Argent

[OB] Argent's "Secret Renarin WoB", a.k.a. The Page™

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24 minutes ago, Argent said:

A bit of background for those who have remained blissfully unaware of this meme (such as @Kurkistan, apparently). Early in 2015, after Brandon's Firefight tour, he came to Chicago and did an impromptu signing where I asked him about Renarin and his Words of Radiance visions, mostly because they didn't feel explainable with either one of the Truthwatcher Surges. The exchange in question (behind a spoiler tag, for brevity):

 

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Argent

Renarin, his visions of the future are they connected to one of his Surges? Both of them? Are they a side-effect of his order?

Brandon Sanderson

Umm...

Argent

Like I can kind of fit in the two of them...

Brandon Sanderson

Alright, how much of a spoiler do you want on this?

Argent

All of it.

Brandon Sanderson

*Incredulously* Really?

Argent

Is that even a question for me?

Brandon Sanderson

Do you want to know something secret that you then can't post?

Argent

*sighs* How-- Is it something that is going to come up in Book 3--

Brandon Sanderson

Yes.

Argent

--or later.

Brandon Sanderson

It comes up in Book 3.

Argent

I'll bear the burden.

Brandon Sanderson

You'll bear the burden meaning I can tell you?

Argent

I'm going to pause this actually... *Audio paused*

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/3-firefight-chicago-signing/#e64

What you don't see in this exchange is my commentary where I explain that I can share as much as another eventgoer would've been able to glimpse - that Brandon asked me for my copy of The Way of Kings, the US hardcover, and pointed me to a specific page in it. A page that supposedly explained the visions. And a page that would come up in both public discourse and private messages every few weeks to few months.

Well, Oathbringer is out, I've gotten a chance to check in with Brandon and make sure it's okay to do a reveal, and he said that it was. So, since I am running out of ways to tease - or troll - you all, I'll just drop it here, without my 2 years worth of speculations, and see what you do with it. A wiser man might've prepared a proper theory to go with this, to catch you up on my thoughts, but I am honestly too tired (and, to be honest, busy) to this right now.

So.

The Page

Oh my god, that's the gem they stuck the thrill in. 

Anyway, neat. He's like half a voidbinder half a radiant. Cool. 

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I don't read glyphs - can someone put into words or circles and arrows the idea? I get it, kinda.

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LOOOOOL. :D:D:D:D:D.

1. No wonder we couldn't find it in relation to Renarin

2. Thats a very big damnation clue/spoiler.

3. No wonder feather was so sure Renarin had something voidy going on, as I'm guessing she took the page out of you years ago, even if she had to hunt you down and torture it out of you.

4 minutes ago, yulerule said:

I don't read glyphs - can someone put into words or circles and arrows the idea? I get it, kinda.

Argent asks Brandon: why is there something weird going on with Renarin's visions? 

Brandon points him to Voidbinder chart page ^_^.

Not overly subtle :P.

Edited by WhiteLeeopard
Added response to yulerule
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Ah, so he's got the surge of Progression and one of the Void surges. But which one? The Turthwatchers are the lower half of the center in the Surgebinding page. The surge Renarin is missing is the one shared to the left, with the Lightweavers.

However, unlike the Surgebinding page, the two center icons aren't connected to any surges, just to other 'Orders.' Does that mean the center two aren't Orders at all, or don't have surges, or aren't limited to only two surges?

3 minutes ago, yulerule said:

I don't read glyphs - can someone put into words or circles and arrows the idea? I get it, kinda.

It's one thing to point to the page, it's another to translate it. To my knowledge we don't know what they mean.

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I... what does it mean. The Voidbinding chart? But... he's neither Radiant or Voidbinder.... how...? why...?

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1 minute ago, Oversleep said:

I... what does it mean. The Voidbinding chart? But... he's neither Radiant or Voidbinder.... how...? why...?

Glys was twisted like the spren in Kholinar. 

 

I'm not sure Venli will wind up half and half though. After all Odium is the human god. And I still don't think his futuresight is a surge, it's a resonance. His surge has something to do with banishing light. But... Well, we're not supposed to know yet.  

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At a minimun Renarin is part voidbinder, otherwise that wouldn't be The Page. So, one surge? At a maximum he has both void surges. 

Although what I want to know is if we have yet seen a voidbinder, as the Fused all just had 1 surge (apparently).

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Also we've got a WoA (Word of Argent) from Chicago where Argent explains it all to us. There was much laughter when he pointed out the voidbinding chart. We'll see whether Argent manages to delete the recording before it gets transcribed. :)

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The bit that I always find interesting about the Voidbinding chart is that Void-versions of Bondsmith and Truthwatcher have no lines connecting to any of the surges.

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2 minutes ago, Aminar said:

Glys was twisted like the spren in Kholinar. 

I know.

But it's a corrupted (probably) Truthwatcher spren, so he's kinda between Surgebinder and Voidbinder, or a little of both.

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So check out this post of mine in relation to that chart. I wonder if the corruption is essential to voidbinding in humans. I keep thinking the Regals use voidbinding, but I'm a little confused about how this realtes to Renarin.

As this post is based only on Part 1, some of it is incorrect.

Edited by KidWayne
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10 minutes ago, Salkara said:

The bit that I always find interesting about the Voidbinding chart is that Void-versions of Bondsmith and Truthwatcher have no lines connecting to any of the surges.

I noticed this too, but only when I went looking for which void-surge would replace Illumination. That combined with the fact that these two Orders are literally within a giant gem that we may have seen in OB, and I'm even more confused. When can we get an explanation of this chart and its images?

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17 minutes ago, WhiteLeeopard said:

3. No wonder feather was so sure Renarin had something voidy going on, as I'm guessing she took the page out of you years ago, even if she had to hunt you down and torture it out of you.

Her original theory actually comes before my question.

16 minutes ago, Rainier said:

Ah, so he's got the surge of Progression and one of the Void surges. But which one? The Turthwatchers are the lower half of the center in the Surgebinding page. The surge Renarin is missing is the one shared to the left, with the Lightweavers.

This is kind of what I've been assuming - that he Surgebinds Progression and Voidbinds Illumination. His Regrowth looks identical to other instances of Regrowth we've seen, but the stained glass futuresight (Fortune?) panorama is entirely unlikely Shallan's Lightweaving - but it's also a very visual thing to do, which makes me think Illumination is involved. 

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4 minutes ago, Argent said:

Her original theory actually comes before my question.

This is kind of what I've been assuming - that he Surgebinds Progression and Voidbinds Illumination. His Regrowth looks identical to other instances of Regrowth we've seen, but the stained glass futuresight (Fortune?) panorama is entirely unlikely Shallan's Lightweaving - but it's also a very visual thing to do, which makes me think Illumination is involved. 

voidbonding use voidlight, renarin use stormlight, venli cannot make her eyes red if she hold stormlight.

Edited by Fulminato
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3 minutes ago, Argent said:

Her original theory actually comes before my question.

This is kind of what I've been assuming - that he Surgebinds Progression and Voidbinds Illumination. His Regrowth looks identical to other instances of Regrowth we've seen, but the stained glass futuresight (Fortune?) panorama is entirely unlikely Shallan's Lightweaving - but it's also a very visual thing to do, which makes me think Illumination is involved. 

Im wondering if his illumination is much more based in the cognitive realm or thoughts (kind of like emotion allomancy i guess). this allows him to have that gem sight view and would explain the adolin seeing the perfect vision of himself

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13 minutes ago, WhiteLeeopard said:

Now I'm wondering how/why Renarin bonded Glys.

Could Glys have crossed over explicitly to bond Renarin before Renarin went to the Shattered Plains?  But while befuddled from the crossing, Sja-Anat got to Glys (since Sja-Anat was hanging around the palace).  Glys wasn't really aware of what was going on and went ahead and bonded him.

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7 minutes ago, Argent said:

This is kind of what I've been assuming - that he Surgebinds Progression and Voidbinds Illumination. His Regrowth looks identical to other instances of Regrowth we've seen, but the stained glass futuresight (Fortune?) panorama is entirely unlikely Shallan's Lightweaving - but it's also a very visual thing to do, which makes me think Illumination is involved. 

Hmmmmm. Would that be why the one flash of illumination we've seen from him involves Adolin seeing himself healed, as it is Adolin's future.. I wonder if he'll learn to do more with his futuresight, like testing out various scenarios to see how they'll play out..

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4 minutes ago, Fulminato said:

voidbonding use voidlight, renarin use stormlight, venli cannot make her eyes red if she hold stormlight.

Do we actually know voidbinding uses voidlight explicitly?

The Fused seem to use surges with voidlight as well . . .

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38 minutes ago, natc said:

Do we actually know voidbinding uses voidlight explicitly?

The Fused seem to use surges with voidlight as well . . .

Investiture is investiture. Stormlight powers Vasher just fine and he's from another planet.

Edited by Aminar
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Just now, Aminar said:

Investiturenis investiture. Stormlight powers Vasher just fine and he's from another planet.

Huh. I didn't even know he used that. Figured he probably had a stash of Breaths stored away or something.

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I'm gonna point it out again. 

Spoiler

IMG_1217.thumb.JPG.43b5d04a47bc8f8d7d61878a61b53ebb.JPG

There is a double eye at the center of the Void-watcher symbol.

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