CognitiveShadow

I agree with this - the Wind seems to be something ancient that has not been corrupted or changed by the Shards. It's tied purely to Adonalsium, and I think that's the reason that Hoid tells Kaladin that he hopes Kal can help the wind. He says something about hoping that somehow a sliver of their old / dead god is still watching through the Wind. I'll just find the quote:

This is how I'm starting to feel too - everything now is like an ominous calm before the storm.... something tells me that this book will be like the 'sanderlanche' of the [eta: first half of the] series, meaning after these little happy chapters things are going to take off. I'm expecting a lot of similar 'go, go, go' pace that we saw in Sunlit Man. And I don't think it's going to end very well for anyone really

I think we have seen how she is not a reliable narrator over time. We were given the surprise realization that she had a shardblade, and then that she had 2 bonds, one of which had been broken, and also there's some fuzziness about her memories with using a seon box communicator before. I think there are plenty of examples of Shallan's memory being incorrect or blocked off to certain memories, and throughout the series we have had some reveals that clarified her real background a little more. So I think it makes plenty of sense for her last big reveal of the first half of the series to be realizing that her mom was actually a herald, so that fact that she killed her was basically what kicked off the desolation. That's a pretty massive reveal that will be very surprising to a lot of people who haven't been digging into the main theories for future events. I think her turning out to be Chana would be kind of odd and just 'surprising' for the sake of being surprising. Kind of feels out of the blue without anything really pointing to it. Edit to add: I just feel like the "Shallan is Chana" theory was born out of people getting very used to the idea of Chana being Shallan's mom, which is also just a theory at this point and hasn't been confirmed. It feels like people got bored with that since it is basically confirmed, and now they are thinking of ways to make a twist on top of the twist.

After re-reading the new chapters, I am very convinced that the Wind is just a new entity and an old, ancient God. A spren of Adonalsium from way back in the day that is still around, vibed well with Honor/Tanavast, and was actively suppressed by rOdium. So either tOdium is not yet aware of the need to continue that suppression, or he is actively allowing the Wind to reach out to Kaladin, knowing that this connection will ultimately further his goals somehow. I don't think the Wind is an Unmade, Aether, Shard, or any other already known entity. Brand new, but it's been there in the background all along.

Maybe it's similar to how she can draw on fortune when she draws pictures of people that then inspire them to change and stuff? Like she has to get to know them a little bit before she can really do that, and the same would be true with using her identity skeleton key stuff?

That makes sense - I think initially I looked at what Shallan did as playing with connection and identity, but I think you are right that she was really just faking identity enough to take back the stormlight that was holding her in place. Sort of like an unkeyed metal mind or turning it into pure dor in a way. Except that she's doing the opposite and making herself match the identity lock as if she were that person. Really, really interesting. It feels like Shallan or someone with her particular set of skills in the far distant space age future would be like a master hacker lol

Just when I thought I could not get less confused about Shallan's past and what is real / what isn't.... lol dying to find out more here! That makes sense, it does seem to be more like: So basically Shallan now has the power to steal investiture that has been coded for other people. Though I assume she would not be able to take investiture directly from someone as they are holding it, only when it is outside of that person and operating on some command or something. That said, I'm still wondering what else she could do: 'your breath to mine' someone's breaths that are in another object (already addressed earlier here but including it for a comprehensive list) tap metal minds that were filled by a feruchemist if she presents herself as that person? In this case, would she get the tapped characteristic (speed, weight, etc.) or would she just absorb the investiture itself and use it as she would regular stormlight? make herself impervious to lashings from a radiant? (or at least quickly and easily dismiss those lashings herself if she practices this skill) What if the lashing is from a fused, using voidlight though... ? Can she access voidlight by coding her identity more in line with one of the fused perhaps? After starting this list, I'm realizing it sounds kind of similar to Nomad and how he absorbs investiture to get to certain BEU levels...? Any relation here, or do we think this is it's own special situation?

That tracks with my headcannon of Fortune as well... but I guess my question is how do we define 'need' in this case? Do we think the horse will play a role in the plot, or is it just more of a physical reminder to him of the experience he had when swearing the 4th ideal, and recognizing that he can't protect everyone? Do we think that Kaladin finding a rock in his bag like that is just Fortune giving him another reminder of Tien, or do we think he will need it for the tasks he has ahead of him? Another thought I've had is around the Wind and how people have theorized there may be a Stone being as well. Kaladin is already listening to the Wind, and maybe the Stone (if it exists or can be called an entity) is trying to make contact in some way as well? Could the Stone try to communicate to him through this special rock perhaps? Feels a bit out of left field but I guess I'm just brainstorming lol Hey, definitely a very practical explanation. Maybe Navani had it get dropped in and did some bondsmith stuff to it so that even when they are far away they can still communicate through it the way they did when he was hiding in the tower and talking to her via the sibling?

Ooooh yes. That's definitely possible! Do we think Vasher could do this then too? And other Returned who can alter their physical appearance based on their view of themselves? It does seem to be a step beyond what Vasher does though... but then again I could still see it being possible. And that would likely require someone like Vasher to be extra cautious and maybe add key phrases that must be uttered by them in order to take their breath(s) out of an object? That way even if someone matches his identity the way Shallan did for Drehy it would still be protected since they don't know the pass code? EDIT: I'm realizing there are just so many possibilities here for Shallan.... could she basically shift her identity in her mind to such a degree that she could become an elantrian? Like would she at least be able to access the dor if she were in Elantris and adjusted her mindset in the right way? I'm just trying to theorize on what the limitations are here haha

OOOH ok now this idea is winning me over a bit actually. I like the idea of Kal pulling out a stone and showing it to Szeth, Szeth being like "WTF is that in oathstone??" and then Kal is like "no, dude, it's just a pretty rock. look at the patterns you can see if you clean it off and hold it in the light" Maybe as Szeth takes some time to smell the roses and look at pretty rocks the voices might fade away for a moment. This is another good point. It's beautiful to think of Kaladin getting some kind of connection to his brother through meeting his former spren, but I agree it's fairly improbable. So my only problem here is what does that mean for Kaladin? Will he just always keep finding random rocks in his shoes and bags as reminders of Tien? Part of me finds that sweet and the other part finds it depressing. I still think there is something more going on with the stone that just fortune because I still think Kaladin was expecting to find it there. That said, as I went back a read the part about Kaladin finding the rock it does seem to be definitively not an oathstone haha it's just a dull brown rock.... still very intrigued about it! Any chance Syl snuck the rock in there or asked someone to do it for her if needed? Maybe since she new the effect that kind of rock can have on him and wanted to make sure he had it with him? But then of course she was there when he found it and she didn't say anything about it, so maybe that's a reach

Agree! HUGE. It's definitely reminiscent of Returned like Vasher being able play with their physical representation based on how they 'view' themselves or their own identity. So seems to have sime ties with identity, and could very well be enhanced by her DID - like maybe that is a special superpower enhancer when combined with her particular skills? And with her now being able to give her illusions physical weight/matter/feel... she's basically Thanos with the reality stone lol Edit to add: Can she now take breaths back from objects that other people have stored breath in? Like if Vasher or maybe someone with more basic skills in using breaths stores a few in a blanket, can Shallan "be [insert name / ID here]" enough that she can then pull the "your breath to mine" and just absorbs them right in?

Yeah, but I feel like there's a big difference between noticing a rock on the ground and washing it off in memory of his brother vs. having a rock just appear in his designated 'special items' pouch in his bag that was just packed. To me this rock/stone seems to be of more significance than that I get that, but he's also super unstable. So I wonder if having that physical object in his own hands, representing his own control over his actions, could come in handy (pun not intended but noticed and left as if it was intentional). Especially since his current allegiance is sworn to Dalinar who will be nowhere in sight, I could see Kaladin wanting to have the oath stone with him just in case it could be useful. Who knows what Szeth would do if he brought it out - could go horribly wrong or perfectly well. Or both? Totally, this is right in line with what I'm thinking. When he last saw it he murdered the guy who made him murder a bunch of people, so maybe in a more controlled setting he and his new therapist can start talking about how Szeth feels when he sees his old Oathstone, especially in the hands of someone who previously killed him but is now unarmed and handing it to him peacefully... idk but there could be some sort of a healing or cathartic experience there.

I really like the idea of Tien's former spren bonding someone new and encouraging them to do little things for Kaladin here and there that they know Tien would want done. Seems like a really plausible answer! Fair, but I wasn't envisioning Kaladin using it to exert pressure or anything. I was envisioning more so using it as a prop to help guide their therapy discussions or something. Or maybe there is some later tie in with an entity similar to the Wind that is more tied to Stone and how it's considered sacred by the Shin. Maybe there is more backstory to how oathstones are formed or used (if they aren't just random rocks that the truthless is made to swear an oath to). It did seem like Kaladin wasn't too surprised to see the stone, and it also seemed like he didn't want to call attention to it or explain what it was. This made me think it might have been something he specifically requested but on the down low. Just read up on the Tien fortune stuff. I can see that, but it seems like a lot to have that happen with the horse and then again with the stone..? And the way Kal just brushed it off as not a big deal makes me think that if it is tied to Tien Fortune stuff, then it's happening even more than we are seeing on screen and he is just used to it by now..? Plus I kind of feel like the extreme emotional outburst that Szeth might have when seeing the stone could be good for him in some ways lol just to see it as a paper tiger or something, and maybe Kal gives it to Szeth to show him that he is in control of himself and his actions or something like that. I like the symbolism of Szeth owning himself through the oathstone in a way.

Wondering if anyone has any ideas on the rock that Kaladin finds in his bag, which Leyton is surprised to see and says he didn't put there? Could it potentially be Szeth's oathstone? Or do we know what happened to his oathstone? I'm thinking if Dalinar and co. have the oath stone, maybe Kaladin asked that they send it down to be packed with his things so that he could have it in case it is useful while he travels with Szeth. Obviously Szeth wouldn't accept it as a binding thing anymore, but I wonder if he wants it as a visual reminder for Szeth of how he was following oaths / orders when he committed all the atrocities he did. Maaaaybe that helps calm the voices in Szeth's head a little bit? Idk, just spitballing. Also saw a theory that maybe Syl had put it into the bag as like a surprise because she knows small pretty rocks are special to Kaladin because Tien used to give him things like that?

Thanks! Clearly I need to start digging through WOBs more before throwing out the first ideas/theories that pop into my brain lol really appreciate you people sharing the quotes and clarifying everything

Gotcha, thanks! That clarifies that question, then! I agree that the Stormfather wouldn't be so shocked if that was the origin for the Siah-Aimians, unless the shocking part was how it was being done?... like maybe with the swearing of the 5th ideal the finally & fully enter the physical realm?... still seems like quite a reach though. But definitely very interesting that the reasons they can change shape are similarly related!.... whatever that means lol

Ah, interesting, thanks for sharing this! Do we know if Brandon has given any further clarification as to why/how the Siah-Aimians have blue skin? It's also interesting that they can change/alter their skin at will too. Would it be unreasonable for the Siah-Aimians to be descendants of human/spren combinations, specifically honor spren? According to the coppermind, their shadows are weird specifically because of a connection to the cognitive realm..... gives some room for speculation and theories....? I'm not sold on it, but it seems to have some ground to stand on still

I like the theory, but adding my vote that it makes much more sense for Shallan to be Shallan. Shallan killing her mother and starting the desolation is already a huge reveal for most of the people reading the books who haven't been digging around through interesting potential theories for the past few years and trying to predict what happens. It fits perfectly in my opinion - thematically and mechanically. This theory seems to be stretching for something that would be an extra big twist and surprise, and I like the idea of it and the possibility, but it just seems a little too extravagant and a very clunky fit with the rest of the story. I understand that we don't know how much we can trust of Shallan's memories and things, but I think this being the solution is just too much of a "psych, everything you thought you knew was a lie the whole time, she IS her mother" whereas the currently popular 'Chana is Shallan's mom' theory is more like "yes, killing both her parents AND her spren wasn't bad enough... her mom was a literal Herald and when she killed her mom that kicked off the desolation". That fits perfectly in my book. Plus it's hard to argue with @alder24's logic in this thread. Very clear, straightforward, and well put. Plus, how would Chana (pretending she is Shallan) be bonded to Testament if that was her daughter's spren, and she killed her daughter? Unless Ishar was there and transferred the bond or something? But then... why would he do that?... It just gets so messy.

I don’t have a horse in this race really, and I definitely am not looking for any arguments or things cause I really don’t care either way how this ends up. I never really expected Brandon to ship Syladin. But I wasn’t outraged to hear other people were shipping it. All I’m here to say is that after reading these first few chapters I’m noticing a lot of little things that feel like they are headed that direction. Which has been surprising to me, cause I really didn’t expect this to be even a real possibility, more so just a fun and pretty “out there” theory. But here are the things I’ve been noticing. Syl is being more human-like, staying full size and using Kaladin’s height as a marker. Kaladin keeps noticing things that she does like wearing a safe hand glove and how she mimics breathing, things like that. There’s more physical contact than usual, like her resting her head on his shoulder. And there were even some callouts in the early chapters that focused on framing exactly how Kaladin had always perceived her: noting that she behaved kind of childish at times but was never actually a child and he never viewed her in that way, emphasizing that even in her smaller size she was always an adult woman, stuff like that which feels kind of unnecessary to call out. The only reason I can think of for why this was included is to make sure anyone who has viewed Syl as a child reframes that view and doesn’t get creeped out if their relationship got romantic or something eventually. Syl also has been taking a more involved role in discussions with other people, even responding to Dalinar that they would accept the mission, and Kaladin notes that she deserves to have a say, etc. not a huge one but just definitely points out the changes she has been making. It just seems to me like there is a lot painting the background for this to potentially happen. So I’m curious if anyone who is against the ship could call out some reasons for why these things are getting dropped that aren’t related to this? Again just looking for other perspectives and logical thoughts that might counteract how I interpreted these things.

So, not that it actually helps that much, but I had MSFT Copilot analyze the chapter headings we have so far, and give me the breakdown of which character's voices match the voice used in the headings. The response below in bold: Focusing solely on the voice and style of the writing, here are some characters from The Stormlight Archive whose speech patterns and narrative styles might closely resemble the quotes you provided: Navani Kholin - Navani often speaks in a reflective and analytical manner, with a focus on history and philosophy. The detailed and contemplative nature of the quotes aligns well with her voice. Shallan Davar - Shallan’s introspective and poetic style, especially when she is deep in thought or recording her observations, could match the tone of these quotes. Jasnah Kholin - Jasnah’s scholarly and philosophical approach, combined with her interest in historical nuances, makes her a potential match for the voice in these quotes. Personally, I strongly lean towards Shallan at the moment, but could definitely see Jasnah. Szeth is my number 3. Kaladin is my dark horse number 4 but I kind of doubt it.

Damn that was pretty much a one sentence summary of my thought process and a clear cut answer! Thank you kindly! Here's hoping we see some vaping mistborns down the road lol

Are there other ways to ingest, absorb, or take in the metals that would still allow you to burn them? And would the effect be more/less powerful based on different ways or would it impact they actual effect of burning the metals? For example, what if you were shot by a shotgun that had pure alloys of some burnable metal or another... could you burn those metals if you survived? I mean we do see Sazed access metals that were shot into his body but that was with Feruchemy. So I'm curious if the same rule applies for allomancy or not. Other more extreme questions: would you be able to snort steel flakes and still access the metal reserves? Would it be any different? What if you injected them into your blood stream? any way to turn it into a topical cream that you absorb through the skin (sounds impossible to me but hey I'm not expert)? What if there was a vaporized metal powder in the air that you inhaled? Lol that just made me think of a vape pen for mistborns, can't wait to see that in era 3. Anyway - let me know all your crazy thoughts, I'm sure this will all be purely speculative.

There are some WOBs about the torments and how they relate to the Dawnshards. To me it reads as though holding one (whether you lose it or not) will come with a torment. I also think this alludes to Rysn starting to have the effects of a Torment but in a very subtle and non-obvious way

Adding a clarifying question here- how much time do we think has passed from when the events in the story happened to when Hoid is telling the story to his audience?? I’m guessing both events are in the same general area of the cosmere timeline, but there’s probably been a significant amount of time between I would think.

That’s a good question, I found a wob that I think sheds some light on how that works: https://wob.coppermind.net/events/188/#e4911