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Rob Lucci

STORMLIGHT SPOILERSThe Silence of the Shardblades

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Posted (edited)

Spren need to be resurrected, hence the 10-second wait for "regular" shardblades. But these blades never act as spren - for all intents and purposes, they remain lifeless constructs that merely seem to feed on the spren's power. Why don't the spren speak? Could it be said that 'resurrection' isn't really a good term for describing what happens when a Shardbearer summons his Blade? What term, then, should we use - what exactly is going on here?

Edited by Rob Lucci
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8 minutes ago, Argent said:

Right, but it's not speech they hear. It's screams.

I think the screams might be words - from Words of Radiance page 672 (kindle first edition) when Kaladin performs the "last clap" on Relis' Shardblade during Adolin's duel (emphasis mine):
"Relis dropped the blade as if bitten. He backed away, raising his hands to his head. 'What is it? What is it! No, I didn't kill you!" He shrieked as if in great pain [...]"

Why would Relis say that if he only heard wordless screaming? My conjecture is the spren is screaming "YOU KILLED ME!" or something like that.

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Posted (edited)

Without a Nahel Bond they still wouldn't have sentience. I suspect that the Gemstone related bond probably acts similarly to the Nahel Bond on a much weaker scale but it likely isn't enough. In addition per Syl (not necessarily the best source but I'll use what we have), we know that linking the Spren to a heartbeat makes them "live a little" the implication being that it is a partial Resurrection. 

Sidenote, you may want to tone down your thread topic as it is a pretty significant spoiler.

Edited by The Sovereign
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I'd say the bond with the wielder isn't strong enough for it to speak to the user. Its a step below the Nahel Bond, so perhaps that is quite literally the difference.

Brandon has said that the heartbeats are required to "revive a dead Shardblade" so it may not be resurrecting the Spren in the way we describe the word.

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7 minutes ago, The Sovereign said:

Without a Nahel Bond they still wouldn't have sentience. I suspect that the Gemstone related bond probably acts similarly to the Nahel Bond on a much weaker scale but it likely isn't enough. In addition per Syl (not necessarily the best source but I'll use what we have), we know that linking the Spren to a heartbeat makes them "live a little" the implication being that it is a partial Resurrection. 

Sidenote, you may want to tone down your thread topic as it is a pretty significant spoiler.

Yeah, just realized it myself.

I guess partial resurrection does the trick. It's not very conclusive or informative of course. I'm hoping someone out there has scoured Theoryland of all Brandon's interviews and knows a WoB relating to this.

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9 minutes ago, Rob Lucci said:

Could it be said that 'resurrection' isn't really a good term for describing what happens when a Shardbearer summons his Blade?

Indeed. Syl does say that they "need to be revived every time", but it's not a full revival - it's more akin to you can make a dead squid "dance" by pouring soy sauce on it. Shardbearers don't really revive their Blade's spren, they just give it enough... something... to summon it into the physical realm.

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12 minutes ago, Argent said:

Indeed. Syl does say that they "need to be revived every time", but it's not a full revival - it's more akin to you can make a dead squid "dance" by pouring soy sauce on it. Shardbearers don't really revive their Blade's spren, they just give it enough... something... to summon it into the physical realm.

Huh, that video was unsettling on so many levels. I completely get Syl's aversion now. Really handy video for driving that point home, actually.

I really hope this will get elaborated on during Oathbringer.

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Posted (edited)

On 5/19/2017 at 10:53 AM, Rob Lucci said:

Why don't the spren speak?

Proto-Radiants and, presumably, full Radiants certainly hear the spren speak when they touch a "dead" Shardblade. One might say that the breaking of the bonds that "killed" the spren left them in a state very similar to the Hoed (from Elantris).

Edit: I responded to another poster below showing that in the climactic Words of Radiance duel, when Kaladin performed a "last clap" on Relis' Shardblade that Relis heard the screaming of a dead spren. Relis then when on to say "No, I didn't kill you!" which leads me to believe that Relis heard the spren screaming something along the lines of "YOU KILLED ME!"

(page 672 of the first edition on the Kindle)

Edited by CaptainRyan
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2 hours ago, CaptainRyan said:

Proto-Radiants and, presumably, full Radiants certainly hear the spren speak when they touch a "dead" Shardblade. One might say that the breaking of the bonds that "killed" the spren left them in a state very similar to the Hoed (from Elantris).

Right, but it's not speech they hear. It's screams.

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Posted (edited)

@CaptainRyan has the correct answer. A sort of resurrection does take place, though not a very pleasant one for the spren. Most Shardbearers simply can't hear the screams.

And of course, since the resurrection needs to happen every time it's summoned, the zombie spren dies again when dismissed. Very unpleasant.

Edited by skaa
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On 5/19/2017 at 6:31 PM, CaptainRyan said:

Why would Relis say that if he only heard wordless screaming? My conjecture is the spren is screaming "YOU KILLED ME!" or something like that.

Why wouldn't Kaladin hear that as well? He was holding the blade at the exact same time, and heard only screams which were either:

  1. Unintelligible to a proto-radiant, but clear to normal humans
  2. Something he understood and devoted exactly zero thought processes about what he just heard
  3. Shocking enough for him to not hear it clearly, but not shocking enough to also blur the hearing of Relis, a man who more than likely hasn't even heard a normal Spren speak, much less scream
  4. Something that makes more sense than the only logical conclusions I can think of at the moment.
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28 minutes ago, The One Who Connects said:

Why wouldn't Kaladin hear that as well? He was holding the blade at the exact same time, and heard only screams which were either:

  1. Unintelligible to a proto-radiant, but clear to normal humans
  2. Something he understood and devoted exactly zero thought processes about what he just heard
  3. Shocking enough for him to not hear it clearly, but not shocking enough to also blur the hearing of Relis, a man who more than likely hasn't even heard a normal Spren speak, much less scream
  4. Something that makes more sense than the only logical conclusions I can think of at the moment.

My guess? Relis was bonded to the blade so he heard it more clearly.

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If the Nahel bond is similar to the gem bond in the shardblade then it would stand to reason that Kaladin may have leaked a little more investiture into the blade by simply touching it than when it was normally summoned. therefor resurrecting it a bit more than a normal summon would have. Doesn't kaladin hear syl scream when he touches a blade on a different occasion?

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I suspect that one method of bringing a dead shardblade back to life requires the assistance of a surrogate Nahel bond. ie: Adolin will need Shallan to touch his blade in order for Adolin to talk to the shardblade and attempt to make new bonds.

At the very least, they might be able to gain information about the Recreance.

Edited by shadowwisp
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