Long Game 22: Corenne al'Daishar

[Mailliw73]

First off, if Sart is evil, that would clear Wilson and Meta not at all in my eyes.

Second, I don't actually suspect Hael much. Meta, like Seonid, I feel bad about this, but something feels off.

[Master Elodin]

Yeah, I think it's time for me to vote. Mostly to solidify the lynch, but also for the information, I vote Sarah.

[Straw]

To solidify this: Sarah.

Edited June 4, 2016 by ThatTinyStrawMan

[Seonid]

Okay, guys, now this is what we call a bandwagon.

 

A pair of votes just to solidify a lynch, towards the end of a cycle...in a game where the only vote manipulation ability is the Mayor, and the current mayor-elect is voting for the lynch target?

 

I am becoming increasingly uncomfortable about this. My vote stays for now, but I want to register my discontent. Something is off about this whole day.

 

Amaiya (Mailliw), care to elaborate. You see it too. Maybe if we put our guts together, we can figure it out. Kelend (Wilson), any thoughts?

[Master Elodin]

Yeah, I guess that makes sense. Just so that discussion can actually affect the lynch, I will remove my vote on Sart.

[AliasSheep]

Yeah, I guess that makes sense. Just so that discussion can actually affect the lynch, I will remove my vote on Sart.

You voted without posting your reasoning, and then removed it as soon as Seonid says you're bandwagoning.  That seems oddly suspicious to me.

 

And StrawMan, just outright bandwagonining.  And you still haven't defended yourself.

[STINK]

Eh, right now I'd say that some people may be bandwagoning 'cause most of the day has been discussion about the meta (ugh I know) (also it wasn't about the Meta but but just the meta ya know) so yeah then due to all the arguments (ahem, logical discussions) , they decided to like try and avoid getting in one by voting on someone but know it's kinda backfiring on them I guess. 

[Conquestor]

Something does seem off. People don't usually solidify votes so early, so, either everyone thinks she is really suspicious or eliminators are manipulating. This is day one, so, unless an eliminator roleclaimed on the forums, no one knows if anyone is anything. What we haved discussed so far is ok, but we keep going to the same stuff over and ove again.

 

What I don't get is what the eliminators are trying to do at this point, I mean if you look at the forum, it really is a messy discussion. Barely anyone has even given reasons fr why they voted or said something about someone. I think that the eliminators are either doing a great job or everyone one is falling onto their face. 

[jaimeleecee]

I am completely put off by this Sarah lynching bandwagon.. I guess I just don't get it. I don't see an issue with any of Sart's posts and no one has given any good arguments other than something being off or that Sarah was trying to divert the conversation in the beginning. I'm just not buying it.

[Seonid]

Honestly, I'm only voting because the information (including connections to other people based on who's attacked and who's defended Sarah) from Sarah's lynch seems like the best outcome for today. I'm more than happy to vote and argue for a better candidate, because I sure as heck don't think Sarah's a good one, but I don't have one at the moment.

 

If you have any suspicions for the thread, I'd love to hear them.

[jaimeleecee]

I'm still voting for Gladium/Straw. His jumping on the bandwagon and then jumping right off furthered my suspicions against him.. He continues to offers little to know reasonings for his actions and hasn't offered any arguments in his defense. He bandwagon voted for both mayor and lynchings and that to me is way more fishy than starting a conversation about day 1 lynchings.

[Bugsy]

I'm still voting for Gladium/Straw. His jumping on the bandwagon and then jumping right off furthered my suspicions against him.. He continues to offers little to know reasonings for his actions and hasn't offered any arguments in his defense. He bandwagon voted for both mayor and lynchings and that to me is way more fishy than starting a conversation about day 1 lynchings.

That tends to be, unfortunately, somewhat normal for him. Still, you make a good point and an outside perspective may be helpful. Let's see if we can generate some discussion on this. Sarah Straw

[Mailliw73]

A pair of votes just to solidify a lynch, towards the end of a cycle...in a game where the only vote manipulation ability is the Mayor, and the current mayor-elect is voting for the lynch target?

I am becoming increasingly uncomfortable about this. My vote stays for now, but I want to register my discontent. Something is off about this whole day.

Amaiya (Mailliw), care to elaborate. You see it too. Maybe if we put our guts together, we can figure it out. Kelend (Wilson), any thoughts?

Agreed completely. I didn't like the Sart lynch from the beginning. I highly doubt it was an eliminator tactic to bring up D1 lynches. If it was, it was a terrible one.

Sorry, care to explain that last part? I'm a bit confused.

[Seonid]

Agreed completely. I didn't like the Sart lynch from the beginning. I highly doubt it was an eliminator tactic to bring up D1 lynches. If it was, it was a terrible one.

Sorry, care to explain that last part? I'm a bit confused.

 

Sorry to confuse you - I think my typing had a fail in there (should have been a question mark in there after elaborate).

 

Just asking you to elaborate on your bad feeling about this, noting that you and I might be seeing the same thing and that if we talk it out, we might figure out what feels so off. And asking Wilson if she had any thoughts.

[Mailliw73]

Sorry to confuse you - I think my typing had a fail in there (should have been a question mark in there after elaborate).

Just asking you to elaborate on your bad feeling about this, noting that you and I might be seeing the same thing and that if we talk it out, we might figure out what feels so off. And asking Wilson if she had any thoughts.

Gotcha. Well, my first thought is that, as eliminators, either Meta or Wilson or both, they're devious enough to throw one of their teammates under the bus, knowing it could soft-clear them for most people. I don't know what it is, but the lynch seems to be being pushed really hard for the terrible foundation it has.

[STINK]

I feel like I'm watching some talk show right now

[Bugsy]

Does anyone have a running vote tally? If so, care to post it?

[Metacognition]

Gotcha. Well, my first thought is that, as eliminators, either Meta or Wilson or both, they're devious enough to throw one of their teammates under the bus, knowing it could soft-clear them for most people. I don't know what it is, but the lynch seems to be being pushed really hard for the terrible foundation it has.

 

You seem to feel pretty confident that Sarah will show up as a Darkfriend. You're already trying to implicate Kendal and I for something that hasn't even happened yet. Why is that? 

 

Now I'm thinking that when I posted this bit: 

 

 

In fact, because we have so few people voting recently, we've lost the ability to learn as much from the votes. If a bandwagon had formed, we could feel a bit more secure in the idea that the Darkfriends were okay with our lynching choice and could start searching elsewhere. 

 

The Darkfriends might have taken that to heart. That's the problem with stating things flat out like that. The Darkfriends are capable of seeing it and trying to use that to their advantage. 

 

Considering that we haven't seen a bandwagon like this in a very long time, I feel that there's something different about this one. Between that and Amaiya's confidence that Sarah will turn up as a Darkfriend, I'm willing to leave my vote right where it is. 

 

As far as the Mayor thing goes, Lomion seems to have it in the bag. But, considering that I don't trust her much at all at this point (her last post was basically just filler about PM safety again), I'd like to offer up another candidate in Lorien. 

[Mailliw73]

You seem to feel pretty confident that Sarah will show up as a Darkfriend. You're already trying to implicate Kendal and I for something that hasn't even happened yet. Why is that?

Now I'm thinking that when I posted this bit:

The Darkfriends might have taken that to heart. That's the problem with stating things flat out like that. The Darkfriends are capable of seeing it and trying to use that to their advantage.

Considering that we haven't seen a bandwagon like this in a very long time, I feel that there's something different about this one. Between that and Amaiya's confidence that Sarah will turn up as a Darkfriend, I'm willing to leave my vote right where it is.

As far as the Mayor thing goes, Lomion seems to have it in the bag. But, considering that I don't trust her much at all at this point (her last post was basically just filler about PM safety again), I'd like to offer up another candidate in Lorien.

Uh, what? That's not at all what I said. Like completely wrong. I said I don't really suspect Sart all that much. Bringing up D1 lynches is the only reason I've seen people voting for him and I think that's, honestly, a terrible reason to lynch some own.

The only reason I said what I did is because Seonid said that if Sart is a Darkfriend, it'd softclear you and Wilson. I disagreed with that point is all. Not sure where you're extrapolating all of this from.

[Metacognition]

Sorry to confuse you - I think my typing had a fail in there (should have been a question mark in there after elaborate).

 

Just asking you to elaborate on your bad feeling about this, noting that you and I might be seeing the same thing and that if we talk it out, we might figure out what feels so off. And asking Wilson if she had any thoughts.

 

Gotcha. Well, my first thought is that, as eliminators, either Meta or Wilson or both, they're devious enough to throw one of their teammates under the bus, knowing it could soft-clear them for most people. I don't know what it is, but the lynch seems to be being pushed really hard for the terrible foundation it has.

---

Uh, what? That's not at all what I said. Like completely wrong. I said I don't really suspect Sart all that much. Bringing up D1 lynches is the only reason I've seen people voting for him and I think that's, honestly, a terrible reason to lynch some own.

The only reason I said what I did is because Seonid said that if Sart is a Darkfriend, it'd softclear you and Wilson. I disagreed with that point is all. Not sure where you're extrapolating all of this from.

 

I'm not seeing anywhere in what Cenn asked you had to do with asking if Sarah was a Darkfriend or not.

[Amanuensis]

When Nik finally arrived at Drell’s Crossing he found it falling apart at the seams. At the north gate he was approached by a young town guard conducting a patrol. Though he reeked of paranoia he did not hesitate to offer his name; Lorien. Nik did his best impression of caring - which, needless to say, was far from convincing - though he did at least give his name in return. Lorien seemed a talkative fellow from the start, and Nik was in desperate need of information. So, despite how much he loathed talking to strangers, he put up with the guard’s every tangent and eccentricity as he took him on the tour of the village.

 

Lorien mentioned a monster outside the city walls and asked if Nik had seen it during his travels, to which he replied with a curt no and followed it up by a question of his own. “So who died this morning?” he spoke loud, blunt even, watching the guard’s face carefully for a reaction. Lorien coughed as if surprised, and Nik, who considered himself more than proficient at determining guilt from a man’s expressions, decided it was genuine. The likelihood that he was involved seemed low, though he did take note of how uncomfortable it made him when Nik asked to be shown the place where he died.

 

Just as he expected the mayor had been the target, and the kill had been made in plain sight. At a tavern, no less, frequently populated by strange wanderers and the village’s louder, more violent residents. Unoriginal certainly, but efficient at inciting chaos. Typical for Sightblinder's servants.

 

Of those involved Nik recognized no one. Padan must be disguised, he thought, but he’s definitely here. He could smell Mashadar’s taint beneath the scent of spiced ale and salted meat. To his displeasure the Mayor’s body had been taken away and the blood he left behind had long been cleaned up. It was at that moment that Nik realized that if he wanted to find his father he’d have to start getting to know these people.

 

For a long while he watched from the shadows, and though some people mentioned his presence they mostly left him be. A local widow by the name of Sarah was being ganged up on for bringing up whether or not someone should be strung up for the Mayor’s death this day or not. It seemed a ridiculous reason to suspect someone a murderer to Nik, but he couldn’t help but chuckle at the irony of it. Sadly that chuckle brought attention on himself, and he was forced to speak up.

 

“What? You want my opinion? I don’t even know you people, let alone your rotting mayor. But if you insist then fine, I’ll tell you. No, I don’t I think either the widow or that thin stick-of-a-man are Darkfriends. I could be wrong, for I’ve certainly been fooled before, but trust me when I say I know what Darkfriends think and how they act. If either of these two serve the Lord of the Grave I’ll be surprised. As for the rest of you lot, I’m uncertain. Give me time to sort through all this nonsense everyone has been spouting and I’ll see if I can glean anything useful from it."

 

---

 

Hey guys. So, I think I'm going to have to not do only RP like I originally wanted, as there's a lot of thoughts I've had that I really can't express in character. Though I think I did do a decent job of it on a couple of things above. Which, if you don't feel like reading because overall the RP is garbage, I mentioned how I don't think that Sart or Strawman are Darkfriends.

 

For Sart it's because this isn't the first time he has brought up the subject of day one lynches at the start of a game, and overall I think doing so is a silly reason to kill someone. I don't believe he had an ill intent in mentioning it, even if I do agree the subject isn't really worth discussing. Personally I think people need to not talk about it and just do what they feel is right. If you advocate day one lynches then participate. If you don't, then don't vote at all or even try to intervene by inciting a tie. For either of these things it's important you explain why, though. Voting without explanation is a personal pet peeve of mine, regardless of who the target is.

 

I do think that bit where Sart voted Lopen for Mayor using an RNG is weird though, and will pay close attention to anything else he might do from now on for it (if he lives), but otherwise I don't really get the bandwagon and if anything I think that should be taken as an immediate sign he's innocent. And while the point about needing to confirm that to get reads on other players is valid, I am pretty confident I've used that exact excuse before as an eliminator, so I'm a bit wary of Seonid for doing it now. At the surface it seems like a really smart reason to solidify a lynch, which is great for an eliminator when they already know a person is innocent. EDIT: Do I mean to imply Seonid is evil? No, not necessarily. I'm just saying what's on my mind.

 

Tangent aside, I strongly discourage some things Strawman has done, and I know that some players like to lynch others for doing something that harms the game rather than for actual guilt. I would like Strawman to invest himself in these games more and personally find that killing a player for that reason won't really help. Positive reinforcement is always better than dishing out punishment, in my opinion, and it worries me how many people are swift to pursue the latter rather than the former.

 

I have some more thoughts but I'm going to read through everything again and take notes. I'll also get a vote tally up if no one else does it. Sadly I have a lot to get through so it's likely going to take a while. Sorry for not being around more, but it actually makes me happy to see we're on page 8 already without me.

Edited June 4, 2016 by Amanuensis

[Mailliw73]

---

I'm not seeing anywhere in what Cenn asked you had to do with asking if Sarah was a Darkfriend or not.

You completely missed this context:

But, finding out his alignment will be the most useful thing that this day could end up with, just because of the insight it will give us into the other players and the way that they have defended or attacked him. In particular, if Sarah is evil, than this will soft-clear Meta and Wilson, and that's a huge benefit to the village. I feel like a jerk for doing this, but Sarah.

First off, if Sart is evil, that would clear Wilson and Meta not at all in my eyes.

---

That's where he brought up you being soft clears and I explained my view. Then it goes to your quotes where he asked me to elaborate.

I'm sorry, but does no one else see Meta misrepresenting people this cycle? Not just me either? Something's up and there's no way you just failed to understand me and Seonid completely.

[TheMightyLopen]

Hello all.  Aye Lopen, I did log in earlier - I saw how long the thread was and then went back to stressing over exams.

 

I'm also suspicious of Lopen for two reasons.  He, like Sart, downplays the important of the Mayor, yet votes for himself?  This could very easily get him the role (by making people less wary of voting for him as Mayor).  He also uses the defence of "If I was X I wouldn't do A, and I've done A, so I can't be X".  Which is an awful defence, seems incredibly suspicious, and I last saw used by Aman in LG21, who was an eliminator.

 

Yes, I said why I downplayed it and even said I wasn't sure who I was gonna vote for, but then my earlier vote on myself was made official and I was like "what the heck, why not" because I don't think it matters very much. I'm not sure how me downplaying the importance of the Mayor role will make players vote on me. And the reason I don't think it matters very much is that it's a public vote manipulation. Public. Everyone knows how it will affect the lynch. It's not even close to being the same situation as LG21, where the eliminators had like, 2 or 3 hidden vote manipulations. If the eliminators want to use it to try and control the lynch, they have to take responsibility for their Actions to every single player.

 

Also, I already explained that "defense." It wasn't really me defending myself as much as me asking Meta if he really thought that or was he just trying to cast doubt on my alignment by suggesting something like that. It's possible for an eliminator to vote on one of their teammates for Mayor, but in that situation and for how early it was and how much suspicion Sart was under, I thought it was unlikely Meta would genuinely suspect that me and Sart were eliminators together based on that. That's basically how I search for eliminators. I ask "does that suspicion of so-and-so seem genuine?" or "could that person logically get to that conclusion from the evidence we have so far?" It's why I have a any kind of read on Wilson. She previously called out a player for starting the "should we have a lynch" discussion in a different game as a villager and I agreed with her statement that Meta was acting like his normal self and had reached the same conclusion about Meta just before she posted that(and so had removed my vote from him).

 

Along that train of thought, you saying my defense was "incredibly" suspicious doesn't seem genuine to me. Although of course I'm biased, but I just don't think it is suspicious(mostly because you misconstrued what I said) and Meta is the only one who commented on it and said it was a bad defense to which I already replied and explained, but you seemed to ignore my explanation on that point. So, Twei. Sheep.

 

I'm also getting suspicious of Elodin, who's moving his vote around quite a bit, plus the point that Meta and Twei brought up were valid and I agreed with them(plus I don't like his voting on me directly after Sheep like he did ).

 

There's been a lot of posts since I last posted and I just skimmed over them, but I'll try to comment on anything I think is out of the ordinary once I read through more carefully. I just wanted to comment on this since it related directly to me.

 

Edit: I'll try to get a vote tally up. Give me a minute or so.

Edited June 5, 2016 by TheMightyLopen

[Orlok Tsubodai]

I'm with Seonid here - I highly doubt that Sarah is a Darkfriend, and even if he is, we've just got lucky - there simply isn't the evidence to support it at this stage, but it does give us the most information by a long shot.

I'm going to put a vote behind Maill for the mayoralty - I think his arguments have largely been sound, I'm not inclined to trust Meta with any more influence right now, and I don't think giving it to Elb is going to pay dividends in terms of delivering additional scrutiny, or voting power for the village if she's not going to use it, as she has suggested.

Not only this, but, in my mind, Elb is actually a little suspicious - she's been really helpful - in putting forward the village advice, but not in a way that necessarily implicates her with anyone - it's a lovely position whereby she gains trust without having to risk any links with potential teammates.

To be very clear, I don't think it's worth voting for her to be lynched for this, by any means, but on top of the reduced use for the role, it's enough for me to suggest she not be made mayor.

[TheMightyLopen]

Vote tally:

Sarah/Sart(5-6): Keland, Mezal, Lomion(2 votes?), Cenn, Gladium

Llewella/Sheep(3): Ruon, Phil Bill, Jak

Gladium/Strawman(3): Sarah, Birgitte, Bugsy

Trafalgar/DeathClutch(1): Tazrim

An-alline/phattemer(1): Eryn

Cenn/Seonid(1): Alain,

Ba'Alzaman/Elodin(1): Douza

Eryn/Nyali(1): Lorien

Jak/Lopen(1): Llewella

Mezal/Meta(1): Amaiya

 

Mayor vote tally:

Lomion/Elbereth(5): Amaiya, Gladium, Ruon, Lomion, Ba'Alzamon

Jak/Lopen(3): Jak, Sarah, Phil Bill

Mezal/Meta(2): Keland, Lorien

Tazrim/Hellscythe(1): Tazrim

Amaiya/Mailliw(1): Locke

Eryn/Nyali(1): M'Hael

 

Just a sec. I'll be right back and edit in the rest of the Mayor votes in just a minute. Edit complete. I'm 90% sure that all of the above is 100% correct.

 

Edit2: If you didn't notice, if Lomion is elected Mayor, her vote will count as 2(unless she says otherwise), so Sarah will actually have 6 votes on her as it is.

Edited June 4, 2016 by TheMightyLopen