the most useless uses for useful powers

[Pathfinder]

Try Forging away your capacity to do so.

Didn't Shai make a stamp to do exactly that? lol

[kinxer]

Get rid of waste paper by giving it a duodecuple (12 times; I learned that word for this post) Lashing upward and let adiabatic pressure destroy it.

Edited September 1, 2014 by kinxer

[king of nowhere]

Get rid of waste paper by giving it a duodecuple (12 times; I learned that word for this post) Lashing upward and let adiabatic pressure destroy it.

Lash it one hundred times instead, and watch as it accelerates to such ludicrous speed that it chatches fire by attrition with the air, burning with merely a trace of ash. Also doubles as room heating system.

[kinxer]

Is it possible to die from excessive Stormlight drain? Because that could do it.

Awaken a mannequin with the command "Become expensive."
Awaken a puppet with the command "Be a real boy."

Edit: Also, assuming lashings are additive, wouldn't that accelerate the paper (until it vaporized) at an acceleration of something close to 1 km/s^2?

Edited September 4, 2014 by kinxer

[lookingglass]

Awaken a puppet with the command "Be a real boy."

 

Possibly the best command ever! It would be even better to use the Mona Lisa or another famous painting and drain its colors to awaken the puppet.

[Curiosity]

Awaken a gemstone with Stormlight and watch as the Investiture leaks... 

[kinxer]

Awaken a gemstone with Stormlight and watch as the Investiture leaks...

Better yet, infuse a gem with a Breath and watch as a part of someone's soul burns away.

[Lightsworn Panda]

Lash yourself a couple thousand times to the sky, and, at the same time, lash yourself as many and more times to the ground.

 

It's called walking in style (if style meant an excessive waste of power.) 

 

Use a teleportation Aon to get to the toilet.

[Pathfinder]

Lash yourself a couple thousand times to the sky, and, at the same time, lash yourself as many and more times to the ground.

 

It's called walking in style (if style meant an excessive waste of power.) 

 

Use a teleportation Aon to get to the toilet.

Would that tear you in two?

[BlackYeti]

Would that tear you in two?

 

I don't think so. When you lash yourself upwards once you become weightless, there is no mention of either Szeth or Kaladin feeling a force pulling them in both directions (as far as I can recall). I think that the forces resulting from the lashings would just cancel each other out.

 

Now, if there were some way to lash your upper body upwards and your lower body downwards, then it might tear your body in half, but the lashings apparently don't work like that.

[Pathfinder]

I don't think so. When you lash yourself upwards once you become weightless, there is no mention of either Szeth or Kaladin feeling a force pulling them in both directions (as far as I can recall). I think that the forces resulting from the lashings would just cancel each other out.

 

Now, if there were some way to lash your upper body upwards and your lower body downwards, then it might tear your body in half, but the lashings apparently don't work like that.

Well lashing upwards once just cancels out the downward pull, but it was states COUNTLESS lashings in both directions. True I do not recall there being any mention of that instance, but there have been plenty where Kal suddenly lashed himself multiple times in a direction and felt a painful yank in that direction. Basically I am picturing the times when Vin pulled or pushed in all directions with dulerium but had to flare pewter because it felt like her body was being torn apart

[A Joe in the Bush]

Now, if there were some way to lash your upper body upwards and your lower body downwards, then it might tear your body in half, but the lashings apparently don't work like that.

 

Lash your UPPER Body DOWN, and Lash your LOWER Body UP.

[BlackYeti]

Well lashing upwards once just cancels out the downward pull, but it was states COUNTLESS lashings in both directions. True I do not recall there being any mention of that instance, but there have been plenty where Kal suddenly lashed himself multiple times in a direction and felt a painful yank in that direction. Basically I am picturing the times when Vin pulled or pushed in all directions with dulerium but had to flare pewter because it felt like her body was being torn apart

 

But that's my point, lashing upwards cancels out the downward pull, so logically if you lash yourself upwards once and downwards twice, the opposing pulls would also cancel. By extension: for all x, lashing yourself upwards x times and downwards (x+1) times, the pulls will cancel. (The confusing part is that if you lash yourself sideways, you apparently stop being pulled downwards. I would have thought that in order to stand on a wall you would have to lash yourself both upwards and sideways, but you evidently don't: I never have understood that.)

 

The difference between the Basic Lashing and Allomantic steel/Iron is that one is adding/changing a natural force, the other is the force. When Vin pushed/pulled in opposite directions, it was like she had invisible arms that were literally pushing/pulling on her body. When Kaladin lashes himself multiple times in one direction, he naturally feels a powerful yank, because he is feeling the force of gravity multiplied that many times in that direction. In our example though, we have two external forces meeting equally at the position of our Windrunner, so they cancel and he/she feels nothing.

 

Lash your UPPER Body DOWN, and Lash your LOWER Body UP.

 

 

If we wanted to crush his body, then that would be correct. But unless I'm being stupid, it would have to be UPPER Body UP, LOWER Body DOWN, in order to tear yourself in half.

Edited September 4, 2014 by BlackYeti

[A Joe in the Bush]

If we wanted to crush his body, then that would be correct. But unless I'm being stupid, it would have to be UPPER Body UP, LOWER Body DOWN, in order to tear yourself in half.

 

That's What I meant.

[Voidus]

Lash your left hand in, Lash your left hand out, Lash your left hand in and then shake it all about.

[kinxer]

But that's my point, lashing upwards cancels out the downward pull, so logically if you lash yourself upwards once and downwards twice, the opposing pulls would also cancel. By extension: for all x, lashing yourself upwards x times and downwards (x+1) times, the pulls will cancel. (The confusing part is that if you lash yourself sideways, you apparently stop being pulled downwards. I would have thought that in order to stand on a wall you would have to lash yourself both upwards and sideways, but you evidently don't: I never have understood that.)

 

The difference between the Basic Lashing and Allomantic steel/Iron is that one is adding/changing a natural force, the other is the force. When Vin pushed/pulled in opposite directions, it was like she had invisible arms that were literally pushing/pulling on her body. When Kaladin lashes himself multiple times in one direction, he naturally feels a powerful yank, because he is feeling the force of gravity multiplied that many times in that direction. In our example though, we have two external forces meeting equally at the position of our Windrunner, so they cancel and he/she feels nothing.

 

 

 

If we wanted to crush his body, then that would be correct. But unless I'm being stupid, it would have to be UPPER Body UP, LOWER Body DOWN, in order to tear yourself in half.

 

I was under the impression that a Half-Lashing upward made you weightless and a Lashing up switched gravity upward.

[BlackYeti]

I was under the impression that a Half-Lashing upward made you weightless and a Lashing up switched gravity upward.

 

Well this is embarrassing, you are absolutely correct. This also explains the problem that I was having with vector addition. I'm an idiot (or else I shouldn't really be posting at 4am).

 

I think the main point of my post is still correct though: I just got the numbers a bit wrong.

[Pathfinder]

I think the main point of my post is still correct though: I just got the numbers a bit wrong.

I dunno, I think the half lashings effect is minor enough that the feeling is negligible, but it doesn't negate the force involved. Increase the force involved, and although the effect would be the same (the object would maintain its location), the stress over the object would be increased. Also just because it is a "natural" force does not inherently mean it functions differently. Gravity is still a pull on the body. While googling I came across an equation that calculated at what point from the center of the earth and moon, does their gravity negate each other? But in this case it is referring to the distance away from each body. Go far enough away from each pull, then the affect is negligible enough to have no discernible effect. Conversely, in this case, it would be like moving the moon and the earth closer and closer to each other as you remain in the gravitation "center" of their interacting fields. 

[BlackYeti]

While googling I came across an equation that calculated at what point from the center of the earth and moon, does their gravity negate each other? But in this case it is referring to the distance away from each body. Go far enough away from each pull, then the affect is negligible enough to have no discernible effect. Conversely, in this case, it would be like moving the moon and the earth closer and closer to each other as you remain in the gravitation "center" of their interacting fields. 

 

I was thinking of it more in terms of being at the centre of mass of a gravitational body. If we take the earth as an example, at sea level the acceleration due to earth's gravity, g = 9.81ms^-2. As you go down below the earth's surface that number will grow steadily larger until you reach the earth's centre, at which point it will drop to 0ms^-2 as the gravity from all directions precisely cancels itself out. Any object at this point (though how it got to this point would be anyone's guess) would therefore become weightless.

[kinxer]

I would agree that the lashings cancel out, except that I'm fairly certain I remember a quote from WoR in which Kaladin (while way up in the air) lashes himself up and down at the same time, which affixes him in the air, not weightless, but rather held in place. I don't have a quote, as I don't currently have access to a copy of the book.

Also, to try and return to the point of this thread:

Expend gratuitous amounts of stormlight to play ping pong on the wall. Bonus points if you awaken a desk lamp (metal, of course) to play against you.

[Pathfinder]

I was thinking of it more in terms of being at the centre of mass of a gravitational body. If we take the earth as an example, at sea level the acceleration due to earth's gravity, g = 9.81ms^-2. As you go down below the earth's surface that number will grow steadily larger until you reach the earth's centre, at which point it will drop to 0ms^-2 as the gravity from all directions precisely cancels itself out. Any object at this point (though how it got to this point would be anyone's guess) would therefore become weightless.

But he isn't the center of the gravitational well. I will gladly look up quotes, but literally it is Szeth or Kal going "The source of gravity is over there, and I am making that source's gravitational pull such and such strength". That is how they get directional flight. I am sorry, I did not mean to derail this thread. BlackYeti, feel free to respond and so as to not further derail, I will leave it at that. I did enjoy our back and forth, and in no way am cutting this short due to differing thoughts on the subject. I just don't want to take over this fun thread. Thank you both BlackYeti and Kinxer for contributing and causing my knowledge of the subject to grow 

[Curiosity]

Use Elscalling to cross the ocean and forget to bring enough Stormlight with you. Try to survive in the Cognitive Realm.

[BlackYeti]

But he isn't the center of the gravitational well. I will gladly look up quotes, but literally it is Szeth or Kal going "The source of gravity is over there, and I am making that source's gravitational pull such and such strength". That is how they get directional flight. I am sorry, I did not mean to derail this thread. BlackYeti, feel free to respond and so as to not further derail, I will leave it at that. I did enjoy our back and forth, and in no way am cutting this short due to differing thoughts on the subject. I just don't want to take over this fun thread. Thank you both BlackYeti and Kinxer for contributing and causing my knowledge of the subject to grow 

 

No he isn’t at the centre, but that isn’t what’s important, only that the forces involved are precisely equal and precisely opposite. Beyond that, the only real difference between the two situations is that one of them is 3-dimensional, the other 1-dimensional.

 

According to the Coppermind, Rosharan gravity is 0.7g, which equates to 6.86ms^-2. When a Windrunner changes the vector of his/her gravity, the result will be based off of that number. So if Kaladin were to lash himself straight upwards (for simplicity, let’s assume that Roshar has no atmosphere) he would accelerate in that direction at a rate of 6.86ms^-2 initially. However as he gets further from the centre of mass, that rate of acceleration should decrease. In other words the strength of the gravity is the same, merely inverted. Therefore, if he lashes himself in two precisely opposite directions, we know that the forces in both directions must be equivalent (to put it another way, the absolute values of the scalar part of the forces are identical).

 

I want to try and better explain my earlier point about the Basic Lashing involving natural forces, since I don’t think I managed to properly express it. Consider this WoB regarding time bubbles in Mistborn:

 

KURKISTAN

Time Bubbles:

If you are standing inside of a time bubble, and throw a spear out of the bubble, what happens to that spear as it traverses the border of the bubble? Are different parts of the spear ever in different "time zones," going fundamentally different speeds?

On that line of reasoning, what would happen to a train and its occupants if Marisi stood next to railroad tracks holding up a Cadmium bubble while that train sped by?

BRANDON SANDERSON

In general, a large object going through a time bubble is not going to notice. An object is either in or out, and it depends in part on how the object views itself. People inside the train would be inside of its influence, and wouldn't notice the bubble. The spear would go from one to the other, but would never be in both.

source

 

I think that, as with the time bubbles, someone affected by the Basic Lashing will be entirely affected by it due to their perception of the force. So for someone lashed in a given direction, every cell, every molecule in their body will be affected equally by the lashing. So when lashed in two opposing directions, the forces will be precisely cancelled out at every point in their body.

 

I hope I’ve made my argument clearer now, I don’t think that there is anything more that I can say to support my position. I’ve also enjoyed our discussion. 

 

Since I’m feeling a bit guilty for going so far off topic, allow me to contribute something towards it. I’d use 1000 Breaths to awaken a fork to eat my dinner with, that way I could be sure to have some company. Not sure what Command I would use, maybe “Skewer things”? (I’m not sure if someone already thought of this one or not, I haven't had time to read all 28 pages.)

Edited September 4, 2014 by BlackYeti

[kinxer]

Awaken a coin with the command "Land on your edge."

[TalenelStonesiniew]

Soulcast the bags of sugar at the grocery store into salt.