Quintessential

Just now, Tani said:

Ok.

When that I was elim did I directly said I was village? Never. Last time I tried to lie about my role I failed miserably.

First time for everything

4 minutes ago, Tani said:

Its called the only valid reason I had for voting you was the ISO Gears did on you and how he said if you were elim hed look at me and see if I was elim too. I was scared you were elim. I was scared Gears might misread me elim. (I'm village. There, I've said it right out.)

Everyone says they're village; I've indirectly done it like twice in my past two posts xD

Seriously, though, I know from experience that exeing someone because they might be e/e with someone else doesn't turn out well unless one or both players are also independently sus and worth voting off. 

Just now, Tani said:

Yer right. Quinn.

...is it just me, or was that too easy. 

Yeah I think I'm just fine with my vote where it is.

Current VC:

TJ (1): Illwei
Illwei (1): Szeth
Mat (1): TJ
Tani (2): Exp, Quinn
Quinn (1): Illwei

1 minute ago, Tani said:

Ya. So I wanna make sure you're not Elim.

How many investigators were elim in LG74?

...okay yeah y'know what Tani (Sart). This is just insane, because by making sure I'm not elim, you're also making sure I can't do my job. You're throwing out one of the most powerful village roles on the off chance that she's elim, when you have no actual reason to believe she is elim. 

LG74 had two elim investigators, but that was because the GM specifically wanted to go against the norm. The norm being, when there's an alignment-scanning role, there's a villager with that role. Extrapolating off of LG74 doesn't make sense because it wasn't a typical game. Voting me off in MR50 because the role distribution was such-and-such in LG74 doesn't make sense.

17 minutes ago, Tani said:

This is concerning. Quinn.

Okay what the heck you guys I now I have the most votes. Why are you trying to kill off your Investigator? Gears' ISO didn't even conclude I was elim, just said I was confusing and noted that if I'm elim, there are people to look at. 

1 minute ago, Szeth_Pancakes said:

VC:

Books (3): Quinn, Mat, Archer, [Szeth]

Quinn (4): Azmine, Books, Jondesu, Ash

[] = insane

Azmine is also insane : P it should be

Books (3): Quinn, Mat, Archer, [Szeth]

Quinn (3): [Azmine], Books, Jondesu, Ash

17 minutes ago, Illwei said:

What do you lose by telling us if you were brigged. Can the ...brigger? Not brig the same person two nights in a row?

...hmmm good point, actually. Yes, I was Brigged last cycle. Now that I think about it, that probably doesn't give the elims much info that they didn't have before... I mean, unless it wasn't because of IA that there was no elim kill C1. And since the Lab is sabotaged, they can't find the IA by scanning me even if they have a Biologist. 

13 minutes ago, Illwei said:

Why not?

Qwinn

Either because I was blocked/protected or because for some reason I chose to scan someone else. Again, draw your own conclusions one way or another.

7 hours ago, |TJ| said:

And @Quintessential, I don't suppose there's a way you could let us know if your scan worked without revealing if there's Brig fella who protected you? Mainly asking if you scanned Gears and got to know his alignment.

I do not currently know Gears' alignment. Draw your own conclusions : P

Well... I mean, voting someone for low/unsatisfactory activity worked out okay last time I did it, so Sart @Sart, any thoughts on... anything? : P

11 minutes ago, Biplet said:

With losing the agent, that means we’ve lost 3 engineers: two to the exe and one in the hospital. Chances are those are our only engineers, bc in a 16 player game, four of one role feels pretty lopsided. Unless someone else can prove me wrong, bc lord knows I hope we have another engineer. 

Agent isn't actually an engineer--they just appear that way to scans and upon hospitalization so that we don't immediately kill them  So far, we've only lost two real engineers, and we could get one of them back.

25 minutes ago, Szeth_Pancakes said:

Who was the PM with? Could we also get confirmation from them?

Uhhh well it was from Illwei, so if you wanted to break the fourth wall, steal a Messenger from the other game, and have them send something to the dead doc, then maybe? But otherwise, no. Archer can confirm that I asked him to ask Gears to PM me, if you really don't trust that I'm telling the truth about something as small as this : P

53 minutes ago, Szeth_Pancakes said:

Can I have confirmation from @Quintessential or her correspondent please?

Yes, I can confirm that I had a PM that said roughly that. Though, I could just as easily have confirmed that you used a Hidden Transcript, since I scanned you N1 : P

8 minutes ago, Azmine_king said:

Im going to look more closely at the two of them but for now, I just feel like Quinn went unaccounted for too long, its a bit of gut.

Unaccounted in what regard? If you're referring to the drop in activity, that was/(is?) due in part to my addiction to Netflix shows and in part to the other game that's started. If you're referring to actions, here are all of the actions I've taken this game:

D1: Spied on Az and Illwei
N1: Scanned Szeth
D2: Spied on Illwei and Mat
N2: Scanned Ash
D3: Spied on Araris and Mat
N3: Scanned Dannex
D4: No action--at this point I didn't think PM-spying would really do anything.
N4: Scanned Books.

Well that's a better outcome than a misexe, anyway. Any Doctors out there may wanna visit the hospital this cycle to save Jon. Engineers--if there are any left, that is--might wanna target the laboratory, so that we can get Biologist scans up and running for future elim kills.

Just now, Matrim's Dice said:

For someone who isn't me, yeah. But it's the same as you immediately writing off Books as Danforth, we don't have any proof of that but you do. Or you have proof that he isn't, but either way. For me Szeth is actually the safest option.

My point, Mat, is that I would expect villagers to be focusing on the high(er) chance of hitting an elim within [me, Books], rather than trying to look outside those two--perhaps to protect a teammate? >> Obviously I wrote off Books as Danforth, because I know I'm not elim. You don't know that, so I can't fault you for voting me if you think I'm more likely to be Danforth than Books, but I can find it odd that you're ignoring the easiest opportunity to catch an elim, in favor of looking for one who may not even exist, depending on the number of elims at the start.

3 minutes ago, Szeth_Pancakes said:

This list feels problematic. Why? Because Mat wrote himself off as village. You need to consider yourself as a possibility if you're going to do an analysis like this - otherwise, you can't convince everyone else that this is correct. PLUS, Ash is not confirmed vil. It's likely, sure, but he was one of the people who knew of the crossbow holder's identity. (Now that I mention is, so was Mat). Sure, that could have been leaked through some lucky PM spying, but it's worth considering.

The point of Mat's thing isn't to convince the rest of us, it's to explain why he's voting the way he is. That being said, I don't necessarily agree with his choice of vote, since we have a pool of two people, one of whom must be elim. The logical thing to do would be to vote for one of those two people, rather than focusing on the rest of the group. 

2 minutes ago, Biplet said:

Oh shoot I need to reread agent rules. I didn’t realize that the agent improving the part the engineer targeted would make it not work.

Well, I think that's how it works lol I know that engineers and sabotages can both mess with improvements, but idk whether it would work if they were both in the same turn... yeah.

9 minutes ago, Biplet said:

Wasn't the original vote on Archer because he was quiet? He's posted since that og vote from Quinn, unless that's not her only reason and I'm misreading. I agree with some of Devotary's reasoning though. The only strong opinion I see from Archer is about Gears' word choice, which was much appreciated but nothing huge.

Yeah, the original point was to get him to say something, but what he did say felt like... well, basically I also agree with Devo xD generally, Archer posts very little per cycle in terms of number of posts, but his posts are high-density, quality analysis (or RP), so it's impossible to forget he's in the game and most people count him as being on roughly the same level of activity as players like me/Mat/Illwei. This game, though, I was looking at the player list and was like "wait Archer's playing???" And honestly his response hasn't really changed that.

12 minutes ago, Biplet said:

Quick additional thought: no one's addressed that the agent didn't improve anything C1. That's weird, so I'm bringing it up. Why didn't the agent do anything?

Agent may have improved the same part that the elims sabotaged, or may have improved a part that an engineer targeted, or may be inactive.

*blink* I guess I forgot to post last turn, huh. 

Yes, Books did scan me (I scanned them). Also Books. The rest of you can flip as many coins as you want, but I have the fortunate advantage of knowing which of us is Danforth already  I'd also be fine with voting out Mat, if that's the exe that gets more traction, but since Books is (for me) confirmed elim and Mat isn't, I'm putting my vote here first.

37 minutes ago, Tani said:

Edit: @Quintessential can you scan me? I think I trust your vil-ness and wish for confirmation of mine.

I won't be announcing beforehand whom I'm scanning, and I won't be taking suggestions. Though, given that I have no clue how to read you, I'll probably end up scanning you at some point if I survive long enough to do so : P

(there are about 4 hrs 15 minutes left in the cycle)

Also @DeTess and @StrikerEZ, if I were to scan the Agent, what would their role show up as? And their alignment, if I scanned a second time?

VC:

Illwei (1): Szeth
Exp (2): Matrim, Jondesu
Tani (1): Gears
Jondesu (1): TJ
TJ (1): Illwei
Archer (1): Quinn

@Jondesu we have 15.5 hours left, which is not "a couple" even if you consider that people in my timezone and thereabouts will be sleeping for some of them. I'm gonna throw a vote on Archer (@Archer) because I've noticed he's been uncharacteristically quiet this turn. If it comes down to it, I'll vote Exp to avoid a tie/near tie, but tbh I don't even remember what they did that was suspicious, which imo means it probably wasn't enough to actually warrant being voted off after C1 : P

18 minutes ago, Jondesu said:

I find this whole discussion frustrating because people are basically saying because Gears does this regularly, they can write it off.  That wasn't the case when he started.  It isn't the case for other people.  Why are we treating Gears differently from other players?

On the contrary, I at least am not treating Gears any differently. I always ignore it when people claim elim, jokingly or apparently seriously.

Edit: Except, I should add, when they claim because they've been found out anyway--in which case, it's still ignoring because I would have assumed them to be elim whether they'd said anything or not.

Edit #2: @Matrim's Dice here's a VC:

Illwei (1): Szeth
Exp (1): Matrim
Tani (1): Gears
Gears (1): Jondesu
Jondesu (1): TJ

4 hours ago, Jondesu said:

Edit: it comes very close to gamethrowing, in my opinion.

*sigh* in this particular case I have to strongly disagree with you, because Gears is RPing as one of the Saboteurs, and like... it'd be kind of unfair to outlaw RPing a certain character/POV imo. In other cases, where he's claiming elim OOC, I kind of get it, but also it's not really a big deal? idk. Like I don't see what the problem with saying you're elim is, because it's equally nonsensical for either alignment to do it, meaning that it's NAI. Treating it as if it should be AI (or forbidden) just doesn't make sense to me; if other people want to claim elim then it's really not that hard to just ignore it in serious analysis.

40 minutes ago, Devotary of Spontaneity said:

That would require Quinn and Gears to have known that a navigator was going to scan Quinn, since I don't think there's any other reason for an elim to target a teammate C1. That would pretty much mean that Quinn, Gears, and the navigator are all evil, which I guess is possible.

In other Quinn opinions, a role/alignment scanner is only useful if they can actually submit scans, which can't happen if Quinn's roleblocked every cycle. The brig is also pretty useless as a way to protect villagers since sabotaging the brig as it protects someone accomplishes the same thing as attacking someone who isn't brigged. Kind of actively harmful since the elims can hospitalise two people at once if one of them is in the brig.

A. Devo had the exact same response I did for the me/Gears e/e thing lol

B. The point of my claiming and asking for protection isn't to actually get protection--it's to keep the elims from attacking me. They (and I) don't know whether Internal Affairs will actually protect me or not. That's up to the person or people with that role to decide. However, so long as the elims know there's a higher than average chance that I'll have protection, they'll be wary of attacking me because doing so might backfire on them and prolong their win-con--something they already have had to deal with once, it seems, and probably aren't eager to have happen again.

Sabotaging the Brig is one way to get around that, obviously, but that was always going to be a problem; I doubt that village Internal Affairs was going to not protect people just because the Brig might be sabotaged that cycle. 

28 minutes ago, Jondesu said:

I’m still stuck on Gears from before, so I’m totally on board with this. Forcing someone to reveal their role is never good anyways.

He didn't really, though. Anyone could have narrowed it down to either Internal Affairs or Investigator, both of which are targets for the elims. I was contemplating revealing anyway and asking for protection, but I wasn't sure whether it would be better to stay silent and hope the elims didn't realize. Really the person who forced me to reveal was whoever shone the ship's spotlights on me : P 

57 minutes ago, Biplet said:

No suspicions yet, but I am curious about what Gears is  lolol

I'm more inclined to trust Gears than suspect him, so I'm not going to reveal his role for now.

Current VC:

Illwei (1): Szeth
Exp (1): Matrim
Tani (1): Gears
Gears (2): TJ, Jondesu

I don't really understand why @|TJ| and @Jondesu are voting for Gears. What would an elim have to gain by intentionally revealing that they have knowledge of another player's role? It makes the elim in question more suspicious if that player dies to the NK, and calling attention to the fact that that player has an important role makes it more likely that they'll be protected, which in turn makes it harder to kill them.

As far as I can tell, Gears forced me to claim because A. I could be elim and B. if I'm not elim, I may already have a huge target on my back and my claiming will at least make the elims think twice about immediately attacking me. It's annoying because now it means I won't necessarily be able to scan people (which is why I sounded kind of annoyed when I claimed :P), but I'll still submit a scan each cycle on the off chance no one's protecting me. In the end, Gears probably just bought me a few more cycles of life, so I'm inclined to read him village for that.

1 minute ago, Matrim's Dice said:

This is not a village move imo :P. But I don't think it's an elim!Gears move to do this and then explain that he did it.

No, it's a Gears move. This kind of thing is why I find it so hard to read him