Bzhydack

Autonomy's magic systems always have sense to me, because they are both achived by relation (not exactly Bond) with separate, idependent (i.e. Autonomous) living organism (also, look at Ashynite system. Similar, right?) Brandon talked about this once. Is not about preserving the trait, is about helping preserve user.

Yeah, but Thrill is a little different case. Is Unmade, yes, but is also mindless. Is basicly force, power with intent, but almost dont have mind to follow it. So follow this what feels, what makes it more similar to normal emotion or nature Spren, than to sapient Truespren. So should be enough to work with it like with those normal spren. BAM is different. Is very inteligent (and with Knight would be even more inteligent) and sapient, so maybe not be enough to just "atract" her with something she know. In fact, is possible she would simply kill this person if would be something she didnt like (Remember, Stormfather tried to kill entire army!). So in her case , we need to do something else. But maybe i overcomlicated things and it was simply "Connect to BAM - ferce her to clse - imprison" without all that swaping bonds thing. Maybe not that far, but we dont know if he wasnt able to make some allies among humans? Maybe he, as a Bondsmith, was able to Connect some humans to Odium as a proof that they could be valuable soldiers? And Raise didnt liked this. Many Fused care much (someimes TOO much) about their reputation. Maybe this was form of punishment, but not in the Odium's eyes, but in the other's Fused eyes? Is implied that "He who quites" was very important, very pridefull title. We dont have direct comparison, but can be something similar to stripping from title prince, degradation of general, or taking away title of professor. If Nahel is in fact Nah El, can mean something like "divine bond", so El alone can be "Bond" in Dawnchant. I know that wil give us "DivineBond Bond" but in fact this is not unheard of in languages, as form of borrowing. So with this El can literally have title "Bond" or "He who bonds".

Yeah, the Rythm of Tower (Honor + Cultivation) is called Rythm of Sience Itself. But I thing better name for Intent of the Sahrd would be "Progress"

@Nameless, @Pathfinder you both are going with the same arguments over and over again. I think this is due to misunderstanding, but also I dont see how you two can compromise, because you both read the same fragment of book slightly differently. So I would argue to simply stop arguing about that and agree to disagree. Also, about Fused. I think that unlike among Radiants, where main military force are (were) Winrunners and Stonewards (followed by probably Dustbringers) main "Ground foot soldiers" among Fused are in fact Regrowth Fused. They are the largest ones, they are heavily armored, insanly strong, and more important, they can heal any wound. Weve seen them regrowth limbs and whole carapce structures literally in seconds time and time again. Practicly anything what isnt strike in the gemheart they can simply walk off (I dont know how about cutting off head... Someone remember?) And as all Fused they are more efficient with Light than Radiants, so they can fight and Regrowth very long time, and fight for attrition.

Dont thinks so. If youu talking about "Nine Shadows" of champion (Dalinar), this can mean anything, even Odium himself. Also, visions of future can change, and can be not clear. So this is not obligatory. But I remember this theory revolving around Forum some time ago.

There was a WoB that sais that Spren gives particular Surges because they are closly associated with those Surges, not because they are closer (or further) to particular Shard. And this is why Nightwatcher also gives Adhesion and Tension, despite being puerly from Cultivation - if this would dependent on association with Shard, she should give Progression and something (Transformation maybe?) Basicly, Spren are embodiment of Surges. So if BAM is closly associated with Adhesion and Tension, shouldnt matter if she is from Odium, she still should give Adhesion and Tension. And we know she IS very closly associated with this, she was able to bring Voidspren and Voidlight, like other Bondsmith Spren. BTW, I had theory about this aspect of Ba-Ado-Mishram some time ago.

No he dont. There wasnt sutch Oath, it was just idea among Shards, but only few of them decided to follow it. If Honor would break his Oath, Odium would kill him almost immedietaly, and not need to wait untill he would be weakened over time.

Shard's power are more or less everywhere. Every shard have part of power dispersed around Cosmere. Also, Spiritual Realm isnt somewhere "physicaly" from the Physical Realm, like in space or underground. So I think you can use Allomancy everywhere, because everywhere is connected to Spiritual Realm. But Aluminum Cage probably can shield you from specific Shard's sight.

This is one of my most favorite theories. Unlike child champion theory, witch has some problems (especially about willingness od child), this one matches perfectly with the theme of the books, because they are not about fancy world and flying, glowing people. They are about men and women who fight and struggling against themselves and thier inner deamons. And Gavilar is embodiment of Dalinar's inner daemon. Dalinar always was in the shadow of his older brother, and memories of him, his life, conquest and death are THE memories - they build all Dalinar was. Im almost sure that with Gavilar alive there would be no Dalinar's change to who he is now. Also remember. If Gavilar is Cognitive Shadow, is possible he is similar to the Fused. So he can be physicly impossible to kill. So technicaly Odium cannot lose, because fight is to the death - but if one side CANNOT die...

Also, why we assume there always was a Stormfather Bondsmith? We know always was one, and always stays in Urithiru, so we can assume that was the Sibling Bondsmith. If during some Desolations was no Stormfather Bondsmith, or he died during it (not neceserly by enemys hand) it would be time without him, so without Stormlight between Highstorms. Also, separating Lights is new thing, they didnt know about this before.

I think we should stop, we are not arguing witch one is stronger here. Last time this took like 60 pages in one topic... It is like comparing multi-purpose vehicle to the tank. In one v one brawl Radiant probably will win, but there is too many factors to simply compare them. Probably jewelry would be too small to contain enough Stormlight. Of course, they can do that. Swalowing gems.... I think should work. Of course, gems also need to be small enough to be swallowed, If I remember correctly Broam is too big for this, but I can be wrong.

And Radiants still are less efficient with power than Mistborn, more even, their power need to be carry externaly, while Mistborn can carry fuel (ok, not literally fuel, because metal is not source of power, it just chanels power. Im adding this because Frustration would pop up and yell: "Metal isnt power source!!!, not carrying that it is irrelevant for this discution. lets simplyfy things) inside his stomach. And for Radiant is enough to someone grab him and rip off pouches/bags/even shirt or coat with gems, and carry/throw away. Or just cut this. It can be even few, even many suicidal attempts, and ane succesfull attack would be enough. And yes, Radiants can take greater risks, but this also mean they can overcommit and suddenly find themselves without Stormlight, so without powers. And this mean death.

Im not sure we can translate this situation from Mistborn to our divagations. First, Zane was constantly on Atium and this makes him absurdly stronger than any Radiant of 3d Ideal, and much deadlier against normal troops. Second, Radiant is of course harder to kill than Mistborn, and have more raw power, but this not makes him deadlier. I would argue than in some circumstances Mistborn can be much deadlier than Radiant. Can use almost everything around him as projectiles, and they are also unlimited, because can easily recover them by simply Pulling, and his power alone forced enemies to fight without advanced weapons and protective gear. Right, against Shardblade armor is irrelevant, but against any projectiles is very usefull, and meele weapon, even deadly as Shardblade, isnt as deadly as ranged weapon with almost unlimited ammo.

So maybe Odium suffers in this encounter as well and part of his power droped with crushed Ambition onto Threnody

@Kandrafish I have very good solution for this problem. What if Spaceshuttle itself would be Feruchemist? It is possible to spike computer hemalurgicly, also advanced enough AI in Cosmere can (and probably will) develop Soul, if would be seen as equal to humans (what is very easy to see happen). So we can use Hemalurgy or Medalion to give Spaceship Metalic Arts, and he would use them just fine (maybe only problem would be to have place for burning metals for Allomancy, but this is just construction problem)

If they would be able to seed sand microorganisms on other things (other than Sand) they can have very cool force able to move machines very efficiently. And I dont know about DarkSide magic, what is capable of. Also not forget Sel. Elantris is much earlier than Mistborn, so who knows what they have.

It is basicly still the problem on Roshar. They probably have mines, but are still relying too much on Soulcasting to the point they dont actualy understands mechanics of making alloys - they use many alloys, but they dont actualy know that they are alloys, because they always make them throu Soulcasting. This is some advantage, because you can have alloy unavailable with conventional methods, but if you forget (or never knew) how to make it, you can only recreat it, and cant try shift its properties.

Wax is other story because in his time there is no Mistborn to wear this piece of outwear. It becomes somewhat traditional for Allomancers, but lost its rightfull meaning.

Focus of Investiture may not be directly Investiture, but servs as some sort of conduct for Investiture. Focus of magic pierces throu Realms and conducts Investiture from Spiritual, or allows to use your own. This is why Aons or burned metals glow. And people on Roshar use focus for their Magic. They use Spren. And in Hemalurgy you still need to have some Innitial Power to rip part of Soul. You need Intent, so proper Intent directed Ruin's Investiture into Spike, just like Intent to burn metal directed Preservation's Investiture into it, or like Intent to store something in metal directed your own Investiture into it.

I think it is option 3, Ruin's own Investiture. I Always see Hemalurgic spike as literal nail, made from Ruin's investiture, and part of soul is literaly nailed to other soul with this nail. So, like physical nail is causing hole in plank, beside being able to pin something to it, similarly hemalurgic spike will cause damage to the soul.

And he is out of Stormlight. After one strike. And like @Karger said, rosharan buildings are nothing like ours - you cant easily crush them or burn them, they are solid stone. And are not exactly easy to spot. No. I just think they are not as hopless as you see them. Singers still can have Warform, and maybe even some can still have Forms of Power (we dont know if Voidspren had to be closed on Braize too). And not powered still can kill someone with power. Moash did this to Leshwi. BTW, humans and Singers interbreed. So this mean in some time period was a peace between two species. This can be between Last Desolation and False Desolation, but is also possible that this happened earlier.

Between Last Desolation and False Desolation was 2000 Years. Im sure there were plenty of humans who get your Idea of exterminating entire spceies. Especially like 20 years after Desolation. But still during False Desolation Singers were really numerous and powerful, and without Fused or Thunderclasts, and with only one Unmade. It is one bolt to the head and she survived. And now imagine 100. Or 500. Its not just about kill, radiant can still feel pain, they can be blinded, and even temporarly blinded oponent is vulnerable, also arrows and blades sticking in your body restrict your movments.. Remember way to kill Bloodmaker? Hit him utill he deplets his metalminds. Here we have the same rule. An Skybreakers cant shield himseld from projectiles, unless he has Plate (unlike Windrunner who has Reverse Lashing, but Windrunner will never attack civilians). So just keep him in the air and force to dodge until he deplets his Gems and he is dead. Remember if Singers survived, they are all veterans of war, untill we talk about brand new village.

@Pathfinder Yeah, probably we arguing semantics. I know how evolution works, but still, it favors traits that are giving better survival of species now, in this concrete point of time. Its not the best overall solution, is the best immedietly available solution. Evolution is like constant provisional renovation, with parts you already have, but still this mean the best suited for survival organisms are in favor of this mechanism. But can we stop off-topic?

Or they can use Surges in other way, not with Forms of Power. Remember what stone in Urithiru shown Venli? Singers (nomen-omen) singing and comand the Surge of Cohesion? Remember Ardents using Surge of Progression with proper Rythm? Remember chanting Soulcasters? Is said in Dawnchant that Singers were forbidden to touch some Surges even BEFORE Humans (and Odium, what mean Forms of Power) were forced to go to Roshar. What mean they could some Surges USE. And I think you overestimate Radiant. First, we are talking about Crusade, what mean 3d level Radiant, so without Plate and who only starts using Division. Only Radiant with Plate could be able to survive encounter with entire... tribe? And we dont know what Skybreakers 4th Oath is. Second, Radiants would be limited with amount of Stormlight they can carry, what mean they cant have as large reach as they need to have. If there was no gems with light on the ground only suitable solution is to stop and wait for Highstorm to recharge gems. Third, we can assume most Radiants were killed during Desolations, so on the end of Desolation we have bunch of not bounded Spren and Radiants of first level, and it takes time to progress in Oaths. Fourth, Singers can breed faster than humans, they are faster adults and can decide when to breed (they enter the mateform).

If this is not "Bettering survivibility" I dont know what is ;-) Your counterexample literaly is example for me. Lizards have better chance of survival hostile envirnoment. And longer legs just happens to be the best solution for this when they needet it NOW. I remember also old example with black and white butterflys (from the same species), when white ones died when air polution rises, because trees were no longer covered by white lichens and white butterflys were very good seen on bark, but when polution dropes, lichens starts cover trees again, and white butterflys again were able to survive, while black ones died.