Farnsworth Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 I had always assumed that Shallan's soul had "broken" and allowed spren to enter when she killed her mom. Or, maybe even later when she killed her dad. But then I was rereading it, and realized that her mom tried to kill her because she was a Radiant. She also had a shardblade. That means her soul was broken even before then. What could have happened? Was it something her dad did? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeldancer Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 I think it might be because her mom was cheating on her dad? At least that what I got out of the one chapter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aon Ene Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 My tentative guess is that Shallan showed some natural (or unnatural) ability like Kaladin did, which caused her mother to hurt her in some way. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farnsworth Posted July 31, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 (edited) @Flash Where did you get that? I don't remember that, although I could easily have missed it. Edited July 31, 2017 by Figberts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeldancer Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 2 minutes ago, Figberts said: @Flash Where did you get that? I don't remember that, although I could easily have missed it. So in the chapter where her mother tried to kill her, she had a "friend" who held Father down while she tried to kill shallan. I remember it being a guy, and I've just kind of assumed that he was somehow involved with shallans mom. Ill go look it up in my copy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathrangking Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Generally speaking her brothers were ill to begin with. it would not require a great deal to break a young child the trauma of that type of household might just be enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeldancer Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Ok here are the passages. Quote Red carpet. once white. her mother's friend lay on the floor bleeding from the arm, though that wound hadn't killed him. - Her mother's arrival, with a friend Shallon didn't recognize, to confront her father. - Her father barging in. Mother's friend with a knife, the two struggling, the friend getting cut in the arm. Blood spilled on the carpet. The friend had won that fight, eventually holding father down, pinned to the ground. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farnsworth Posted July 31, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 20 minutes ago, Flash said: Ok here are the passages. Quote Red carpet. once white. her mother's friend lay on the floor bleeding from the arm, though that wound hadn't killed him. - Her mother's arrival, with a friend Shallon didn't recognize, to confront her father. - Her father barging in. Mother's friend with a knife, the two struggling, the friend getting cut in the arm. Blood spilled on the carpet. The friend had won that fight, eventually holding father down, pinned to the ground. Yeah, that does seem like it would be pretty traumatizing. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeldancer Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 5 minutes ago, Figberts said: Yeah, that does seem like it would be pretty traumatizing. Thanks! But that wasnt what broke her. Hrm. If she had just started manifesting her powers, and that's when her mom attacked her... something broke her before that. I question whether even an unfaithful mom could have made a child break, because little kids don't understand that kind of thing, much less have it crack their soul. However, I am very curious about the friend of the Mother. Who was he? Was he in a relationship with Shallans mom? Was he a ghostblood? What happened to him afterward? It says he didn't die from that wound. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toaster Retribution Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Figberts said: Yeah, that does seem like it would be pretty traumatizing. Thanks! Those events were the ones in which she used her Shardblade though, and killed her mother. So she must have been a Radiant before then. EDIT: Flash is worthy of his name. I got ninja'd. Edited July 31, 2017 by Toaster Retribution Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crucible of Shards Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 (edited) I recently started a thread about this very subject here. I'm not sure if it covers any additional ground, but Calderis had some good insights. My conclusion was that if everyone, including her siblings and servants were very ready to accept the proposition that Shallan's father killed his wife and her lover, (and dismiss Shallan's assertions of her father's innocence) then it is likely that he (and quite likely Shallan's mother) is the reason she was broken at such a relatively young age. Edited July 31, 2017 by Crucible of Shards Additional thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeldancer Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 I sort of agree with Calderis's assumptions about her mother. They make sense. But... I feel like there is something more going on. Why did her mom want to kill her? Why would she hate Radiants so much? How would she even know what she was? And who is the friend? Why would this man who shallan had never seen before want to kill shallan? What motivation could he possibly have? And frankly, Shallan make a lot of progress with her truths at a fairly young age in order to summon a shard blade. What truths did she have in order to advance? When did she complete the first oath? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crucible of Shards Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 IIRC I think she actually got to the final advancement, although I'm sure @The One Who Connects @Calderis or @Extesian could find the WoB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Just now, Crucible of Shards said: IIRC I think she actually got to the final advancement, although I'm sure @The One Who Connects @Calderis or @Extesian could find the WoB She's only 1 ahead of Kaladin, which is 4 out of 5. Quote tganchero How many oaths can a Radiant swear? Brandon Sanderson There is an upper-limit/threshold to the number of oaths a Radiant may make. By the end of WoR, Shallan is a step higher than Kaladin. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 (edited) I've said this in another thread before, but I think that Shallan's mother was most likely emotionally and/or physically abusive. The woman was willing to murder her child. All of her children were emotionally shattered in some way. Everyone was perfectly willing to believe that Lin had murdered his wife. The only evidence we have to show that life before her mother's death was shiny and happy is from Shallan herself, and we all know how flawlessly honest she is with herself. Edit: started typing this in one location, and finished when I got home and since then the @Crucible of Shards linked to his Q&A topic. As to why Shallan's mother and a strange man would be wanting to kill surgebinders, I think it's a little bit more than coincidence that Helaran sought the Skybreakers. Edited July 31, 2017 by Calderis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeldancer Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 3 minutes ago, Calderis said: I've said this in another thread before, but I think that Shallan's mother was most likely emotionally and/or physically abusive. The woman was willing to murder her child. All of her children were emotionally shattered in some way. Everyone was perfectly willing to believe that Lin had murdered his wife. The only evidence we have to show that life before her mother's death was shiny and happy is from Shallan herself, and we all know how flawlessly honest she is with herself. Edit: started typing this in one location, and finished when I got home and since then the @Crucible of Shards linked to his Q&A topic. As to why Shallan's mother and a strange man would be wanting to kill surgebinders, I think it's a little bit more than coincidence that Helaran sought the Skybreakers. I was starting to suspect that very thing... although if that man were a skybreaker, I doubt he would have died that day. Or that shallan would have survived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crucible of Shards Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 2 minutes ago, Flash said: I was starting to suspect that very thing... although if that man were a skybreaker, I doubt he would have died that day. Or that shallan would have survived. Well, just because he sought them out doesn't mean he actually became one, as the many, many Helaran theory threads will tell you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 1 minute ago, Flash said: I was starting to suspect that very thing... although if that man were a skybreaker, I doubt he would have died that day. Or that shallan would have survived. Just because he was a part of the group doesn't mean that he was a surgebinder himself. We know there are surgebinders with Nale, but organization probably includes squires and hopefuls as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeldancer Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Just now, Crucible of Shards said: Well, just because he sought them out doesn't mean he actually became one, as the many, many Helaran theory threads will tell you. Lol I was talking about Shallans moms friend. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crucible of Shards Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Just now, Flash said: Lol I was talking about Shallans moms friend. Oh. My bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeldancer Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 2 minutes ago, Crucible of Shards said: Oh. My bad. That being said, I am partial to the theory that Helaran is still alive. However the evidence that he had dead plate and blade at any point is too much for me to think he ever actually became a skybreaker. Otherwise we would have seen him in edgedancer. I think Lift would have mentioned a red head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathrangking Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Her childhood would have been horrific her older siblings save perhaps Helaran were scarred and emotionally damaged. This may well have been a result of her mother's uncaring and dark behavior. It occurs to me now that perhaps with the death of her mother what we saw was a adoption of a new role on Lin's part. Let's examine what we know Lin was a loving father up until the time when his wife was killed by Shallan. He shouldered the blame and spared Shallan from then on he is abusive and is now possessed of a short temper. Could it be that maybe he adopted the persona of his dead wife as a coping mechanism for his grief if so then this would explain Shallan's breaking at such an early age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errdil Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Wait, is it confirmed that radiants need to snap to form Nahel Bond? Either way, her mother was willing to kill her. Take a minute to let it sink in. One could come to a conclusion, that their family wasn't all sunshine and rainbows even before her mother learned about Shallan's abilities. Or maybe in Oathbringer we'll learn how she killed all of her grandparents too. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 53 minutes ago, Errdil said: Wait, is it confirmed that radiants need to snap to form Nahel Bond? Yes it's confirmed. http://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=1083#10 Quote JEREMY We know that Mistborn needed to Snap, and Surgebinders needed have the cracks in their souls filled. But what about the people in Warbreaker or Elantris? Is cracking and snapping only required on certain worlds? BRANDON SANDERSON (PARAPHRASED) This is universal to the cosmere; however, in certain magic systems / on certain worlds, this is easier than others. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxal Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 I am extraordinarily boring. My personal thoughts are Shallan's family merely was an... unhappy one. She once drew a drawing of what she claimed once was her family: they were all happy. I think it was Hoid who seen it and I honestly don't recall the whole scene, but my thoughts have always been this drawing was a lie, a powerful lie, the lie which drew Pattern. Shallan's family never were happy. Her mother probably cheated on her father. She probably had her beliefs. It may be she didn't love her children all that much. Shallan's parents probably fought. There probably was a lot of conflict within this family and conflict can impact children: there is no need for anything else to have happened. A child's mind can crack over very little things and I think Shallan's initial break was just a result from being born into a dysfunctional family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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