Friendshipspren

Well It says " three of sixteen ruled , now the broken one reigns ". It doesn't say " three of sixteen ruled , now only one of them reigns ". So that's how I'm rationalizing it. Now, we must remember that Roshar was constructed and greatly shaped by adonalsium. It might be the thing that created the unique ecology and the Highstorms. Indeed , the planet's low gravity imply that it's core is soft and incapable of supporting a strong magnetic field . It seems the Highstorms serve that purpose. So we can say that pre-shattering , adonalsium had greater symbolic Dominion on roshar , ie, adonalsium reigned. Then he got shattered and his sculpted world was the battlefield for 3 shards. Honor is dead , cultivation hides and odium was dormant. For millennia , the Highstorms were the greatest magical phenomenon on roshar and yes, it was imbued with a splinter of Honor but the Highstorms and perhaps the stormfather himself were created by adonalsium. So it was Adonalsium's creation reigning over roshar. So in a symbolic manner , adonalsium rules again. It's a fragile rule which ended as soon as Odium returned Hence , the broken one refers to adonalsium in a highly symbolic manner.

Autonomy is said to be pursuing her own agenda which coincidentally might have helped Rayse. There's not much to suggest he has an alliance with her or any other shard. The WoB just states he had help. Whether it was intended or not , is upto speculation. Even if there is an alliance ,Doesn't mean he can't betray his allies , if he has any Alliances are weak things indeed ,as szeth quite wittily said In WoK prologue. I could argue that the other shards are uncaring cause they have had opportunity to study Rayse over the years . Besides they might ( rightfully perhaps ) think that Rayse is doomed to be bound to Roshar. Either way odium is screwed and bitter about it . Odium has access to fortune and the spiritual realm but other shards have far greater access. Besides odium never saw Dalinar summoning a perpendicularaity not did he see jasnah sparing renarin. Also it seems cultivation similar to preservation has a super long term plan to defeat Rayse. So in summary , I still believe the death rattle is about a bitter thought of odium and the broken one being referred to is Adonalsium. Yes I understand this one doesn't really carry the plot. But still it's interesting to note Anyway Rayse is finding things are a lot harder than he foresaw and Likely to get harder still.

@Nnatel what if there was a third shard ? Suppose a shard wanted to grow stronger and decided to consume dead shards . It would be unsuccessful on Sel cause odium did a good job sequestering the dor. But on Threnody and perhaps on other systems u have large chunks of Ambition's investiture strewn about. I don't know if odium took the proper precautions there. So it's possible a shard tried to hijack the investiture , with what degree of success I can't say. But that's why the shades have red eyes. A Possible candidate are Autonomy. The resulting aberrations in intent could be easily nullified by her multiple personality disorder. This excess investiture might be the partial answer to how she's creating her avatars Another candidate is the survival shard. Maybe it thinks having more investiture will give it an edge.

I don't know if supplying energy to keep a CS going is equal to investment. @RShara Like isn't it supposed to be hard or near impossible to reclaim invested investiture. In contrast , L odium threatens the Parshendi that he can simply reclaim the investiture sustaining Them. Maybe Investment is doing stuff like creating Spren , splintering urself to form unmade or stormfather/ Nightwatcher like entities , creating an entire planet from scratch , letting small pieces of u go feral on Threnody, etc. Since he can reclaim the investiture sustaining the Parshendi much like how ruin could have reclaimed the atium. I'm guessing infusing CS doesn't count as investment. Once the jobs done he can simply pull back and the Parshendi ghosts will fade into the Beyond. Maybe he used the same technique before on Sel. Or maybe he is investing in whichever planets he decides to fight on but he's always careful to reclaim the investiture once the battle is done

Okkk. Sorry , I got my post Shattering history mixed up

So I think the broken one is Adonalsium. It's an obvious conclusion , isn't it ? What's the synonym for shattered ? That's right ,broken Yes , yes , it's too obvious and u have already thought of and rejected this but bear with me. I think it's more of a metaphor. Like odium wants to be the only God right. That's why he's murdering other shards and maybe that was his motivation to shatter Adonalsium in the first place. So now he finds himself not a god but a entity that has been bound to the Greater Rosharan system for millennia and he has been forced to invest there too , much to his chagrin. Then he's also realizing that killing Shards isn't really that easy as he thought. He was quick with Ambition and DnD , he must have thought it would be way easier after killing Dominion and Ambition whose intents clashed on the same frequency as his . He must have thought the rest were easy prey that he would slash through them in little time and be the one God , but then he had to spend millennia killing honor but at the cost of got bound and he still had to lay dormant for a few more millennia and now he still has to deal with cultivation and even those splinters of honor are still fighting . His Victory is not assured and even if he does it will be difficult to uninvest himself from the system , assuming he actually can break the bounds , his Victory doesn't necessarily mean his freedom and by now other shards are wise to him , the last few millennia have been a great opportunity for them to learn how to deal with him and smart shards like endowment seem to have even constructed contingencies/weapons to deal with him. Shards like autonomy with thier multiple daughter shards will be harrowing to hunt down and autonomy herself or one of her avatars at least seems to be quiet cunning . Then u have harmony , a greater shard who terrifies odium. Then there are the 6 other unknown shards who might have gotten used to thier powers by now and have had ample time to study Rayse . might stand against , defeat or atleast offer a prolonged resistance to Rayse. Many of them might have far better futuresight , a priceless advantage. Then there's hoid , he by himself is a threat and he's trying to forge an anti- Rayse alliance as well. He also had to deal with new developments like technological progress on Scadrial , roshar and Sel and perhaps nalthis. Maybe even taldain. Silverlight shouldn't be underestimated either. So far they have remainder neutral observers but it could change. These humans might in a few centuries be powerful enough to take on a bound shard. Especially If they have Shardic help. Then there's the problem of the Evil on Threnody , which might or might not be Ambition in vengeance mode. Even if it isn't, it's still a possible threat. Then u have the sentiant landscapes on Sel , an unforeseen effect of the Dor being converted into free investiture. I'm imagining they won't be too happy with Odium or odium too happy with them as he wants to kill the stormfather for being a big splinter of honour and sane principles might apply for the selish landscapes as well. Then there's Nightblood and hemalurgy. A shard using hemalurgy based overpowered puppets might easily defeat Odium's forces. They could even create new species like Koloss , kandra and Psalms werewolves to tackle his regular troops. All in all , Odium is in a bad position. Maybe the other shards are waiting for odium to become weaker still by fighting honor and cultivation . And then they will spring upon him. Or maybe odium is doomed to be bound to the Rosharan system in any eventuality. I'm sure odium has given all this and more , enough thought. So he's bitter and he's thinking " Hell , I defeated u Adonalsium but now look at me now ,bound to this system and even if I win , it will still be really difficult to be free again and even if I am , i might still have my work cut out for me and I might get killed myself , maybe even by those puny humans. U have ur revenge. I thought by now I would be the only God and i would reign supreme. U were broken but maybe u foresaw all this , Maybe in a way u still reign ". Moalach might have picked up on this thought and being mindless , didn't really think twice about revealing Odium's thoughts in a death rattle. So yeah that's my theory . Even if my analysis of the death rattle is wrong. U can't deny how screwed odium is , can u ?

Ok , so ambition was odiums first kill right. It was unplanned. He stumbled upon her whilst on the way to Sel ( We don't exactly how much after the Shattering this happened. It could have occured within a few days or years or decades ). We do know it was in the wake of the Shattering , so I guess at most it could be about a century or so after the Shattering. So Odium was still unused to the Shard's power and parts of him got ripped off along with ambitions and he saw thier effect on Threnody . Times moves differently for shards right , so he could have been in conflict with Uli Da for centuries . Enough time to see the effects of his investiture there. Then when he went to Sel. He used this new knowledge to create vicious shades , who helped him defeat DnD. Then he left the system and withdrew his investiture , leaving the shades to be pulled away into the Beyond. Later the humans who survived the desolation mythified odium as the great Other and the shades as his minions . Later on , these elements, including odium himself were forgotten in most regions but the shades were integrated into shu -dereth in the local parlance as the Svarkiss. Then he left for roshar and used a similar strategy for the Parshendi and is still using it. I'm interested in why there are still shades active on Threnody . Did a large part of him got ripped there ? Or did he manage to reclaim the parts leave behind only a miniscule amount which acts more of a trigger. Like maybe it's small pieces of odiums investiture that lead to the transition into a cognitive shadows but then it's Ambitions investiture that sustains it. This would be somewhat similar to what happened with kelsier. If it weren't for leras unwittingly giving away the location of his shardpool and he saturating himself with investiture by bathing in it for a year , he would never have become a CS. On Threnody , since the shard is dead and I believe the entire continent of Hell is saturated with Ambition's investiture , maybe souls can get lucky often and hit upon Odium investiture sparking then into becoming shades and then they can use Ambition's investiture to sustain themselves. An alternate explaination would be that odium and Ambition's investiture got fused together and the chunk infused the continent. Odium was unable to reclaim his investiture as it got melded. The intents melded together to have vengeance ( one interpretation of Ambition ) and blind hatred ( one interpretation of Odium ) as the goal of the CSs created from them. As for the Evil , I hold to my theory that it is the Shardic equivalent of a zombie or Onryō (怨霊 onryō, literally "vengeful spirit", sometimes rendered "wrathful spirit") . That it is Ambition ,nearly splintered and nearly mindless but still alive to an extent, bent on vengeance against Odium. Maybe vengeance is one interpretation of Ambition or maybe it's due to Odium's investiture melding to a larger extent with her.

But what about transformation and Transportation. They aren't natural concepts. They are abstract ideas. Division too is a hybrid between fact and concept

Nin son God

Me laan

Just imagine Nightblood learning about the Evil on Threnody. He's probably gonna burst a groove on his blade from excitement. NB : " Evilllllllllllllllllllllll " "Szeth, did you hear that ? Let's ditch this place , we need to go to Threnody " Szeth : " No , Sword Nimi , I have pledged my allegiance to Dalinar Kholin and intend to follow him till he releases me or till I die " NB : " Screw that Dalinar guy, didn't you try to murder him twice ? Come on , let's ditch this place . There's an ENTIRE CONTINENT FULL OF PURE ,PURE EVIL THERE . AN ENTIRE CONTINENT, SZETH . I think I know the route there , Vasher knew it better but I can manage. We probably won't be lost for long .Let's go " Szeth : " I'm afraid I can't do that , Sword Nimi . Nin-Son-God told me that you are to remain here until or unless your true master demands you back. " NB : " Oh come on , both of them are so boring . Please , pretty pleaseeeeee . Are you angry I accidentally tried to eat your soul ? I promise I won't do that ever again. " Szeth : " sigh "

So if non standard Spren can be bonded , u can theoretically access non standard surges as well ? Noice

Ok ,I have a few questions . 1). Why aren't the shards allowed on Yolen ? 2). Woah what I thought Ati and Leras and now trell were the only shards to ever come within a light-year of Scadrial ? 3). What ? I knew he had stuff from across the shard worlds but I didn't know Yolen was among them . Which item was it ? What's it's significance ? Can I get some more info and WoBs pls.

Ok I have a theory too. Well not a theory , more a exciting guess. Could that be whatever's left of Ambition ? I mean , perhaps she fled from Threnody and with Endowment's aid was able to fight Odium off . That would explain why Egdli is so confident she can deal with Rayse . She has beaten him once already. But maybe it was too late for Ambition by then and she got splintered and the Shard's cognitive aspect now follows around Nalthis ? It's possible , I mean so far we know of only 2 non human shard vessels , Uli da who was Sho del and Egdli who is possibly a dragon. Maybe they have or had some sort of solidarity and Uli Da thought she might help her. Endowment might have supported her since she wasn't violating the Pact. Maybe she didn't expect her to remain around but once she died , the cognitive splinter like imprinted on her and she's stuck with it now. At best she's a good friend and Uli da is dead and that's nothing more than her corpse , at worst she's a hypocrite who's violating the Pact by associating with a camouflaged shard . Although she wouldn't technically be violating it since Uli da isn't actually on the same planet as Egdli. Yeah , I know this is probably completely or atleast partially wrong. But it's exciting Then there's this possiblity. What if Egdli didn't help Uli da ? What if she was able to scare off odium somehow but didn't lift a finger to help Ambition ? Now we know Odium is infamous for killing Shards and stuffing thier corpses in the CR ? Maybe that's what happened here ? Like maybe endowment wasn't really ok with it but didn't want to confront odium after all and odium couldn't go out against endowment but stuffed the corpse in the orbit of Egdli's claimed world just to spite her. Khriss does mention that Ambition was splintered somewhere outside the Threnodite system . Also , a murdered shard stuffed into the cognitive not around a planet but in it's orbit. Yep , definitely counts as an anomaly . A known anomaly but an anomaly all the same. I doubt Egdli can access the investivure . If it were that simple I'm sure one shard or another would have already been to Sel and consumed the Dor . It might have other effects however. Like how on Sel the free investiture is allowing entire landscapes to becoming sapient or atleast sentiant . I don't think the effect here is as profound as that if it is indeed Ambition's corpse but I guess there will some subtle effect on Nalthis because of it.

My situation is the same in a way

Oh yeah , that makes sense. I'm sold

Wait so how did the first oath come to be ? Like all the other ideals are specific to each order and reflect the Sprens cognitive idea/bias. But the first like it's common for all orders except maybe the LightWeavers right . So like did honor create it ? But no , honor never intended to form the knights or so we think. Maybe it was the honorspren , maybe they were like we are shards of honor so u have to say some words indicating honor. And then the other Spren copied them. Tho that doesn't explain why cultivation Spren need them But then again cultivation Spren seem like the sort that will jump off a cognitive bridge if everyone else is doing it . Hmmm what do u think ? Was it honor himself , cultivation , one of the heralds or the Spren themselves who came up with the universal words of the first ideals

Oh good. Jesus i was beginning to think I had been pronouncing it wrong my entire life. I write it as aluminium instead of aluminum and pronounce it as Alu-mi-ni-um, u know like how u day cadmium .

Yup , honorless said it better than me. Yo honorless what do u think of my theory that the small amounts of power leaking from the dor and not the dor itself is gaining sentiance. It could revive ur alive nations theory right ? Like the magic released in Maipon identifies itself as Maipon . Arelish magic imbues itself in the landscape of arelon and regards itself as Arelon and so on .

Exactly. No one is gonna ascend and wield all the power. But the power is trickling out , a negligent quantity of it which is imbuing itself rather than be wielded by a single person.

They do ? Oh u mean the temporary perpendicularaity. Right

The graphic novels yeah. I tried to read the prose , idk didn't really get the usual wow this is amazing vibe so left it in favor of the comics and coppermind.

@Karger yeah you do seem to be simply trying to prove the Traveller wrong rather than contribute to the conversation. Pls stop that. It's just making this thread long and tedious. Btw @Honorless who or what is Skathen ? Oh the emperor of Darkside kk.

Okk thanx. Also you have convinced me a bit. I used to think they were era 3 Scadrians but Roshar makes sense too. I think roshar might develop spacecraft faster than Scadrial ( tho not FTL ) . They might have too in order to take the fight to Odium on braize, they could use the cognitive realm but I think it would be hard for them there as they can't use surges and attacks by wild Spren , voidspren and singer ghosts make it very costly , not to mention that most of the other Spren aren't quite on great terms with humans. Rosharans lusting after aviars to protect them Scadrian or odian emotional manipulation would also make sense. Besides they could act as intermediaries and sell them to nalthisians to hide breath auras. I don't think the alethi ( atleast unless Dalinar completely changes them ) care about making laws against unrestricted contact with developing societies but the Thaylens. Yep they could definitely do that or maybe the Aziri . Or maybe it's the Aziri who made the laws and the Thaylens who are trying to circumvent it It's said that the ones above look like us , it's not specified if they have long eyebrows or not but then again it wasn't necessary in the conversation with dusk. The chouta comment makes it likely too. But it's said " sometimes they talk like us ". That screams connection. It might be a common attribute on Scadrial but on roshar , so far only bondsmiths are capable of it. Of course maybe they have invented a fabriel that allows connection. Or maybe they got access to some Scadrian connection tech. And yeah they being Scadrians is too on the nose. Yep I'm sold.