Opal Lion Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 Lion finds this result interesting yet unexpected. Lion knows that statistically we are much more likely to kill a villager than a eliminator. Lion wonders if the train on Crocodile was at all influenced by the bad guys or if they simply stood back and let nature take its course. Lion wonders a lot of things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlet Octopus Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 I do think that the Croc train was propagated by the elims. I think at least one of the vote manips was elim as well. That makes me more suspicious of Gorilla and Saffron and less suspicious of Chameleon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charcoal Hyena Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Chartreuse Penguin said: Sorry I'd been out n about the entire day and only now have I gotten a chance to properly look at the thread. Thanks Meerkat. All cards on the table, Hyena, here's what went down w me: My initial vote on you was largely because I didn't like the fact that your first post was a huge hedgey reads list that had the potential to bent in any direction to assist in any future elim needs. I misread your reply to that as saying that you'd written that entire post before opening your GM PM, which I found to be very odd and hence left my vote where it was. Not a screaming red flag or anything, but like others have brought up, on D1 you sorta just gotta pounce on whatever little thing you can. After that things happened and I eventually ended up discussing your post with Meerkat in our PM, and they brought up the fact that you'd said you had only BEGUN writing that post before reading your GM PM. I found this to be even odder cuz like why even bring the fact up then? It basically means nothing when you'd yet to type up 90% of it, like you say. This seemed suspicious to me because elims often just add unnecessary facts and fluff-like details to their posts for add an element of the villager ethos, if you know what I mean. But at this point I was kinda rooting for a three-way tie cuz I thought it would be fun to see 1) randomised exes 2) how the vote manips and things would play out (if at all) and my vote sitting on your name in solitude didnt seem to be working forwards a tie so I started looking at other options (i.e. my temporary experimental vote on Cham, which I was hoping would lead me to comprehend other options). However, when Meerkat switched their vote to yours I dropped all my other trains of thought and replaced my vote back on you in hopes that one more person might add their vote to you as well, pushing your exe up as another tied candidate. Then I went to bed and later found out that no one did add a vote to you. A three-way tie did end up happening though! Shouldve maybe gone for a four-way tie though, cuz vote manip dissolved the tie. I will probably give my own thoughts on the vote shenanigans soon That a nice summary? I certainly understand where you're coming from on "potential to be bent in any direction," however, I'd like to point out the use of the word "potential." You call it "huge hedgey" but to me, being hedgy is going back and forth on reads, which I've not done I completely agree that players need to look out for suspicious changes to other's reads, but I don't believe I hedged or that people should be voted for something that might happen in the future Either way, our prolonged interaction has left me feeling mostly positive about you. It's clear to me you're more paranoid rather than being nitpicky about my reads themselves. I would expect an elim to point out specifics or push for my lynch more aggressively, rather than get caught up in hypothetical scenarios or preconceptions and then leave it to fate. That said, I'm curious what thoughts you have on the rest of the execution options, as well as if any of their voters stand out. In the meantime, I'll continue working on a more detailed reads list / analysis of recent events. Edited January 6, 2022 by Charcoal Hyena Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emerald Falcon Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 6 hours ago, Salmon Meerkat said: this jumps out @ me a bit b/c im trying 2 understand what falcon is saying - y is swan of concern when swan had 2 votes @ that point in the cycle? i get the unease w/ cycle quietness given ties & i am a bit confused at why the lack of pushback is startling b/c in a cycle w/ a 3 way (near 5 way) & vote manip, i feel like quietness implies either vote was sufficiently diluted (1/3 odds not bad odds & again, possibility of dilution to 1/5 per candidate), no elims were threatened (of concern yes) or behind-the-scenes vote manip It was the whole cycle though. I never felt any pushback on anything besides zebra. no one ever fully formed other wagons, just...tied everything. Nothing passed Iguana until the very end. I mentioned them as coinshot targets for the same reason you did. I think Iguana might be village at this point, but that doesn't mean they're not going to me a mislynch down the line. Iguana was the direct counterwagon, and chameleon is closely tied with Iguana. Iguana and Chameleon are in a position where if I was an Elim they are never getting NKd. So, while I wouldn't shoot them as a first choice, resolving the CWs and the first train early in the day isn't a bad thing to do, on principle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amber Vulture Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 Apologies for my absence in the second half of the cycle. The nature of how I've gone about thinking about this game meant I wanted to be caught up, and that took a serious amount of time. Following the slight disaster of my last post's formatting, I'm going to try to use spoiler boxes and smaller tables within them. Apologies again if this doesn't work. I intend to get back to this later on tonight, and synthesise my views, but due to time constraints think it is plausible that I don't have time to do this tonight, and want to get my thoughts (at least in their present state) on record before the end of the cycle. As such: Amethyst Scorpion Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 24 RP. Says elim coinshots too powerful. Notes village lost every Tyrian Falls game, thinks weaker elim team in response. N/A N/A Agree re elim coinshots, NAI argument. Disagree that necessarily weaker elim team, perhaps more conservative distribution though? NAI Doesn't directly reply, engages in thread discussion D1 58 Replies to Charcoal Hyena's read list. Says Coral Swan helpful with opinions, "keeping options open alignment wise". Says Saffron Iguana's opinions on Seekers and Lurchers justified. Points out that new players can also be eliminators. Respinds to vote saying qualifiers in opinions. N/A N/A Sensible engagement with post, NAI NAI Says Saffron Iguana's views on seekers justified. Replies to Charcoal Hyena, who voted on them D1 172 Replies to Charcoal Hyena. Thinks Charcoal Hyena and Pearl Chameleon cannot be an e/e pairing as Charcoal Hyena was incorrect about the number of votes on Pearl Chameleon. Does not think lack of reaction to Pearl Chameleon leading the lynch in the early part of the cycle is enough to clear them - plenty of time for votes to change. Responds to Pearl Chameleon. Dislikes slef-preservation vote as considers it unnecessary. Thinks Pearl Chameleon and Coral Swan could be e/e, Turquoise Gorilla and Pearl Chameleon could be e/e, Coral Swan and Turquoise Gorilla not e/e. Votes on Pearl Chameleon Pearl Chameleon N/A Number of alternative potential votes - active choice to vote on Pearl Chameleon. Not bad reason to vote. Should relook at Pearl Chameleon myself NAI Votes on Pearl Chameleon D1 215 Gives summary of recent vote movements. Thinks Mauve votes have come out of nowhere. Doesn't like tied votes. Doesn't like last minute push on Saffron Iguana, so votes on Turquoise Gorilla (creating three way tie) Turquoise Gorilla Pearl Chameleon Posted contemporaneously with vote from Saffron Iguana. Doesn't give reasoning for vote on Turquoise Gorilla. Although dchooses not to lynch Iguana, unlikely to be on a team - post at same timestamp, and feels confused, not coordinated Mild village Chooses not to lynch Saffron Iguana Charcoal Hyena: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 42 Provides emotion based reads on players who have posted. Says Coral Swan felt village, disagrees with Saffron Iguana but says feels like they are trying to solve game. Gets new player feel from Magenta Albatross, says feels geniuine. Leans village on Scarlet Octopus, says tunneling both offputting and reassuring. Leans village on Salmon Meerkat due to poke vote on Sunburst Toucan. Neutral on Chartreuse Penguin, wants more engagement. Neutral on Emeraldn Falcon. Very slight village lean on Fuchsia Ostrich due to nonchalance to number of spiked. Neutral on Mauve Crocodile, suggest their retraction from Pearl Chameleon and encouragement for players to vote elsewhere could mean E/E. Neutral on Melon Dingo, Oxblood Beagle, wants more engagement. Says would have done the same thing as Pearl Chameleon for same reason, suggests more thoughts based on their response. Neutral on Turquoise Gorilla. Suggests Amethyst Scorpion might have slipped with firm language about elim team being weaker. Votes on Amethyst Scorpion Amethyst Scorpion N/A Emotion based reads both useful and convenient to back down from. Mild support of Pearl Chameleon not explicit in post. Question why Salmon Meerkat's poke vote felt alignment indicative. Not sure I agree re Amethyst Scorpion slipping - feels slightly contrived. Post an attempt to seem helpful, having opinions, without committing to them? Unsure - reevaluate Summons all inactive players. Comments on all active players. Unprompted support for Pearl Chameleon, lynch candidate. Votes on Amethyst Scorpion D1 88 Replies to Chartreuse Penguin's vote on them. Claims to have started writing reads post before logging in to see alignment. Says solves game by narrowing pool of suspects down. Says switching reads a good thing for determining alignment. Says initially read Pearl Chameleon as village for first post, but reaction to pressure needs looking at. Says village read of Magenta not just because they give new player vibes, but village new player vibes N/A N/A Reminds me of a very dangerous player… Call out writing part of post before logging in. Odd behaviour - although not necessarily alignment indicative, merely player being prepared to be an eliminator. Willingness to admit it perhaps reduces likelihood of this. Explanation of how they solve game NAI. Gut read that genuinely trying to solve game. Watch carefully. Timezone aligns with dangerous player. Reevaluate frequently, gut village Replies to Chartreuse Penguin, Safrron Iguana. Coral Swan, Scarlet Octopus, Mauve Crocodile, Amethyst Scorpion D1 95 Thanks Mauve Crocodile for reads list. Says late for them, so will just update the vote count N/A N/A Very late at 5:30am GMT. NAI NAI Appreciates Mauve's read list Chartreuse Penguin: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 40 Provides vote count. Votes on Violet Axolotl. Says normally more talkative. Will be less so this game. Asks to be PMd. Says vote count wrong as missed a page Violet Axolotl N/A Less talkative playstyle generates less information - excuse to hide? Vote on player who hasn't yet posted. NAI Votes on Violet Axolotl D1 43 Responds to Charcoal Hyena, says voted on Violet Axolotl to make them more active. Notes their own mistake on vote count, says they thought their vote split vote four ways. Votes on Charcoal Hyena on gut, but says their reads list an easy way for an elim to gain village cred Charcoal Hyena Violet Axolotl Feels like a genuine and fair read of Charcoal Hyena's post. Very mild village Votes on Charcoal Hyena D1 55 Asks for reads list from Coral Swan. Suggests absence of elim seeker from Meerkat (Iguana's) power reads because elims might have seeker. Asks players not to roleclaim in PMs (Confuses Meerkat and Iguana) N/A N/A Agree with view of Iguana, feels like engaging with posts in attempt to solve game. Distancing? Possible, probably not Mild village Confuses Salmon Meerkat and Saffron Iguana. Unlikely to be on a team with either. Less likely to be on elim team with Saffron Iguana D1 57 Acknowledges Salmon Meerkat re confusion on player identities. Says village will lose more from genuine roleclaims. N/A N/A NAI NAI Replies to Salmon Meerkat D1 105 Replies to Charcoal Hyena, questioning oddity of reads list prior to opening role PM. Says they will vote on Pearl Chameleon to strengthen the lynch against vote manipulation. N/A N/A Interesting that prepared to strengthen lynch they don't support enough to presently vote on. Surely valuable information from vote-manipulable lynch? If doesn't want lynch changed then implication of a degree of certainty about lynch target Mild evil Replies to Charcoal Hyena, expresses willingness to vote on Pearl Chameleon D1 111 Would mark Salmon Meerkat's read of Amethyst Scorpion as NAI. Amethyst Scorpion fake claimed in PM to Chartreuse Penguin N/A N/A Useful to know NAI Doesn't read Amethyst Scorpion as village, has PM with Amethyst Scorpion D1 114 Finds players lose distinctive qualities in Anon games. Finds they tunnel more in anon games, as difficult to keep track of players N/A N/A Understandable views, NAI. NAI None D1 121 Votes on Pearl Chameleon Pearl Chameleon N/A No explanation for vote. Seek reasoning. Revisit Votes on Pearl Chameleon D1 124 Wanted to gauge Pearl Chameleon's reaction to unexplained vote N/A N/A Odd. Reaction to unexplained vote predictable - just querying vote Mild evil "Explanation" for vote on Pearl Chameleon D1 134 Expresses excitement at Salmon Meerkat voting on Charcoal Hyena N/A N/A Low effort, difficult to tell views Unsure Excited that pressure on Charcoal Hyena? D1 138 Explains Violet Axolotl's point, says for villagers any other player has same chance to be evil at start of D1, except eliminators, who have a bias knowing alignments N/A N/A True, at very start of the cycle. Philosophy would mean absence of material to analyse - through reasoned (if poorly) votes early in cycle, we build picture of player actions, so not all players have the same chance to be evil NAI None D1 141 Points out to Pearl Chameleon that it doesn't make sense for e!Coral Swan to highlight suspicion of Charcoal Hyena in the first place then not vote on it N/A N/A Engaging in conversation, nothing major to analyse NAI Explaining Coral Swan to Pearl Chameleon D1 145 Votes on Charcoal Hyena Charcoal Hyena Pearl Chameleon Consistent with earlier post expressing enthusiasm for Salmon Meerkat's vote NAI Votes on Charcoal Hyena Coral Swan: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 6 RP. Agrees with assumption of 5-6 spiked. Doesn't agree with assumption of LG74 distribution. Expects a village seeker N/A N/A Makes sensible statements. Noithing controversial or alignment indicative NAI Refutes assumptions of Saffron Iguana and Magenta Albatross D1 15 Responds to Saffron Iguana's reasoning for LG74 baseline. Suspects elims do not have all roles. Responds to Pearl Chameleon vote on Saffron Iguana, says they considered it. Suggests content of Saffron Iguana's first post unlikely to have been written since role PM. Suggests Chameleon village slipped by calling Seeker powerful role, but could have been deliberate. Finds Scarlet Octopus' assumption of 7 elims high, questiosn why they assume scenario they admit less likely. Definitely doesn't believe eliminators have a coinshot N/A N/A Agree generally with points made - but NAI. Disagree with considering Seeker only power role for village. Believe it to be one of the strongest elim roles available. Unsure Replies to Saffron Iguana, semi-defends Saffron Iguana to Pearl Chameleon, replies to Scarlet Octopus, replies to Turquoise Gorilla D1 18 Agrees with Fuchsia Ostrich that number of elims doesn't matter. N/A N/A Agree with them, but NAI NAI Agrees with Fuchsia Ostrich D1 47 Multiquote. Replies to Scarlet Octopus, notes time of lynch or lose shouldn't change behaviours. Says Mauve Crocodile's view of Turquoise Gorilla a villager thing to do. Says they want to village read Pearl Chameleon for voting on Saffron Iguana as nearly did same thing themselves, notes last anon game discussion sparking player was evil. Replies to Charcoal Hyena's read on Pearl Chameleon, says if you think you'd have done the same thing as what someone did, enough for a D1 village read. Doesn't like that only one red name on list, thinks reasoning for vote on Amethyst Scorpion weak. Thinks absence of read on Pearl Chameleon weird. Reads post as elim based on construction. Replies to Chartreuse Penguin's vote on Hyena, notes agreement re thoughts. Says non-commital tone though more likely to come from a villager. Strongest village reads on Crocodile and Iguana. Strongest elim read on Hyena. Votes on Amber Vulture Amber Vulture N/A Agree with village read on Mauve for read on Turquoise. Having noted that, limited transferable applicability to village read on Coral Swan. Question lack of committal to view on Charcoal Hyena - why no vote? Very mild village Slight, if odd, defence of Pearl Chameleon, elim read on Hyena without a vote. Votes on Amber Vulture D1 53 RP reply to Quartz Zebra N/A N/A None NAI RP reply to Quartz Zebra D1 60 RP reply to Quartz Zebra. Says mathematically revealing role to another player at random likely to be village, calls it a terrible idea. Asks Amethyst Scorpion to clarify their read on them N/A N/A NAI N Replies to Quartz Zebra, Chartreuse Penguin, Amethyst Scorpion D1 69 Replies to Mauve Crocodile. Doesn't feel settled enough on read of Hyena to want them dead. Voted on Amber Vulture to add pressure N/A N/A Fair enough answer, review connections later on NAI Says not sure about read on Charcoal Hyena. Vote on Amber Vulture to add pressure. D1 75 Gives read list. Mauve Crocodile, Magenta Albatross as village. Salmon Meerkat, Chartreuse Penguin, Scarlet Octopus, Fuchsia Ostrich, Amethyst Scorpion as light village. Quartz Zebra, Saffron Iguana, Pearl Chameleon light spiked. Charcoal Hyena, Turquoise Gorilla spiked. Not sure about their reads on Hyena, Chameleon, Iguana, Scorpion and Penguin. Everyone else null or hasn't posted. Wants to vote for a null read, as wants to develop other reads more before voting for them. Retracts from Amber Vulture, votes on Melon Dingo, as their posts just mirror earlier thoughts Melon Dingo Amber Vulture Doesn't give reasons for reads. Strong dislike of not wanting elim reads lynched - seems not to want to be held to their reads by alignment reveal Moderate evil Votes on Melon Dingo, retracts from Amber Vulture. See post summary for views on other players D1 80 Says voting for null read because doesn't want to kill based on poor read, would rather kill less active player for "almost as much reason". Responds to Violet Axolotl, says they will consider voting for Turquoise Gorilla. Doesn't know whether they feel stronger about Charcoal Hyena or Turquoise Gorilla N/A N/A I still think the logic is fundamentally flawed. Beyond that, lynching less actives has been discussed to death, and I remain fo the view that it is largely useless. Moderate evil Replies to Oxblood Beagle, and Violet Axolotl's request they vote on Turquoise Gorilla D1 85 Says Onyx Flamingo's post is light village due to tone and commitment. Hasn't received PMs N/A N/A Disagree, based on content of post Very mild evil Supports Onyx Flamingo D1 89 RP. Appreciates Charcoal Hyena's method of solving game. N/A N/A None. Large part of what Charcoal Hyena said was NAI, yet also get village gut read NAI Reply to Charcoal Hyena D1 91 Replies to Oxblood Beagle, says they don't trust their own gut. Respects Oxblood Beagle's vote on them N/A N/A Not worried by vote, but under no lynch pressure. NAI Reply to Oxblood Beagle D1 93 Replies to Fuchsia Ostrich, says Mauve Crocodile's posts read village. Early reads not likely to have been made by eliminator. Approach to solving seems solid. N/A N/A Approach to solving should be NAI - easy to replicate if evil. Agree re tonal reading of posts. Willingness to defend views Mild village Defence of Mauve Crocodile, response to Fuchsia Ostrich D1 108 RP. Replies to Salmon Meerkat, says they will switch to Turquoise Gorilla, Quartz Zebra or Opal Lion if the count stays close, and is fine with any, but in that order. Doesn't know where they stand on Pearl Chameleon. N/A N/A Check against actions at end of cycle NAI Replies to Salmon Meerkat, prepared to vote on Turquoise Gorilla, Quartz Zebra, Opal Lion D1 113 Replies to Amber Vulture's posts about them. Believed Seeker role to be alignment scanning only, so discounted it for eliminators. Now has gut village view on Charcoal Hyena, still doesn't trust self to commit to reads. Still sees value in lynching less active players, compares to Salmon Meerkat's logic for lynching peripherals N/A N/A If true belief, then plausible to discount. On reread of post, fits with how statement made. Disagree with views, but openness about not wanting to see flips strikes me as a village thing to say. Odd enough (flips give information) that likely to be probed. Sticking with it through probing Mild village Gut village on Charcoal Hyena D1 117 Doesn't think Pearl Chameleon has raised suspicion of them before vote, asks them what they are suspicious of. Will vote on Pearl Chameleon in self-preservation if votes remain constant, to force vote onto Turquoise Gorilla N/A N/A As opposed to switching directly to Turquoise Gorilla? Preparedness to take positive action to see Turquoise Gorilla lynched, not currently voting for them Mild evil Will vote on Pearl Chameleon, willing to contribute to Turquoise Gorilla lynch D1 120 Highlights oddity of making reads list then not voting on it, suggests as an eliminator would not want to draw that attention N/A N/A True, awareness of it does mean could be a gambit. Highlighting it now NAI NAI Reply to Pearl Chameleon D1 128 Says if they were eliminator, would heva put teammates more as village than as eliminators, as don't want to kill them. N/A N/A True - but valid to think might put teammates as suspicious to build village cred if they flip NAI Response to Pearl Chameleon D1 130 RP explanation N/A N/A None NAI None D1 132 Points out to Pearl Chameleon that eliminators can come up with good reasoning for bad outcomes, and villagers bad reasoning N/A N/A NAI NAI Response to Pearl Chameleon D1 137 Votes on Pearl Chameleon.Suspicion of Pearl Chameleon from recent posts Pearl Chameleon Melon Dingo Valid take as villager or otherwise. NAI Votes on Pearl Chameleon D1 143 Explains vote on Pearl Chameleon - believes Pearl Chameleon rationalising their vote on Coral Swan, having initally piggybacked on other's arguments N/A N/A Fair enough - although Pearl Chameleon tunneling, now trying to justify their own belief? NAI Suspicious of Pearl Chameleon D1 161 Thinks Pearl Chameleon sent a village PM to them. Retracts from Pearl Chameleon, moves to Turquoise Gorilla for opportunistic vote. Asks Turquoise Gorilla to explain their vote better Turquoise Gorilla Pearl Chameleon Get village vibes for reforming view strongly from Pearl PM. If Coral Swan eliminator, cannot see them going to the thread with this - Pearl a viable lynch candidate. Still possible that Pearl evil and a good manipulator, feels more likely to me that Coral Swan and Pearl Chameleon are v/v. Agree re opportunistic nature of Turquoise Gorilla vote Moderate village Reviews view of Pearl Chameleon, now thinks they are village. Unlikely to be evil if Pearl Chameleon village. Votes on Turquoise Gorilla D1 165 Gives commentary on Emerald Falcon's post. Gives village read to Chartreuse Penguin. Village read on Mauve Crocodile N/A N/A Relook at in context of vote manip. Knows Mauve will die, wants to be seen as village reading them? Seems highly unlikely Review Village read on Chartreuse Penguin and Mauve Crocodile D1 169 Says never PMd Emerald Falcon N/A N/A Investigate Investigate Emerald Falcon D1 173 Says Emerald Falcon could check their PMs N/A N/A Not incorrect NAI Emerald Falcon D1 177 Asks Emerald Falcon to elaborate re the PMs. Is open to voting on Quartz Zebra or Saffron Iguana N/A N/A Has RPd with Quartz Zebra, hasn't mentioned Saffron Iguana since reads list post #75. Had both Quartz Zebra and Saffron Iguana as light spiked in that list. Hasn't substantiated thoughts on Saffron Iguana since #47, has Saffron Iguana as strongest village read (with Mauve Crocodile) at that point. Vote currently on Turquoise Gorilla for opportunism - why preference for voting on Quartz Zebra over Turquoise Gorilla? Consistent with mid-cycle views, confused about lynch preference Unsure Willing to lynch Quartz Zebra and Saffron Iguana D1 185 Gets positive gut feel from Melon Dingo's post N/A N/A Don't get same feel, but fair enough. NAI NAI Positive gut feel for Melon Dingo D1 189 RP N/A N/A None NAI None D1 194 RP N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 217 Notes lynch went to 4/4/4 N/A N/A Chooses to stay on Turquoise Gorilla, not vote on one of other candidates. Look at views on Crocodile and Iguana NAI, probably None Emerald Falcon: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 19 RP N/A N/A Difficult formatting NAI None D1 26 Says brain not working N/A N/A Unhelpful - post to stay active? NAI None D1 158 Provides reads on players. Reads Saffron Iguana as suspicious, as ignored manipulative potential of seekers for eliminators, underplayed lurchers, but has good take on Pearl Chameleon. Only not solid eliminator for this take. Not teamed with Pearl Chameleon. Magenta Albatross as neutral (?) for asking about non-village seekers. If Magenta eliminator, seeker confirmed village. Mild village read on Coral Swan, agrees with many thoughts, but comes to opposite conclusion. Not on a team with Mauve Crocodile. Amber on Pearl Chameleon. Feels like playing down abilities of seeker. Turns accusation into a joke. Doesn't know who they'd kill of Pearl Chameleon and Saffron Iguana. Lean red (?) for Mauve Crocodile, thinks they're ignoring discussion and coasting by. Chartreuse Penguin Amber, thinks vote is valid, reasoning flawed. Light village read for Charcoal Hyena. Thinks reads are just active player village, less active not. Then says village read doesn't make sense. Amethyst Scorpion only engaging with Charcoal Hyena's post doesn't feel right. Not teamed with Charcoal Hyena. Thinks votes on Turquoise Gorilla pointless - hasn't been helpful, but not been trying to look helpful. Dark Amber on Amber Vulture - opener weak, needs conclusions from notes post. Analysis of interactions between Saffron Iguana and Pearl Chameleon. Says interactions started by Pearl Chameleon's vote, thinks Iguana fixated because of it, feels like Iguana the eliminator of the two. Quotes a number of posts, difficult to tell who from. N/A N/A Thoughts on elim seeker being downplayed align strongly with my own worries. Would appreciate further thoughts on Saffron Iguana/Pearl Chameleon. Feels like genuine attempt to solve game, but difficult to keep track of thoughts. Demonstrating evolution of thinking - NAI. Helpful to do as village, to clear oneself, difficult to replicate, but effective as elim if you can. Mild-moderate village, keep track of view evolution Read post D1 166 Kept mistaking Mauve Crocodile and Coral Swan, following PMs votes on Mauve Crocodile Mauve Crocodile N/A In light of following posts, where it appears Emerald Falcon did not PM either of them, very, very odd. Must have known this would emerge - so why make mistake? Review at end of thread Review Votes on Mauve Crocodile, claims non-existent PMs with Coral Swan and Mauve Crocodile D1 168 Claims just PMd Coral Swan N/A N/A Investigate Investigate Coral Swan D1 171 Says someone needs to explain who they were Pming N/A N/A Odd dismissal - has PMs, can see who they were Pming. Aware how odd this looks to thread, doesn't seek to clarify it Investigate Mauve Crocodile, Coral Swan D1 175 Was not thinking of PM with Pearl Chameleon N/A N/A Not terribly helpful NAI None D1 179 Asks what Quartz Zebra has done to deserve being lynched N/A N/A Active defence of Quartz Zebra - willing to be tied to it. Sensible enough question. Hasn't posted except RP, and not in a while. Mild village Defence of Quartz Zebra D1 191 ISO of Saffron Iguana posts. Comments on what seems like agenda to steer village from consideration of certain roles. Notes only read is on Pearl Chameleon. Notes Saffron Iguana expresses distrust of Magenta Albatross but doesn't pursue it. Thinks they're hedging. Thinks lack of reaction to wagon is concerning. No reason to village read Saffron Iguana, but don't think it warrants a lynch. N/A N/A Provides a list of reasons to consider voting on Saffron Iguana, but is voting on Mauve Crocodile for coasting by. Unsure of link between what they say and stated lack of distrust Mild evil Doesn't trust Saffron Iguana, doesn't think it warrants a kill. Trusts Salmon Meerkat D1 196 Remains committed to the view that Mauve Crocodile is ignoring thread discussion. Provides read list - Coral Swan, Oxblood Beagle, Salmon Meerkat village. Doesn't want to kill Charcoal Hyena, Chartreuse Penguin, Violet Axolotl, Scarlet Octopus. Has Pearl Chameleon and Saffron Iguana in limbo, says people voting for MelonDingo or Turquoise Gorilla would be wrong, encourages votes on Mauve Crocodile and Amber Vulture. N/A N/A Looks to me like Mauve Crocodile did engage with thread early in the cycle. Period mid cycle of just joking responses/vote counts, so plausible that that's where Emerald Falcon formed their opinion. Do not think argument against Mauve Crocodile as compelling as against Saffron Iguana, yet put Saffron Iguana in limbo. Can see largely where opinion from Committed to vote on Mauve Crocodile D1 203 OOG N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 204 ISO of Mauve Crocodile. Finds Mauve's village read of Turquoise Gorilla (for conflating elim!coinshot and elim!mistborn) odd. Dismisses Mauve Crocodile's explanation for their vote on Pearl Chameleon. Takes issue with Mauve Crocodile ascribing a villager point to Charcoal Hyena for their reads list. Goes through remainder of posts, dismisses reads list for lack of conclusions. N/A N/A Feels very tunnelly - dismissing without considering in balanced manner Mauve Crocodile's points. E.g. I think villager point for Turquoise Gorilla was fair - there is a real difference between the two roles. Dismisses engagement with Saffron iguana re their coinshot wording, missing the point of what was asked (which was about coinshot distribution, not role reveals). Doesn't feel like trying to solve Mauve Crocodile's alignment, instead trying to have them lynched Mild to moderate evil ISO on Mauve Crocodile D1 208 Notes all three can self save, asks Magenta Albatross why they commented on Saffron Iguana in particular N/A N/A Fair question NAI Reply to Magenta Albatross D1 211 Doesn't feel good about votes on Coral Swan (Oxblood Beagle, Turquoise Gorilla). Doesn't feel good about it being quiet. N/A N/A Oxblood Beagle in their village reads. Why those votes in particular? Gut that feels slightly performative Mild evil Brings up votes on Coral Swan Fuchsia Ostrich: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 16 RP. Responds to Saffron Iguana, suggesting LG74 an exception to Tyrian Falls meta. Says number of eliminatorsdoesn't matter. Calls attention to Pearl Chameleon's thoughts on Coinshot N/A N/A Nothing of note NAI Calls attention to thoughts of Pearl Chameleon D1 92 Thought Charcoal Hyena was Fifth Scholar, but now realises that Fifth IMing. Asks Coral Swan why they read Mauve Crocodile as village, as strong gut read on Mauve Crocodile as evil. Votes on Mauve Crocodile Mauve Crocodile N/A Also have mild village read on Mauve Crocodile. Would like to see if Fuchsia Ostrich can articulate their gut view Very mild evil Question to Coral Swan, vote on Mauve Crocodile Ivory Dragonfly: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 151 Busy but wanted to note presence N/A N/A Dodging filter? NAI None Magenta Albatross: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 4 Says "looked differently in a past life". Replies to Saffron Iguana, suggesting that if LG74 distro holds, perhaps no village seekers. N/A N/A Played at least one anon game before. Engaging with assumption of LG74 distribution without questioning it - why? NAI Reply to Saffron Iguana D1 10 RP. Asks what rules mean by role madness. Gives self answer - that not everyone has a role. Suggests regardless that all spiked have a role. N/A N/A Genuine question? Why assumption of spiked roles? Inexperience, or desire to appear so? Unsure None D1 73 Replies to Saffron Iguana. Admits to having asked players for roles in PMs. Provides updated vote counts. Suggests they have mild village reads on those who didn't want to role trade in PMs. Says they don't know who to vote for N/A N/A I think acknowledging having been phishing is NAI. Possibly leaning elim - felt better to come into open about it first? Clearly engaged with game if Pming, doesn't give reads from PMs despite claiming they have them. Dislike their reluctance to vote. Mild evil Replies to Saffron Iguana, claims to have PMd multiple players D1 206 Provides vote count, votes on Saffron Iguana, tying them with Turquoise Gorilla and Mauve Crocodile. Notes Saffron Iguana could self save. Thinks tie will produce information Saffron Iguana N/A Unlikely to be on a team with Saffron Iguana or Turquoise Gorilla. Village vibes from information reasoning of the vote Mild village Votes for Saffron Iguana D1 210 Says they commented on Saffron Iguana in particular because they voted on Saffron Iguana N/A N/A Fair enough NAI None D1 216 Asks Saffron Iguana why they didn't vote to save themselves, edits it following second Iguana post N/A N/A None NAI Replies to Saffron Iguana Mauve Crocodile: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 29 RP. Votes in character on Pearl Chameleon Pearl Chameleon N/A No explanation for vote - query reasoning. Third vote, but one minute after second vote - likely written beforehand. NAI Votes on Pearl Chameleon. Unlikely that Salmon Meerkat and Mauve Crocodile on same team for this reason D1 32 Jokes that distribution is all vanilla with one mistborn. Replies to Turquoise Gorilla, says elim would not make equivalence between elim coinshot and mistborn, and so leans village. Replies to Saffron Iguana that they can't see equivalence between seekers and lurchers N/A N/A Agree with village read on Turquoise Gorilla. Seeking village cred by pointing it out? More likely genuine effort to solve game. Mild village Replies to Saffron Iguana, considers Turquoise Gorilla village lean D1 35 Says Octopi adept at tunneling N/A N/A If suggesting Scarlet Octopus is tunneling, agree. If so, then supporting Pearl Chameleon without making it explicit NAI Potential disagree with Scarlet Octopus, indirect defence of Pearl Chameleon. Potentially just a joking comment D1 38 Says they thought their vote would be second on Chameleon, but explicitly notes hasn't retracted it. Says people should vote if they don't like three votes on Chameleon N/A N/A Has not justified their vote on Chameleon, but by making it explicit not hiding on lynch train. NAI NAI Addresses Pearl Chameleon D1 67 Replies to Charcoal Hyena, suggests reads lists early D1 are village leaning because harder for eliminator. Asks Saffron Iguana what information would be gained from a coinshot kill. Asks Coral Swan why they are voting on Amber Vulture if their strongest eliminator read is on Hyena. Replies to Amber Vulture, says villagers most likely to be pessimistic about distribution N/A N/A Strongly disagree re view on D1 reads - always much easier for me when eliminator - feel less pressure to be right. Fair point re Scarlet Octopus. Gut very mild village Supports Charcoal Hyena, questions voting of Coral Swan, replies to Amber Vulture defending Scarlet Octopus D1 70 Replies to Coral Swan, is satisfied with their explanation N/A N/A NAI NAI Replies to Coral Swan D1 87 Read list. Null for Amber Vulture. Positive for Charcoal Hyena for early reads list, even though they disagree with contents. Positive for Chartreuse Penguin as reads overanalysing as village. Positive reads on Coral Swan for finding village slip in post by Pearl Chameleon, negative for not voting based on reads, positive for explanation of not doing so. Negative for Oxblood Beagle for opportunistic vote. Negative for Pearl Chameleon for asking village coinshots to hold off. Null for Saffron Iguana. Positive for Salmon Meerkat for PMs. Positive for Scarlet Octopus for paranoia. Positive for Turquoise Gorilla for conflation of elim coinshot and mistborn. Positive for Violet Axolotl for trying to persuade people onto a train - willingness to own consequences N/A N/A Unless I've missed a retraction, vote presently on Pearl Chameleon. Disagree with some conclusions - e.g. on Oxblood Beagle. Very mild village See post D1 99 Joking responses N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 103 Joking responses N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 150 Asks Salmon Meerkat how they would feel switching together to Melon Dingo. Responds to Saffron Iguana, says difficult to move votes subtly, calls out Saffron Iguana saying eliminators have likely prepared ways to do so. Asks Pearl Chameleon how they would feel switching onto Saffron Iguana N/A N/A Now know alignment. Like the calling out of Saffron Iguana. Can see how asking to move might appear suspicious Probably mild village? Preparedness to vote for Melon Dingo or Saffron Iguana D1 152 Asks Ivory Crocodile how many elims they think there are N/A N/A Not helpful conversation topic, might engage player NAI Replies to Ivory Dragonfly D1 155 Joke N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 159 Provides updated vote count N/A N/A None NAI D1 164 Responds in joking manner to Emerald Falcon. Says they will ignore D1 roles discussion. Says formatting not desgined to be nefarious N/A N/A Can't separate my thoughts from knowledge of alignment None Response to Emerald Falcon D1 167 Says they didn't PM Emerald Falcon N/A N/A Investigate Investigate Emerald Falcon D1 170 Says weird mistake for Emerald Falcon to make N/A N/A Still can't see the gambit Emerald Falcon is attempting Investigate Emerald Falcon D1 176 If lynch comes down to Coral Swan or Turquoise Gorilla, would prefer to see Turquoise Gorilla lynched. Doesn't like either option. Slightly trusts Turquoise Gorilla, moderately trusts Coral Swan. Votes for Saffron Iguana, as they have said a lot, but Mauve Crocodile has no read. Is still suspicious of Pearl Chameleon, partly because Pearl Chameleon lynch disappeared without them being defended. Persuadable to vote for Quartz Zebra, who has posted three times but said nothing Saffron Iguana Pearl Chameleon Nothing useful post-alignment reveal None None useful D1 178 Asks Pearl Chameleon and Salmon Meerkat their thoughts on voting for Quartz Zebra N/A N/A Disliked this at the time. Agree that Quartz Zebra flying under the radar, but lynch of them would not generate new discussion or add information to compare to existing discussion At the time, thought mild evil None useful D1 182 Says case against Quartz Zebra is posting without saying anything. Asks Emerald Falcon what thread discussion they suggest Mauve Crocodile is ignoring N/A N/A Whilst true, disagree that sensible way to use vote at this stage in cycle Not useful None useful D1 190 RP N/A N/A None NAI None D1 199 RP. Asks Emerald Falcon again to clarify what they think Mauve Crocodile has been ignoring. Defends seeking votes on Quartz Zebra as wishing to be proactive in avoiding lynch as a villager N/A N/A Fair enough. I still think Quartz Zebra is a strange target choice, however. Not useful None useful Melon Dingo: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 30 RP. Says similar setup to LG74 unlikely N/A N/A Doesn't engage with vote discussion. NAI points NAI None D1 183 RP. Asks Saffron Iguana to clarify view on tineyes (which was that likely only one tineye, might be evil). Finds it hard to keep players distinct. Thinks distribution likely standard. Finds tone of Pearl Chameleon's first post jarring. "admires" choice of Coral Swan to vote for a null read D1. N/A N/A No vote. NAI close to end of cycle if not properly caught up, which this gives the impression of. NAI Finds Pearl Chameleon's post jarring D1 188 Replies to Saffron Iguana, thanks them for clarity on their tineye statement N/A N/A None NAI Reply to Saffron Iguana D1 192 RP N/A N/A None NAI None D1 195 RP N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 207 Says rollover is tense N/A N/A NAI NAI None Mint Heron: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 187 RP. Believes discussion reduces randomness in voting. Votes for Violet Axolotl for views on random D1 voting Violet Axolotl N/A Not sure views warrant lynch vote. Whilst counterproductive, haven't shut conversation down. Equally, has given Violet Axolotl cover not to justify voting. Easy place to put vote without risking lynch Gut mild evil Votes for Violet Axolotl Onyx Flamingo: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 81 RP. Votes on Violet Axolotl for being over eager to lynch Turquoise Gorilla. Violet Axolotl N/A Possible defence of Turquoise Gorilla? Disagree that trying to persuade others of your view is suspicious Mild evil Votes on Violet Axolotl, indirect defense of Turquoise Gorilla D1 198 Votes for Mauve Crocodile for being defensive, and asking for votes on Quartz Zebra Mauve Crocodile Violet Axolotl Critical vote, late in cycle, on villager. Valid conclusion to draw from a recent read of the thread, however. Suspect an eliminator, knowing vote manip potential, might not have been so overt Mild village Vote on Mauve Crocodile D1 202 RP N/A N/A NAI NAI None Opal Lion: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 46 Says they have been sleeping N/A N/A Nothing of note NAI None D1 64 Asks whether we know if everyone has a role N/A N/A Hasn't read rules. Claiming a role. Could be confised villager, or eliminator deliberately seeking to give impression Mild village None D1 78 RP N/A N/A NAI NAI None Oxblood Beagle: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 39 Replies to Emerald Falcon saying their brain doesn't work, agrees N/A N/A Unhelpful, NAI NAI Replies to Emerald Falcon D1 62 Replies to Charcoal Hyena asking them to give more information. Thinks distribution discussion irrelevant N/A N/A Doesn't provide any more relevant discussion themselves NAI Replies to Charcoal Hyena D1 65 Replies to Opal Lion, says not role madness N/A N/A Has been following thread NAI Replies to Opal Lion D1 76 Finds it odd that Coral Swan voting for a null read over an eliminator read. Votes on Coral Swan Coral Swan N/A Completely agree with analysis Mild village Votes on Coral Swan, calls out their logic D1 90 Responds to Coral Swan's explanation of not voting for their reads. Says it makes sense, but that they have historically ignored too many gut reads N/A N/A Not sure they should be letting Coral Swan off that lightly NAI Reply to Coral Swan Pearl Chameleon: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 9 Suggests coinshots should be initially cautious, as odds of hitting spiked increase as game goes on. Suggests five spiked, six if role balance weak for team. Places vote on Saffron Iguana for relying on LG74 distribution. Saffron Iguana N/A Sensible, well reasoned post. I've always been more in favour of thought out vigilante kills, but C1 probably does have too little information to go on. Vote on Saffron Iguana the obvious vote, but voting on largely NAI material NAI Disagrees with Saffron Iguana, votes on them D1 23 Replies to Saffron Iguana. Jokingly suggests seekers not that powerful. Replies to Scarlet Octopus (who queried earlier guess of five elims). Says five felt right. Says maybe six makes more sense. Hadn't realised increase to 26 players. Thinks likely coinshot or mistborn. Expresses sadness at Scarlet Octopus' vote on them. Says elim coinshot would be fun, but is unlikely. N/A N/A Limited conviction in views - adjusting when challenged. NAI? NAI Replies to Saffron Iguana, responds to Pearl Chameleon, notes vote on them D1 33 Responds to Salmon Meerkat's vote on them. Says every first post of game is performative. Says wanted to spur discussion, so looked for a reason to vote. N/A N/A Mild village - agree with logic, and D1 voting generates more information than non-threatening discussion. Have done the same many times as village. Mild Replies to Salmon Meerkat D1 37 Replies to Scarlet Octopus. Says first vote was a shot in the dark, retracts it. Replies to Salmon Meerkat, says their first vote was shoddy. Says they had thought that having bad reasoning meant evil. N/A Saffron Iguana Dislike reaction to pressure. No conviction in views. If village, perhaps more likely to stand by them? Mild evil Replies to Scarlet Octopus and Salmon Meerkat. Retracts on Saffron Iguana, under pressure. D1 116 Provides vote count. Doesn't know what to make of vote layout - doesn't have strong opinion on Turquoise Gorilla. Doesn't trust Saffron Iguana, considers lynch unviable. Votes on Coral Swan as suspects them and they have a vote on them. Will vote in self-preservation. Wording at end of post "would not want to sacrifice myself in a tie if it turns out Gorilla or Swan is truly a Spiked." Coral Swan N/A If they do still distrust Saffron Iguana, why did they retract their vote earlier in the cycle under pressure? Odd wording at end of post. Logic feels backwards. Mild evil Doesn't trust Saffron Iguana, no opinion on Turquoise Gorilla, votes on Coral Swan D1 119 Completely forgot to give reason for vote. Reason is the same as others have given - effort of making a reads list, yet sticking with voting on someone they aren't suspicious of N/A N/A Is not an invalid reason to vote as such, particularly in self preservation NAI Gives reason for vote on Coral Swan D1 122 Says they see Coral Swan's actions as wanting to look like they are contributing without being held accountable for reads flipping village. Says they think Coral Swan's current position is to appear not to change view under pressure. Asks Chartreuse Penguin to explain vote N/A N/A Fair enough view. Feels highly unlikely from interaction that Pearl Chameleon and Coral Swan are both eliminators. NAI Explains further suspicion of Coral Swan D1 125 Responds to Saffron Iguana, says they would rather vote in way that led to a lynch than on player without votes N/A N/A Lynch candidates not set in stone - consensus can still build. Doesn't want to be responsible for instigating a lynch? Unsure - mild evil? Response to Saffron Iguana D1 131 Did consider possibility of Coral Swan putting eliminators in elim reads as reason for vote on null. Felt like Swan's vote had faulty reasoning N/A N/A More I reflect on Coral Swan's vote, the odder it feels as an eliminator play, unless anticipating suspicion and using that to prove innocence. Very dangerous D1 where low suspicion lynches normal. Pearl Chameleon's statement consistent NAI Suspicious of Coral Swan D1 136 Says thinks Violet Axolotl has a weird take. Says makes more sense to expect reasoning for lynch votes. Wouldn't be comfortable with random killing because most players in the game are village N/A N/A I think this is a fair reading of Violet Axolotl's post, which is unintuitive. Performative statement re random killings? Very mild evil Thinks Violet Axolotl has a weird take D1 139 Believes Coral Swan has a bias as doesn't want to put votes on eliminator reads. Asks what about recent votes confirmed suspicions N/A N/A Gut tells me this is a village/village situation. Suspect eliminator!Pearl Chameleon would have used cover from Salmon Meerkat to move off suspicion of Coral Swan, can see villager being sufficiently confused by oddity of actions, but not consdiering that oddity itself Mild village Reaffirms suspicion of Coral Swan D1 142 Thinks Coral Swan could have raised suspicion in an attempt to solve the game. Disagrees with logic of Violet Axolotl N/A N/A Understand initial thought process. Wasn't the only player to raise it. Sticking to it now increasingly feels like villager - genuine difference in view Moderate village Continues to be suspicious of Coral Swan D1 146 Claims not to have piggybacked on opinions of other players in suspicion of Coral Swan. Says doesn't know why they wouldn't follow through, as thoughts of an eliminator are mysterious. Says might not vote on Coral Swan as confusing themselves N/A N/A Backwards logic - assumes elim, so doesn't have to explain odd thoughts, vs odd thoughts leading or not to elim. Not actually solving game. Explanation feels lacking - in post #119 says reason for vote "the reason others have given for suspecting you". Withdrawing under pressure, or genuone confusion Mild evil Acknowledges confusion over Coral Swan D1 148 Suggests Violet Axolotl's view is sad N/A N/A None NAI None D1 153 Replies to Mauve Crocodile, says they wouldn't be averse to moving to Saffron Iguana if a third player joined them. Currently suspicious of Saffron Iguana and Coral Swan N/A N/A Why the need for a third player? Gaining no traction on Coral Swan, has indicated confusion. Might be genuine conviction? Unsure Expresses suspicion of Coral Swan and Saffron Iguana D1 174 Asks if Emerald Falcon was thinking about the fact they PMd them. Moves vote from Coral Swan to Saffron Iguana, as discussion and Pms made them rethink position. Will move vote from Saffron Iguana if no one joins it. Saffron Iguana Coral Swan Performative rethinking? Unsure - don't think conversation and frustration with Coral Swan could be faked. Tonme of this post strikes me as off Has impact of removing Coral Swan from being tied in the lead. Reassess as part of iso. Consider views on Saffron Iguana Very mild village/unsure Removes vote from Coral Swan (who was tied in lynch), votes on Saffron Iguana D1 180 Would prefer not to lynch Quartz Zebra, as jas no reason to vote for them N/A N/A Fair enough view to hold NAI Defence of Quartz Zebra Quartz Zebra: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 52 RP. Thinks six eliminators with no coinshot N/A N/A Completely uncontroversial, NAI NAI None D1 54 RP reply to Coral Swan N/A N/A None NAI RP reply to Coral Swan D1 101 RP N/A N/A NAI NAI None Saffron Iguana: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 3 Gives LG74 distribution. Draws spiked ratio from this. Suggets village distribution similar. N/A N/A Odd to assume distribution similar. Player of limited experience? Agree re spiked number. NAI None D1 7 Suggests LG74 as baseline because up to date with meta. Draws from this that 2/3rds have roles. Suggests spiked one of each role. N/A N/A Disagree with assumption. Plenty of prior meta, GMs have wealth of experience. Anon game meta also differs. Possibility of role? Spiked having one of each role vastly overpowered - see coinshot. Possible deliberate comment if evil, likely village not considering power Mild village Reply to Coral Swan D1 11 Replies to Pearl Chameleon (who voted on them). Doesn't engage with vote. Asks why Pearl Chameleon describes seeker as power role for spiked N/A N/A Either attempt to seem village, or genuine village thought process. Seeker of great value to spiked in identifying village power roles to kill, and to claim village seeker & build fake trust circle. Nai on not engaging with vote Mild village Replies to Pearl Chameleon, doesn't engage with vote D1 21 Suggests Fuchsia Ostrich bold to assume that GMS didn't take LG74 as a challenge. Replies to Scarlet Octopus Suggests equivalence of v!lurchers to e!seekers. Limited value due to size of group N/A N/A Stranger to asusme GMs did take strange game as challenge. Not sure I follow equivalence. NAI Disagrees with Fuchsia Ostrich, replies to Scarlet Octopus D1 45 Thanks Charcoal Hyena for reads list. Notes contract between Pearl Chameleon's earlier strong argument and more recent retraction. Thinks a villager would be more likely to not change views under pressure. Replies to Amethyst Scorpion, says theory on elim coinshots being too strong will be tested soon enough, assuming "our coinshot" chooses to shoot tonight. Explains belief in equivalence between v!lurcher and e!seeker as both being a role stronger for other team. Rates elim vote manipulators as limited power N/A N/A Agree re views on pearl Chameleon's actions - feels genuine. Request explanation for what they meant by theory being tested soon enough - why would village coinshot prove elim coinshot as too powerful? Mild village Replies to Charcoal Hyena, Pearl Chameleon, Melon Dingo, Salmon Meerkat, Amethyst Scorpion, Mauve Crocodile. Expresses elim view of Pearl Chameleon D1 63 Replies to Salmon Meerkat spotting absense of spiked seeker from power list, doesn't give explanation. Says value would be after smokers. Agrees with Violet Axolotl that Turquoise Gorilla not being helpful. N/A N/A Query reason for omission. Agree with view on Turquoise Gorilla's actions. NAI Supports Violet Axolotl's view on Turquoise Gorilla D1 71 Responds to Mauve Crocodile's query of their thoughts on N1 revealing an elim coinshot. Assumes any coinshot will shoot tonight, except hesitant village on. If three kills, probably eliminator coinshot. Responds to Amber Vulture, says Scarlet Octopus just pessimistic N/A N/A Not sure I buy the logic here - they themselves acknowledge complications. Suggest speculating on impact of night rurn on distribution better done as post hoc analysis. Gut mild evil Responds to Mauve Crocodile, Amber Vulture, defends Scarlet Octopus D1 83 Calls out Magenta Albatross for hedging their views. Says they receieved PMs from Amethyst Scorpion and Magenta Albatross N/A N/A Agree with calling out of Magenta Albatross NAI Calls out Magenta Albatross D1 107 Reads Charcoal Hyena as potentially part of eliminator team, abstaining from voting in case spiked lynch target of Chameleon changes. Suspects Spiked have a plan to move those votes. N/A N/A Post only makes sense if believes spiked votes already on Pearl Chameleon. Not likely to be on eliminator team with Charcoal Hyena. No current vote - if they hold this belief, why no vote? Probe, potentially moderate evil Has gut evil read on Charcoal Hyena. Suggests spiked want to lynch Pearl Chameleon. D1 123 Says two votes low enough for outcome to change, would rather Pearl Chameleon voted on them than in self preservation at this point in cycle. Effort clears Salmon Meerkat and Amber Vulture N/A N/A Doesn't feel in danger of lynch. Agree that pre-emptive to vote in self preservation. Disagree with effort clearing - I've done this before a number of times whilst evil. Willingness to effort clear cycle one makes me wary. Very mild evil Thinks Salmon Meerkat and Amber Vulture village D1 186 Respects commitment of Pearl Chameleon to read of Saffron Iguana. Replies to Mauve Crocodile, says has been giving commentary as they go, just hasn't consolidated it yet. Thinks amount of Octopus Rp posts makes them suspicious. Thinks possibility of elim tineye to give village choice of whether to kill suspicious player but shut dowen Pms or do reverse N/A N/A Not that many RP posts from Scarlet Octopus - odd player to single out for it. Still no vote, despite lynch building against them. Relaxed as to outcome of lynch due to vote manipulation? Reevaluate Suspicious of Scarlet Octopus D1 200 Replies to Emerald Falcon. Says sees any post not containing the another player as NAI .Thinks Spiked would prefer predictable lynch to random one meaning one of their own might be lynched. Thinks Pearl Chameleon was this lynch N/A N/A Many of their own posts therefore NAI - thus not helpful in contributing to meaningful discussion. Interesting to ntoe view on pearl Chameleon. Unsure Village read on Pearl Chameleon D1 212 Replies to Magenta Albatross' vote on them, votes for Magenta Albatross Magenta Albatross N/A At this point still tied, and feels relaxed. Planning to change vote, or confident of vote manipulation? Mild evil Votes for Magenta Albatross D1 214 Replies to Turquoise Gorilla, suggests compromise vote on Mauve Crocodile, votes for Mauve Crocodile Mauve Crocodile Magenta Albatross Has not expressed any suspicion of Mauve Crocodile, but now leading lynch. Why Mauve Crocodile over Turquoise Gorilla? Self-preservation likely NAI Votes for Mauve Crocodile Salmon Meerkat: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 22 RP N/A N/A RP NAI None D1 25 Says LG74 distribution had been generated for AG5, so unusual distribution possible. Says elim coinshot included in some possible distributions. Votes on Sunburst Toucan Sunburst Toucan N/A More active/experienced player. Thoughts and poke vote NAI NAI Replies to Saffron Iguana/Scarlet Octopus re distribution. Votes on Sunburst Toucan to encourage activity D1 28 RP. Complains of reading distribution discussion. Agrees with Coral Swan re pointless element to discussion. Says if village seekers then elim smokers. Notes power of village seeker re alignment/role. Says Elbereth/Fifth have more orthodox doctrine on distribution, but doesn't want to engage in guessing GMs. Retracts from Sunburst Toucan, votes on Pearl Chameleon for making performative vote. Says felt like looking for excuse to vote. Likes Octopus' line of thought, thinks idea of lylo useful. Says vote manip/nks useful for making distribution inferences. Pearl Chameleon Sunburst Toucan Thoughts prior to vote NAI. Agree that Pearl Chameleon's vote was easy, but five player posts prior to it - didn't have much to go on. I often place early votes as tool to generate discussion. In essence, agree with Salmon Meerkat's read of it, do not consider it vote worthy or AI. Query why timing of lylo useful. Voting on Pearl Chameleon's early vote not engaging with context - mild elim read Mild evil Agrees with Octopus, votes on Pearl Chameleo D1 36 Responds to Pearl Chameleon. Says first votes not always banal, cites games. Says dislikes Pearl Chameleon's vote because based on something NAI or bad reasoning, but that villagers can also have bad reasoning. Says feels like Pearl Chameleon not concerned with finding elims but appearing to do so. Doesn't like addition of votes to Pearl Chameleon this early in cycle. N/A N/A I don't disagree that bad reasoning certainly done by villagers. I disagree that voting on tenuous grounds is just to appear to find elims. Entirely legitimate to vote to generate information at this stage of the game, rather than to find eliminators. Rationalisation of earlier vote? Unsure Develops pressure on Pearl Chameleon, but dislikes lynch train growing on them D1 41 Replies to Chartreuse Penguin's vote count. Says they thought more votes on Pearl Chameleon, and too early for that. N/A N/A Indirect discouragement of more votes on Chameleon. NAI Replis to Chartreuse Penguin, indirect discouragement of more votes on Pearl Chameleon D1 44 RP. Retracts from Pearl Chameleon, votes on Amber Vulture for reading thread but not commenting Amber Vulture Pearl Chameleon Lowers pressure on Pearl Chameleon, consistent with earlier statements, but not in way defending them. Fair enough to vote on me. NAI Lowers pressure on Pearl Chameleon, votes on Amber Vulture D1 48 Asks Saffron Iguana why seekers absent from Spiked power ranking N/A N/A Sensible question. Saffron Iguana earlier also downplayed power of seeker to spiked Very mild village Queries Saffron Iguana D1 50 Quotes Turquoise Gorilla, points out Tyrian Falls meta build by Metacognition. Calls out further discussion of distribution N/A N/A Agree with points, NAI NAI Replies to Turquoise Gorilla D1 56 Points out that Chartreuse Penguin meant Safron Iguana in post 55. Comments on roleclaiming. N/A N/A Nothing alignment indicative NAI Replies to Chartreuse Penguin D1 59 Replies to Chartreuse Penguin, will not engage in fakeclaiming. N/A N/A NAI NAI Replies to Chartreuse Penguin D1 72 Says from PMs light village read on Amethyst Scorpion. Retracts from Amber Vulture because they guessed successfully my identity and didn't wish to see me dead. Returns vote to Pearl Chameleon. Pearl Chameleon Amber Vulture Mild gut good from presentation of read on Amethyst Scorpion. Vote on Pearl Chameleon interesting - from reading thread I'm (at post 72) inclined to agree with it. Gut feeling that Salmon Meerkat trying to solve the game. Gut mild good PM with Amethyst Scorpion, mild village read. Retracts from Amber Vulture based on player identity. Votes on Pearl Chameleon D1 77 RP reply to Coral Swan N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 97 Joking responses N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 100 Joking responses N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 102 Joking responses N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 104 Provides list of present reads. Amethyst Scorpion, Scarlet Octopus stronger village, Coral Swan, Mauve Crocodile, Saffron Iguana, Charcoal Hyena, Chartreuse Penguin, Fuchsia Ostrich, Oxblood Beagle weaker village reads. Opal Lion, Pearl Chameleon, Turquoise Gorilla, Quartz Zebra, Emerald Falcon weak eliminator reads. Doesn't give specifics for players. N/A N/A Appreciate visual conveyance of information. Reads consistent with iso of previous posts, and consistent with actions. Mild-moderate village read Mild village See post D1 106 Wants to discuss vote train on Pearl Chameleon. Says returned vote to Pearl Chameleon to gauge responses, doesn't feel like much response has occurred. Suggests eliminators aren't particularly invested in outcome of Chameleon lynch. Long post on theory of eliminator actions. Suggests in essence elim team will have some active players and some under radar. Looks at players voting on side trains, concludes Quartz Zebra, Melon Dingo, Opal Lion, Emerald Falcon, and Turquoise Gorilla fall in this category. Of these players, Turquoise Gorilla has a vote, so votes for them to tie the lynch. Turquoise Gorilla Pearl Chameleon Don't fundamentally disagree with reading of lynch on Chalemeon, or that likely eliminators on side trains. Early in cycle I gave credence to Turquoise Gorilla having "village slipped". Possibly deliberate, still consider them less likely to be evil than others. Concerned that I'm trusting Salmon Meerkat too much, but gut village read on them Gut village Votes on Turquoise Gorilla. See post D1 110 Has mentioned thoughts on Amethyst Scorpion to PM partners, wanted to be explicit to thread. Has read my long post (or at least parts of it). Light village read on Amethyst Scorpion because of odd way of phishing - claiming that Salmon Meerkat is an elim vote manipulator. N/A N/A Brave for trying to parse the long-post… Agree with regards to odd way of phishing, inclined to agree with village read from it Mild village Village read of Amethyst Scorpion D1 112 Is influenced to clear Amethyst Scorpion by nature of phishing as alignment, not role, phishing N/A N/A On balance, could simply be trolling. Haven't had interactions with Amethyst Scorpion, difficult to judge NAI Re PM with Amethyst Scorpion D1 115 Replies to Coral Swan on lynching less active players. Suggests Quartz Zebra as player under the radar. Gut dislike of Coral Swan not voting on suspicions. Shift from Pearl Chameleon because mood of thread suggested no eliminator under threat, if Pearl Chameleon not an eliminator then best place for eliminators is to be elsewhere N/A N/A Valid reason to move. Wary of my village reading of Salmon Meerkat Mild village Identifies Quartz Zebra as player under the radar. D1 127 Buys Coral Swan's explanation "with some salt". Doesn't think Pearl Chameleon has a good take on Coral Swan's actions, as early mislynch easy to explain even if eliminator. No pressure to act in the way they have N/A N/A Feels like genuinely thinking about interactions in way difficult to recreate Gut village Slightly less suspicious of Coral Swan D1 129 Clarifies the lowering of distrust of Coral Swan as not trusting them either N/A N/A Preparedness to be explicit on views - willingness to be held to them Very mild village Clarifies position on Coral Swan D1 133 Doesn't see how e!Coral Swan holds thought process as can't see how e!Coral Swan benefits from bad reasoning used. e!Coral Swan with e!Charcoal Hyena if e!Pearl Chameleon, otherwise voting on Charcoal Hyena gives distancing and doesn't distract from Pearl Chameleon lynch. retracts from Turquoise Gorilla, votes on Charcoal Hyena, asking them to explain why they called out having made reads list before game started Charcoal Hyena Turquoise Gorilla I buy the logic used re Coral Swan. Appreciate direct question to Charcoal Hyena - claim seems to be odd claim, used to gain village cred. Moderate village Doesn't see evil Coral Swan not voting on evil Charcoal Hyena unless Pearl Chameleon also evil. Questions Charcoal Hyena with vote D1 144 Asks Pearl Chameleon why Coral Swan didn't follow through on their vote. Thinks Pearl Chameleon set on Coral Swan. Negative gut read of both Pearl Chameleon and Coral Swan N/A N/A Trying to explain situation to Pearl Chameleon. Disagree ongut - think v/v more likely than e/v or v/e NAI Trying to explain actions of Coral Swan to Pearl Chameleon D1 201 Replies to Mauve Crocodile's question re lynchign Melon Dingo. Says Melon Dingo on performative list. Not so suspicious as to vote for them on basis of vote solicitation. Vote solicitation makes them paranoid. Responds to Amethyst Scorpion, acknowledges point that make-up of eliminator team might be reason for lack of energy in preventing Pearl Chameleon lynch N/A N/A Unsure if reading post correctly. No new thoughts Unsure None D1 205 Finds it interesting that neither Turquoise Gorilla nor Mauve Crocodile have voted in self preservation yet, expects them to do so. Doesn't feel invested in saving Gorilla or Crocodile. N/A N/A None really Believe them to be village Not invested in saving Turquoise Gorilla or Mauve Crocodile D1 209 Appreciates Emerald Falcon's recent posts N/A N/A NAI NAI Reply to Emerald Falcon Scarlet Octopus: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 13 RP. Suggests 6.5 eliminators, rounded to 7. Makes assumption about village distribution. Doesn't think eliminator tineye. Discounts eliminator seeker. Firmly discounts eliminator coinshot. Questions Pearl Chameleon's guess of five eliminators. Questions confidence of Pearl Chameleon in their confidence of role distribution, questions spiked seeker, calling it weak. Votes on Pearl Chameleon Pearl Chameleon N/A Disagree strongly re number of eliminators - much too high. Dislike discounting of eliminator seeker. Gut concern that elim seeker on team. If flips spiked, reconsider this strongly. Mild evil Disagrees with Pearl Chameleon, votes on them D1 17 Says if elim coinshot, lynch or lose four rounds away. Doesn't find it likely, but says could be balanced with lurchers/seekers N/A N/A Dislike formatting - obfuscates their points. Why call attention to lylo this early? Doesn't inform how we should play game - based on two very unlikely assumptions (7 elims, elim coinshot). Says it could be balanced with thugs, doesn't consider them in lylo calc. Feels alarmist. Fed by recent game meta? NAI None D1 20 Replies to Coral Swan saying elim numbers don't matter, suggests consensus on lylo point important N/A N/A Why is it important? How does LyLo point alter our gameplay, particularly if based on assumptions. I view use of numbers discussion as only useful to validate opinions on distribution (which I think is of limited value itself), or in late game to check known eliminator views Probably NAI Disagrees with Coral Swan D1 27 Replies to Saffron Iguana's suggestion that lurchers less useful to village, suggests can turn games. Kill blocked every other game. N/A N/A Lurchers most of use when village begins to identify trusted villagers. Threat of kill on trusted villager being blocked perhaps of more use than blocked kill itself NAI Replies to Saffron Iguana D1 31 Replies to Emerald Falcon, says we should cleanse "those who bog us down" N/A N/A Agree that Emerald Falcon unhelpful. If suggesting we vote them out, strongly disagree. Easy way to waste information generating discussion. Very mild evil Calls out Emerald Falcon D1 34 Says Pearl Chameleon feels slimy/evasive. Says they are being backtracky, notes may be tunneling. N/A N/A Disagree - but maybe because I like playstyle of Pearl Chameleon. Adding pressure to Pearl Chameleon, lynch candidate, four hours into cycle. Very mild evil Replies to Mauve Crocodile, supporting lynch of Pearl Chameleon D1 51 Replies to element of Charcoal Hyena's post considering them. Points out that their own vote wasn't very thorough. Says not going to do reads at this point N/A N/A Calls out Charcoal Hyena, provides sensible logic for their vote remaining in place. NAI Less likely on same team as Charcoal Hyena D1 68 Replies to Amber Vulture, saying "not the best reasoning, but valid" N/A N/A Nothing meaningful NAI Replies to Amber Vulture D1 84 Replies to Saffron Iguana's defence of Scarlet Octopus to Amber Vulture. Says their pessimism is because games almost always go to lynch or lose N/A N/A Haven't been following recent games. Makes sense if formative game experience NAI Response to Saffron Iguana re Amber Vulture D1 86 RP N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 98 Joke N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 154 Joke N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 156 Joke N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 162 Feels consensus is off Pearl Chameleon, null on Charcoal Hyena, mild village on Coral Swan, so votes on Turquoise Gorilla. Prepared to return vote to Pearl Chameleon Turquoise Gorilla Pearl Chameleon No reason provided for vote on Gorilla, but vote with potential to kill. Unlikely to be on a team with Gorilla. Expresses willingness to lynch Pearl Chameleon, then removes any viability of the lynch. Unsure Votes on Turquoise Gorilla, putting them tied to lead lynch. Possibly on team with Coral Swan, tied with Turquoise Gorilla? Turquoise Gorilla: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 8 RP. Proposes we discuss village to eliminator distribution. N/A N/A Unhelpful formatting. Seeks to spark discussion, well trodden ground for early discussion, of limited value (but not much else of value to discuss) NAI None D1 14 Non-RP post. Believes 6-7 spiked. Suggests eliminator kill role (coinshot/mistborn) N/A N/A Disagree with spiked assumption, probably NAI. Village slip considering coinshot/mistborn equivalent for spiked? Mild village None D1 49 Quotes player distribution discussion. Says thinks 25% the sweet spot for eliminator numbers, so 6-7 eliminator team N/A N/A Doesn't engage with vote discussion Very mild elim Quotes team distribution discussion, doesn't engage with posts directly D1 118 Notes typo in Pearl Chameleon's post N/A N/A Doesn't engage with vote discussion, even though centred on themselves Unsure None D1 157 Asks for a vote count N/A N/A Not engaging with thread enough to find last one and work it out. Not trying to solve game? Very mild evil None D1 160 Votes on Coral Swan. Reads them null, possibly mildly elim, but doesn't see reason for other trains. Says Pearl Chameleon and Mauve Crocodile both seem village in PMs, doesn't see reason for voting on Charcoal Hyena Coral Swan N/A Four hours left in cycle, not strictly necessary to vote on one of those four, given low vote threshold. Feels like wants to lynch someone, doesn't need a good reason to. Mild evil Votes Coral Swan - not on a team with them, as threatens lynch. Defends Pearl Chameleon and Mauve Crocodile. D1 163 Says their vote on Coral Swan is because it is too late to start a lynch train, and that they are gut reading Coral Swan as mild elim N/A N/A At least consistent with actions. Poor reason for vote, but prepared to vote and be seen to do so on gut Very mild gut evil Explains vote on Coral Swan D1 193 Provides updated vote count, in which they are leading N/A N/A Relaxed about outcome? Seems slightly nonchalant Mild evil None D1 213 Doesn't want to see Mauve Crocodile or themselves lynched, so votes for Saffron Iguana, despite null read Saffron Iguana Coral Swan Four minutes to end of cycle, consistent with self preservation. Announces trust of Mauve Crocodile before they get lynched - seeking village cred? NAI, gut mild village Declared wish to keep Mauve Crocodile alive, voted to lynch Saffron Iguana Violet Axolotl: Spoiler Cycle Post Summary Vote Retractions Thoughts AI (perceived) Notable connections D1 61 RP. Votes on Turquoise Gorilla for trying to look helpful whilst not helping Turquoise Gorilla N/A Agree with observation of Turquoise Gorilla's actions. Very mild village Votes on Turquoise Gorilla D1 79 Asks Coral Swan to join their vote on Turquoise Gorilla, as Coral Swan has Turquoise Gorilla as an elim read N/A N/A Committed to their vote, consistent view Mild village Asks Coral Swan to vote on Turquoise Gorilla D1 82 Responds to Onyx Flamingo, defending (sarcastically) trying to persuade others of their view N/A N/A NAI NAI Replies to Onyx Flamingo D1 96 Jokes to Fifth Scholar N/A N/A NAI NAI None D1 126 Says not voting on someone because not suspicious misses "guilty until proven innocent" point. RP. N/A N/A Interesting way to think about game. Preparedness to vote on those not actively suspicious of? Philosophy seems consistent with vote, at least Unsure Replies to Pearl Chameleon, doesn't engage with vote D1 135 Says early on abstention needs more justification than a vote N/A N/A Disagree strongly - unreasoned votes add noise w/out signal to analysis, reduce likelihood of correct analysis achieving plurality of votes. Discussion of mechanics without players - nice place for eliminators to hide, but knowingly controversial statement. Very mild evil None D1 140 Says usefulness of vote hinges on distinction between village voting randomly and eliminators with bias N/A N/A Need thought through votes to produce discussion revealing bias NAI None D1 147 Suggests D1 does not have material on which to base vote, so may as well embrace it N/A N/A Deeply pessimistic view, ignores generation of views through D1. Not taking into account end of day 1 massively different game state to start of game NAI None D1 149 Replies to Pearl Chameleon, view not sad, enjoys murdering players, doesn't feel bad as random N/A N/A Not attempting to solve game, doesn't care about not being seen attempting to Mild village None D1 197 RP response to Mint Heron's vote N/A N/A Doesn't engage with substantives of vote. Doesn't feel under any pressure NAI None Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffron Iguana Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Emerald Falcon said: Iguana and Chameleon are in a position where if I was an Elim they are never getting NKd. Are you freezing my objections, because icy no problem with this situation. 2 hours ago, Scarlet Octopus said: I do think that the Croc train was propagated by the elims. I think at least one of the vote manips was elim as well. That makes me more suspicious of Gorilla and Saffron and less suspicious of Chameleon. The three main wagons made up 12 of the 17 votes, so I imagine some of the five to seven Spiked voted for us. I was waiting to comment on the vote manipulation until Gorilla did, but they also ignored it. @Turquoise Gorilla? 2 hours ago, Coral Swan said: Tonight I plan to reread the last two pages of the day, the night, and make some PMs :D. We'll see how that all goes.Disappointed in the cycle result; two out of three candidates were low on my trust list and the third was my highest trust, and who dies? I'm very interested in where your vote will go next round. Lion's too, if they vote. Let me call that cat back here to say if they have an answer to any of the questions they've posed. Here, kitty quody, pspspsscripsiscripsi. * Vulture asked why I chose Crocodile over Gorilla. I considered trying to reference the Bruno Mars song but the Crocodile pun came easier so I went with that. I also thought I might be able to get Gorilla to move their vote and better my odds of survival, but I didn't read their post closely enough about why they picked me otherwise I wouldn't have bothered. Edited January 6, 2022 by Saffron Iguana Added response to Vulture Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emerald Falcon Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 2 hours ago, Coral Swan said: Ok Mr massive-iso-condemning-croc Yes? is there a problem? I made the ISO hoping to find something villagery, and then made a PM with him that never got answered (too close to deadline) but all I could find is places where it felt that he was trying to hint at being a power role. 2 minutes ago, Saffron Iguana said: Are you freezing my objections, because icy no problem with this situation. The goal of not killing you would just be to further confusion. In the end, every person the Elims kill is someone we don't have to solve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Swan Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Emerald Falcon said: Yes? is there a problem? I made the ISO hoping to find something villagery, and then made a PM with him that never got answered (too close to deadline) but all I could find is places where it felt that he was trying to hint at being a power role. No problem, I just thought it was funny. Like Vulture said in their latest post, I found the iso quite tunnelly as I'm sure you could have found something village in their posts seeing as they all came from a villager. I don't think it's [the iso] necessarily elim. Praise the Ja! Edited January 6, 2022 by Coral Swan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elbereth Posted January 6, 2022 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 13 hours ago, Salmon Meerkat said: @Fifth Scholar, @Elbereth - actually can we get a clarification on whether smokers can send in an order every turn or not? i realise the implication of the off on night turn on on day turn ruling is that u can send in an order any turn as far as i can recall standard tyrian only allows smokers to act at night - hence the cooldown problem and a rabidly anti-smoking village but standard tyrian is already problematic b/c the game began on a night turn hence the actions skew and the smokers problem if smokers can only first switch off during n1 if smokers can switch on in the day and off at night then smokers should absolutely do that >edit - @fifth @el - if smokers can act in the day, can we also get an ooa including vm and the lynch and and u know what can we get a night ooa pls just to be clear b/c i don't want to assume xD >editedit > sorry i haz more qns - the clarification wording talks about activation: is activation the same as deactivating copperclouds wrt to the two possible actions for a smoker: deactivating coppercloud + extending it? *takes a deep breath* Okay MOAR EMOTIONAL ALLOMANCY CLARIFICATIONS because apparently these are neverending :)))) (many are in response to Meerkat's post, some are stuff we just thought up ourselves or that other people asked) On Smoking: Smokers can send in one Smoking-related action per numbered cycle (e.g. only once during C3). That action could be "turn off my coppercloud" or "smoke X" or "just smoke myself" (only necessary if you want to change states after 1 turn rather than wait 2). That action will last for two turns (unless it's a Night order and the Smoker puts in a superseding one the next Day). After those two turns are up, if the Smoker does not put in another order, they will return to their default state of Smoking themselves. Also, no zombie copperclouds: if I submit an action to smoke Fifth during N3, and am killed that same turn, Fifth will be smoked N3 but not D4. Rioting/Soothing: You can Riot someone to a no-vote but not from one. If you try to Riot someone from a no-vote, your own vote doesn't get cancelled - you just get told the action was invalid (and, where possible, we'll try to prevent that from happening as your friendly neighborhood GMs, in the same way we'd alert someone who tried to Lurch the same person two cycles in a row). A Rioter trying to move Fifth's vote to Wilson will still have their own vote nullified if Fifth's vote ends on Wilson. A Rioter cannot move their own vote, and a Soother cannot self-target. Other stuff: You cannot place two actions during the same turn (i.e. no elim kill + night action from the same person), but you can place two during the same cycle (i.e. day action + elim kill is fine). Day OoA: Smoking*, Soothing/Rioting**, Execution Night OoA: Smoking*, Seeking, Tineye Message, Lurching, Kills *As noted, Smoking does not extend protection to someone the turn after the Smoker dies. ** The interactions between Soothing and Rioting have already been clarified extensively. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emerald Falcon Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 3 minutes ago, Coral Swan said: I'm sure you could have found something village in their posts seeing as they all came from a villager I would be voting you for this sentence right now if it was a day phase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turquoise Gorilla Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Saffron Iguana said: The three main wagons made up 12 of the 17 votes, so I imagine some of the five to seven Spiked voted for us. I was waiting to comment on the vote manipulation until Gorilla did, but they also ignored it. @Turquoise Gorilla? [Apologies. I have been lacking the motivation to post much today, but I find it likely that the vote manip was all elims, possibly 1:1. Iguana and I had been the brunt of most of the suspicion D1, so whether or not they’re an elim, the elims have reason to protect both of us.] Edited January 6, 2022 by Turquoise Gorilla “Packing” :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Swan Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 Just now, Emerald Falcon said: I would be voting you for this sentence right now if it was a day phase. :P. Alright maybe not but do remember I'm someone who read every single bit of Crocodile's posting as village So to me it's strange how you saw literally none of that Also this is the second AG we killed Croc D1. Hmm. Praise the Ja! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emerald Falcon Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 1 minute ago, Turquoise Gorilla said: [Apologies. I have been lacking the motivation to post much today, but I find it likely that the vote manip was all elims, possibly 1:1. Iguana and I had been the brunt of most of the suspicion D1, so whether or not they’re an elim, the elims have reason to protect both of us.] What about pearl? As far as I remember, the vote didn't swing to you guys until later in the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turquoise Gorilla Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 Just now, Emerald Falcon said: What about pearl? As far as I remember, the vote didn't swing to you guys until later in the day. [I’m very confused as to what you mean here] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet Axolotl Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 After the crowd dispersed from where Riggs had been killed, Dyring gently hefted the corpse over his shoulder and began the long walk up the road and back to his inn. The day had been a disaster, an innocent man killed, but it was hard to see things playing out any other way. Dyring himself had pushed for the death of one of the townsfolk, and that person might just as easily have been an innocent bystander. But, well, some things just had to be done. And someone had to take care of the bodies. Dyring had dug a grave out back once it was clear that the day would end in violence. No sense in digging more than one, with the ash coming down like it was, but putting the body to rest was the most he could do for Riggs at this point. Once the burial was complete, Dyring rounded the front of Dyring's Inn and began to sweep the porch off. The night was when he had enough time really keep the place clean, especially given that still none of the townsfolk or the newcomers had taken up his offer of work. Dyring lost himself in the rhythm of the broom for a while, mulling over the day's events. He figured the most important thing that nobody knew was whether any of the saboteurs was actually in danger. Given the number of Allomancers in the town, the Spiked likely had their fair share of Rioters and Soothers, and it was unlikely they would let one of their own perish if the crowd couldn't make up its mind. Of course, if everyone had been totally off base, then focusing on the villagers that had nearly died was something of a waste of time. Hopefully some events would transpire during the night to clear that up. If not, chances are more innocents would die to mob rule during the day. Having swept the ash off the surface of the porch, Dyring turned to the pair of chairs that sat off the to the side of the entrance to his place. He pulled a small brush from his belt and meticulously cleaned first the left chair, then the right, using a soft touch to keep the ash from rubbing into the grain of the wood. As Dyring worked, he couldn't help but see his Elly in one of the chairs, smiling back at him. Eventually, his work done, Dyring fled from the mists and his memories into the dubious safety of the inn. He took a good long while to catch his breath and blink his eyes clear. There was still work to be done, and getting lost in the past wouldn't make it any easier. That was what he told himself, at least. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charcoal Hyena Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) To begin, I'm going to focus on the Saffron Iguana and Turquoise Gorilla execution groupings. Because I'll be doing isolation analysis of each player involved, I may not be able to get to the non-participants until later. Quote Saffron Iguana (3): Magenta Albatross, Mauve Crocodile, Pearl Chameleon, Turquoise Gorilla It appears that one of the four voters here were Soothed by a third party or attempted to Riot someone themselves, perhaps not realizing they'd lose their vote in the process, only for the Rioting to fail. In the first case, it would appear like Saffron was being saved by an ally; or framed, for the more charitable take. In the second case, it would seem a voter was very confident in their read and willing to throw their role's weight behind it. We know Mauve wasn't doing it to self-prez at least, though if either Magenta, Pearl, or Turquoise are indeed a Rioter, they may want to consider admitting to the mistake so we can rule out Elim!Soother interference saving Saffron. As important as role safety is, that context could help us solidify multiple reads. Saffron Iguana Opening Post: Team number and role distro speculation. NAI to me. Second Post: Responds to Coral's own distro thoughts (calls Coral insightful). Continues the discussion, which remains NAI. Insightful comment could be a smol pocketing attempt, but it seems genuine enough, given Saffron's interest in the topic. Third Post: Responds to Pearl's vote on them (for focusing on past rule distros for speculation on this game). I find Saffron's response very nonchalant, like they were a duck and Pearl's vote was water on their back. I really liked their comeback question as well, which I read as Saffron genuinely trying to solve the game. Lean Village. Fourth Post: Began by responding to my reads list, suggesting me to use a quote box in the future (NAI). Further challenges Pearl on their initial strong argument followed by a fairly easy retraction, expecting that a villager who put that much effort into explaining their vote would make them push further after being challenged. I can't help but agree that something is off (which I'll figure out in my Pearl isolation later) which further supports my Village read of Saffron. The latter half is mostly about what roles they believe are the best for elims and village. Fifth Post: Corrects themselves on a previous mix-up with roles, then asks Salmon Meerkat about the identity of who tried phishing their role. Replies to Violet Axlotl's vote on Turquoise Gorilla for quoting a bunch of people and saying nothing about the posts. It's another good reason to look side-eyed at someone, though it's worth noting they didn't join the vote. They even use apologetic language, as if dismissing the weirdness completely. Willing to give the benefit for now, but this could point to an E/E interaction. Sixth Post: Says they "lichen" Mauve Crocodile's attention to detail (reading Mauve as village or smol pocketing again?). Explains that they assume "any Coinshot in play will shoot tonight, except perhaps for a hesitant village one, and if there is a Spiked Coinshot, there will also be a village one, so potentially three total kills." What stands out to me is that Saffron's wording almost expects a Spiked Coinshot kill, since a Villager Coinshot was the "except perhaps" afterthought. If that ends up being true, this may be Suspicious in retrospect. (Also quotes Amber Vulture about people thinking about the endgame and then correlates it to how optimistic a player is, which I find NAI). Seventh Post: Directly confronts Magenta Albatross on a hedgy post ("I don't know who to vote for, but we'll need someone with a lot of votes to prevent vote manipulation... so I won't jump on anything yet"). Says they don't like how Magenta appears to have explicitly planned to vote late in the round. While I agree, I once again wonder why Saffron didn't follow up the confrontation with a vote. I'm not certain which way to lean here; will need to see what happens next. Eighth Post: Challenges me this time on not addressing Pearl before going to bed, concerned that I was delaying a vote to set up elim shenanigans. I responded to this earlier, agreeing that's a fair read, though I provided the true reasoning. Ends the post with a quote of Chartreuse Penguin about reads list, telling Coral Swan to take notes. Again, no votes. ??? Ninth Post: Another pun, this time to Turquoise, with no game-related comment added (???). Continues to challenge Pearl Chameleon, but this time for setting up an early self-preservation vote with 9 hours left in the turn and only two votes on them. Still doesn't vote or indicate they plan on it, which I find odd given how active they've been on top of how much time they have just addressed is left. This makes me think Saffron knows they will be on later in the turn and holding their vote, which is odd considering they accused me of the same thing earlier. At this point, the trend is becoming more Suspicious. I'm hoping to see a vote from them soon, because whatever alignment they are, I expect its timing will be telling. They also end the post saying they believe Amber Vulture and Salmon Meerkat are both Village for their committed analysis. Tenth Post: Respects Pearl's commitment to their read by voting for... Saffron. Addresses Mauve Crocodile's vote on them (has no read of Saffron despite their activity) by pointing out they haven't yet consolidated reads or voted. Adds that they are suspicious of Octopus for all their RP posts, then continues to talk about whether Tineyes will be village or elim. It's worth noting this post is 2 hours before rollover. 7 hours after their last post. And still no vote! Leaning Elim. Eleventh Post: Responds to Emerald Falcon's own isolation of Saffron's posts, which points out things I didn't, and also suggest Saffron being an eliminator (steering village perception of elim roles, which I didn't even process because my brain no likey role speculation). Saffron says they're impressed, and defends themself by saying "unless I talk about another player, this is all NAI." Regarding Pearl Chameleon, they claim to "imagine the Spiked do have some idea of a potential fall person" and believe that Pearl was their early choice. Again, this doesn't look good, since Saffron themselves is withholding their vote and barely commenting on the execution candidates. Leaning Elim with a possible E/E interaction with Pearl. Twelfth Post: During the last hour, Saffron finally votes on Magenta Albatross... with barely any explanation. Just a quote and a "Y". I'm very confused. Thirteenth Post: Immediately switches their vote to Mauve Crocodile to self prez when Turquoise Gorilla voted for them. The turn ends shortly thereafter. As we now know, Mauve ends up being Village, and Saffron is missing a vote. Overall, I'm finding the bad of their later content heavily outweighs the good I found in their early posts. Lots of challenging statements, as if poking for weaknesses, while never settling on any vote until the very last hour (neither of which have explanations) and when they're about to die. The fact Saffron went to Mauve over Turquoise when Turquoise just voted for them and said they didn't want Mauve dead is... weird, especially considering their vote on Magenta seemed to be a reaction for Magenta voting Saffron. Could Turquoise have known a Saffron vote was going to be Soothed, and thus put their vote where it wouldn't matter for village cred, while Saffron placed their vote to protect Turquoise? I'm not sure how the weirdness can be explained otherwise, and if correct, would imply that Saffron is a power-role worth protecting over Turquoise. In summary, Saffron's whole Day 1 has severely dropped them in my estimation to an Elim Read, with implications that Turquoise could be an opportunistic ally. This alone has taken longer than I expected, so I'll post it now and continue working on my next isolation. Though I originally planned on doing Saffron's three voters, the weirdness with Turquoise has convinced me to check their posts first, which is helpful considering they were the other train. Edited January 6, 2022 by Charcoal Hyena Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmon Meerkat Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 1 hour ago, Elbereth said: *takes a deep breath* Okay MOAR EMOTIONAL ALLOMANCY CLARIFICATIONS because apparently these are neverending :)))) (many are in response to Meerkat's post, some are stuff we just thought up ourselves or that other people asked) On Smoking: Smokers can send in one Smoking-related action per numbered cycle (e.g. only once during C3). That action could be "turn off my coppercloud" or "smoke X" or "just smoke myself" (only necessary if you want to change states after 1 turn rather than wait 2). That action will last for two turns (unless it's a Night order and the Smoker puts in a superseding one the next Day). After those two turns are up, if the Smoker does not put in another order, they will return to their default state of Smoking themselves. Also, no zombie copperclouds: if I submit an action to smoke Fifth during N3, and am killed that same turn, Fifth will be smoked N3 but not D4. Rioting/Soothing: You can Riot someone to a no-vote but not from one. If you try to Riot someone from a no-vote, your own vote doesn't get cancelled - you just get told the action was invalid (and, where possible, we'll try to prevent that from happening as your friendly neighborhood GMs, in the same way we'd alert someone who tried to Lurch the same person two cycles in a row). A Rioter trying to move Fifth's vote to Wilson will still have their own vote nullified if Fifth's vote ends on Wilson. A Rioter cannot move their own vote, and a Soother cannot self-target. Other stuff: You cannot place two actions during the same turn (i.e. no elim kill + night action from the same person), but you can place two during the same cycle (i.e. day action + elim kill is fine). Day OoA: Smoking*, Soothing/Rioting**, Execution Night OoA: Smoking*, Seeking, Tineye Message, Lurching, Kills *As noted, Smoking does not extend protection to someone the turn after the Smoker dies. ** The interactions between Soothing and Rioting have already been clarified extensively. tyvm ilu too <3 i appreciate there is an extensive literature on tyrian variants w/ a subsection dedicated to the excavation of metacognian utterances on the properties of smoking and the kasimirian codicil on riot interactions w/ smoking & i want u 2 know i greatly appreciate the work u & fifth put into making this cursed bramblepatch of absolute suffering watered by the tears of stray gms into a set of moderately easy to understand rules =P 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emerald Falcon Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 coolio. Spoiler [P] Pearl Chameleon votes Saffron Iguana ^ 1 [P] Scarlet Octopus votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Sunburst Toucan ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Sunburst Toucan - 0 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 2 [P] Mauve Crocodile votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Chartreuse Penguin votes Violet Axolotl ^ 1 [P] Charcoal Hyena votes Amethyst Scorpion ^ 1 [P] Chartreuse Penguin unvotes Violet Axolotl - 0 [P] Chartreuse Penguin votes Charcoal Hyena ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Amber Vulture ^ 1 [P] Coral Swan votes Amber Vulture ^ 1 [P] Violet Axolotl votes Turquoise Gorilla ^ 1 [P] Amber Vulture votes Scarlet Octopus ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Amber Vulture - 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Coral Swan unvotes Amber vulture - 0 [P] Coral Swan votes Melon Dingo ^ 1 [P] Oxblood Beagle votes Coral Swan ^ 1 [P] Onyx Flamingo votes Violet Axolotl ^ 1 [P] Fuschia Ostrich votes Mauve Crocodile ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Turquoise Gorilla ^ 2 [P] Pearl Chameleon unvotes Saffron Iguana - 0 [P] Pearl Chameleon votes Coral Swan ^ 2 [P] Chartreuse Penguin unvotes Charcoal Hyena - 0 [P] Chartreuse Penguin votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Turquoise Gorilla - 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Charcoal Hyena ^ 1 [P] Coral Swan unvotes Melon Dingo - 0 [P] Coral Swan votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 4 [P] Chartreuse Penguin unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 3 [P] Chartreuse Penguin votes Charcoal Hyena ^ 2 [P] Turquoise Gorilla votes Coral Swan ^ 3 [P] Coral Swan unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Coral Swan votes Turquoise Gorilla ^ 2 [P] Scarlet Octopus unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 1 [P] Scarlet Octopus votes Turquoise Gorilla ^ 3 [P] Emerald Falcon votes Mauve Crocodile ^ 2 [P] Amethyst Scorpion votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 2 [P] Pearl Chameleon unvotes Coral Swan - 2 [P] Pearl Chameleon votes Saffron Iguana ^ 1 [P] Mauve Crocodile unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 1 [P] Mauve Crocodile votes Saffron Iguana ^ 2 [P] Amber Vulture unvotes Scarlet Octopus - 0 [P] Mint Heron votes Violet Axolotl ^ 2 [P] Onyx Flamingo unvotes Violet Axolotl - 1 [P] Onyx Flamingo votes Mauve Crocodile ^ 3 [P] Magenta Albatross votes Saffron Iguana ^ 3 [P] Saffron Iguana votes Magenta Albatross ^ 1 [P] Turquoise Gorilla unvotes Coral Swan - 1 [P] Turquoise Gorilla votes Saffron Iguana ^ 4 [P] Saffron Iguana unvotes Magenta Albatross - 0 [P] Saffron Iguana Votes Mauve Crocodile ^ 4 [P] Amethyst Scorpion unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 0 [P] Amethyst Scorpion votes Turquoise Gorilla ^ 4 Spoiler [P] Scarlet Octopus votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 2 [P] Mauve Crocodile votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Chartreuse Penguin votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Coral Swan votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 4 [P] Chartreuse Penguin unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 3 [P] Coral Swan unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Scarlet Octopus unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 1 [P] Amethyst Scorpion votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 2 [P] Mauve Crocodile unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 1 [P] Amethyst Scorpion unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 0 Specific things that stand out to me - The seeming fluidity of Penguin's vote. Penguin votes Violet axolotl, a poke seemingly, but has no hesitation in immediately switching to Hyena. This happens almost /directly/ after, with Penguin's first vote at post 42, Hyena's first post at 44, and then Penguin changing his vote at 45. I find his movements onto Pearl and then back onto Hyena those more likely coming from a villager as well. - Swan being a follower. Where penguin is fluid, Swan's votes in general felt very rigid to me, but I don't see anything new from him really at all. he poke votes dingo, but after joining Meerkat on Amber. 46 is where Meerkat votes Amber, and then Swan votes alongside at 49. He does then set himself up to switch votes-mentioning an incoming readslist to collect his thoughts and vote...which comes at post 77, an hour after 74, where Meerkat retracts. I don't even think there's a good way to phrase this, but just look at the votes, and you notice he seems to be following Meerkat's votes, but on a delay. Perhaps what this really means is that they're both village. - Votes on Pearl seem to be... well. everyone who put Pearl up to 3 votes-Mauve, Meerkat, Penguin. Mauve was village, and I have village reads on both Meerkat and peguin, however flimsy they may be. Coral was the one to bump up pearl to 4 votes, but I'm still conflicted on them. if you look through all the Pearl voters, there isn't any of them that I strongly distrust. Coral isn't a solid village read, but I'm not incredibly suspicious of them right now. Side note: Gorilla's reasoning for Swan was strange. Specifically for me the part where he said " I don’t really see why everyone’s jumping on Hyena; none of their posts at all stood out to me", Simply because I don't think you could pass the large colorful readslist. I might be interpreting this wrong, so benefit of the doubt. No reason for including the pearl votes other than that was a main point of D1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opal Lion Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 4 hours ago, Scarlet Octopus said: I do think that the Croc train was propagated by the elims. I think at least one of the vote manips was elim as well. That makes me more suspicious of Gorilla and Saffron and less suspicious of Chameleon. Lion somewhat agrees with this thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magenta Albatross Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 I realized that a Rioter could have voted for someone(other than Saffron or Gorilla in this case), taken a vote off of Saffron or Gorilla, and moved that vote onto the person they originally voted for, thereby covering up the fact their vote got cancelled and keeping their role secret. So my previous statement that Saffron couldn't be a Rioter is false. And anyone who didn't vote for Saffron or Gorilla could have done it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emerald Falcon Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) 4 hours ago, Scarlet Octopus said: I do think that the Croc train was propagated by the elims. I think at least one of the vote manips was elim as well. That makes me more suspicious of Gorilla and Saffron and less suspicious of Chameleon. What do you then think of the people on the train then? Onyx was the one who brought Mauve up to 3, which was something i forgot to mention in my last post- - Onyx's pop in Onyx didn't really speak at all, with three posts last day. The first was a vote on Violet, and then strangely the moment Mint joins the vote on violet they pop back in thread, switch vote, and then leave again. It's pretty awkward timing, imo. and then just to disappear again. the only other post was a small bit of RP i believe after the second vote. And if the croc train was Elim-motivated, it also doesn't neccessarily reflect on the counterwagons as much as the composition of the wagon, so I find it interesting that you bring up the counterwagons and not the members voting on croc. All they have to do is push one of a v/v/v wagon over and suddenly those other two people take up our discussion for the next two days while the Elims lie back and relax. Edited January 6, 2022 by Emerald Falcon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlet Octopus Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 So a single Rioter could have caused that result. That means that if it was an elim defending an elim, we know that one of Guerilla or Iguna (or theoretically both, but I don't think we're that good) is an elim and a voter of the other option was an elim. If both are evil, then one of their combined voters is an elim. Or one of the aforementioned scenarios happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emerald Falcon Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 41 minutes ago, Emerald Falcon said: coolio. Reveal hidden contents [P] Pearl Chameleon votes Saffron Iguana ^ 1 [P] Scarlet Octopus votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Sunburst Toucan ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Sunburst Toucan - 0 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 2 [P] Mauve Crocodile votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Chartreuse Penguin votes Violet Axolotl ^ 1 [P] Charcoal Hyena votes Amethyst Scorpion ^ 1 [P] Chartreuse Penguin unvotes Violet Axolotl - 0 [P] Chartreuse Penguin votes Charcoal Hyena ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Amber Vulture ^ 1 [P] Coral Swan votes Amber Vulture ^ 1 [P] Violet Axolotl votes Turquoise Gorilla ^ 1 [P] Amber Vulture votes Scarlet Octopus ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Amber Vulture - 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Coral Swan unvotes Amber vulture - 0 [P] Coral Swan votes Melon Dingo ^ 1 [P] Oxblood Beagle votes Coral Swan ^ 1 [P] Onyx Flamingo votes Violet Axolotl ^ 1 [P] Fuschia Ostrich votes Mauve Crocodile ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Turquoise Gorilla ^ 2 [P] Pearl Chameleon unvotes Saffron Iguana - 0 [P] Pearl Chameleon votes Coral Swan ^ 2 [P] Chartreuse Penguin unvotes Charcoal Hyena - 0 [P] Chartreuse Penguin votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Turquoise Gorilla - 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Charcoal Hyena ^ 1 [P] Coral Swan unvotes Melon Dingo - 0 [P] Coral Swan votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 4 [P] Chartreuse Penguin unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 3 [P] Chartreuse Penguin votes Charcoal Hyena ^ 2 [P] Turquoise Gorilla votes Coral Swan ^ 3 [P] Coral Swan unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Coral Swan votes Turquoise Gorilla ^ 2 [P] Scarlet Octopus unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 1 [P] Scarlet Octopus votes Turquoise Gorilla ^ 3 [P] Emerald Falcon votes Mauve Crocodile ^ 2 [P] Amethyst Scorpion votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 2 [P] Pearl Chameleon unvotes Coral Swan - 2 [P] Pearl Chameleon votes Saffron Iguana ^ 1 [P] Mauve Crocodile unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 1 [P] Mauve Crocodile votes Saffron Iguana ^ 2 [P] Amber Vulture unvotes Scarlet Octopus - 0 [P] Mint Heron votes Violet Axolotl ^ 2 [P] Onyx Flamingo unvotes Violet Axolotl - 1 [P] Onyx Flamingo votes Mauve Crocodile ^ 3 [P] Magenta Albatross votes Saffron Iguana ^ 3 [P] Saffron Iguana votes Magenta Albatross ^ 1 [P] Turquoise Gorilla unvotes Coral Swan - 1 [P] Turquoise Gorilla votes Saffron Iguana ^ 4 [P] Saffron Iguana unvotes Magenta Albatross - 0 [P] Saffron Iguana Votes Mauve Crocodile ^ 4 [P] Amethyst Scorpion unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 0 [P] Amethyst Scorpion votes Turquoise Gorilla ^ 4 Reveal hidden contents [P] Scarlet Octopus votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 1 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 2 [P] Mauve Crocodile votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Salmon Meerkat votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Salmon Meerkat unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Chartreuse Penguin votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 3 [P] Coral Swan votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 4 [P] Chartreuse Penguin unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 3 [P] Coral Swan unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 2 [P] Scarlet Octopus unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 1 [P] Amethyst Scorpion votes Pearl Chameleon ^ 2 [P] Mauve Crocodile unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 1 [P] Amethyst Scorpion unvotes Pearl Chameleon - 0 Specific things that stand out to me - The seeming fluidity of Penguin's vote. Penguin votes Violet axolotl, a poke seemingly, but has no hesitation in immediately switching to Hyena. This happens almost /directly/ after, with Penguin's first vote at post 42, Hyena's first post at 44, and then Penguin changing his vote at 45. I find his movements onto Pearl and then back onto Hyena those more likely coming from a villager as well. - Swan being a follower. Where penguin is fluid, Swan's votes in general felt very rigid to me, but I don't see anything new from him really at all. he poke votes dingo, but after joining Meerkat on Amber. 46 is where Meerkat votes Amber, and then Swan votes alongside at 49. He does then set himself up to switch votes-mentioning an incoming readslist to collect his thoughts and vote...which comes at post 77, an hour after 74, where Meerkat retracts. I don't even think there's a good way to phrase this, but just look at the votes, and you notice he seems to be following Meerkat's votes, but on a delay. Perhaps what this really means is that they're both village. - Votes on Pearl seem to be... well. everyone who put Pearl up to 3 votes-Mauve, Meerkat, Penguin. Mauve was village, and I have village reads on both Meerkat and peguin, however flimsy they may be. Coral was the one to bump up pearl to 4 votes, but I'm still conflicted on them. if you look through all the Pearl voters, there isn't any of them that I strongly distrust. Coral isn't a solid village read, but I'm not incredibly suspicious of them right now. Side note: Gorilla's reasoning for Swan was strange. Specifically for me the part where he said " I don’t really see why everyone’s jumping on Hyena; none of their posts at all stood out to me", Simply because I don't think you could pass the large colorful readslist. I might be interpreting this wrong, so benefit of the doubt. No reason for including the pearl votes other than that was a main point of D1. an Anonymouse note was left at my door telling me my colors were not understandable Yellow is just there for pearl, i think their wagon was an important one throughout the day so I just highlighted all the votes that put them above or at three votes. Red is the same, but for the EoD wagon. Blue is just simply the first vote and what was unvoted to vote saffron at EoD, by Pearl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffron Iguana Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 1 hour ago, Emerald Falcon said: following Meerkat's votes Is that a baby horse task, because it looks like a foal's errand. Meerkat reevaluates a lot and follows multiple lines of inquiry right up until the very end. 2 hours ago, Turquoise Gorilla said: [Apologies. I have been lacking the motivation to post much today, but I find it likely that the vote manip was all elims, possibly 1:1. Iguana and I had been the brunt of most of the suspicion D1, so whether or not they’re an elim, the elims have reason to protect both of us.] Interesting that you don't believe a Village vote manipulation role might have taken a liking to you and helped you out, or that a villager really wanted to Croc dead and your potential death was getting in the way of that. I'm not sure if you're lying or not to protect your role, but I won't push that any further. 2 hours ago, Charcoal Hyena said: In summary, Saffron's whole Day 1 has severely dropped them in my estimation to an Elim Read, with implications that Turquoise could be an opportunistic ally. I can answer a lot of your suspicions with my cosmetic role is Helpful Heckler. I wasn't planning on voting that round if I hadn't had to. It's a conscious, experimental playstyle choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Swan Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) Attempting to make a new reads list, may I be guided by the Ja! I've found in the past my reads tend to not like to move if I try to modify an existing list as opposed to starting from scratch, so in the interest of being as accurate to how I feel as possible I'm starting completely over. I, hopefully, fixed any errors in my last list by creating two more tiers. Hopefully that doesn't just make things more confusing. Italics indicate someone who hasn't posted. No order within tiers. Village: Albatross, Meerkat Slight Village: Scorpion, Hyena, Chameleon, Vulture Null+: Mouse, Penguin, Falcon, Flamingo, Axolotl, Dingo Null: Dragonfly, Lion, Rhinoceros, Elephant, Octopus, Toucan Null-: Ostrich, Heron, Beagle Slight Elim: Zebra, Iguana Elim: Gorilla I probably could give a rationale for anyone's placement, but if I'm being honest I c/pd the player list and went down going 'you're here, you're here, you're here'. Obviously it was slower and more complicated than that but it's not like I ISO'd everybody; don't expect me to have. Note that Gorilla and Iguana likely aren't e/e since Gorilla would have voted Croc and not Iguana for self pres were that the case. It's possible they are, and Gorilla didn't due to the vote manip the elims had in place, but Occam's Razor blah blah idk Praise the Ja! Edited January 6, 2022 by Coral Swan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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