Elandera
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Everything posted by Elandera
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I get the being forgetful thing. As I noted last night, I infamously let myself die because I forgot to submit an action required to keep me alive (an interesting pewter mechanic in a previous game). The problem is figuring out why so much vote manipulation went in to apparently saving you.
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So unless someone just didn't want Devotary to vote, they had been on late in the cycle enough to catch that last minute shift if votes to Ark.
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Oh, poor Shane. I'm curious about the vote manipulation on Devotary. @Kidpen, does brass apply in the cycle it's used? Depending on the answer to that, someone didn't want Ark to die. I believe that was Devotary's first vote last cycle, so it couldn't have been intended for anyone else.
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We know we have 6 aluminium medallions (the max). Devotary says at least 3 pewter based on a scan. Of all the people up for a lynch, I think I agree most with either a contribution crusade on shanerockes, or Ark. Ark more so for actual suspicion, but I can understand forgetting to submit an action (even if said action is the only way to stay alive). However, we had several people writing reminders and sending requests for the results of the scan. It wasn't until Devotary called him out that he responded at all. So, Ark.
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That's reasonable. Roadwalker . But I'm back in a spot where I have no idea who to lynch.
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I'm running out of time that I'll actually be online this cycle. At this point, I'm less comfortable with a Devotary lynch than I am with a possible Roadwalker lynch. It could be a simple mistake that left out the Eternum information, but I'd like to give a little more incentive for Roadwalker to reply. I do not, however, know their schedule and if they're normally on around turnover. I should be able to get on in the last 10 minutes or so (depending on the weather for my drive home from work), so if we get any explanation in that time, I'll remove my vote. It's just a better lead than we have for Devotary, who I've been getting a more village read from this cycle.
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I went back through Eternum's posts, and found he had claimed 2 bendalloy after that. Apparently we missed this discrepancy before. @Roadwalker, any reason Eternum wasn't included in the list?
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I am also getting a bit of a strange vibe, but it seems to be mostly inexperience. They've asked a lot of questions that, had they been elims, would have been better asked in a doc (how elims decide a target, for example). For now, I'm putting Tiempo in a Mostly Village category. Devotary is very good at sounding the same as both elim and village. Her voting patterns tend to be what tip me off first, usually including very last-minute votes with few poke votes early on. However, I haven't seen much of that outside of CadCom's vote. I'm still not sure about lynching Devotary, and would love if someone else piped up with some analysis. I feel lost at this point.
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If I was elim!Elandera protecting elim!Itiah, I probably would have tagged Snip as a way to get the vote removed. The vote on Devotary was simply an effort to get some discussion going, and hopefully get someone else to speak up with some analysis. Unfortunately, I'm at work, so my ability to do real analysis is limited. I just know there have been several people, CadCom included, who've expressed some concern about Devotary. CadCom asked us to not ignore his analysis, so this is my, trying to not ignore it. It's the best lead I have at the moment, since me previous leads have all ended with a villager lynch.
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Well, we're less than 12 hours away from the end of the cycle, and there's been little to no lynch discussion. The only vote so far was a poke vote from Snipexe onto Itiah. I'm at a loss for a possible lynch candidate. I'm seeing Fura as less and less possible elim, especially after Lum's flip as village. I think I'm going to vote in honor of CadCom, using his analysis from after he was lynched. He seemed most suspicious of Devotary.
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While that is possible, it's not a definite way to do it. Elims can submit the kill at any point during the night turn. Sometimes they'll have decided who they want to kill before the night turn even begins.
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In general, everyone needs to be careful about what medallions they claim while they still possess them. Aluminum isn't so bad, as it seems elims wanted several of those out there. If you have a medallion that elims might consider a threat, it'd be best to keep it quiet. Wow. That's a lot of medallions. It seems RNG liked you. I've got a chart in progress, though I may have missed some D1 claims. I believe I shared what I had (number-wise) in a post near the end of D2. It needs to be updated though. As for Rath's death, my immediate thought was an information-deprivation kill. Since Rath had been less active than others, not a lot of information could be gleaned from it. My guess if they wanted to make Devotary more suspicious, you'd be their initial target, since you've expressed some of the most doubt about her.
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RaLeen had seen plenty of political intrigue and deception in her years - she was part of the Eighth Generation, after all - but this debacle with the Southern Scadrians was unique. A whole new peoples, which Harmony only hinted at, come to meet with Elendel. There was so much potential for good, but someone wanted to ruin it. Aliat had even been killed. He was a bit... stuffy, but he'd at least been willing to talk. Now everyone seemed to be clamming up. How was a modern Kandra supposed to get information now? It's not like RaLeen could just eat someone and take their place. Harmony frowned on that, and RaLeen was trying to behave. She'd have to rely on talking then. She walked up to a group that was gathered, and smiled. "Anyone know who we're looking for? Because I sure don't."
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Quick Fix Game 36/Anonymous Game 5: Dream Thieves
Elandera replied to Steeldancer's topic in Sanderson Elimination
This sounds amazing. I enjoyed the body-hopping mechanic of the Black Ops anon game. Count me in! -
It's not necessarily who you voted on, but your reasoning expressed at the time and how you voted. You seemed to be wanting to go with a bandwagon, while seeming to actively avoid the biggest bandwagon. That's a safe elim tactic, and commonly used by new elims, since they can never be pulled out of a group who caused a mislynch. You might just not have expected so many late votes on CadCom. It's also a common thing to avoid a bandwagon and/or contribute to a different wagon if the main candidate is a teammate. Oooh, I didn't think that all the way through. I also remembered after posting that there isn't an actual limit to how many can be held, so it's not implausible. Especially since a few people have claimed no medallions.
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Alright, we are quickly running out of time in this round. Good news is, we've heard from everyone but @Eternum, @Ark1002, and @ElendVenture. Elend, you said you were confused about what was happening. Please feel free to ask any questions and we'll do what we can to help you out. I'm also sure Kidpen won't mind answering specific questions regarding your abilities in your PM with him. The vote count stands as such: Lumgol (3) - Xino, Itiah, Roadwalker Xino (1) - Lumgol This is still well within vote manipulation abilities to mess with. By the way, did anyone get a gold count? As I said before, I don't really believe Lumgol is an eliminator based solely on the fact they lied about having an aluminum medallion. Had they claimed in middle of the group, then possibly, but claiming at the end is entirely too risky a move for an eliminator when the max number of medallions had already been claimed. Unless, as Devotary pointed out, it could have been an effort to keep the tin medallion holders from scanning another metal, like Pewter. But again, that's a very risky move because it would end in almost certain death. It doesn't help I'm a little frustrated Lumgol then used the 7 aluminum claimants as an excuse for voting (see below). That doesn't seem very village in my mind. But I keep going back to her vote pattern. When I called her out on her reasoning of a "bandwagon" forming toward me, she immediately switched her vote. From past (and painfully bad) experience, this might be a sign of a new eliminator. I know the first time I was an elim, I panicked with how to vote and switched it around a lot at the first sign of someone calling me out. This seems to be what Lumgol is doing. I also feel she hadn't given a satisfactory answer to why she seemed to be avoiding voting on Fura, especially with this post: @Lumgol, is there a way you could explain that though were were convinced by the arguments against Fura, it was more logical to vote on someone else? I apologize, I think I may be falling into my tunneling trap once again. But I also feel there are some questions your lynch may help resolve. So, Lumgol On to other things. Fifth! I'm so sad I didn't get to continue the RP with you! I'll try to write up a good RP in where I am sad the first person I met died. I hope you enjoy it. Regarding Fifth's death, he seemed to be most suspicious of Fura. If she is evil, and anyone in the elim team was in last game, they may have recalled how quickly he rooted us out and decided it would be better to stop his arguments sooner rather than later. However, it's possible Fifth may have been killed to keep suspicion in that area. It's a terrible IKYK situation, but still worth watching Fura. Whoa, wait! As I started rereading this cycle, I feel like we missed this glaring claim: (bolded is mine) @Furamirionind, does this mean you have 3 medallions? Does anyone else have 3? @shanerockes, I just want to confirm you got Bendalloy both last cycle and this cycle? From my count of claims so far, we have: (spoilered for length... this post is getting very long...) I was going to RP, but this is already very long. I'll leave it at that.
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While it is possible Xino is an elim using this opportunity, we did also ask the tin holder to scan for aluminium so we could figure out who was lying. This kind of move is unadvisable, to say the least. While I can kind of understand the reasoning, I don't like the tactic. It draws time away from people who are actually concealing something. However, it doesn't seem like an elim move. If you'd have been an elim, you would have known if someone was lying and could have claimed tin. For now, I'll hesitantly say Lumgol.
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In that case, Lumgol. @Lumgol, is there a reason why you lied? @FatherTiempo, the same question goes for you. The reason I have placed a vote on Lum over FT is because of their voting pattern last cycle. It seemed hedgy, and their arguments for why they voted that way feels vastly incomplete. Hopefully someone used gold and can tell us their results today. EDIT: Also, I'm going to go back through and look at the aluminium claims to see maybe if we misinterpreted something.
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A lot of the quotes you pulled rely on context, so I'll try to provide some of that while I explain as well. This was said while there was a lot of conjecture about what sort of metals the elims had distributed. It didn't seem to me at that point that people were considering the idea that they might just go ham and send out all the medallions. I was just offering my two cents regarding what might be the case. However, I do admit from the outside, this could definitely be seen as distancing. That was not, however, my intent. Most games I am very against role claiming, but with how the mechanics work in this particular game I didn't see it as harmful as others might as long as people were reserved about their choices. I later advocated for people to claim only less important metals, or ones that wouldn't make them as much of a target. I claimed aluminum, but I didn't mention I had Cadmium that I ended up using because I didn't want to reveal to anyone attempting a hammer that their plan might be thwarted early on. I usually find myself tunneling on someone, then reviewing the evidence in order to find something to support my suspicion. I'm trying to not do that this game, because it's a very dangerous habit that leads to more villagers being lynched than elims. I'm trying to be a bit more reserved about labeling someone as definite elim until the facts show themselves. I still stand by my CadCom lynch, even if he does flip village, because enough of what he did proved suspicious enough for me to lynch him. This was responding to Lum saying the argument of a Lum-Fura connection would be based on one being a confirmed elim. My thoughts on lynching were just saying that was the only way to confirm an elim, and thus the only way to confirm or disprove a Lum-Fura connection. My post before the one you quoted was me pointing out Lum refusing to vote on you, not a defense of you. I'm not really sure where you say I defended you, aside from in D1 when I was saying I didn't think your call for role claim was inherently evil. I wasn't necessarily defending you here either, just saying that we can't automatically call someone evil because more than one of a possibly powerful metal shows up. Only the elims know exactly how they distributed metals, until we can get a list from Gold. My third paragraph was in direct response to Itiah stating they were going to look into a possible counter-wagon. The only way we'd know if CadCom's lynch was a counter wagon is if you die and flip evil. It's more likely to have been a counter wagon if CadCom flips village (which we still don't know), but not necessarily. It could just be villagers who didn't think you were suspicious choosing another option. I was fairly defensive of you to begin with, because I didn't see your role claim call to be super suspicious. However, some of that view changed after Fifth presented his arguments. He had good reasoning for voting on you, and I likely would have joined the vote had I not been more suspicious of CadCom. Lynching you would answer quite a few questions (your link with Lum, most of the D1 discussions, etc.), so I wouldn't be opposed to it. Before I go that far, I'd rather look at other people as well. Like I said, I'm trying not to tunnel too much because it ends with me lynching more villagers than anything. Waiting for D2 to claim tin is probably the preferable option so they don't become an immediate target for elims. Tin is a powerful enough medallion to want to destroy from the game, especially in cases like this where we have more than the logical number of claims on one metal.
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It all depends on what playstyle the elims are going for. It's possible they distributed a few to increase their chances of getting one in the future. It's a fairly useful medallion, so I could see them creating at least two or three extra. I would hold off until we can get a gold count before automatically assuming two irons has evil intentions. Several people last cycle had suggested using Bendalloy on the lynch target because there had been an assumption the alignment would still be revealed right away (This is also an answer to @Steeldancer ). If they were village, it would give them a chance to offer some last thoughts and maybe take an extra action. If they were elim, it would give us a chance to grill them a bit. I started the counter wagon on CadCom. See my vote post last cycle for the reasoning. It's possible if Fura is evil, at least one of the following votes is an elim taking an opportunity to save a companion. As for Lum, her stating there is a Lum-Fura connection I believe was more hypothetical in response to some of us (myself and Devotary I believe) looking at Lum's avoidance of voting on Fura. Because of how she voted, we got a little suspicious and called her out on it.
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Unfortunately, there's rarely a confirmed elim until one is dead. There is only suspicion. It's the same for villagers, in the sense that people can be viewed as village, but confirmed village is difficult to obtain without first dying. The biggest solution would be to lynch one or the other of you. If one flips village, I'd be more likely to view the other neutral/village. If one flips elim, I'd probably be willing to lynch the other, just in case, unless other evidence arises.
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Except there were 4 votes on you before CadCom placed his first vote on me. You also had a vote on CadCom, and I had one on Shanerockes. I found it a bit odd when they claimed the votes were shifting to me, when there was only one, while you had a few. Lum seemed unwilling to vote on you, but more than willing to join other singular votes. It could be Lum just didn't find the claims against you worth a vote, but that was never expressed. They just ignored you entirely as an option. It's not enough for me to view either of you as village or elim, but it's enough for me to keep an eye on you both.
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The vote as it stands, a little less than two hours from turnover. Fura (3) - Fifth, Eternum, Roadwalker CadCom (2) - Elandera, Lumgol Elandera (1) - CadCom Shanerockes (1) - FatherTiempo @FatherTiempo, generally, when you place a new vote, you'll want to put the old vote in green in your new post. It helps GMs track vote counts. Most GMs will count the last vote as the correct one, but we may need to confirm that to be the case with @Kidpen. All is fair! I'd take it with a grain of salt if anyone else said it as well! And I'm tempted to switch my vote to Fura, because it would resolve quite a bit of discussion for today. But as the vote count stands, I'm content with leaving my vote on CadCom. EDIT: Also, I'll likely respond to the RP next cycle. I'm at work and rather busy.
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I'm not sure how to respond to the vote. It seems it's on me simply for being the second (third? I can't remember and am too lazy to look) to claim aluminum. I would have no reason as an elim to claim a medallion I do not have. I find it more likely that elims are among those not claiming, or claiming to only possess medallions. Lying about which you have is a dangerous move that will bring quick reaction, and I'm far too terrible at lying to even attempt such a move. My thoughts when I decided to poke vote were generally leaning village on Fura. The initial call didn't seem inherently elim to me because of how I interpreted the rules. Her response and interpretation then to your suggestion C2 would be better pushes it more toward village. Some of the flip-flopping is a bit off, but again, I don't read it as inherent elim, just scattered neutral. (Everything is on a different page now, so I'm stuck with this or losing everything I've typed) The strange coordination between CadCom and Lumgol seems a bit... off to me. I'm not sure why @Lumgol is saying a bandwagon going in my direction. There's been one vote. And as Fifth pointed out, CadCom did a pretty solid hard-clear of Lumgol early. I thought of voting on him earlier when he was a bit vague about his stance on Fura, but didn't want to based on minor suspicion alone because he's been lynched early a lot. However, the recent events have me raising my eyebrow a bit more. CadCom shanerockes.
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The question here is does Duralumin extend to medallions only, or would it also include the elim kill? It says "power", so I'd venture to guess the latter. If so, I could imagine at least one of these in play in elim hands for C1. The same could potentially extend to Nicrosil as well, if the ability extends to the night and not just the next day. @Kidpen, would you be willing to clarify if powers means only medallions? For the person(s) who has gold, tonight would be a great night to use it, to get an idea of how many of what kinds of medallions we have out there. That knowledge will likely give us a look into the kind of personalities we have among the elims (are they more reserved, logical sorts... or would they be a bit crazy with distribution). As for the lynch discussion, Fura's push to share medallions isn't inherently elim. I'd actually see it as more village because elims already have a fair bit of knowledge regarding who has which medallions. I'll place a poke vote on shanerockes for now, as I don't believe they've posted yet this game. @shanerockes. I also don't believe we've heard from @ElendVenture either.
