AquaRegia

Did we learn ANYTHING new about Paalm from The Lost Metal? I don't feel like any of my questions got answered: How did she get involved with Autonomy in the first place, and how long ago? How exactly was a Trellium spike delivered for her use? To what degree was she controlled by Autonomy? (That phrase never fails to make me laugh.) Did she really hate Harmony as much as she seemed to? What were her intentions, really? Was she part of The Set, or was that just parallel play?

In other words, Wax is a tool. ;-)

Great answers, everyone. I'll just add that presumably, anyone who has both Allomancy and Feruchemy with the same metal should be capable of compounding. https://coppermind.net/wiki/Compounding

I think you have keenly summed up a very important point. I know I'm guilty of treating the Cosmere as if it were a real-world logical puzzle, and that by "scientifically" collecting data from the novels, stories and WOBs (and maps!), we'll be able to answer every question and solve every mystery. Unfortunately, and Brandon's ultimate goal is simply to tell stories, not to create bulletproof hyperrealistic astronomical, geophysical or sociopolitical systems. That said, TERRIFIC work on the scale-sleuthing of the new map! I'm with you in suspecting the "truth" is likely somewhere between those two options.

All excellent questions. If the same geophysical laws operate as here on earth, then the Elendel Basin - at sea level and less than 10° from the equator - is in the warmest, wettest, and most consistent climate zone on the planet. @Oltux72 is correct in comparing its location to that of Dakar on the coast of West Africa, which has average daily temperatures around 28 °C (83 °F) and average night lows of 21 °C (70 °F). The all-time record low temperature in Dakar is 14 °C (57 °F). Given that it does snow in Elendel, the warmest place in the world... most OTHER places on Scadrial should be VERY cold indeed. Agreed, that's painfully clear. I'm still working on getting it straight. So the Southern Scadrians have lived for 300+ years in a place too cold for them, where they need magical technology powered by dedicated metalborn slaves just to survive... and never considered moving someplace warmer? What's Kelsier been doing all this time? What about Marsh, and Harmony, and all the Kandra? I'm still trying to wrap my head around the idea that both of these cultures, North and South, have apparently somehow coexisted on the same landmass for 300+ years without any contact. I guess we are supposed to infer that there is the Scadrian equivalent of the Himalayas separating them... but both sides surely must have had boats for quite a while now, right? One side has railroads and the other side airships, for Harmony's sake. By 1850 on earth, people had explored (and colonized) every coastline not covered with ice.

We really don't know where Alendi and Rashek started from, though, right? Only the barest hints about the geography of Khlennium survived. Not gonna lie, very little about the whole "Ice Death" thing makes any sense to me, to the point where I just sort of put it out of my mind. The SoScads spent literally 300 years "freezing to death"? That's 15 generations. I'd think people would either find a way to cope or die out long before that. And in all those years, Harmony did nothing for them? How is Allik managing (thriving, it seems) without any metalminds? Maybe I'll make another topic about it. Back to the original discussion, the Basin being tropical does make some sense in terms of 1) a very mild and hospitable climate, 2) little to no seasonal weather variations, and 3) no noticeable variations in length of day/night. But it sure does wipe out a lot of our earlier speculation about E2 geography. How well does the new map agree with distance estimates made previously, and does it help to better determine the size of the planet as a whole?

Immediate thoughts (I haven't taken a lot of time to think yet): Something very strange must be going on if the region occupied by the Malwish (extending into southern mid-latitudes) is significantly WARMER than the coastal equatorial climate in the Elendel Basin. I'm not sure axial tilt is available as a reasonable explanation; both day/night and seasonal cycles would be crazy away from the equator. Much of Malwish territory would be in perpetual daylight or darkness for chunks of a year, and it would be EXTREMELY cold in winter - WAY more so than an equatorial location could ever get. The Bilming broadsheet is titled "The Three Seasons", which implies less seasonal variation than we are used to here on earth, and I don't recall any of the four E2 novels indicating any important differences in seasonal weather or length of day. I note on Isaac's most recent map that the N-S scale lengthens away from the equator, just as one would expect from a Mercator-style projection. I'm assuming for now that those grid lines represent divisions of 16 degrees, but I'm way too lazy to verify whether this is consistent with earlier estimates. In any case, I think @Jofwu must be right.

Hard agree, sadly. We've all read MB Era 1... we've SEEN what he's capable of in terms of seamless integration of plot development, character arcs, new magic wrinkles, big endings, etc... and TLM doesn't measure up. My hope is that it's a result of him writing four other novels in the same time span.

It would be a very Brandon thing if Discord turned out to be "better" for Scadrial than Harmony. It's also very Brandon for one person's friendly god to be another's dire existential threat. Presumably, on Taldain, Autonomy (or her aspects/avatars) is regarded by the natives as beneficent. And, on Roshar, Discord is much easier to spin as an adversary for someone than Harmony is. I think Sazed is moving in the direction of becoming, like other Shard Vessels we've seen, a sympathetic person with relatable motives who nevertheless is compelled by circumstances and/or Shardic Intent to be a credible threat in the Cosmere. "Better" for Scadrial? Possibly, in some ways. More fun to read about? Definitely.

I agree with @Treamayne. In general, it always makes most sense to read things in publication order, regardless of the order in which they actually take place. The last scene in BoM is one of the high points of everything Brandon has written, and it would be rendered completely anticlimactic if one reads Secret History beforehand. It seems to me that much of Secret History will seem like random nonsense without some additional Cosmere knowledge.

I thought their romance was hilarious, precious, poignant, and lovely all at the same time, and I think Brandon did a great job with it. Also, as a 55-year old man, I find this new use of "ship" (verb? noun? adjective? Yes to all, apparently) both confusing and odd. ;-)

Bringing this topic - always close to my heart - back again, since now we have a lot more new information. I understand and appreciate this forum is not yet cleared for spoilers from The Lost Metal... but there's a NEW MAP in there, and Isaac told us where the rusting EQUATOR is. https://wob.coppermind.net/events/508-dragonsteel-2022/#e15856 Trust me, I promise it's not spoilery at all. But just in case: @Jofwu @Oltux72 @cometaryorbit

I'd argue that ALL the surges involve Investiture turning into energy. Also light leaking out of Invested spheres is also Investiture -> Energy. Both Lift and TwinSoul can make short-lived matter which can occupy space and resist force, but evaporates away again. I know Brandon says otherwise, but as a chemist myself I see no way to make the observed behavior of Godmetals fit with them being made of normal atoms. At some point, "fantasy rules" have to diverge from "real world rules". Godmetals are "matter" in the sense that they have mass and take up space, thus they are neither energy nor Investiture, but their "magical" properties simply can't be explained nonmagically. If I recall correctly, Brandon has stated that in Allomancy, the metals themselves are not turned into Investiture, but rather that the metals are a kind of "key" or "conduit" which connect the Allomancer to Preservation's power. The fact that the metal atoms do, in fact, disappear from the stomach of the Allomancer when "burned" (or leeched) remains another fantasy magic puzzle. It's a truly amazing thing that Brandon has invented this entire ridiculous fake universe... and dragged so many of us into it with him.

Two main clues: "nondescript" clothing could mean either "intentionally non-attention-drawing" or "unfamiliar"; and the obvious question "is this action legal?" I'm not saying I agree with the speculation that they are Skybreakers, it's certainly more likely for the Ghostbloods to have a team of native Scadrian Allomancers. But given how many other worldhoppers we saw in this novel, the idea that they are Rosharans isn't completely crazy. Had they been described as "tall" I'd be on board, but alas...

I'm a huge MB Era 2 fan, absolutely LOVED the first 3 novels. Found plenty to enjoy in TLM, but overall I was disappointed. Others have made many of these points, and as others have said, maybe my expectations were too high... but rust it, I've SEEN what Brandon can do, and I just don't feel like this novel measures up. Overall, it seems like the level of complexity, instead of reaching a new high, has reverted to "adolescent fiction" level. Here are, in good Scadrian form, sixteen very specific things I found disappointing: 1. Bloody Tan: “Somebody moves us”. The very first mystery of Era 2, from the first scene of AoL. Given multiple callbacks in SoS (and one in TLM), seemed to be building to an important reveal… and we get nothing. No explanation of what Bloody Tan knew, how he knew it, or what it meant. Was this the first instance of Autonomy’s “freedom” vs Harmony’s “control”? Maybe, I guess, but except for a brief last-minute "apology" from Sazed, we get zilch. 2. Lessie/Bleeder/Paalm. Hoping for more about when, why and how Paalm got a Trellium spike? Tough. Nothing. 3. The Men of Gold and Red. Foreshadowed in every book as a dire and ominous threat; never actually show up. 4. The “Faceless Immortals” of Trell. Shown onscreen at the end of BoM, likely some kind of cognitive entity able to possess human hosts, terrific potential to be powerful foes. Never seen or mentioned again. 5. Avatar of Trell. In BoM, Edwarn and Telsin are horrifying protagonists: overpowered, intelligent, several steps ahead of our heroes at every turn, and barely bested by the intervention of Harmony and the godlike power of the Bands of Mourning. Now, Telsin has gone even further, she’s an actual Avatar of a Shard. Result? She spends all her screen time STALLING, trying to confuse and distract Wax instead of just killing him, which she should easily be able to do. We see zero evidence of her awesome powers, and when Wax finally figures out the right answer to the bomb shell game, she literally lies down and dies. 6. The Set. Built up over 3 novels as a well-organized, deep pocketed, cosmere-aware hierarchy with all kinds of deep evil plans, backed by an invading Shard. What we see in TLM is a handful of spiked metalborn (see below), hundreds of level one targets for our heroes to steamroll, and Telsin (see above). 7. Gertruda and Dumad. AKA Not-Wayne and Not-Wax, in case you missed their names (I had to look them up). Fun idea, made for some cool dialogue. I kept thinking “there better be a good explanation for how this came about.” Not really. 8. The kidnapping victims/“The Community”. The payoff of one of the Set’s disturbing plots, I can at least understand what Brandon was going for here… but I don’t feel like he pulled it off. It felt too simple, too easy, not something actual real people would try to pull off, let alone fall for. 9. The Bands of Mourning. Hoping for some more insight regarding how this wonderful artifact works? How it was made? Maybe see someone use it again? Tough. Nothing. 10. Malwish medallions. See 9. 11. Kelsier as the Sovereign. The stored memory Wax sees at the end of BoM (given to him by Hoid) was one of the most amazing things I’ve ever read. I get goosebumps just recalling it to this day. I couldn’t wait to see more about that time in Kelsier’s journey. How did he regain a body? How did he save the Southern Scadrians? How did he make the Bands of Mourning? What did I get? Nothing. 12. Kelsier as Thaidakar. Glad he finally got some screen time… but brooding impotence is not a good look for him. Where is the eternal optimism? Where is the joy of being part of a crew? The goal is “save Scadrial”, but what’s the plan? 13. The Ghostbloods. Happy to see Shai again, and happy she’s part of a team. TwinSoul is cool. But we get nothing new about how their actions are furthering their goals. 14. The Explosion. It’s almost like Brandon was planning on something cool happening, then changed his mind. Why so much foreshadowing for nothing? Does Wax have new powers or not? It was so exciting… and we ultimately get nothing. 15. One-dimensional Mayors. Brandon has always impressed me with his ability to make all his characters, whether protagonist, antagonist, or none of the above, real-feeling fully fleshed PEOPLE with believable motivations and behavior. Neither Entrone nor Varlance felt like real people to me; both read like cardboard cutouts. 16. The Lost Metal. I assume it’s Lerasium… but why am I not SURE what the rusting title of the rusting novel refers to? OK, now that I've got it off my chest, hopefully I can let it go, and look forward to 4 more novels next year!

Good questions. My sense is that the Set was directly propelled by Trell/Autonomy. Now that Autonomy has withdrawn, there will be no Set, and any remaining Set members will be forced to follow their own separate path. I was underwhelmed by Telsin's actions in TLM - she spent all her screen time verbally sparring with Wax, trying to distract him from figuring out the plan, when (with the power of Autonomy fueling her) she could presumably have simply killed or disabled him far more easily. Then, when he figures it out, she literally just lies down and dies? Lame. One of many weak plot points in this book, IMO. Given the numerous logical inconsistencies, I decline to make any predictions beyond this: the near-miss at Elendel, combined with the political tension between north and south (plus Kelsier poking Harmony) will result in some greatly accelerated technological development over the next 50 years.

Era 2 Scadrial has already invented the belt-fed water cooled machine gun (1920s), the multi-shot standalone grenade launcher (1930s) and nuclear weapons (1940s). On the other hand, they have not yet invented fixed-wing aircraft (1900s) or television (1920s). There is now some significant political and military tension between the Northern and Southern Continents, which should spur more rapid technological advancement, and Kelsier is pushing Sazed to speed things up even more. Assuming electronics and computers will be an important feature of Era 3, I'd guess the gap will be at least 50 years, but not more than 100. It's unlikely that Wax will be alive, and, while his children should be, my bet is that Brandon will want a fresh cast of characters, with only an occasional cameo throwback to earlier Eras. We don't know Ranette's last name, do we? Along with Tarcsel Electric and the wildly popular Professional Noseball League, I expect Ranette's weapons manufacturing company to be an obvious player in Era 3's corporate landscape.

At first I thought, like many others, "wow - 16 vials, each with a different metal? Is Wax a Mistborn now???" But on careful rereading, I think the implication is that 15 of the vials are all the same - steel - but slightly improved somehow. Perhaps the "perfect" alloy composition of maximum effectiveness, perhaps a level of purity Wax has not yet had easy access to, or perhaps adding something else Wax can now use (thanks to his lax safety practices). In any case, I'm confident that the first time Wax burns these new metals, he'll figure out exactly how they are different and why. I agree the last one is likely atium, lerasium, harmonium, or some other god-level upgrade. (CAN'T WAIT) Agreed, Trell = Autonomy was always the "obvious" answer, and the Odium connections people tried to make always felt forced. Happy it wasn't a giant red herring... that would have made me angry. I agree with others that since Wax has held and used the Bands of Mourning, he would immediately sense the presence of, and know how to make use of, a new reserve of allomantic or feruchemical power. But hemalurgy? He's never experienced THAT yet. The allomantic lines Wax is starting to see remind me of the vision at the end of BoM, when Wax is seeing through Kelsier's spiked "eyes". Given that he inhaled tiny shavings of highly invested godmetals, I think he may have entered a state of being hemalurgically "minispiked". Looking forward to seeing how THAT plays out! My guess is that Ranette has produced Scadrial's first assault rifle, and have no doubt we'll see it in action before this novel ends. Regarding Autonomy's motives, I'll repost the following. Well over a year ago, I heard a podcast outlining this excellent explanation of how things might be playing out: 1. Autonomy is working for maximum freedom in the entire Cosmere, and wants all worlds to meet on roughly equal footing 2. Technological advancement in ONE place will lead to colonialism, which drastically reduces freedom for those whose planets are under colonial rule 3. Autonomy has already frozen technical advancement (and outside trade) on Taldain to prevent said interstellar conquest and colonialism 4. Harmony has created conditions (especially in Southern Scadrial) which favor rapid technological advancement, and is actively encouraging it 5. Autonomy needs to shut that rust down so that Scadrial doesn't become the center of an interstellar empire, squashing everyone else's freedom Not my idea, but it makes a lot of sense to me. If anyone else heard that podcast, please credit the right person. I see no recent developments which contradict this set of ideas. Obviously, the decision to "sterilize" Scadrial now would certainly prevent an interstellar Scadrian Empire. Gaining complete control of the planet would also presumably allow technological advancement to be effectively suspended. It feels very "Brandon" to me for both parties in the dispute to have excellent reasons for pursuing their goals. Harmony, for us, has always been the "good guy"... but seen through Autonomy's eyes, he's enabling the development of a Cosmere-wide authoritarian dictatorship which must be opposed in the name of freedom.

I encourage everyone to keep in mind that Brandon is a storyteller, NOT a physicist. I'm a science nerd too, and I get that it's fun to try to work out the rules; by all means, carry on! But he has already admitted how his "science people" get headaches trying to work out how Cosmere FTL and time dilation will work. In the end I think the rules are going to be whatever works best for the stories, not what satisfies a rigorous mathematical relationship.

I, for one, have no doubt that Stormlight will allow Physical Realm space travel in Roshar's future.

Edgedancer every time I take the quiz (and try to answer honestly), so I'll own it. Based just on my own self-image, I'd have guessed Truthwatcher or Elsecaller.

Not gonna lie, this made me laugh until tears literally came to my eyes. Thanks, I needed that. :-D

As has so often been the case, @Ixthos absolutely nailed it. Well done! Is it hard being so much smarter than the rest of us? ;-)

Here at the 17th Shard, the party NEVER STOPS! *cue bumpin' music*

I think maybe Wax might find he doesn't need earrings anymore... his lungs are now spiked with every godmetal he's ever heard of. As expected, E=mc2, and just like that, Scadrial enters the nuclear age.