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Quick Fix 64: Spies in Starsight

Szeth_Pancakes

By Szeth_Pancakes
in Sanderson Elimination

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Kasimir

Kasimir

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, _Stick_ said:

fine Nerdy

inb4 we’re playing right into the gambit’s hands…

but also the logical flip following v!Xino was always nerdy

i don’t like this gambit 

In Szeth's game of circles, you either die or go insane.

I'm pretty sure I'm envious of Fifth, watching us from the Elysian peace of the dead doc.

Also, FWIW @Haelbarde, you did consider some mindgames with Sith vote manip and the kill but IDK if this level is in your wheelhouse.

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Szeth_Pancakes
Szeth_Pancakes

Important note: This ruleset was written before Cytonic and the novellas. Think of this game as an alternate continuity of sorts.  The UrDail, in collaboration with the DDF and using M-Bot’s hol

Amanuensis
Amanuensis

I'll sign up as Amanuensis.

Kasimir
Kasimir

Wow bro you sign up for Aman but not for me?  

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InfiniteInsanity

InfiniteInsanity

Posted
Posted

I've been reading the email I get for following this thread. And y'all have gone back and forth so much it's all just kind of gone over my head. Can someone explain where y'all are at? I see a lot of Nerdy right now but I've seen discussion about literally everyone today so I am so lost.

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Kasimir

Kasimir

Posted
Posted
Just now, InfiniteInsanity said:

I've been reading the email I get for following this thread. And y'all have gone back and forth so much it's all just kind of gone over my head. Can someone explain where y'all are at? I see a lot of Nerdy right now but I've seen discussion about literally everyone today so I am so lost.

Spoiler

lost-johntravolta.gif

Realistically, that ^^^^

Pragmatically: we think that someone within <Stick, me, Hael, Mat> is Evil, for reasons that have to do with the kill patterns. Our problem is we also think everyone in that set is Village.

I have also proposed that TUN should be more on the table than he has effectively been, largely because he hasn't been particularly Village.

Aman's argument and the current dominant train is Nerdy, because there's little reason anyone can see that the Elims would kill Xino unless Nerdy is Evil and going to flip. (There are other potential reasons but they have been lost in the past seven+ pages of confusion!)

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Mat

Mat

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, _Stick_ said:

inb4 we’re playing right into the gambit’s hands…

If that's the case, then there's an elim in [Hael/Kas] for sure, right? Because there had to be someone who saw my switch. And... thought of the gambit within those two minutes? 

Nvm I have no idea what that means help

5 minutes ago, InfiniteInsanity said:

I've been reading the email I get for following this thread. And y'all have gone back and forth so much it's all just kind of gone over my head. Can someone explain where y'all are at? I see a lot of Nerdy right now but I've seen discussion about literally everyone today so I am so lost.

I'm sorry for your inbox :P You might consider changing notif settings to Shard-only; I have that and it makes my email much more manageable. Though I guess if you don't mind, then you can ignore me.

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Amanuensis

Amanuensis

Posted
Posted
Just now, Matrim's Dice said:

If that's the case, then there's an elim in [Hael/Kas] for sure, right? Because there had to be someone who saw my switch. And... thought of the gambit within those two minutes? 

Nvm I have no idea what that means help

I'm glad we explored the idea of a gambit but I don't believe it's actually fruitful until we flip Nerdy. Occam's Razor = e!Nerdy wanted v!Xino dead after their flip. If this didn't happen and someone like Almond got NK'd instead, we'd still be voting out Nerdy today, so this theoretical gambit effectively achieves nothing but generating confusion and making us look elsewhere. Meanwhile, the same players who could have done some kind of gambit are the same players who work on a team with Nerdy. We just need to settle this once and for all.

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Haelbarde

Haelbarde

Posted
Posted

Dunno if anyone actually wanted any of this, but have some comments about comments about me.

3 hours ago, Kasimir said:

I could see E!Hael having the strat cunning to work this out, IDK how much E!Hael gambits, but I sort of feel like I'm being driven there by PoE. The big question in my head between TUN and Hael is more if an Elim team with TUN as the anchor can do what we've seen. Because if TUN isn't anchor, then we are back to the set of three. 

I think this is what I was trying to address in my last post.

2 hours ago, Kasimir said:

Then again there's Hael's speculation of me-Aman E/E at C2 EoD...

Context on that is both of you I'm aware are deadly in thread when you want to be, making you dangerous eliminators. You both also had been (and continue) to be the main drivers of discussion in thread, which is a particularly nice place to find yourself if you're eliminators - you can guide the focus of the thread in the way you want, and your very activeness and apparent engaging in hunting elims generates village reads on the both of you. But then you both started chaotically voting right at the end of cycle, and that was not giving the good Vibes, hence the jump to considering the pair of you E/E amidst the chaos of those 15 minutes.

2 hours ago, Amanuensis said:

I'm kinda at e!hael now too but I like hael so I no wanna rn

Essentially because it feels like the biggest reasons for me v!reading him is making the Silver train viable again (possible e!Hael didn't want any fallout by voting v!Nerdy, v!Aman, or v!Xino and didn't expect Kas + Stick to switch) and because he's been generally more in the background / following my preferred votes, which have since proven wrong (great stalling tactic).

This would mean he put the Xino kill in either because

A) Xino's C3 inactivity corresponded with an IC member's doc inactivity
B] He wanted to frame Nerdy further, or potentially Stick, given the direction he took the Xino double execution
C) He's either giving us a chance or trolling us (this perspective seems more like e!Kas imo, assuming he decided to make this game more fun for us rather than immediately win)

Is this a good time to mention the game of Resistance where I was evil, I failed the first mission, my buddy failed the second, but then I talked my way on to mission 3, and succeed it, and mission 4, essentially hard confirming myself, only to pull out a fail in round 5, just because why not troll when you've got the chance. :ph34r: 

2 hours ago, Amanuensis said:

I'm kinda at a crossroads rn, where either e!Nerdy did submit the Xino kill and his self-vote today was to maybe wiggle out like Kas did C1 and I did C3, or e!Hael intentionally framed Nerdy.

One problem is, Mat didn't switch to Xino until the last couple minutes or so, yeah? Still possible we have a case of e!Nerdy and e!Hael, where e!Hael expects his partner to die and shoots v!Xino.

I guess that makes sense too, given Hael needs to blend in with the other active+Silver voters for as long as possible.

 

FWIW, if I find myself as the most experienced member of an elim team, with teammates without strong opinions, I very much like to start puppetmastering everything. I'm likely to have a voting strategy by this point in the game, as I plan towards getting control of the execution by numbers. And yes, that's not necessary in this game as far as win con, but that didn't stop me from focusing on doing just that in the similar set up in Kas' last Star Wars game. 

5 hours ago, Kasimir said:
  • I would like to invite you to carefully and thoroughly ask if I would, given these known profiles outside of the game, seriously and willingly make a controversial self-vote to try to guilt people into saving me and Village reading me. I would like you to ask if you think E!me would consider the impacts or the fallout after the game, if it was clear that that stunt was just to get a decent Village read and coast through part of the game. I would further like to ask you, and this is one reason why I Village read Aman so hard (sorry Aman), if you think this is a case of a player weaponising his pain to help his team get an advantage and if he would feel happy about winning that way, or any further effects on the community.
  • In a simple sentence; if we can no longer trust players if they say they are not having fun, if the 'tap out' is no longer sacred, SE breaks down. Because we will be incentivised to question that in future, or we will be incentivised to leave. No one wants to keep getting gulled or taking the L. Just from me, I'd rather get C1ed and take the L than be known to do this. Which is where Archer says hard tells are bad and Connie is known to do it - which, sure. But admittedly I don't usually get that button pushed either and had been explicitly planning to play this game softing IC to try to draw a kill. But time wrecks all our plans I guess. Anyway if this line of reasoning makes you feel uncomfortable, feel free to ignore it. But I'm just putting it out there because I think willingly, thoughtfully or otherwise, you are saying E!me functionally decided the win mattered more than my ethics or any knock-on effects on the SE community. Which, ngl, is where I'd be a bit of a psychopath I guess.

This I feel strongly. It's a line I wouldn't let myself cross as an elim, and I don't believe Aman and Kas would either. Perhaps I'm choosing to believe that because I want it to be true, but I'd rather continue to hope for the best in that area than start doubting people on that when it matters.

I think this is the current state of the votes.

Vote Tally (Detailed)
(6) Nerdy: Stick {1}, Bookwyrm {1}, Nerdy {1}, TUN {1}, Aman {2}, Mat(t) {4}, Kas {3}, Stick {3}
(0) TUN: Kas {1}, Mat(t) {1}, Mat(t) {3}
(0) Hael: Stick {2}, Kas {2}, Aman {1}
(1) Stick: Mat(t) {2}, Exotic {1}
(1) Aman: Nerdy {2}
No Vote: Infinite, Hael

Vote Tally
(6) Nerdy: Bookwyrm, TUN, Aman, Mat(t), Kas, Stick
(1) Stick: Exotic
(1) Aman: Nerdy
No Vote: Infinite, Hael

Next up, actually reevaluating my reads.

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Mat

Mat

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Amanuensis said:

Would a team of Silver/Nerdy/TUN play like this? Or are we still certain about a deep wolf?

I mean my main problem with Stick/Nerdy was that Stick was pushing Nerdy over xino hard but she's reopening that door rn

...Which just adds to Kas' argument of her innocence

>>

e!TUN in an e/e exe world I don't think abstains from voting. It's my point from earlier-- if the D2 trains were e/e, there's no point in not bussing. Bussing is actually straight-up beneficial.

I guess, I know e!Stick/Kas/Hael wouldn't abstain there. TUN just abstains regularly anyway so idk if that would weigh out over the gain from bussing for him.

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Amanuensis

Amanuensis

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Matrim's Dice said:

I mean my main problem with Stick/Nerdy was that Stick was pushing Nerdy over xino hard but she's reopening that door rn

...Which just adds to Kas' argument of her innocence

>>

e!TUN in an e/e exe world I don't think abstains from voting. It's my point from earlier-- if the D2 trains were e/e, there's no point in not bussing. Bussing is actually straight-up beneficial.

I guess, I know e!Stick/Kas/Hael wouldn't abstain there. TUN just abstains regularly anyway so idk if that would weigh out over the gain from bussing for him.

I do feel e!Stick is perfectly capable of playing this way.

Like, the win con from the get go isn't to outnumber. I could see Stick walking into this game and going: okay, I'm going to play this village. All I need to do is convince other people I'm village. None of the votes matter as long as I don't get voted. I just need time to reason out the Inner Circle.

That said, I could see Hael doing the same. All he needs to do is not get voted out, which can be fuzzing up our villager-dars.

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Mat

Mat

Posted
Posted
Just now, Amanuensis said:

Would honestly be kinda fun if the elim team immediately decided "hey, let's not use this doc at all or tell each other who we are and just play the game as villagers while spying on the doc". I'd give it a shot

There was a game a few months ago where the elims just randomly decided to make their doc be anon, I think it was just Archer and dannex, with it being dannex's idea. I think they had a clause like, if I'm about to die then I'll tell you, but I don't remember. I also don't remember how it went for them.

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Amanuensis

Amanuensis

Posted
Posted (edited)
45 minutes ago, Matrim's Dice said:

There was a game a few months ago where the elims just randomly decided to make their doc be anon, I think it was just Archer and dannex, with it being dannex's idea. I think they had a clause like, if I'm about to die then I'll tell you, but I don't remember. I also don't remember how it went for them.

Speaking of Archer, why haven't we yeeted him yet?

ED1T:

RIP discussion. My bad :P

Edited by Amanuensis
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The Unknown Ajah

The Unknown Ajah

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Amanuensis said:

Speaking of Archer, why haven't we yeeted him yet?

ED1T:

RIP discussion. My bad :P

You just made me think Archer was playing. Shame on you.

I'm here, and comfortable with where my vote is at, could be convinced away I guess, but I just want some clarity on the Nerdy slot.

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