes that he wants to get involved, which is closer to his inciting incident, though I need to figure out how to frame that to make it work right. At first he assumes all of their political work is above-board, but learns that several of Ras's associates are less concerned about such things, to the point of supporting a group of insurrectionists that is forming among Gil- citizens who have chosen to study at the mage school. Ras insists she has nothing to do with that way of doing things. "After all, does it seem like the king can be threatened or intimidated into changing laws?" But Ala still doesn't like that Ras is working with them at all, and he feels like Ras isn't telling him the full story. 3. Somewhere through here, there will be some moment where someone needs to swear something on an oath or something along those lines, to make it clear that 1. oaths are a thing with potential consequences and 2. this is how things are supposed to go when all is well vs. commenting on what would happen otherwise. Or, possibly, some random noble swears something on an oath before the king, who doesn't trust them and calls them to account, and said person goes up in flames. Because its seems like a good, clear "this is what happens when oaths aren't kept" TBD. Hooray! Roads are always more interesting than people think. Says the engineer Yeah. I do want to include a little more of the feeling of this early on. That Ala- sees himself as someone who builds things, not as someone who destroys them. I haven't yet decided if I want this to carry across the four-way foil where R sees himself as destroying things (even if it's not accurate). Is- sees herself as preserving things. Ali- sees herself as.....something. Fixing things? Trying to think of how her attempts to get her family to acknowledge their issues and change fits into that setup. Creation/destruction/change/preservation? That almost works, but I feel like there's a little more forcing the puzzle pieces to fit than I'd like at this point... Thanks for sending me off on that thought-process, thought I definitely need to make it clearer what is expected, and that the confusion here is more that it seems to be some middle-ground rather than a clear innocent/guilty verdict. The "does it only manifest in situations like this" and the "doesn't seem like a great oath system if you can get away with stuff" needs some clarification as well. There's some answer to it in the Ali- chapter when Der- arrives with news, in that Is-n had been hoping to request a pardon for his potential-oathbreaking, but I'm pretty sure there wasn't a clear enough framework set up for that to get added into it accurately. For the behind the page details: The gods allow space for human-negotiation before accusations/confessions/etc. and if those people can reach an agreement on mortal terms, the gods accept that. Usually. Because obviously someone can say "hey...I accidentally did this thing. Forgive me?" And have it agreed to when the person may be hiding more sinister things. In general, the fact that no one quite trusts the gods' sense of justice means that they tend to try to figure things out on their own terms first, but get the gods involved if things are desperate. In this case, Ras isn't aware that he's done anything to act against his oath. But that isn't revealed until later. Maybe I should hang a lantern on that in Ala- and Tre-'s conversation at some point. That Ras- wouldn't be so willing to have the oath removed if he thought he'd acted against it. This *is* a shift to Ala- moving more into the spotlight than he'd been earlier on, and should be a pretty clear escalation of earlier conflicts between him and Ras-, but those conflicts don't really exist in the version I've submitted thus far. So we'll have to see how it all pans out in the next round of revisions. This is an issue I've been aware of all along (the version I started submitting through this time last year was close to 210k. ) I think this revision is on track to end up at 160-170k, but it's hard to tell when I'm still shifting later chapters around and trimming things back. I do think there's a lot of room for streamlining the early chapters, but I don't know where that will put the wordcount once I get that in better order. I still don't think cutting straight to Part 2 will do it, but I am aware that Part 1 still needs a lot of work and trimming. This revision, I did a lot of squishing information from the old early chapters into the current Part 1 because I thought it was needed, but I'll have a better sense of what is needed and what's not on the next pass (if only it didn't take so long to do each pass ) It's still encouraging. Don't worry I expected to have a lot of issues with the setup on this one because it's the one that has the most shifted around beforehand. Ali- has setup issues as well, but her arc being tied into the family means there isn't as much outside-information to tie in later. Ala-'s setup is almost entirely separate from that, so shoehorning the changes in now is a lot more jarring. But that will hopefully just be a this-chapter thing. Hopefully. Wow. That was even more rambly than I expected it to be.... I probably shouldn't be surprised by that at this point, but here we are. Anyway. As always, thanks so much for your thoughts!

Hi, All! This had originally been two chapters, and while I trimmed back the extra detail a good deal (I think it had been close to 8k when I started), but there's probably still more that can be cut. The Ras/Ala dynamic isn't set up as much in the early chapters in this revision as much as it will be next time around. Ultimately, Ras still sees Ala as a kid half the time, and hasn't trusted him with some of the more risky aspects of the political work Ala's mom was doing before her death. And Ala is torn between trusting Ras's judgment and feeling like he's going into things blind (which doesn't play well with his anxiety issues). Content Warning: mild language, mention/brief depiction of panic attack 1. Anything confusing? 2. Anything that feels like it goes on too long and could use some trimming? 3. Thoughts on how the characters are coming across? 4. Any specific points of engagement/disengagement? Thanks!

That's alright. What is time anyway these days?

Can I have a spot for tomorrow? Sorry for the late request. My usually typing space has been overrun by a house project, so I've barely looked at my computer for two days.

I will say that avoiding a monotheistic setup is probably the easiest single thing that would pull it away from seeming like Islam. I think there are other ways to have a polytheistic setup without it seeming like the different races have their own gods. Lois McMaster Bujold's World of Five Gods books is probably the best example I can think of. Where there are four gods everyone in the surrounding area agrees on, and a fifth that some view as a god and some view as a demon depending on culture. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_of_the_Five_Gods I also just generally really enjoyed those books for having non-standard fantasy protagonists. Curse of Chalion's Caz being a guy in his mid-thirties who ends up as a tutor, and Ista from Paladin of Souls is an older widow who is tired of being treated as such, and in an attempt to get away, sets out on a supposed "pilgrimage" (because it's the most socially acceptable excuse she can find to get away from the boredom). But anyway. Having any sort of multiple-god setup separates it from Islam, but you don't need a full pantheon. And having a priest or saint or prophet that some cultures sort of deify for some heroic feat in the past but other cultures don't consider a deity might be a good way to make some small variations that don't feel like the usual "this group worships this deity. This group worships this deity" setup. This is also a good thing to consider. I figure the term angel has you fighting the Christmas-angel image or the more varied and terrifying Biblical descriptions for various angel-subtypes. Maybe some sort of magical creature that acts as a divine messenger? Whether that's an existing animal that people consider sacred or something made up entirely. This definitely makes a lot of sense. Though even within abrahamic religions, the frameworks vary quite a bit. You can be sure you'll get more comments as we go along Gotcha. Yeah, I think that's fine as long as we are aware of what he does and doesn't understand. I think getting a sense of "I know it's important because my brother thought it was important enough to die for" and that that's driving his search for information would be a fix for what I thought was missing.

Questions: 1. I really like the concept for the psychic/empathy magic, and the world setup is really interesting, and my world-building brain is already running off on tangent thoughts about how race and gender presenting themselves this way would impact the world development and culture. Definitely interested in seeing where things are going. 2. There are a couple of spots that came off as a little info dumpy, where there was a lot to absorb at once (mentioned below). Other than that, I think telling us he’s looking for the RA when he is out in the market near the start of that scene will make it feel a little more directional. As it is, he’s mentioned going out to get information, but without knowing what that is, his walking around feels a little meandering. 3. I think the biggest thought I had in this regard was the possibility of making it into two chapters. One related to gathering information, one with the meeting with his brother. 4. Long answer incoming. Because you’ve stumbled into the path of one of my soapboxes. Apologies in advance for the rambling. I’ve actually been meaning to put my thoughts on fantasy-religion-building together for an essay or blog post or something for a while and haven’t gotten around to it, so they're still all a little jumbled, and this walks right into the middle of it. Anyway. Ultimately, I like the setting and worldbuilding a lot, but would be careful about what parallels you’re drawing to *Islamic* Arabia vs. a desert culture like we’d see in Arabia whether or not Islam was involved. Especially with the characters and themes we’ll probably be dealing with. Sticking closer to the former, you’ll probably find yourself running into a lot of pitfalls regarding how you’re presenting the religion and its interaction with the culture. If you don’t have a good handle on the theology of Islam or other monotheistic religions, I’d tread lightly in how you’re representing one in a story that will push back against anyone holding those beliefs. There’s certainly a place to challenge said beliefs, and I think having an intersex protagonist is a good way to do that in the way I think you might be trying to. However, I think an intersex protagonist in a setting where there’s a pretty strictly two-gendered culture achieves the same goal without needing to do too much in-depth theological study to make sure you’re not running the risk of misrepresenting a set of religious beliefs [I have a comment about page 2 related to this]. You just want to make sure that the practice of the in-world religion would imply the gender norms/views you’re setting up. Representing real-world religions in fantasy settings can be really tricky because it’s hard to make it clear what aspects are being presented as comparable and what aspects are presented as part of the fantasy world. Describing “Islamic Arabia with normalization of alcohol and a lack of gender segregation” very quickly ceases to be Islamic Arabia. Which is probably a safer bet anyway unless you’re really familiar with Islam or have someone who knows their theology who you can bounce ideas off of (if it was Protestantism/Catholicism, I’d volunteer. I’ve done enough study to poke a stick at tricky spots there. But I don’t know enough about Islam or Islamic cultures to be helpful as any sort of sensitivity reader or research source on that front). I’d probably recommend taking a few clear steps further away from historical Arabia on the religion front to avoid some of those pitfalls. Pg 1: The first sentence is really long, and could probably be made stronger. Having the first look at the character and the book be him stumbling is probably not ideal. Also, I’m not sure how to pronounce S’s name, which throws me off a bit. I think it’s partly some weird instinct to go with “Sammy” which doesn’t seem to fit the setting. “freak out” does not seem to fit a setting with wandering merchants and veils for sand protection. This being the first look at the world, the “when he addressed them as humans” isn’t entirely clear. I assume it means that the guards tend to be dehumanized by the people they protect, and aren’t sure how to respond when people break that pattern. But when everything is fair game this early in a fantasy, I wasn’t sure if it might mean that the guard (and most guards) are some sort of non-human species. The inheritance traits section is a lot to absorb up front. We’re getting introductory information about two different races while also learning that royalty has certain markings while also learning about an unusual setup of the inheritance of physical traits. These are all interesting details, but I think they need to be spaced out a little more to sink in. If we get information about what the average Sh- person looks like and what the average Xa- person looks like and have time to process that, adding in the details of how they mix is going to be much easier to work into the framework. Pg 2: I like the descriptions of the empathetic connections. I remember finding that really fascinating when you submitted something related to this world before. Would like a clarification of who D is here, though. Obviously S is in disguise, and the way she addresses him and the “confidence of a monarch” suggests that she’s also a royal in disguise, but the “usual” servants’ garb makes it unclear. Her nickname runs into the same issue S’s does, in that it separates me from the setting a bit. I’m sure I will have comments on the world’s theology as it gets fleshed out. I apologize in advance In the meantime (with the caveat that none of the following is meant to be argumentative or dismissive. I don’t think it should come across that way, but text tone is always hard…), I did want to point out a small concern with the “If the creator made us…” line. It’s hard for me to not see it as a throw away one-liner trying to call out inconsistencies with Abrahamic religions. Which makes me wonder how close a parallel the religion is supposed to be to Islam. If it’s supposed to be a strict parallel (I’d recommend not going this route), you’re going to run into far bigger issues related to how the religion is expressed in the culture. And if it’s not a strict parallel, I’m not sure what the takeaway should be. I don’t know as much about Islam as I do about Protestantism/Catholicism, and I’ve seen similar arguments in that realm, but they never quite hold water for what Christianity actually says. I see the point that’s trying to be made, and the argument has weight behind it if presented properly, but the wording here is setting up a straw man argument of a different theological point altogether (one that isn’t really relevant) that interferes with it being a credible point about creators making mistakes. It comes close to where the real complication/supposed inconsistency lies, but ignores a pretty big detail of Christian theology to make its statement. It doesn’t entirely misrepresent Christian theology (maybe…I’d have to think about that), but it definitely oversimplifies it and misses where the real “gotcha!” point would be. And if this is supposed to be a fantasy setting that doesn’t align with a real-world religion anyway, I’m not sure what it’s trying to do. If you’re planning to go in-depth in developing the world’s religion, and D will be giving a thorough explanation of both that religion’s theology and this potential conflict with it, that’s one thing, but if it’s meant to be a one-line comment on a real-world religion, you might be getting yourself in trouble here, because it’s cherry-picking aspects of a religion without acknowledging that no single component of a religion exists in a vacuum. TLDR: The line feels a little too on the nose, and it makes me antsy when Christianity (or other things, but it’s the one I know things about) is misrepresented or simplified beyond recognition to prove a point. Especially when I agree that there’s a point there to be made and it’s not being shown in the best light. Ultimately, I’d probably recommend leaning a little away from the direct Abrahamic religion parallels unless you’re able to make it clear what is comparable and what is different and how the setup of your world affects and is affected by that. Pg 3: “trying to get rid of me.” *snort* Though I am also sympathetic with her inability to find reliable sources. Hate when that happens. “catch you later” there are a number of things like this, where the dialogue feels far more modern and casual than the setting implies. Pg 4: Ah. She is a servant. Oops. I’d probably try to make her seem a little more deferential to S, even if they’re friends. That doesn’t have to mean groveling at his feet or being overawed, but a note of some of the more automatic behaviors that she’s likely to have developed while working around royalty. Do we know who J- is yet? Ah. Next line. “Maybe he should go easier on them.” I like that he realizes that he’s put Y- in a difficult position, but am a little disappointed that he would do so intentionally. The reasons following are alright, but still feel a little off if he seems to take servants/guards more seriously than his peers would. A personal guard might help. Someone whose primary job is to keep S safe, and therefore has a clearer line of authority. Especially if these trips are something S does regularly. If he worries about the guards getting in trouble for it, it seems like something he might have tried to find a solution to. The wording in the sentence before the section break is a little confusing, but I really like the hook into the next section. Pg 5: I know there’s a bit of a trope of people giving away disguises by using titles, but if S is really concerned about being caught and he does this regularly, I’d expect him to be more careful of which guard he’s bringing. Pg 6: Runaway sister seems to come out of the blue. Might help to have him reference that he’s going to see her before now to give their wandering a little more focus. Pg 7: “gave them an excuse to wear full veils…” “Them” being the guard and S (I didn’t think the guard had a crystal thing)? S and his father on other trips? The last paragraph on this page mentions Ki- invaders, Sha-, Xa- empire in addition to giving more information about Hu, and making passing reference to the HR, who we don’t know much about yet. That’s a lot to follow in one paragraph (a situation that I am fully sympathetic to, having run into it…oh, once or twice [once or twice today, that is…] in my chapters) Pg 8: I like the detail of him paying more attention to their emotions than to their words. “rattlesnakes” – vipers? Tarantulas? Some similar unwelcome creature? I think rattlesnakes are mostly a North American thing. Depending on what you’re trying to do with cultural associations. Pg 10: I think some of this conversation would stick better if we knew what S is expecting the angel to signify. I feel like angels don’t have clear enough tropes attached to them for me to know if this is supposed to be a terrifying thing or an exciting thing, and S’s reactions aren’t giving me any clues. This also seems like something that would be worth bringing in above. That this is what he’s intentionally searching for. So that the wandering feels more direct and intentional, even if it’s a little meandering because he’s looking for specific information. Pg 11: The explanation here feels a little info dumpy. I’d try to figure out what we need here and now, and what can be filled in later when we have a better sense of the framework of things. Pg 14: I almost think this should be two chapters. One with him sneaking out and getting back, ending with him being “caught” by his brother, then the rest of this conversation. The destruction of the crystal collection comes out of the blue, and while it seems like it should be a big deal, I don’t know enough about it significance for it to hit very hard. I don’t really know anything about Z at this point, so S connecting the dots and accusing her here is less engaging than if I’d had reason to sort of connect the dots along with him. I think if there was more given about her being tied to revolutionaries (or something similar) and seems to be on the HR’s bad side, that would be helpful. Pg 16: Do we know anything about the FC? My Islam-parallel paranoia is filling him in as a great prophet of some sort, but I don’t know what that means in this world (and ties things close enough to a real-world religion to put me on-edge to expect pitfalls) We get some information here, but he is mentioned a few times through the chapter without any explanation. Does J not know where Z is? If she’s within the city, doesn’t he have the ability to track her down? The questions here at the end would be more engaging if I’d had a better sense of the significance of them, but I think there was a little too much going on to process why S would be asking those specific questions. Closing line could use a little more detail. Though I think part of that comes from the above point of not having a good sense of the significance of the questions. Because of that, I’m not having a lot of luck guessing what he’s feeling here, or what expression he would be trying to hide. Overall: Despite my cautiousness about the way the religion is presented (which, really, probably doesn’t bother 95% of people. So there’s that), I really like the worldbuilding and setting, and am excited to learn more about them. I mentioned a couple of things I think could be shifted around a bit to come across more clearly, but the ideas themselves make me want to read on to figure out where the story is going from here. Full apologies for the rabbit trails. Depending on what your goals are on that front, you’re welcome to either ignore them or send a message to pick my brain on it further. Thanks for submitting! I enjoyed reading

Good to know that these things need some clarification. This is definitely a chapter that I could have benefitted from letting it sit for a few days to distance myself from it before submitting. If I'd known it would take me so long to get to finishing the interlude, I probably would have done that. I think this part also needs some of the reaction/processing that @shatteredsmooth thought was missing from the end section. Finding a balance of Is- encountering her weaknesses/vulnerabilities and intentionally blocking out any acknowledgment of them is going to be a challenge, but I think it needs more of that to tie it together as more than just being in pain. It's actually more relevant that this isn't something people are generally expected to do themselves. I thought I'd mentioned that, but it might have gotten trimmed back to a point of being unrecognizable as such. Ultimately, Gil- requires magistrates to be involved with rituals most of the time, since the percentage of the population that knows the fire spell is pretty low. Usually, if someone kills someone, they're probably going to get dragged before the magistrates if they get caught anyway. Or if it was accidental or self-defense, there would be an associated "trial" that them performing a ritual would fall under. If this had all happened in the capital, she would have been walked through the process with the magistrate doing the actual spell-casting and deity-calling. But even there, they'd probably assume that it would be a simple self-defense death that wouldn't generally expect any immediate punishment/dramatic divine response. This should ultimately be the key thing that carries through, so I'm glad that's coming out to some extent, even if it could use some clarification. Also, for brief summary, at least in Gil-, the Judge and the Goddess (In Gil, she's considered too sacred to give lesser names to, or even to mention all that often) are male and female respectively and have a creation/destruction dichotomy thing going on. Gil- generally considers the gods very sacred, to the point that they don't make art of them, don't even "worship" them for fear of offending them (ironically, this is probably why the religion has felt absent. Because it's not something people are supposed to discuss without the proper respect), and where swearing by them is serious business. Most kingdoms/cultures acknowledge two main deities, with some sort of similar associated dichotomy, but some have some other ideas they mix in (the magics specialized in some areas lend themselves better to powerful mages being viewed as deities), and some would merge them into one overarching deity. Which one actually gets it right? Now isn't that the real question? None of that is really important here, though when I redo the early Ala- chapters, I'll be referencing some of the distinctions between the Ket- and Gil- views of the gods, and how it impacts the respective cultures. And in a few chapters, we'll get some of the contrast between overarching Gil- and Mish- views. But I digress from my beloved worldbuilding details. Sort of. Ultimately, it's sort of a mixture of both of those things. In that (in Gil- understanding) the J is the one who decides what justice is (and practice seems to prove that), but his definition of what that means isn't always going to match the mortal definition of what justice means. Based on who has gone up in flames after confessing certain actions, they have a vague sense of the things that are always punished, but there's a lot of murky ground where a biased person might think they were entirely in the right, but it turns out that's not the case. Even here, Is- assumes that it will just be a rote (if uncomfortable) thing. But she hasn't yet realized that the thing that she confesses (the killing) wasn't the only thing she did wrong. I think some of that will come across better if there's more information in the Ala- chapters about how the rituals work (and maybe find some poor soul to murder someone for no reason except that the readers need to see the gods punish him). However, I do need to make it a little clearer what she does and doesn't know. So in many ways, the outcome of a ritual may seem unreasonable to human minds, but they assume that the gods know things they don't if it goes differently (or they live in anger at the gods, which is fair, but considered a sort of fruitless endeavor). Did you ever see the version of chapter 1 that opened with a theology lesson? There was a reason for that. I just never found a way to squeeze it back in. But maybe I'll be able to do that with some of the early Ala- chapters (man, those are going to have a lot of weight to pull....). Yeah. I definitely need to find a way to convey that she's blocking her mind off from everything but the pain because the weakness/fear/emotional anguish are things she is terrified to even acknowledge, let alone feel, and physical pain is something that she has more of a concept of how to work through. I think I mentioned that in passing somewhere in the middle or near the end, but maybe having that near the front would set the tone better, and make the moments when the walls are cracking a little clearer. This is fair. There's a lot going on here, and I could have definitely used a few days away from it between editing passes to make sure things were coming across like they were supposed to. But I didn't do that, so here we are. A lot of the notes here will be really helpful in getting a lot of that nailed down next time through. As always, thanks so much for all of the thoughts, everyone!