Kingsdaughter613

They don’t currently know, but hemalurgy is basically unknown right now too. Once North and South get to no each other better they will find out. At which point the religion goes through a theological crisis, and it gets folded in. I’d assume it’s common knowledge by the space age.

It depends on your opinion of the soul. I could easily see some people believing that the Spike allows part of their soul to live on post-Mortem. One interesting element to this is that the Survivorist church will not come out directly against hemalurgy, due to the Survivor having a Spike through his eye! That’s actually rather important, since views of the soul tend to be influenced by major religious bodies.

There’s also option three: Lirin had a very understandable trauma response. I actually had less issue with that than some of his later statements in the infirmary, until I realized he thought Kaladin was already dead from his internal wounds at that point and that was his way of coping with it. I don’t think Lirin could be a Nale Skybreaker. I think he could be an original type Skybreaker, which could include someone who followed the Pirates’ Code. I think he would reach his third Oath pretty quickly, and his Spren would help him find a more reasonable Crusade. His current one isn’t particularly workable. I also love the idea of father and son in rival Orders.

Considering ‘Horneater’, I’m pretty sure Rock is okay.

Because we trust Kalak? The guy whose organization was trying to return the Desolations? Who ordered Kaladin’s squad killed? Who is a Herald, someone we’ve been repeatedly told NOT to trust?

Rushu reminds me more of NVLD or NLD, which shares some elements with executive processing disorder. I doubt this is the case though, as NVLDs aren’t very well known.

You’re welcome!

I think he would make an excellent Skybreaker.

‘I’m terrified’ may have been accepted by someone who was not Pattern.

115

Kelsier’s been back for 300 years. He used Hemalurgy to do it, somehow.

“I accept that there are times I should not protect.” The ‘I deserve protection’ one is part of the third ideal; it was essentially the one Teft swore.

At what point in the writing process did Thaidakar definitively become Kelsier? Who was he originally? What was the plan if Alloy had not become its own Era? Were the Ghostbloods always intended to be Kelsier’s new crew? If yes, when/why did you decide to use them here? Just to note: Thaidakar was not Kelsier yet in WoK (as Kelsier couldn’t be used until his survival was revealed in Mistborn). But I think the GBs may have been the new crew all along, which makes me wonder what the original plan was.

I’ve felt Thaidakar could be Kell based on the GBs feeling like the Crew to me, so... But let’s deal with the actual issue. What Mraize said is NOT the GBs real goal. This is Kelsier. Shallan isn’t a crew member; she’s a preliminary member of a single branch. Anything she’s told, while not a lie, is not what the GBs are truly after. Investiture, to paraphrase another great trickster, is just a way of keeping score. The GBs may want it, but they don’t CARE about it. It’s just a bonus. Similarly, Kalak. That’s much closer to a real truth; getting Kell offworld is definitely a GB goal. But it still isn’t their real one. It’s a general, long term goal that happens to coincide with what they actually want. But what they want? That’s a secret that, going by Kell’s previous plans, will only be evident in hindsight. We’re seeing the balls tossed in the air, but we can’t see the pattern. And now that the jugglers been confirmed, we know there is one. So what do we actually know? The GBs have a real beef with the SoH. That’s the ONE constant throughout. They wanted Gavilar dead. They wanted Amaram dead. They’ve done everything they could to endure the SoH were wiped out. Whatever they’re up to, the answer is in the ONLY consistent goal we’ve seen. We have one other real hint: “Iyatil has reported to Master Thaidakar,” Mraize said, “and he has accepted—after some initial anger—that we will not be able to control the Oathgates. I explained that there at least is a calming wind in this, like the riddens of a storm. With Dalinar controlling the Oathgates, he can prosecute the war against Odium.” “And that helps your cause?” “We have no interest in seeing the enemy rule this world, Shallan.” Reading between the lines, it seems the GBs may have intended Dalinar to have the Oathgates; they just wanted to be in control of their use. They may not be willing to acknowledge it, but they aren’t neutral third parties. They do not want Odium winning, which means they back the coalition. The GBs are antagonists, yes, but they’re antagonists on the PROTAGONISTS‘ side. Quietly, of course. But what they’re really up to? Shallan doesn’t know. Mraize and Iyatil don't know. No one does, except Kelsier himself. Plots behind plots, plans within plans. There is ALWAYS another secret.

I think Seon’s go in Aluminum boxes and Spren go in gemstones and then boxes. But Aluminum almost certainly plays a role. I think you and I have different opinions on the problem. I think the problem is Kell’s original Connection to Preservation, which is similar to the Heralds. You seem to think the problem is Kelsier being a Sliver, which I view as being solved in the way as the Spren problem.

Thank you!

How do I ask questions for these?

I actually think that was Valor. It fits much better, especially with the themes of sacrifice. Whimsy would be more stereotypical fantasy on the surface, but with a lot of unpredictability and diversity, especially in the environment. But I actually think Whimsy is the Shard that doesn’t want to Invest in a world. I think it’s to flighty to settle.

Kell couldn’t leave the system before he Ascended. And he can’t leave now. But there are different reasons for the restrictions. Originally he WAS in the same position as the Heralds are currently. He was being directly and continuously infused with Preservation’s Investiture, just as the Heralds are infused with Honor’s. The exact mechanism was different, but the underlying concept was the same. Post-Ascension, Kelsier no longer needs that Connection. He’s now a Sliver, fundamentally altered by the power he held. He IS a sliver of Preservation, similar to how Spren are splinters of Honor and Cultivation. This Investiture is intrinsic to him, which means he actually would be safe in a gem stone! But he’s still Connected to the greater whole that is in Harmony. And he still has his original problem, as the original Connection still exists despite it no longer being necessary. I see Spren and Heralds as having two different issues. Splinters (and Slivers) are drawn to the greater power that birthed them. I think of it a bit like a planet’s gravitational pull or a magnetic field. The power WANTS to be one again, so it draws the Splinters toward itself. If you can get a Splinter (or Sliver) far enough away they escape that pull and are free. Doing this is a trick the GBs (and some others) know. Heralds have the issue you described. They’re tethered to the power sustaining them and don’t know how to break it without dying. Kelsier has BOTH problems. He’s being pulled toward Harmony AND he’s tethered to the Shard. I suspect Kelsier’s concerned that trying to break the tether could lead to the Sliver somehow being drawn back to the greater whole. Or he’s unaware that there are two problems, not one. Or he may just not know how to break the tether at all.

The metal will slowly change over time.

I think he could only do it once he started becoming fully Invested in Roshar and one of his Unmade (BAM) began to become his Bondsmith Spren. So we can’t have an Adhesion Fused until BAM is free...

Thaidakar is Kelsier. So he obviously knows a lot about Scadrial, and he’s clearly spent the last 300 years learning as much about the Cosmere as he can.

I think Sacrifice makes more sense as a magic system than a Shard. God is everything, so the concept of sacrifice doesn’t really work? I don’t really know anything about the New Testament, sorry. Of course I know the Hebrew; I learned the Torah in Hebrew. With multiple commentaries. And then there’s the ever-growing, written down, Oral Tradition. I also learned some Navi and Kesuvim. To me what you’re saying Paul said doesn’t really add up. If Avraham expected God to return Yitzchak, then where is the test? The Akeida only makes sense as a test if he didn’t know - and did it anyway, despite it going against everything he believed, because HaShem commanded him to do so. The test wasn’t ‘will you sacrifice your son’, so much as ‘if I command you to do something that I have repeatedly told you is wrong, will you still have faith and believe and obey despite the seeming hypocrisy?” I think a lot of people get that test wrong. Bereishis is really hard to understand in general though. The Avos and Imahos experienced the world on a completely different level than we do.

That’s where I said the environment constantly shifts. And there are multiple species, because Whimsy thinks it’s interesting. It’s not a happy, perfect fantasy. It’s a true fairytale world, where all those sorts of stories exist in some form. And it can be as dark and horrifying as some of those tales are. (Let’s just forget that the Queen in Disney and Grimms Snow White is a cannibal, or that Disney has Frollo sing a song about committing rape, because obviously Disney is all fun and games, right?) But the thing about Whimsy is that it’s wonder. It’s creativity. It’s joy. The nature of the Shard does not lend itself to turning people inside out. It lends itself to ‘let’s give people wings, because who doesn’t want to fly?’ Whimsy is fanciful, not capricious. It’s thoughtless, not heartless. It may not be kind, but it’s certainly not cruel. Whimsy is the embodiment of innocent childhood wonder, and that’s what its world will reflect. To people from the rest of the Cosmere, Gaiety is a fun place to visit. There’s Investiture in everything, the world is unpredictable in fun and interesting ways, and Whimsy welcomes visitors. For the people living there, well... They have to worry about traps, about monsters, about haunted forests. They have to deal with capricious magic users. They have to worry about their rivals, and have to be careful about what they do because Whimsy does NOT like war. Politics on this planet gets NASTY, because they can’t war so they find other ways to destroy their enemies. Oh, and forget not knowing tomorrow’s weather - you don’t know tomorrow’s environment! Oh, look. It’s Winter in Summer. Well there go the crops... Ah, the snow has melted... and now I have a gemstone mine and a colony of confused dwarves from the fifth island. And half my neighborhood is somewhere else. Hey, at least those annoying elves are gone! And my kid can now talk to plants... Furthermore, Whimsy does not like technology, as it makes things too organized. Whimsy likes road trips, not airplanes. Whimsy does NOT like rules, and technology works on laws. So the planet is in enforced Medieval stasis. (The people have gotten really good at mechanical technology, as everything past a certain point doesn’t work.) Clocks never run correctly either, except for the days they do. EVERYTHING is always changing. For Cosmere visitors it’s a lot of fun to visit. The people living there are actually living there, and they don’t enjoy it nearly as much. A good number do see Whimsy as capricious, though it isn’t.

The Oathpact is their Connection to Honor, through which they are continually infused with Investiture. Honor may be dead, but the effects of his actions remain. The Knights Radiant can still use his surges, including Adhesion, for example. The power still exists, even Splintered and the Heralds are connected to that. The GBs seem to know how to transport Splinters, like Seons and Spren, across worlds. Thaidakar and the Heralds seem to be a separate problem.