Green Hoodie Mistborn

You seem to be on the same page as the Shard of Honor at the end of this book and seem to have not understood the journey that Dalinar did go on to get to this point at the end of the book. He saw and was shown not just that the Vessels were not perfect, but that the Shards themselves apart from one another are flawed and need to grow. The only out of the cycle of violence between the Shards themselves (regardless of the Vessels in play) was to sacrifice His oaths and allow Honor time to grow and learn, which to date it had not done, it had just continued to perpetuate the cycle with Odium or hidden within the Spiritual Realm unchanging. Hard disagree here. I think the awareness that context matters should make the weight of Oaths far higher on both sides, the level of trust required even higher and working together to ensure that people aren't making blind oaths even greater. To me it pushes the Oaths' import even higher. Honor is not dead, but it needs to grow beyond being just about the oath divorced from circumstance and life. It needs to mature to understand that the world is not black and white, oath kept or not kept; that there are contexts that both shape the oaths and when it is right to keep your oath or not. The sacrifice of these Oaths very much cost something, and breaking them very much gave those who broke their oaths nothing (personally) in return. They maintained their virtue through the sacrifice of their oaths, and would have conversely sacrificed it to maintain the Oaths to the detriment of themselves and others. These weren't easy or snap decisions for any of those who did it in this book.

One of my favorite parts of WaT was the slow crumbling/disintegration of the chapter arches and their eventual collapse. I also love that in the final chapter possible we see a brand new Herald arch stone Kaladin's arch is fresh, clean, his bridge 4 tattoo prominently displayed, and while it's not much, there is a stone below his arch stone for his arch stone to sit on that wasn't there in the previous chapter. (see? no middle stone as above where Kaladin is resting!) This gives me hope at the end of the things along with the postlude. What do the rest of you think? did you enjoy the gimmick of the arches slowly crumbling and collapsing throughout the book?

Yeah, and a main plot point of RoW was Shallan had broken her oath, so that is like 1 3/4ths of our main characters who have broken oaths. And the Recreance. There are plenty of examples and foreshadowing for it. The Spren have said this whole time that humans can't be trusted with Oaths. Skybreakers were structured in a way so that the Spren are the ones making the oaths in order to protect themselves from human perfidy. The difference of the oaths broken in WaT and (maybe?) others historically, are that these oaths were broken for the purpose of what is "right" rather than blind Honor. Dalinar through his breaking of oaths is trying to teach Honor that it's about more than just blind Oaths. You could argue that the Recreance was about what is "right" as well. Sig's broken oath was literally done to protect Vienta, the heart of Windrunner oaths. Szeth's broken oath is honestly the only one in this book that I have a real problem with narratively. It didn't make sense when it happened and still doesn't to me mostly. It felt like (for me) Szeth's broken oath was done strictly for the purpose of setting up the end/epilogue scene between 12124 and Sigzil rather than anything to do with Szeth and his journey

It's a good question! It could just be fear of past and history sure. It could also be that there are still Void spren on Braize who will Torture any Heralds they find I thought the Fused still returned to Braize but they could immediately funnel back to roshar via the Everstorm. With the Everstorm's global presence now though... I have no idea what is happening. Maybe their souls are chilling on Braize with no one there to torture while their Cognitive aspects are stowed away in the Spiritual recreation of Ashyn (re-read this postlude last night and Im' pretty sure this is what is going on now) With no Stormlight in existence (the book is pretty clear that Retribution pulled all Stormlight back to himself and it doesn't exist anywhere out there now) can you even create anti-light for it to harm Honor based entities like was discovered in RoW and used a couple of times here in WaT? Don't you need the base light to generate the anti-light?

The Storm Daughter! I like this idea, though it will be a big back half implication and probably won't come into play until the Heralds decide to Return in the second half arc. Her departure from Roshar with Kaladin might also explain why the Highstorms have gone away completely. Maybe when she returns with Kaladin the Highstorm will start blowing again, even if more tame than before. I would love to see Syl as the Storm personified in the future Also ... isn't the Ashyn locale just for their souls to experience while their bodies/minds are actually back on Braize being tortured? Did I misunderstand the ending completely there?

Todium has the advantage of foresight that Jasnah does not possess. He saw the best way to attack her. He laid the groundwork for it by visiting her and getting under her skin before the actual argument. she was very much trapped in an unwinnable confrontation. Jasnah shown time and again that her mask of indifference is just that, a mask, that covers her emotions and brain spirals. Even the smartest people get flustered and put into situations where they don't perform their best. That is very human of Jasnah, not anything else. People are holding her to WAY too high a standard IMO. She's smart, she's really smart, but that doesn't make her all knowing or capable of out arguing an nearly omniscient being! And even if she had won, she still would have lost because of the Deepest Ones and the treachery of the Merchant Council already put in place and planned. It was a true Kobayashi Maru, but one she didn't know was completely unwinnable until she started participating and lost. that's the point though, this isn't the end. it's literally the middle of the saga and Jasnah is still around. She's now come to a nadir of her character from which she has 1-5 books to re-ascend after starting out at the high point. She's been slowly coming down from her high point since she was assassinated in WoR and now (I bet) she's reached the bottom of her arc with up to go for the rest of books 6-10 We're at the "Han is taken, Luke has his hand cut off" point of the story arc right now with a bit more resolution on some portions of the vast story. To judge Jasnah's earlier chapters negatively in light of where we are right now in the story would be like hating Han's character because he got trapped in carbonite and is frozen. Jasnah froze and didn't perform her best in an intense pressure situation. Even if she had, she still would have lost and maybe been killed by Deepest Ones and Thaylen troops after they switched allegiances.

Suppose it was!

Either Brandon mis-spoke or was deliberate in his wording in one of two ways Deliberate option 1 - He left Vasher's name out of the two people he did name not knowing how to convert Stormlight to Breaths because Vasher DOES know and he's being deliberately obtuse. Deliberate option 2 - He had just mentioned how Vasher uses Stormlight to feed off and then didn't need to include him in the list of people who don't know how to convert it because it's implied Vasher also doesn't because he feeds off the stormlight as is and even Hoid can't do it, so obviously Vasher can't... I'd like to believe it's option 1, but feel pretty strongly it will end up being option 2 By luck or Fortune, Vasher also ended up trapped in the one place on Roshar where he can still reliably feed on a form of Light. If he were outside the Tower, he'd have to figure out a way to get Warlight and I don't think he wants to draw Todium's eye. I'm actually super interested to see what Vasher gets up to and hope we get a Novella/Novelette with him and Lift's training before we get SA6. Maybe he can help them figure out more fun stuff about light in the interim as well.

I like this take, there did seem to be a weirdness to the interaction there

Feel like I have to step in to defend my boy here... just because Vasher helped create the initial anti-light that Gavilar had, doesn't mean he knew how to weaponize it against the fused per se. Also... the Interlude that has him in it seems to indicate that he was captured and held/tortured the whole time of the Tower's invasion through when Lift found him, so he wasn't available to help do that at that point. maybe he could have stepped up earlier, but maybe also he felt regret about providing the anti-light under duress (maybe?) to Gavilar and didn't want to interfere in this world by helping make large explosive things?

Welcome to the Shard! I think their kid is going to be very special and potentially pivotal in the next arc of the SA or future of the Cosmere. But I doubt they'll be that level of powerful from Birth? Maybe! But it'll be interesting to meet them and learn about them and Oroden and even Gavinor in the coming arcs. Poor Gavinor

Agreed - I don't think any spren were killed through his actions, other than seemingly the Stormfather (for now at least) I also thought that was just him hoping at that point... but maybe now with more context it's more than that! Hopefully Sig and Kaladin get more scenes together later. I'm still sad about Sig's relationship to his former spren. I mean... I get it, but dang.

I read it when it came out and it made me TERRIFIED for what WaT had in store for us there seems to still be a ton of missing stuff between WaT and Sunlit man though. I honestly thing when we're even further into the Cosmere than we are now, Sunlit man will be recommended reading for probably after SA6-10 or something

Not taking it negative myself at least I think the explanation on the page was exactly that the disconnect was quite large and she wasn't aware of it to a large degree, which is why it was such a blow to her

I took it less as "she hadn't considered the points/counterpoints to the various philosophical arguments before" and more that Jasnah declaimed one thing as being her guiding principle, but then her public words vs secret preparations/actions were dissonant because she like most people are blind to many of their own deficiencies. I'll need to re-read the book to really get a feel for her section again, but that was my take. It was more the blow to her psyche about her cognitive dissonance on her words vs actions/preparations

This is a great question! The spren are still there, though no longer bound to Roshar as they were before. So I'd think for any normal forms as long as a Singer can find the right spren, they can change whenever they want right? For forms of power, I'm sure Retribution will have to send the spren chosen to the Singers and it will all be regulated through their leadership.

I got there! No one like any more of my posts!!

Hoid's Seon is the one that Shallan requested go to Azir to help her connect with Adolin. It's noted that Hoid asked the Seon to flee the tower ahead of the Contest of Champions I don't know that Shallan has a way to directly contact Urithiru in the near/mid term outside of Jasnah mastering Elsecalling. Also Jasnah could have connected to Shinovar via re-empowered spanreeds, maybe. Either are possible. I think hte bigger issue of Elsecalling is that Jasnah's powers could/would fail outside of the Tower like other Radiants (noted in Adolin's final chapter)

I like Reason over Ambition for Exist Ambition, Viruosity, Whimsy, and Odium feel like their more matched in a NYT "Connections" manner than Reason

Hoid's epilogue shows even a change of heart from him on letting Roshar burn, though it comes after he'd already failed his objective of continuing Odium's containment. This question is honestly at the heart of the entire SA. Basically the Stormlight Archive a giant trolly problem. Do you let Roshar burn under Odium's rule/reign for the sake of saving the rest of the Cosmere. It's what Honor did, it's what Hoid stated he would do. It's what Jasnah would have done, potentially, prior to her breakdown at the end. Dalinar chose to send the train down the track with the most people and let them deal with the it after Roshar dealing with it for 7k years or so. Do we condemn him for that choice?

Given that he has his Fused, or at least El, to rule the human areas of his lands per earlier statements of the book, I have to assume that the human lands will be able to access Warlight moving forward. It's not explicitly stated, no, but it must be the case. As to the durability of Warlight in gems... Voidlight seems to be able to store almost indefinitely, Stormlight for weeks. I would imagine that Warlight is more on that end of the spectrum vs what Lifelight and Towerlight were.

I hope not, I hope it's in a Novelette or something ramping us back into SA book 6

I think anyone under Retibutions control can have light if they ask for it as the Listeners do in the Shattered Plains as he knows that is the only way they can grow any crops/food But it CAN be stored in gemstones, which means eventually Span reeds will start to work again. If they could be powered soley by Voidlight in RoW, I can't imagine that Warlight won't be able to power them and other fabrials

That was my understanding as well I can't wait to read the interaction with Shallan/Adolin through the Seon where that info bomb is dropped. I hope to Honor that Adolin gets to reunite with her sometime before the time skip of years...

So much of this book was hard for me to read, but that one was particularly rough. I felt SOOO bad for Jasnah through the breakdown of herself and her failure in Thaylenah. Especially when she got back to find Wit's note and realize she just wanted someone to hold.... so rough I am intrigued for where it goes from there in future stories though