shatteredsmooth

Even if the convo with the dad doesn't happen write away, if you opened with her being humiliated at the ball we don't see, she could be deciding if it is worth to stay visiting her dad and battle this out, or to just go home and forget about her dad's world. And when he offers to have her stay, that kind of ups the stakes of the decision. Me too! Several people seem to agree on starting it later, and I'm over here, start it earlier and make the conflict/arc OK, I'm not the only one. :-) When I got to this section, I started paying less attention to sentence level things. I marked some missing words or missing periods, but since I'm reading straight through to catch up, its on my kindle, and too much work to stop and mark errors. Everyone else seems to have caught them anyways. And I'm pretty good at ignoring grammatical stuff, especially in the summer when I'm not actively trying to teach students to at least attempt to edit before turning in a final draft. Plus, if you saw the state of some of the pieces I sent, then you know I'm one to throw stones about grammar.

I agree with this -- I was a little bored with the dresses, but if you followed this suggestion and opened with the humiliation, then went to the dress shopping, it would be more engaging. I found that I would get a piece of information a page or two after I needed it, and then it would come in an a way that felt a little too much like an info dump. For a while, I was wondering why she was even in the city so much it was making it hard to focus, and later, I did get my answer, but I really needed it sooner. Other times, I felt information was repeated. I'll have more details when I finish reading. Me too! This concept and arc has a lot of potential, but the way it is executed is the problem, but there is a lot of potential you can hone. This is one of the bigger problems I had with the story too. And It really bugged me when the MC talked about her father's society as civilization. It made it seem like she was devaluing her own culture instead of thinking of it as a different civilization. A lot of people commented on the grammar. I made some notes as I read -- I'll email them later, but it looks like others have pointed them out. Anyway, when I get caught up to the latest submission, I'll give you more detailed overall feedback. I just wanted to see what others had said and chime in.

I'm not sure I agree with this -- I mean, it seems like it is only a very small part of the population. It might make people more protective of their pets and afraid of casters. I'm not letting those sneaky, grave-robbing magicians near my puppy... I almost said something about the pet cemetery about that being more of a modern, or at least 20th and 21st century thing, but there a state park near me that used to be a rich person's estate in the 1800's, and there is a pet cemetery on it.

Overall, I liked this chapter. I don’t have many complaints about structure, character or logic. I was engaged through out. I got a little caught up in some of the decription, but it was pretty and made me wish I could really go explore these grounds, so for me, it was a good kind of lull in the action even if did kind of make me forget the stakes a little. I have mixed feelings about the familiarity but not knowing the place is familiar. In some ways, it is too vague and a told more than it is shown, but on the other hand, I’m not sure it can be shown any more than it is. Having a sliver of more concrete memory might help, but the lack of not knowing does make me want to read on to find out more as much as it irks me. And I’m not sure if this comment makes any sense. But overall, this chapter works for me Here were my thoughts as I read, which are more sentence level things since I didn't have many major concerns. "Many talked loudly in groups" I know you can say this in a better way. "I examined the recessed casement..." Instead of saying I examined, can you show him examining. Like, "those iron drainpipes are so smooth they would be hard to climb up if they are wet" but obviously something more accurate and appropriate for the character. "On the platform, he wearing a..." Something missing "Different colours predominated" Can you be a little more specific about which colors? Is this a whole rainbow of plants? "I walking on loam." Missing word? Wrong tense? "Suffered the full brunt of the storm" Show this. I want to see the carnage of trees. Maybe there is a metaphor in there. "I would of one of the bones...' Something is off here "Because..." You could probably just delete the because and two of the periods.

No, you didn't miss anything. I wrote a transition chapter between Earth and the moon but cut it thinking it was unnecessary and slowed things down and got me in trouble with world building around Earth that wouldn't be relevant later. I'll add a line or two at the end of the ch. before the moon to let the readers know that is where they are going then later, when I sent this to beta readers, I'll have to see how the transition between those two chapters works. Thanks for the feedback again! :-)

LOL Well, if I'm being a pain and complaining about individual words, it means I couldn't find something worse to critique.

A few months ago, a friend bought me a craft book specifically about writing emotion. I haven't gotten myself to open it yet (I see the value of craft books but I hate reading them), but I really need to. However, with the last two or three books I read, I have been making notes about emotion. So hopefully I successfully apply that as I revise... Thank you!!! And I hope you're having a smooth recovery.

To some extent this is about blocking and aiding the reader picturing events, but I'll accept it's a bit much here. I have trimmed it. Blocking is something I tend to skim over when I read, even in books that are already published, especially when the writer slows down to make sure the reader knows exactly who is where. This is probably why I'm so bad at it or just leave it out of my writing. Keep that in mind when reading my comments on blocking.

So without having read ch. 1 or 2, and without a summary of what happened in those chapters, my ability to comment on content is limited I loved the description in this chapter, was fascinated by the character, and what I saw of the world. The arc of what happened so far was well set up, though maybe you could do without the walk back to the town. As I read: "The darkness breathed,"Nice opening phrase "Something he" Who us he? "thick enough to drift through" I’m loving the voice and description in this piece "The drengir was smelling her." I am thinking this is kind of dragon like and I would have a better idea of it significance if I had read earlier chapters "Who, if anyone...semblance of a normal walk." This group of paragraphs was there twice "...being civil with her" So I am guessing everyone is going to say the village was attacked by the d? I felt a little lost through the whole thing because I was reading it out of context, but I still got that W was different from the other people, had me the D and showed it compassion where others were blaming it for attacking a village, and I can easily see what kind of conflict and plot arc would come through.

Overall thoughts: This wasn't my favorite of your pieces in this story. There was a lot of description of markets and where people were sitting or walking that really didn't seem to add much to the story unless I am being really thick and missing something. There were a few nice lines that really jumped out at me as addition to the character's personality, and the plot did move forward a little. However, I suspect (though I won't really know until I read more) that this section could really be condensed. I made a lot of comments in the word doc, so I'll email you LBL's. Here are some highlights P. 33 "The big man who I knew so little breakfasted for some minutes." How significant is this page and a half description of the market? Which details really matter? "doubled while I was in jail" Is this confirming the numbers he just ran or on top of those? It made sense until I got here. .” ... was neutral" This is one of those lines that is too telly but there isn’t really a great way to show it either. P. 34"pleasure bathing her skin in warmth" Nice description The dialogue following this lost me -- more explanation in the LBLs "...have to face me" Ok – overwhelming detail about who is sitting where. I don’t really care where they are sitting as long as I know the whole crew is in there. P. 38 "...big imagination"Nice! P. 40"... I let Krister go in front of me as the others jumped down" I get bored with all the detail of what order people are sitting and walking in. These are some of the bigger comments, but there are more little details in the LBL's. There is some cute flirting and a little set up, but I got a little lost in detail and a big cast and am unsure how much of this is needed and how much can be cut -- its not my story, so that's not my decision anyway. I still like your characters and arch, and did like the detail about him counting how much moneyed was owed. Preventing them from losing the house/boat seems like a more concrete goal than getting it back after it was seized. He just has to get and give the money, not beg or convince, and shifts more of the focus to the job.

Thanks! I am going to keep working at it -- I'm slowly plugging away at revisions. I have a super rough full draft, so I'm not giving up on it anytime soon. I read a bunch of books this week and am taking a break from Oomph to draft a short story. After that I'll revise the chapters I've already sent and try to carry that feedback through the next section, which I'll probably send next week. :-)

@Robinski and @Zay Wolfe Thank you for your comments! They're very helpful. This is my first attempt at writing a novel that leans this far towards science fiction, and definitely the first project that involves outer space. I always have trouble conveying feelings/emotions in writing (and in real life), but I think it is worse in this novel because I am also balancing it with a different kind of world building than I am used to. Obviously, this project still needs a lot of work, but you are all helping me shape it up.

Good catch! In one version, yes, but that seems to have disappeared in the many times I've rewritten the first chapter. No -- about the people chasing Ronny Thank you @Mandamon !! You caught a lot of big I was too close to the story to notice. Exactly what I was looking for.

Content Warning: Language and Violence Hi All, Here is my next submission. It picks up where the last time left off. This replaces a lot of the content that was in my second submission. After reading the feedback, I just opened a new word doc and completely rewrote the section. Any feedback at this point will be helpful. There are probably missing words, because I never seem to notice when I leave out things like "a" or "the," but at this point I am really more concerned with plot and whether or not things make sense. My characters aren't all that likeable, and maybe they're not the easiest to connect with, but is there enough there to make you want to keep reading their story? Thanks! Sara Last week: Di picks up an illegal object for xir mom. Di's oopmh suppressant is missing (Oomph is an energy field certain beings can tap into) and being caught without it is a death sentence. After getting into a scrape with law-enforcement, Di and friends flee Earth.

Thanks @industrialistDragon and @Robinski! I got that this was for full ms reads. Alpha reader was just a new term. I guess the people I think of as critique partners are alpha readers then because even if I am sending something out chapter by chapter, it is from a complete manuscript. I don't use cp's as I'm writing because the more I let people read a work before I write through to the end, the less likely I am to finish said work. Anyway, that just helps me so I know what to ask for if I do post here looking for someone to read the whole thing.

Question: What is the difference between beta readers and alpha readers? I've heard of / used beta readers, but outside this forum, I think I heard the term Alpha reader once. If m Camp NaNoWriMo revision plans happen, I may be seeking people to read the full Oomph manuscript in August, and if I post the request, I want to make sure I'm using the right word. I'd basically be looking for feedback on things like plot, character and world building. I've called that looking beta readers, but if that's not what it means in the context of this thread let me know please.

I made some changes and I think I am going to file the rest of the comments and any future ones aside for after I rip the rest of the book apart. It is so easy to get hung up on my first twenty pages or so and I know there are major gaps later on. Thanks!

This part is giving me headaches but I do need to find a way to make it clear. It's kind of like the government is on a fine line between police state and not, and freaks out about Oomph whenever it pops up. BUT the reason Z says his mother got arrested isn't the whole story -- there is stuff Z doesn't know his Mom that comes up later. Would having the characters react a little more shocked at her arrest help? It's like she was on a watch list, but Z and friends don't know this. Anyway, thank you for the comments! They are very helpful.

The voice and character come to life more for me in this section. So does the MC’s personality. He seems more aware of his flaws, which I liked. P still bothers me. She is so subservient and loyal and cowed but I don’t know why. I also have no sense of why. The narrator being baffled doesn’t help. Most of my "As I read" comments were about here. As far as the plot goes, it is progressing. The MC is taking some action, but also relying a little too much on these seekers. I’m hoping to see him take more direct action himself soon. There are also hopefully some hints he is or might be learning something. Little hints or seeds, but they can grow. As I read: “On a near by an attractive...” something was off with this sentence “She must have taken it as a reprimand…” She is too cowed and apologetic. And would someone really cry at something like this? P is too much of a cliché right now, and not a good one. She makes women look all week and weepy. “twice the coin” why make a world where women are mistreated like it’s still the 1950’s? There are tons of those and this is fantasy. You can invent one where they are more equal. Plus, P and her comment about wages are inconsistent with the guild person who is so calm and competent it is almost scary, and I doubt she makes half the wage of the men… P doesn’t have to be like her, but she can be a little less desperate to please in such a cliché way, and if women like guild person exist, why hint that the rest of them are treated like second-class citizens? “Beyond seeking a good wage…” So having romantic feelings = being scared of someone and desperate to please them? “What had he done…care about him?” Good question. Maybe as you move forward, you can build P more and then after, go back and apply that to the earlier chapters?

I'd like to submit again this Monday if there is room.

When I was a teenager, and my dad taught me to drive his boat, I would be a little of course one way, but I would turn the wheel to hard and end up off course the other way. I'd zig-zag my way across the bay until I got a feel for the currents. Revision is a similar experience. Hopefully, having streamlined the course of action in these chapters, I will be able to go back and add meat to bones without slowing it down too much. Thank you for the comments, and the LBLs!

Take my comments with a grain of salt since I'm not familiar with the novel and universe this is story was associated with: The magic system in this story is truly fascinating! I love the symphonies and their manifestations in the physical world. The character and their reactions were consistent and well developed, but this piece doesn’t really seem to be working as a stand-alone that could be read separate from your novels. I read the very end of one of them, if I am not mistaken, but otherwise, I haven’t read them, and with this story, I felt like there was something missing that you were already assuming I knew or had, and it wasn’t necessarily about the magic system, more like the culture of the world and the history of the characters. As far as plot and pacing go, I had a hard time with the opening since it was mostly dialogue – characters telling other characters about things that are happening and what needs to be done. The story could probably work without it. The next scene seems internal thought paired world building and description that don’t end up being all the relevant to what actually happens. The point I became engaged at was when they noticed the transforming plant. From there on, I was fascinated as the character investigated, struggled, and survived. The one place I was thrown out of the story was the parents reaction to him showing up. If this had been going on for ten days, and one parent had left and come back, why not seek help? And when a random stranger walks in, why assume they can help? The way the MC survived was a bit of a let down. They held out until the infant basically destroyed itself and had almost given up. They didn’t over come anything. The infant just happened to give up or die or lose interest before it was too late. So survival wasn’t really because of something the mc learned or did. Then at the end, it was the council of people who talk a lot, and the mc was invited to and accepted the invitation to join some research project. But the character didn’t change, and the story didn’t feel complete or resolved – more like it was leading up to another section, or to a novel. I think If I had read the novels, and was going back to this as a prequel, the end would probably work a lot better. But as it is, the end falls flat for me since I’m not super invested in the world.

This didn't occur to me. Once I heard about them losing the house, I assumed they were too busy trying to survive to visit. Before that, I wasn't sure they even knew where he was and why he was missing. I got too caught up in the voice to realize, but after thinking about it, I do agree with Fox. He makes a choice to work with them, but also made it sound like it was his only option. He showed a little more agency at the end telling them to do the heist before the big party, but otherwise, yes, things have been comming to him and taking him along. He hasn't acted with much independent agency.

Dead Horse Notes, for this submission and the previous one. This is much better than the first versions I read, especially the part in the prison. The narrator’s actions make much more sense, there is more tension, and the stakes are clearer. I’m glad you left out the early romantic stuff, since without that distracting me, the rest of the set up worked so much better. I’m guessing it could return later, but now you have a much better set up for it. Very subtle hints at attraction early, and then having kiss with C in the barn to try and fool the blue coats, sets up for some possible tension as the job gets going. And now that I know the characters better, it will be less distracting. G’s betrayal was more or less well handled. I was a little surprised by it, but it made sense, especially with him being all nervous. I was a tiny bit confused at the end of the last scene – so they are doing the same heist, only with the government in on it? And maybe stealing something more specific than just gold and jewels? If this becomes clearer in the next section, you might not need to elaborate further. Notes as I read: p. 4 “he’d trusted me” I thought while the very first version had too much description, this opening was very internal. “I could make this right. I had to.” This line really made the motivation and the stakes clear. It made things matter to me. “squabbling noisily over scraps” you can cut nosily. Gulls squabbling is enough for the reader to know it’s noisy. p.5 “Every car player” did you mean card player? p.6 “; a pile of lobster creels and crab pots against the stone building.” So I know this is secondary world, but I got pulled out here thinking about how lobsters were only eaten as a last resort, and harvested by hand but not trapped, until the mid to late 1800’s in New England. And since this world has an feel of something pre-1800’s, I think of the traps, or creels, not belonging there. But most people probably wouldn’t think this, and lobstering may have other history in other parts of the world, and this isn’t set in north east America anyway. So it’s probably irrelevant. “I pulled the gate too, snatched” Something is off. Pulled the gate too ___ / if you are using too as meaning also, it isn’t working because it is in the first sentence of the paragraph. “young ladies of Qauwney, and Lautless, apparently.” Do you really need the apparently on the end there? There were a couple other places where you had an adv on the end of a sentence and it bugged me. It’s not incorrect, just kind of interrupts the flow of the narrative in my head. Page 12 – the who dialogue around this page was much more believable and easy to follow. Same for page 15. Page 16 “Money could make this right, somehow.” You have a great end to the chapter with suspense and clear stakes Page 20 went inside.” Extra quote Page 21 “This treacherous thought of treachery” It makes me giggle, but it also pulls me out of the story.

Yay!! I'm glad to hear that! Thank you. I need to clarify -- they don't have these sensors everywhere. That would be too expensive, but the SE agents carry then on their person. It's not a total surveillance state. They don't always bother enforcing laws until something they really care about like something related to Oomph, or an insurgency, pops up. And in an area where they don't usually bother to keep a presence, one where surveillance equipment is destroyed quicker than its replaced, tracking a person, especially who isn't an Oomph user, is harder. Al and Zeek could've probably evaded SE for a while but once Di gets involved, they are in much deeper. Good point -- I'll reword so it's not an "if". Di knowing SE got it raises the stakes. :-) Thank you!!