Mandamon

Hmm...good thought. I may try that!

Is there still room on July 2nd? I can submit the first half of a short story I wrote.

Thanks so much for the feedback! So I'm hearing pretty consistent things, some of which I remember worrying about when I was writing, which usually means it's a problem. The first half of the book, at least, follows the same trend, so I feel like I should take some time to rewrite before posting anything else. Otherwise you're just going to be making the same comments over again. I've heard these problems so far: 1) Isaac is only responding to things. 2) If I'm using a concept or philosophy, make sure I explain it. 3) Address culture clash and language barriers. 4) Bring out the mother/son relationship and describe more completely how they live together. 5) Either make the Greats the sole focus (which they aren't), or make them more of a road trip/sight seeing attraction, on the way to rescuing Isaac's father. 6) The journal. I debated doing this plain first person, but I thought the journal would cut out a lot of the downtime while they are traveling. But it also forces Isaac's reaction to be less active, as he's relating something that already happenened. I may try plain first person and see if that helps. Any thoughts on this? Anyone else with experience writing journal entries? Anything else I need to work on? Thanks again!

Hmmm...I seem to be the first...I'll leap right in. Sci Fi is a nice change. Your prose seems very professional. As sometimes happens in this sort of future colony Sci-Fi, I was still a little confused as to where they were by the end of the chapter. Bethany hasn't touched the ground, so I guess they were in a space station of some sort? It seemed like there was gravity, so I wouldn't think ground would be terribly strange to her. Page 3/7: The Drugs/food notation was sort of strange. Is it one or the other? Why are they thought of as drugs? Page 8: The target's new friend has shown up for 12 days in a row, yet the S.O.M. and his wife don't seem very familiar with her. I would think they might have noticed her before. Page 10: How does he know what the in-stream card says when he's looking somewhere else? "Flashed" makes me think it's visual, but he seems to be sending messages while it's still in a pocket. The chapter as a whole was enticing, and setup enough questions that I want to read more and find out what's going on. However, there is a pretty steep learning curve for the setting. Reminds me of Charles Stross, in that you can tell it's a Sci-Fi future, but things are strange enough that's it hard to relate our civilization to this one. But it's almost as if you are taking that type of story and purposefully obscuring the setting. You might want to consider answering a few more questions to take a little bit of the slope out of the curve, though I may need to read some more before I come to a strong feeling on that one.

I don't want to go into grammar too much, but I do agree with Guenhywvar. There were enough errors that it took me out of the story. Since English isn't your native tongue, it's not your fault (I only speak one language fluently!) but it is something that you will need to pay particular attention to if you are submitting something to an American agent. The biggest technical things I noticed were apostrophe use, having thoughts in italics, and the structure of your dialogue. In general, I like the story and your writing. You have a good grasp of putting a scene into words. That said, the fight was a little long, although it was exciting the whole time, for me. Although there were some pretty standard elements (medieval structure, fey guardian, magic sword) you used them well enough that it only added to the story, and the magic and descriptions were easy to follow along with. I could instantly grasp what magical element were being used, even if I don't understand how they work. I think the only bad part of this was the very beginning. I almost lost interest before finishing the first page, and I think moving the whole part about why the letter is written would be better moved to the end of the chapter. Maybe start with the third paragraph? The action in that one was the first part that sucked me in. This reminded me of a recent Writing Excuses when Mary brought up that people used to not sleep for eight hours at a time and would get up in the middle of the night. I've been contemplating how to work that into a story myself. Very true! I want to read the next chapter!

Hello all, Here is the second part of The Best Kind of Present. Isaac and his mother have discovered that there is a rogue book in history that looks just like the one they use to navigate. Now they are trying to track it down. Thanks in advance for the feedback!

If you have room, I'd like to submit again, for the week of the 25th. The next section is a little long, at 7100 words, but it gets to a good stopping place.

Thanks all! Good points about the intro. This actually gives me some hope for the rest of the book, because a lot of things you've brought up are answered there. Looks like I need to move them forward. Isaac definitely starts running the show later, as he grows up, but it sounds like I need to get some action in earlier. Isaac was originally 8, and my first set of readers all complained that he was too smart! This is also why he is more of an observer at the beginning. Would 10 be more believable? He ages about 6 years during the course of the book. I was thinking the prospect of imagined meetings with historical figures would be a good hook, but it seems like that fell on its face. Sounds like if I pull in some conflict of why they are running through time first, it will help. Right now, that doesn't happen until later. Yes, this is YA and I purposely didn't go into a lot of detail on the translation and culture clash. I mention that they both study languages a lot, but sort of leave it at that. I wanted the book to be more of the Doctor Who timey-wimey bent than with very stringent time travel rules. The western civ question and the description of the house are handled a little later on. There is a direct correlation on time travel to time passing, which becomes a plot point. I have a whole spreadsheet for it And the Time Travel episode was the reason I posted this. I figured I would get some good feedback because of it. Thanks again! One more question--do people want to see more of this book, or do you think the premise is too damaged and I should take it aside for rework and post something else for now?

Sorry I couldn't get in on this discussion earlier! I was a victim of a terrible internet connection while I was on vacation. There was a lot of good feedback going on in this thread, so I wanted to post my two cents and hope I don't repeat too much: Since no one has really done much in the way of specifics, first here are a few nitpicky things I noticed. Page 1, first pp: "Rather, not in the same way." should be something like, "Rather, it would not exist in the same way." two sentences further on : "She flew high above the city, her vision enhanced she watched people walk idly by, oblivious as to what was about to happen." You either need some more commas, or to break this up into two sentences. There are a lot of other sentences like this. Page 9/10: repetition of Hinther's name. Use "he" or "him" when you can. Page 14: '“You have a head beyond your years Keling.” The dragon said, sending a telepathic message.' We can figure out that it's telepathic from the italics. Page 16: I think there's a little too much telepathy...I'm not sure who is talking where. Bottom of page 17: You have Athir referred to as a he, instead of she. Page 19: we see that Cekoti seems to have betrayed the others in the future, but we don't see any hint of this when they are originally destroying the world in the prologue. Should we? It comes as sort of out of the blue otherwise. page 22. Mental link? This seems to have popped out of nowhere. I think this goes along with the comments on the magic system. Page 24 "She watched as he howled until her eyes stopped following him as she breathed her last breath." This sentence is a hard to follow. Even more than the magic system, the thing that bothered me most was the comma usage. I know there are some fairly lax rules regarding commas, but there are also some hard and fast ones, and you don't seem to be following either consistently. You might want to look into that. Another big point is that you have too much infodumping. There's the really big on on in the prologue about magic, and then another one on page 10 about summoning Daemons. I think most everything I thought of on the characters, the Gods, and Magic has been covered, so I won't be redundant. This reminds me very much of the first time I actually finished writing a book. I immediately submitted it to agents, and of course never heard anything, because it was pretty bad. Soon after I listened to my first Writing Excuses podcast, which was Writing Excuses 5.13: Writing the Second Book. This was the one that made me go back and listen to five years of previous Writing Excuses episodes to catch up, because they had tagged basically everything that was wrong with my book in 15 minutes. If you haven't heard that one, I would encourage you to listen to it. There's another one somewhere about putting everything you can in the first book (that is, not leaving in bits that say "Ah Ha! I'll write about this in another book!") because you will always have other (better) ideas. So I would say if that prologue takes place so far in the past and is really another book in itself, take it ALL out. Leave hints in the book about what happened in the past, and DON'T write about it. Fans always wanted Robert Jordan to write a book about the Second Age of the Wheel of Time, and he refused, because that would take all the mystery and wonder and legend out of the Age of Legends.

So, evidently beach internet access is not so great. I'm back to civilization now... To me, this chapter was a lot of repeat of chapter 4. I want to like Alberic, but the subject of the chapter just isn't that interesting. first, a couple notes--I think everything else I noticed has already been mentioned: "He grunted and threw himself into a chair, in the opposite corner of the clerk— no use antagonizing the man." Which man? You've spent a few paragraphs in description, so I'm not sure who you're talking about by now. Also I know you're filling in names later, but the many XXX characters are not helping the already sort of confusing context. Zen philosophy? I know this has already been mentioned, but I wanted to add one thing, as a general comment. I've seen several other mentions along the way of Earth-centric things. If this is Earth, by now, say so. If not, start giving the philosophy and other Earth-centric things some different name to clue you in. Overall, this chapter once again had a lot of description, a lot of thinking, and not a lot happening. It's good that you're setting up the chase for the main characters, but it still feels like a chapter that's an excuse to reveal the plot. The blue crystals belong to the lord and he wants them back--we could figure that out on our own or through some hints (maybe a glimpse of him looking at one of the crystals). You have Alberic with free reign now to hunt the thieves. Did he not have the ability to track down thieves before, or was it just that it wasn't his primary concern? I like Alberic's character, but the two chapters with him in them don't seem to advance the plot. Also, Alberic is a trifle TOO happy at the end of the chapter to be believable with his character. I had the same thought!

Here is the first 4K words of a 70K word YA story I wrote for NaNoWriMo last year. This is the third full-length story I've written, and I think it's my best so far... That said, I've submitted it to several agents who say it "doesn't draw them in." Here, you are introduced to Isaac and his mother, who are traveling the history of Western Civilization in a time machine in hopes of changing it just enough to bring back Isaac's father. The book starts with a short note about an appendix, which I added on earlier complaints that not many people know of all the historical people included. I can make it available to anyone who wants it, or just do a quick search on their name if you are curious!

Having had the opportunity to read all fifteen chapters at once, I thought I would give more of an overview, rather than a chapter-by-chapter description. First, let me say that I like the book, the concept, and your writing style very much. I'm eager to read more. So much for the praise... Now for the critique... -Chapters 1-7 were very exciting to read, and I wanted to keep reading. Chapters 8-14 started to slow down a lot, the characters didn't do as much, and when there was action, it was overly described. The description was good, but there was so much of it that I started to lose track of where everything was. -Watch your punctuation on quotes ending a question. Quite a few times, someone's question has ended with ("X," he asked). Some of it might be the style of delivery, but make sure dialogue with questions end with ("X?," he asked). Serissa is said to look similar to Rosalin's sister, Sericea. I got so confused by this, I had to go back to chapters two and three to figure out who had which name. For any similar characters, make sure the names don't start with the same first letter (unless there's some hidden reason for this, like she is actually Rosalin's sister, in which case, the hint is too obvious). I think my general problem with the book is the goal, or goals. I love the prologue, which sets up a world with several magical styles, and some good explanations of the world's inhabitants. The next few chapters expand this a lot, with Rosalin, and Rosen, and Dais. Black Rose's awakening had me primed to see her do some real damage now that she's awake. But then the story sort of hits a big hole in the road. Everyone ends up at a city that no one can leave, Rosalin is looking for her home, but has no idea where it is, Dais seems content to hunt birds and run from gangs of thugs, and Black Rose is fighting a battle where it's not very clear who the opponents are. The only place there is movement is the secondary character of Dais' father's caravan, who are, I presume, tunneling under the city walls to get away. That and Rosen, who wants to do something, but is unfortunately trapped in Rosalin's head. The purpose of the book in the prologue seems to have been to defeat the Shifter Tyrants that were threatening in some manner. Now we find out that there is another army, and people, the Imperials, who have taken over, and the Tyrants have been killed. We're not sure what the Imperials are doing yet, so there's nothing driving the story forward. The meeting of the story lines in Chapter 11 did not have the resolving payoff I thought it should have. Maybe it was too early or people didn't do enough? Hemlock: he seems to be thrown in there without a lot of explanation, except that he's one of the vaunted shifters we heard about in the prologue. I know we haven't had another Black Rose chapter, so I'm hoping for more revelation in chapter 16 or 17. A bit about the later chapters: Chapter 13: Speaking of running from gangs of thugs, Chapter 13 as a whole seems to be a repeat. More of Dais running from people. Are they connected with Amelanchier? If not, they don't seem to have a purpose except to chase Dais into Chapter 15. Chapter 14: Rosalin seems determined to find her home, and says so often, but is instead lollygagging with Serissa, who seems an obvious bad influence. Most of this Chapter seemed like a repeat of #13. Main characters engage in brawling with local undesirables. It doesn't add much to the story. I quite agree. I was confused by her adult viewpoint right after she and Rosen got together, but by this point in the story, (even reading straight through), I had forgotten the fact and am wondering why she is so immature. Chapter 15: A very rewarding chapter. Finally, we're back to seeing the Paths being used, and the city seems to be falling as an obstacle. This moment didn't come soon enough. I really enjoyed this chapter and it flowed more like the early ones (1-7) did. I'm glad Rosalin is showing some ambition and action by rescuing Dais. I'm ready for them to go off to find their respective lost things. I have to say I'm still a little unsure on who's fighting who for what reason, though. Is the invading army the one led by Black Rose? I know the characters wouldn't know that, but you could drop some hints for the reader. From the beginning to Chapter 15, I like your writing style, descriptions, and the world you've built. I also like the magic system. I would take a good look at the middle chapters and try to cut down a little. We're 50 thousand words into this book, and the characters are really just getting started. Assuming the Shifters are defeated, I now have less of an idea of the plot than I did in the beginning! The characters haven't really even stated their goals yet, and I would assume we're about a quarter of the way through. At this point, the reader should have at least a hint of the direction of the book, if not a set goal. I may be missing it, but I can't tell you what it is. So all that said, I'm ready for the next chapter!

Apologies for the multitudinous posting all at once...I'm reformatting my computer tonight, so I wanted to get this done beforehand. First, I should say that I really enjoyed these last two chapters. It feels like you're getting into these characters. Chapter 6: -This heist is a lot more interesting than the one in Ch 1. It helps that Jorah seems a little more competent now. The Jorah/Kat/Dexter intrigue sums things up better than Jorah's daydreaming in Ch 1 and Molly's self-introspection in Ch 3. This also gives some character development as you do it. -Green men--what's going on here? I know it's hints about the worldbuilding, but you might need a little more. The juxtaposition of something we recognize as early 1900's SciFi (little green men) with a fantasy setting either needs more explanation to mesh together, or something to stave us off until later. That and the lack of description about the city is getting closer to the frustrating than the tantalizing. Also Molly's height is made mention of again, but no real explanation. Chapter 7: -I've always assumed when this sort of thing happens (the hero finds the convenient object), that otherwise there would be no story, so it's sort of required for coincidences to happen to have a really good tale! -I thought this was a nice concise chapter with plenty of excitement and questions raised. It really starts getting to the heart of things. -Having read all seven chapters basically in one reading, here's a big suggestion, and feel free to ignore me: I really think the last two chapters, with some minor explanations added, can make a dramatic start to your story. Even though I've read the whole thing, I think I could have jumped in at chapter 5 and not lost a lot of information that couldn't have been added in a few sentences. What if you cut the first 4 chapters out entirely? -Also, all the chapters have been from Jorah's perspective, except for #2 and #3. The POV change is too short to catch the attention, especially having two different POVs. I would think either you could give Jorah a large chunk of time, or sprinkle in different POVs more often.

Here's my two cents...since I made some notes I feel like I might as well post them. Chapter 5: -Good menace on kicking Jorah out if he doesn't get the wine. It's about time he had a swift kick to get him going. my only concern is there's not a lot of reaction on Jorah's part. Does he just not believe it, or does it not matter if he gets kicked out of the group. I would think this would be a very scary threat for someone who has no other place to go and no means to support himself. -pg 31 apostrophe use: "lords" instead of "lord's" and "your" instead of "you're". Another instance on the next page. -I also thought there would be a hand holding the bag down! But the mysterious power is more interesting. I didn't have a problem with Jorah being able to unstick the others, whether it's his power, or something to do with the testing grounds. -spelling: pg 37, wandering instead of wondering, pg 42, squealed instead of squeeled. -Another mention of greenies, several of space, and Lance is wearing jeans...now I'm intrigued. I know there's been a lot of talk about descriptions, and I don't want to beat a dead horse, but it's starting to get in the way. You have attention-catching references, but we need a context to put them in. -Okay, so aside from a few minor grammar thingies, this was a great chapter! I'm intrigued, I want to know more about Jorah and his ability, whatever it is, and Lance and Dexter have some more personality. You have a race against time, mounting horror and tension of whether the hands will come out, the mystery of things sticking to the ground, and then a race against certain doom at the end! If you can capture this sort of feeling for the first 4 chapters, it will really perk up your writing.

Chapter3: -Ooh! New POV. I'm excited to see what Molly does vs. the whiny Jorah. -"She let her hand down to rest on her lap and tried not to sigh. She hadn’t necessarily expected the cat to still be here, since she was a couple hours earlier than her usual visit, but she had hoped." This sentence is confusing--the cat is still here, earlier? -The whole part with the cat is a little forced, but I like the description of character it provides for Molly. -"it's" vs. "its" (sorry, pet peeve). -Much better description of Kat by Molly than from Jorah. Even though the Jorah description needs to be edited, I still like the two contrasting viewpoints. -"spacewaste." Is this slang, or just something Jorah came up with? I think there is still some missing setting description here. I don't yet know whether to view this as a fantasy, or horror/victorian, or what. -This chapter is much better than the first two. You can easily see how Jorah seems to Molly. While it's a good setup chapter, my only complaint is that's the only thing that happens. You do get some good character facetime, but aside from that it's a fairly routine "let's divide up the loot." -For example, what is up with Molly's height? Now that's really bugging me. You hang a lantern on it in the first chapter, and then nothing about it, even when Molly is comparing herself to Kat. I assume the rest of these folks are "normal" height. Is Molly just a genetic dwarf? Is she something magical? Is she non-human? It's more background and setting that needs to come through your descriptions. Chapter 4: -Contrary to Asmodemon, I have to say, this chapter didn't hold my interest. Maybe it's because, as you say, you struggled with how big of a character Alberic is. There was a brief flicker of interest because it was a new POV, and then there was just discussion of criminal activity. The only thing that happened here was that we learn that some sort of police chief knows Molly's gang is around. It would be easy enough for it to be mentioned at some point that the guards might be on to them. -The character of Alberic is good, and competent, but he's just reacting. We don't have any reason why we should care about the robberies. Is the city that short on supplies? -To that point, now that you've introduced (I assume) the main characters, I've settled in, 20-ish pages in, and want to know more about the world, maybe from someone higher up in the hierarchy, like Alberic. What's the city like? Where is it? how is it ruled? I'm guessing Alberic works under the Lord, but is it a monarchy, oligarchy, democratic, tyrannical...? Are there factions of thieves? Do they bribe the guards with stolen goods? Not trying to write for you...just trying to give some idea of what I think is missing from the story so far.

So I started making notes while catching up on your story, and I figured I might as well post them. I know punctuation and word choice aren't a big issue now, but there were a couple things that caught my attention, so I noted those as well. Chaper 1: -I would agree that the intro is a bit vague/unfocussed in the first page. The writing is tense; it's a heist, but then Jorah drifts off into a daydream. I understand the character-building, but it ruins the tension of "will they get caught." Maybe a little less exposition? -you have "Well on his way" twice on the first page, in the same paragraph. -"He was only a little sad to have disappointed her" This seems a little at odds with pining over Violetta...does he want to get back to her or not? -Molly's height is "110" centimeters. Not sure what I think about this. From a U.S. reader perspective, I'm not sure whether she's tall or short at first glance (and I work in metric at my job...). Maybe mention where her head is in relation to Jorah, and leave out the exact measurement. (Ok, so I looked up the conversion later...she's really short. Now that I know, it gets my interest why a three and a half foot tall person is calling the shots. Definitely point this out so everyone can understand.) -Jer/Jerimiah and Jorah's names were too similar for me when just starting out a story. I could tell them apart, but had to think about it. -Overall, I think the resolution of the chapter is good, but the beginning (especially for the beginning of a book) needs some more tension to draw the reader into the fact that Jorah is basically caught goofing off when it could mean <whatever the punishment for thieving is>. Possibly shift him getting caught to the beginning and move some daydreaming/exposition later on in the chapter. It would be even worse if he were caught, and then Molly has to chide him AGAIN for drifting off while she was talking to him! Chapter 2: -Your use of "Little green men" feels strange to me. I thought this was fantasy and now I'm confused. I don't think the idea is foreign to fantasy, but maybe find a different set of words more similar to the rest of the setting, like "other places among the stars where strange beings lived." etc. It might be what Asmodemon mentions, that the setting is a little unfinished. -"He wondered how he had never come to this part of the city before?" I think this should be a period. -A page and a half of Jorah thinking about things is certainly too much for the beginning of the story, and starts to sound like fluff. -Pushing through underbrush in a city park? That's pretty overgrown. I understand this later on, but it pulled me out a little at the time. Again, explaining the setting better will let me see whether I should expect some rampant plant growth in the broken-down parts of the city. -A general sentence construct nitpick: watch out for stuff like, "before swinging down to the ground and helping push the attached bodies up from the interior of the ground." and even your first sentence, "Jorah never dreamed of spending his twenty-first birthday helping rob a warehouse." They just sound awkward. Also, "The houses decaying more as they approach a central spot, combined with the restrictive terrain next to a wide-open clearing; he’d stumbled on one of the testing grounds." I think it's the "ing" that's getting to me. For example, what if you said, "The houses decayed as they approached the center. That and the restrictive terrain near a clearing meant he'd stumbled on one of the testing grounds." -I like the testing grounds--it put some much needed tension into the story. However, where is Jorah and how did he get separated from the rest of the group with his loot in this chapter? Is he going home? -"Which was worse, though — robberies, or monsters." This does need a question mark... -There's a lot of wishy washy pining over Kat/Violetta when Jorah's just been chased by monsters. I would be thinking about the monsters at a time like this. -Jorah stood around counting waving monster arms? If there were that much time, I would be like, these things seem pretty slow, I'll just run and get my bag, thank you. I think this is another spot where toning down the explanation will help. -Again, good resolution to the chapter. I like the last zing of getting startled by an innocent bystander--my heart actually jumped! I think the biggest thing to do is to cut out the excess thought, show, don't tell, and fix some of the awkward wording, like I mentioned above. -I think Jorah has a lot of room to grow. He does seem whiny and wishy-washy, but if you focus on accentuating his competencies while showing the whiny-ness getting smaller, as the story progresses, I think Jorah can become a great character. I like the story so far! I'm excited to read more, and I'll post as I catch up to the most recent chapter.

So at the risk of being the presumptuous new member, can I submit something for the week of the 18th? I have a week of vacation coming up, so I hope to get a lot of reading and writing done. I’d like to submit the first 4000 words of my latest story (It's in journal format, not chapter). In brief, it’s a Y.A. time travel tale about a boy who is stuck in a time machine with his mother, visiting influential people of the past. The boy grows up, and his point of view shifts on how such power should be handled. I thought with the recent W.E. episode on time travel, it was sort of apropos. Thanks!

Hello all! Mandamon here. I just joined Reading Excuses today. I've been listening to Writing Excuses for about two years now, and I've been amazed at how it's shed new light on my writing. Before that, I had written a 200,000 word space opera, submitted it to Amazon’s Breakthrough contest, and not even gotten past the first round. So after finding W.E., I put my writing on hold for about 6 months and took a crash course. I listened to about 3-4 episodes a day, transcribed thoughts and insights, and even put together a WikidPad encyclopedia linking different topics (only updated to season 5, sadly). Afterwards, I wrote a 60,000 word novella to help my character building, and then a 70,000 word young adult time travel story for NaNoWriMo last year (which got to round 2 in the Amazon Breakthrough contest!). I think my writing has gotten better, but I really need some good critique, especially since submitting the last story to some agents and getting back a consistent “It didn’t draw me in, but maybe someone else will like it.” Especially after the recent W.E. episode on time travel, I know my book needs some help! Let see…I’m 31, I’m a mechanical engineer, I teach karate, and I write, garden, and game in my spare time (not necessarily in that order). Writers I like: Many. But my top favorites (books I stop reading other books for) are probably Terry Pratchett, Jim Butcher, Scott Westerfeld, Charles Stross, Robert Jordan, and some guy called Brandon Sanderson. I’ve already looked over the forum, and it looks like some great books are in process. I’m looking forward to sharpening my critiquing and getting some good critique back from others. See you around!