Cosmere Maps [AU Spoiliers]

[Argel he/him]

Has Vax been confirmed as a planet?

[HoidvsVoid]

I am pretty sure it isn't, if coppermind is up to date. I seem to recall a WoB saying so but I might be making it up. 

Vax is confirmed I think.

Edited November 22, 2016 by HoidvsVoid

[PallonianFire he/him]

I dunno if it's been confirmed by WoB, but the Elantris anniversary Ars Arcanum certainly makes it sound like a planet.

[Argent he/him]

49 minutes ago, Argel said:

Has Vax been confirmed as a planet?

 

48 minutes ago, HoidvsVoid said:

I am pretty sure it isn't, if coppermind is up to date. I seem to recall a WoB saying so but I might be making it up. 

Vax is confirmed I think.

 

44 minutes ago, PallonianFire said:

I dunno if it's been confirmed by WoB, but the Elantris anniversary Ars Arcanum certainly makes it sound like a planet.

Vax has not officially been confirmed as a planet. In fact, Brandon is being intentionally vague about it - when I was telling another fan about it during Brandon's latest visit to Chicago, I said it was strongly suggested that Vax is a place (which Brandon agreed with it). I took that as a confirmation that Vax is a planet, but Brandon corrected me that the implication was only for a place, not necessarily a planet.

This being said, I do believe it's a planet. But this has not been confirmed.

[Asperity he/him]

Regarding that constellation chart, do we know why the constellations have images (like the knight with sword, a female face, etc)? Are they the Cosmere constellations? (like we have a bull for Taurus, that kind of thing)

And stupid question that I'm sure I know but can't recall right now: what is the Scar? Kinda surprised to see Sel and Nalthis so (relatively) close.

[Landis963 he/him]

6 hours ago, Kythis said:

Regarding that constellation chart, do we know why the constellations have images (like the knight with sword, a female face, etc)? Are they the Cosmere constellations? (like we have a bull for Taurus, that kind of thing)

And stupid question that I'm sure I know but can't recall right now: what is the Scar? Kinda surprised to see Sel and Nalthis so (relatively) close.

It's a collection of stars that can be seen from multiple systems: Characters from Roshar and Scadrial both mention it under different names.  (As "Taln's Scar" and "the Red Rip", respectively)  Its distinctive red coloration has lead some to assume that it is Significant to the history of the Cosmere - a claim that is not entirely without merit given the information we have.  

Edited November 27, 2016 by Landis963

[WeiryWriter he/him]

4 hours ago, Kythis said:

Regarding that constellation chart, do we know why the constellations have images (like the knight with sword, a female face, etc)? Are they the Cosmere constellations? (like we have a bull for Taurus, that kind of thing)

I'm not sure I entirely understand your question. Constellations pretty much always have images associated with them? That's kind of how they are defined in the first place? Unless you mean the signs of the Zodiac? In which case I case I don't think these have anything to do with a Zodiac. This is just the view of the cosmere from the perspective of Silverlight.

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And stupid question that I'm sure I know but can't recall right now: what is the Scar?

As Landis said it's the red swath of stars known as Taln's Scar on Roshar and the Red Rip on Scadrial.

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Kinda surprised to see Sel and Nalthis so (relatively) close.

I would be very leery of basing any sense of "closeness" based off a star chart like this, as it does not take into account how far the stars are from the viewer.

[Landis963 he/him]

2 hours ago, Ookla the Indefinite said:

I would be very leery of basing any sense of "closeness" based off a star chart like this, as it does not take into account how far the stars are from the viewer.

However, if someone goes into the Cognitive Realm armed with this map, then using it to navigate would probably warp the Cognitive Realm; i.e. basing one's knowledge of the Cognitive distances between systems on that map would probably alter those Cognitive distances to fit, or at least the headings between them.  (I'm thinking of how Kelsier knew the Ire were past the oceans, so he went directly away from Scadrial and lo and behold the fortress of the Ire was directly in his path once he got deep enough into space)

Edited November 27, 2016 by Landis963

[Asperity he/him]

Ah yeah. For some reason, I thought that the Red Rip/Scar may have been in one of the already-known systems. Seems very far removed from the other Shardworlds so that's interesting too.

[Zmann966 he/him]

On 11/22/2016 at 5:36 PM, PallonianFire said:

Of the planets we know about. Isn't there another major Shardworld unaccounted for?

Ashyn isn't what you're thinking about correct? As it isn't a major shardworld?

It is the place of the next novella though, where people attain powers through disease... 

[Landis963 he/him]

6 hours ago, Zmann966 said:

Ashyn isn't what you're thinking about correct? As it isn't a major shardworld?

It is the place of the next novella though, where people attain powers through disease... 

Ashyn is still a minor Shardworld, I believe.  The world of Dark One, however, is still in the offing, and that might be a major Shardworld. 

[ScarletSabre he/him]

3 hours ago, Landis963 said:

Ashyn is still a minor Shardworld, I believe.  The world of Dark One, however, is still in the offing, and that might be a major Shardworld. 

Depending on the timeline and setting of Dark One, I'm wondering if Ambition relocates to the world it's set on, and is involved in the story. Becoming the prophesied evil destroyer sounds like something a warped, injured Ambition would have a hand in....

[Pagerunner he/him]

15 hours ago, Zmann966 said:

Ashyn isn't what you're thinking about correct? As it isn't a major shardworld?

It is the place of the next novella though, where people attain powers through disease... 

 

9 hours ago, Landis963 said:

Ashyn is still a minor Shardworld, I believe.  The world of Dark One, however, is still in the offing, and that might be a major Shardworld. 

I think Ashyn is a major Shardworld. Its story, The Silence Divine, started out as a full novel, but Brandon is thinking of shortening it to a novella. Contrast that with Sixth of the Dusk and Shadows for Silence, which were developed as stories and placed on Shardworlds which Brandon had already created for worldbuilding purposes. (See Brandon's postscripts in AU, especially for SSFH. Threnody has existed as a concept since his unpublished days, and when he was asked by GRRM for a story he created one set there.)

It's also possible that Ashyn will play a large role in Stormlight, possibly being connected like Warbreaker is, with Vasher being a Way of Kings Prime character. Brandon has RAFOd questions about it in the past because of the influence of Rosharan Shards on it.

The now-defunct 36 book outline which Brandon had spoken of back in the day consisted of: 10 Stormlight, 9 Mistborn, 7 Dragonsteel, 3 Elantris, 3 White Sand, 2 Warbreaker, Silence Divine, and one other book. (Possibly Aether of Night, but I've never been able to find a direct confirmation of that, and the unpublished novel was supposed to kick off a series. I won't speculate more outside of the Aether spoiler board.) I only say this to show that, even counting Ashyn and Braize as core Shardworlds, there are still only 8 represented in the series that we know. So, there are at least two core Shardworlds unaccounted for, and possibly as many as 5 in an extreme case (if the three worlds of the Rosharan system all count as 1, and something funky is happening with Yolen such that it doesn't count).

Edited November 28, 2016 by Pagerunner
https://xkcd.com/859/

[Landis963 he/him]

2 hours ago, Pagerunner said:

 

I think Ashyn is a major Shardworld. Its story, The Silence Divine, started out as a full novel, but Brandon is thinking of shortening it to a novella. Contrast that with Sixth of the Dusk and Shadows for Silence, which were developed as stories and placed on Shardworlds which Brandon had already created for worldbuilding purposes. (See Brandon's postscripts in AU, especially for SSFH. Threnody has existed as a concept since his unpublished days, and when he was asked by GRRM for a story he created one set there.)

It's also possible that Ashyn will play a large role in Stormlight, possibly being connected like Warbreaker is, with Vasher being a Way of Kings Prime character. Brandon has RAFOd questions about it in the past because of the influence of Rosharan Shards on it.

The now-defunct 36 book outline which Brandon had spoken of back in the day consisted of: 10 Stormlight, 9 Mistborn, 7 Dragonsteel, 3 Elantris, 3 White Sand, 2 Warbreaker, Silence Divine, and one other book. (Possibly Aether of Night, but I've never been able to find a direct confirmation of that, and the unpublished novel was supposed to kick off a series. I won't speculate more outside of the Aether spoiler board.) I only say this to show that, even counting Ashyn and Braize as core Shardworlds, there are still only 8 represented in the series that we know. So, there are at least two core Shardworlds unaccounted for, and possibly as many as 5 in an extreme case (if the three worlds of the Rosharan system all count as 1, and something funky is happening with Yolen such that it doesn't count).

Ashyn is not a major Shardworld because Khriss would have mentioned the fact that a Shard is in residence there.  (Although Khriss does not mention where Odium's locus is, or indeed if he even has one in the Rosharan system, and someone without knowledge of The Stormlight Archive would be left unaware that Honor's and Cultivation's Shardpools are both on the planet of Roshar)

There might be a disconnect in parlance here.  (When I call a cosmere planet a "Major" shardworld, I am assuming that there is a Shard present, e.g. Scadrial, Nalthis.  In contrast, "Minor" Shardworlds have never had a Shard put down roots, e.g. Threnody, First of the Sun.  Sel is a bit of an edge case because of the Dor, but for lack of a better option I've been grandfathering it into the Major Shardworld category)

[Amanuensis he/him]

I think Sel most definitely applies, because the Shards (or at least their bits and pieces) still reside there. They just don't have a living Vessel controlling them (although I would not be surprised if large amounts of them were held by either Skai and Aona's Cognitive Shadows, or perhaps by the self-aware countries/continents, similar to how Tanavast's Cognitive Shadow and the Stormfather fused).

Edited November 28, 2016 by Amanuensis

[Pagerunner he/him]

33 minutes ago, Landis963 said:

Ashyn is not a major Shardworld because Khriss would have mentioned the fact that a Shard is in residence there.  (Although Khriss does not mention where Odium's locus is, or indeed if he even has one in the Rosharan system, and someone without knowledge of The Stormlight Archive would be left unaware that Honor's and Cultivation's Shardpools are both on the planet of Roshar)

There might be a disconnect in parlance here.  (When I call a cosmere planet a "Major" shardworld, I am assuming that there is a Shard present, e.g. Scadrial, Nalthis.  In contrast, "Minor" Shardworlds have never had a Shard put down roots, e.g. Threnody, First of the Sun.  Sel is a bit of an edge case because of the Dor, but for lack of a better option I've been grandfathering it into the Major Shardworld category)

Right, the terminology can be a little confusing. Brandon's '10 core Shardworlds' quote can be found here. They tell the 'overarching story of the cosmere,' and they all have 'significant Shardic influence,' although that doesn't mean they all have a Shard.

I do wonder how many worlds have one or more Shards, and thus have perpendicularities and can participate in the worldhopping community. (This seems to be more in-line with your definition of Major Shardworlds.) Aside from the 6 planets for the 6 planned Cosmere series (we'll leave Yolen and Taldain on that list, even though they're not members of the worldhopping community right now), Mraize's collection implies that there's another world, where the Aethers are from (they probably won't be from Yolen when they finally appear officially).

I don't think Dark One's planet will be one of the 10 core Shardworlds, since it might not be in the cosmere. (It's gone back and forth in various States of the Sanderson, and the 2015 edition didn't say either way). It can't tell the 'overarching story' if it won't necessarily be part of that story. I think this makes it difficult to place a Shard there, since what would happen to that Shard in the cosmere canon if the series wound up being non-cosmere? (Granted, Brandon might have contingencies. Like, for an illustration that is FALSE FALSE FALSE and don't take it too far 'cause I haven't even read this story, let's say Ambition was the Shard for Rithmatist while it was a possible cosmere story. When the story wound up outside the cosmere, Brandon had Ambition get killed by Odium before Investing in a planet. All I'm trying to say is that Dark One might have a Shard, but that doesn't mean it's a 'core Shardworld' by Brandon's definition, or even necessarily will stay in the cosmere.)

[StormingTexan he/him]

Brandon is the ultimate answer tease. He gives us all this then adds "The Scar". I think it makes sense this could be Taln's Scar/Red Rip. Anyway pure speculation but to me it makes the most sense this POV is from Silverlight wherever that may reside. 

So a little confused to see Scadrial and Nalthis in the same constellation.  Trying to not read too much in to this but it seems odd to me. 

 

[Amanuensis he/him]

Since I haven't seen anyone else mention it yet, the knowledge that this map is from Silverlight's perspective has convinced me that the "Restaurant at the End of the Cosmere" does not exist in the Cognitive Realm, which is interesting to me since that was a theory at some point (not sure if it's still believed or not). Which means that it's both accessible via the Cognitive Realm (has it's own reliable perpendicularity) and that it exists in a separate system than the rest of the worlds that we've seen so far. Given how often Khriss notes perpendicularities that aren't made up of a specific Shard's investiture (First of the Sun, Threnody), I wonder if Silverlight is inhabited (and perhaps ran by) a Shard that encourages an intermixing culture / adventure / research.

Edited November 28, 2016 by Amanuensis

[Windrunner he/him]

I think that's an excellent point. If this view is truly from Silverlight, it must have at least some component in the Physical Realm. (Although the idea of a city that is populated in both the Physical Realm and the Cognitive Realm is kind of fun.) It could still be some sort of space ship or station, but upon closer review of the image itself, it really does appear to be an ancient mural of some sort, with cracks in the paint and whatnot, which implies to me that this is a reproduction from an actual building, much like many of the Stormlight endpapers.

[Djarskublar he/him]

Is it confirmed to be from Silverlight? I though that was just a good guess...

[Pagerunner he/him]

5 minutes ago, Djarskublar said:

Is it confirmed to be from Silverlight? I though that was just a good guess...

Here's the source.

[PallonianFire he/him]

On 11/27/2016 at 11:23 PM, Zmann966 said:

Ashyn isn't what you're thinking about correct? As it isn't a major shardworld?

Correct. We've known about Ahsyn for a long time.

[Oversleep]

I think that Dark One can be cosmere just fine. IIRC Rithmatist was supposed to be cosmere but then wasn't and let's face it, Calamity totally sounds like a Shard (that's why RECKONERS ISN'T COSMERE meme exist in the first place).

[VirtuousTraveller]

As I'm wondering about Vax being a place, but not necessarily a planet, is it possible that this refers to a location within Shadesmar somewhere?  After all, that's where Ati appears before moving on to the Beyond in MB: SH - assuming the atmosphere of the Cognitive Realm has some similarity everywhere, that makes the most sense to me.

[Djarskublar he/him]

I just had a thought. The star chart is done from the perspective of Silverlight. I think Brandon is trolling us a bit here. I put two and two together on this. A star chart really should be circular. I think Isaac was saying the chart is kinda strange perspective wise, like it is imagined or something. The Cognitive Realm is '2 dimensional' in that planets just flow into each other. Maybe the star chart is actually a map of the Cognitive Realm! So it being from the perspective of Silverlight just means that it is the Cognitive map. That is pretty clever of Brandon if it is the case.