Pathfinder

This is in reference to the latest short story released "Sixth of Dusk". Not sure the protocol so I will include it in spoilers:

We could also look to our own natural world for evidence. Dinosaurs that are huge when compared to humans, produce eggs and young that barely come up to our calves. Insects metamorphisize into forms completely different than how their larval stage appears or in many cases function. Crustaceans also start small, and molt as they grow. Given the highstorms I doubt it would be difficult to imagine all those molts being washed away which has prevented their discovery. Finally larkin's have wings. We have yet to see them fly (unless i missed something). How far have bees traveled? How far do birds migrate? How far do whales, dolphins, turtles, and any number of other species travel during different seasons, mating habits, or maturity? So a larkin traveling all that distance, or changing into something to travel all that distance and then becoming a chasmfiend isn't far fetched at all. Other than that logic however, I do not know of any in book reference that would specifically support this theory.

I think whether or not it was "right" to kill Sadeus is largely up to what "lense" we chose to view the action through. Purely by Alethi laws it was wrong. Purely by Skybreaker ideals it was wrong. Purely by Windbreaker ideals it was wrong (due to HOW it was done, not the REASON), purely by dustbringer or nameless order of radiants Brandon mentioned it was right. By Elsecallers I would also hazard it was right. I think it can easily be seen to be honorable to kill evil wherever it is found. Yes evil is a very subjective concept, but given the form the orders take, it is very easy to see one such order viewing Sadeus as evil and Adolin being honorable in taking his life.

I thought it was explained in the book pretty succinctly. Lift interacted with Wyndle's mother who we assume is the Nightwatcher and Lift received a boon. Wyndle comments that what she does by touching him is unusual which states to me that no other edgedancer, or at least it is not COMMON among other edgedancers, regardless if the edgedancer knows what he or she is doing. The boon is that Lift exists partially in the cognitive realm and allows her to metabolize stormlight and interact physically with her spren.

Although the bullet idea is clever, I do feel the need to point out that there wouldn't be any tools of persuasion that would work on Miles. It is literally shown and stated that after healing so much so many times Miles no longer feels pain. Maybe sensory deprivation MIGHT work?

Actually your last point lends me to think it was not a dularium effect. Like you said, we know they turned it on before, and did not get this reaction. Also like you said the activation was a red herring, the true goal of the Ones Above was for the machine to be opened and figured out, so the indigenous people would advance enough for trade to be possible. I don't know about you, but if I had a strong enough understanding of reamatics enough to produce faster than light space travel, then I would be able to guess that dularium which magnifies my own abilities and machines would more than likely magnify any ability on the planet. Now as I type this, I admit this could have been the point. Show the indigenous life how powerful the Ones Above's technology by "accidently" amplifying their powers, and make them crave more but I do not think this is the case. It is the equivalency of setting off a grenade in the middle of a group of people, not knowing if they have the proper shielding to survive it, and then expect them to be grateful and try to emulate it. I still see it as a huge psychic backlash across the board to all aviar of the implications that "something is coming", and that Sak was the vehicle Brandon used to explain/portray it to Dusk. Again just my own extrapolation. edit: actually a better way to elaborate what i wrote. If I have this understanding of reamatics enough to have faster than light travel, then I will know what will happen when that machine is opened. So if the case is dularium, then I will know it will have an effect on all the aviar amplifying their power, whatever those powers may be. If that is the case, then the question is why would I want that to happen, or why would I be ok with that happening? As of this point I do not have an answer that results in an advantage to the Ones Above. Now my line of reasoning doesn't conclusively prove it is not dularium, I am just pointing to the thought that if it was dularium, then following the line of reasoning I presented, it would not make sense for them to arrange the machine to be opened. I am fully open to other lines of reasoning of course.

although cliche, if kelsier spiked into another person, still DID have all his mistborn powers, then we may know the identity of the modern day mistborn serial killer. it has been said in the books, in any other age kelsier would be a criminal (more so than a thief) rather than a freedom fighter. but i hope thats not the case

I understand your point that the main religious figures use or had hemalurgy used on them, but that doesn't necessarily preclude its use for its followers. God created man, yet the religion of Christianity says that is only the realm of god. Man cannot make man (except through procreation). It's why there is the whole cloning debate and protests about genetic modification. I will take it further, Jesus got holes in his hands from being put up on the cross. Baring stigmata, the congregation does not do ritual disfigurement with (rather applicable), spikes just because Jesus was spiked. I am sure there are examples in other religions as well, I am just siting Christianity because I was raised one though I do not identify as one. As to socially, it could be a rather big problem if it is not strictly regulated. Take muggings for money or identification for example. Now add in the fact that if you knock the person out, and spike them, not only do you get money, but you also get POWER. If not regulated, you could in an extreme situation get the same scene as was with the shardblades when the knights radiant gave them up en mass. Last person standing wins and has all the power. Ethically I think it comes down to the person, or the ethnical structure that the society perscribes to. If for instance this occurred today in real life and I had no prove you were ripping out my "soul", then I would view it as organ donation and euthanasia. But knowing that in this book series "deities" exist, and that it would be factually ripping out my soul, I would take an ENTIRELY different stance on the matter. So I think it would be determinate on how knowledgeable the society is on the practice and what it involves.

I could see it ending up slightly like steel inquisitors. Admittedly it is due to them missing eyes, but they flare their steel to become savants, and "see" people by the iron in their blood and etc. So maybe color and general eyesight deteriorates, in favor of seeing everyone in terms of the metal pervading their body

Oooooooor, they get craftier, and shape their blessings like hip bones, or shoulder bones, etc. Then when x-rayed, it is a convenient hip replacement, etc.

Well this may tie into your post, or not but this for some reason popped up in my mind after reading your post. So we all accept everything on and around the island has some sort of psychic ability. So what makes the Aviar unique? Their ability to SHARE their psychic ability to who they bond with. This leads me to think that potentially if Dusk and his planet learn how the worms work, then humans could gain their OWN psychic abilities. Now I am not sure if this is where Brandon is going with the story, but if we build on the concept that different breeds of bird, when exposed to the worms result in different abilities, then would different ethnicities have the same result? Also lets take a step back from humans and focus on the birds again. What would happen if you breed one type of aviar with another? Would one ability be dominant over the other? Random? or would a whole new ability pop up?

Sad thing is, i mainly referenced you after seeing all your posts regarding hemalurgy. It took till I went to bed for it to click in my head regarding your picture too lol :::shakes head::::

Also the nature of Ruin's power is a net loss. I would buy it if the worms were actual parasites as was defined earlier in this thread, but they do provide some benefit. The worms don't just take, in fact they give. Though it would be kinda funny if you got "blessings" from eating the birds. Then it could be Ruin. Lol, hey what if the fish in pure lake is a form of hemalurgy? By eating them, you consume their spirit web, grafting it to yourself and thus get rid of arthritis or any other abilities they may offer lol. Hey Swimmingly, this all but screams you lolol

If a mistborn put up a speed bubble, and then flared eletrum, would he see the shadows of himself moving outside the bubble, or would the limits of the bubble end the effect?

Excellent point, and I see what your saying. Though this would be a stretch, but how many times in fantasy/sci-fi literature have we seen a character who is "sensitive", pick up something when it is very very strong, despite their "specialization"? Again, I admit, total stretch and I am just spinning possibilities but wouldn't it be possible that the other Aviar do not have to have the "death sight" in order to pick up with their psychic abilities that something could be very VERY wrong?

So I am reading the pre-edited portion and I came across this quote, emphasis mine: "Could he really have ever been foolish enough to be caught by cutaway vines? Near as he could tell, Sek only showed him plausible deaths. He liked to think that most were fairly unlikely - a vision of what could have happened if he'd been careless, or if his uncle's training hadn't been so extensive" So I definitely feel this supports the Sak seeing probabilities theory. Also another thought I had, for the camp of the machine NOT containing dularium. What if all the birds/the island felt the probabilities that resulted from the machine being open, were so catastrophic that it was a psychic overload. Kind of like watching a nuclear bomb go off up close and personal.

I thought Wax's skill with steel pushing and altering his weight is like Vin. She was preservation's chosen, so despite being small, her pushes and pulls were stronger and better manipulated. So Wax is Harmony's chosen, and un-naturally good with his abilities.

So few thoughts. First i feel Sak functions like Atium. Your opponent makes a choice, you see how that choices plays out in how it affects you and you act on it. Just instead of it showing the path and acting on a choice, Sak is showing probabilities. Had Sixth decided to go over to this tree, then the vines would have grabbed him and killed him. If Sixth had decided to go to a certain place in the water, the untow or whatever killed him would have killed him and so on. So I am in the camp that the machine acted like dularium, and Sixth saw all the ways he could potentially die in his tree house based on the choices he made or other inhabitants on the planet made. As I type this, its like the multi-verse theory or Schrodinger's cat. For every choice there is a result or alternate world. Sak is just very specific in showing the choices that lead to death. But I ramble on, now to get to the second point. I think depending on the timeline, it could be argued that Rosharans are the space travelers. We have already seen with and they already have fabrial technology. They just need to re-learn how to use it. And I could see a culture bound with honor, would find ways to hold "honorably" to a code but still accomplish their goals. Just because at the point in time of the stormlight archive they haven't reached FTL travel, doesn't mean that by the time of Sixth of Dust, that they haven't. Sorry for the double post, I couldn't figure out how to insert a quote in a post I am editing. One thing to point out in our world, is there is a sea cucumber, that eats plankton i think it was, and incorporates chlorophil into its body, allowing it to then use sunlight like a plant to nourish itself. So mama nightmaw giving baby nightmaw a animal to gain mind sense isn't far fetched at all. In fact we have no idea what a nightmaw's diet is. It is shown that Aviar aren't afraid of nightmaws. In fact trees with Aviar are sought out because of the mindsense blocking. So it would make more sense for the nightmaw's to prey on another creature that potentially preys on the aviar, and gain the ability that way. There are numerous parasites that go through multiple stages of maturation through numerous species. One starts in the water, is eaten by a fish, the fish is eaten by a bird, and then the bird poops out the mature parasite into the water to start the process all over again. edit: honestly i think the worms are involved in the entire ecosystem. it is stated that the shadows in the water keep close to the islands despite the fact that they could find much better hunting grounds back where the humans live. So the Aviar migrate to the pool which also feeds the plants. So creatures could potentially feed on the aviar or plants, and then in turn their waste is consumed and passes on the ability, or they are consumed and pass on the ability. and then THOSE things are consumed and so on leading the entire ecosystem developing abilities that are at the core the worms/pools

Totally picturing a side story, where a young kandra who had spent most of its life in the home land goes off to explore the world and ultimately infiltrates a prison. While investigating, it is just about to be discovered so it dives into a room. Not having the bones on hand to change shape, the kandra sees a chair in the middle of the room. Thinking to itself "perfect!" it quickly molds around the chair. Shortly after two officers dragging in a person in orange, throw the orange garbed individual into the chair and straps him in. At first concerned that it would be discovered, the kandra relaxes once it realizes no one is paying any real attention to the chair, so all that remains is to wait for everyone to leave. Another person comes in dressed all in black, with a pin of the survivor on his lapel. He begins to talk to him all about the survivor and meeting him. Hmmm, must be a religious service the young kandra thinks. This may take longer than originally expected, but ah well still just have to wait it out. Then for some reason the kandra starts to feel a humming coming from the chair it is using as a frame. This is odd, the kandra thinks. Curious, out of sight of the people, the kandra forms a nose and take a whiff. Why do I smell burning........

LOL, thank you for the link, and of course now my mind is spinning as to the ramifications of that. Right now I am reading Sixth of Dusk, but the moment I am done with that, I am hoping onto that thread, as well as searching for a discussion thread on Sixth of Dusk because my brain is spinning on that too!

Kelsier the space ship.....how could that POSSIBLY go wrong? lolol

Makes sense. Everything we see of Wax clearly shows he is a VERY experienced coinshot, so it would not be a stretch at all to imagine he would have the level of proficiency required to accomplish that. If it becomes relatively common for coinshots and lurchers to do so, and potentially accelerate travel then though it is a stretch, I could see it affecting how communication develops. For instance Japan used fax machines earlier and for far longer due to their character based language. It may take longer for fax machines to gain a hold when compared to a swift coinshot courier system. Do I wait for cities to be wired enough, and an expensive and faulty fax machine to be set up to send a missive, or do I just hand it to my local coinshot courier and he or she gets it there for me?

Could you link where you move the discussion thread so I can continue to follow? I am hesitant about spoilers, but my curiosity about the tid bits regarding eye color is killing me lol.

Just a thought regarding silver. In real life silver compounds used to be used as disinfectants and microbiocides. Antibiotics replaced much of its applications but it is still being researched in its possible medical uses. Most of what I posted is from wikipedia, but the reason it popped in my brain, is that is also mentioned in the book The Strain by Guillermo Del Toro, so out of curiosity I looked it up to verify. So maybe that is why it is used against shades? It is a natural disinfectant, or purifier? Much like how fire is viewed?

Well I know what WON'T be a challenge anymore. Once the radiants get a handle on shardplate, Adolin won't have to worry about soiling his armor anymore! He can just think the armor away and back!