Torchwood17

For me it's, Amaram, just the way he goes from being Kaladin's idol and picture of a "true lighteyes" to how it's shown he's an absolute trash human being. Then that change is shown even more as he continues to compromise what he was shown to stand for, eventually betraying even Dalinar and siding with Odium. The best shock villain for me in cosmere was Bluefingers, I didn't see his betrayal coming at all and when he reveals his true nature I was shocked. Honorable mention is the Set and specifically Edwarn Ladrian. The way they go about so sneaky, and almost while being gentlemanly yet evil and schemers is intriguing. I'm interested to see if the Set stays organized and shows up again in Era 3. That'd be cool, or if they figure out world-hopping and meet up with the Silverlight or the Ghostbloods

My list is pretty similar, just the placements seem different mostly. But of course Hoid is #1, I wonder how many Cosmere readers don't place him at the top of the wittiest character list 1. Hoid 2. Wayne 3. Lightsong 4. Shallan 5. Sarene 6. Nightblood 7. Steris 8. Breeze 9. Jasnah 10. Kelsier

It's probably a combination of all the aforementioned reasons shards are missing. Some were misplaced and covered with crem, some are in the hands of various secret organizations, some are in the hands of individuals who keep the fact they have them hidden, like the assassin Jasnah talks to in her prelude, and there likely is a secret stash, maybe even two out there with a lot of shards. @The Traveler this is not really related to this thread, but it's likely the Windrunners and Skybreakers meant for the massacre we see in Dalinars vision to take place because that was what forced their oaths to be broken. There was a great thread I read where it went really into depth on that, but I can't remember what it was named. My two cents, I think the Shin likely have collected a bunch of them via their Stone Shamans. Szeth was convinced when he was killed, his Honorblade would be would be collected by the Stone Shamans which to me says they have more powers than normal. After all, whoever kills the Assassin in White surely would have been decently powerful, yet Szeth is just like, yeah, they'll get the Honorblade when I'm dead, no problem. That's where I think the majority of the shards are, but some are sprinkled throughout the rest of Roshar in all kinds of situations. Who knows, maybe some in Urithiru, that tower is huge and we likely haven't discovered all of it's secrets yet. Where better to hide shardblades than the abandoned home of the ancient Knight Radiants?

Further credit to his name, hasn't he managed to be in every major Kholin engagement and survived to this date?

It seems like the main question of this discussion is, what amount of "badness" makes Dalinar irredeemable? I don't really have more to add on the discussion of Dalinar as my personal beliefs say the direction a person's life is at the present is infinitely more important than what they did in the past which to me says Dalinar is well on his way to becoming that better man he's wanted to be. Not to de-rail the thread, but it seems natural if we are asking if Dalinar's actions at the Rift are irredeemable, what about Szeths's as the Assassin in White? He killed countless of world leaders, caused a civil war that devastated Jah Keved, and become the living embodiement of terrorism on Roshar. Plus I'm sure there's more that I've just neglected to mention So is what Szeth done made him irredeemable? PS: This is the type of discussion here on the 17thshard that's the reason I'm here so way to start it

1. When Taln regains some lucidity and Ash is apologizing for all the Heralds betraying and abandoning him. Yet he's like, no it's amazing, we gave them the time they needed. Yeah it's a somewhat happy moment too, but to me that is one of the saddest cosmere moments I read. I may or may not have had tears in works when I read his first coherent words. 2. When Elend dies after preventing Ruin from gaining the atium and this was made even worse by the fact that Vin had to watch her husband die and could do nothing about it. Then as if that wasn't all enough, Elend is killed by an old friend and former/kind of current ally in Marsh. Elend was always one of my favorite characters and watching him die was brutal. Edit: Oops, sorry didn't mean to double post the same comment.

I'd say the AP tests I took in high school. I thought I was so smart so I signed up and took like every AP class (basically college classes in HS) I could, thought I would pass all the tests, I failed the majority of them cause I didn't really study properly. Made me realize I couldn't just breeze through life but that I need to study and actually put the time in to learn knowledge and skills, the memory of those failures largely motivated me to get through college and that anything worth doing was worth putting some effort in for.

We might not have seen many uses of silver because in most of the Cosmere books; Mistborn, Stormlight, Elantris, and Warbreaker there hasn't been very much corrupted investiture present. So it makes sense the people don't value it highly because they really don't know it's capabilities and even if they did, there's not a huge need for it at the moment. I do think as we see more shards interacting with one another and as worldhopping becomes more common and the various magic systems coming into contact, we'll see the value of silver spike. On the matter of corrupt vs co-opting investiture, it seems like corrupted investiture is anytime one shard uses a magic system that is normally fueled by the power of another shard/shard's. Corrupted investiture is not when two shards willing choose to work together. For example the spren of Roshar who are part of Cultivation and part of Honor are not corrupted, but any spren that has been "infected" (not sure of a better word) by Odium. So this means the investiture that was originally aligned with Cultivation and Honor has been forcefully taken away and is currently coming from Odium. Co-opted seems to be essentially the same thing as corrupted here, though that may not be true.

I like that idea Notshur, I can't think of any evidence that supports it, but I also can't think of any evidence that would say otherwise. We probably just don't have enough instances of combating co-opted investiture. Who knows, likely as the Cosmere comes more and more together we'll find out this idea of Silver being an anti-co-opted metal is completely off base, but it seems a reasonable theory. Edit: Do we know, like have a WOB on whether the Shades on Threnody are corrupted investiture? I haven't read that story in forever so I can't remember

I can see your point of Lopen being used by Sanderson for some foreshadowing, I don't think Lopen is some form of shard or super power. I think he's just a weird dude with a very strange perspective of the world. But then again that may be wrong, but reasons I don't think he's some sort of higher being 1. He's bonded a spren of his own, I don't think a higher being could do that, only normal humans with the proper breaks on their spirit web 2. While Lopen is very strange to Alethi and our own standards, from the screen time we've got of other Herdazians, he actually doesn't seem too far out there. 3. You'd think with him being around Dalinar/the Stormfather, if Lopen was some crazy power being wouldn't the Stormfather probably have recognized him and said something about it to Dalinar? It's a fun theory, but I doubt it. Also Rock isn't Herdazian, he's a Horneater, two very different cultures/races on Roshar

Weren't the guards from the alien space station in Skyward described as being like crabs? Did Sanderson in that quote say it was something from the Cosmere?

Radical, Flame, or Nagol though I'd love to use Windrunner, but that seems a bit cliche on this forum.

Yes, that moment when Kaladin steps up to save the other bridgemen despite everything being against him, that was such a powerful scene. The way he cares just makes it so you can't help but be moved by it. At least for me.

When Kaladin saves Dalinar from Szeth in all of his Radiant awesomeness. Like I totally thought the Alethi army was about to get smashed by that and the loss of all their generals and whatnot, then boom the hero arrived literally glowing white. Also when Roaden restores AonDor, that was pretty epic.

Yeah it seems like the Parshendi were created by Adonalsium, especially since they're whole race is so tied to the highstorms and we know the highstorms were originally of Adonalsium. Not sure where the reference for that is but I'm at work so can't really take the time to find it right now.

Not that we have any information on this but I feel like the Bondsmiths are supposed to embody the ideas of the different cultures. The Stormfather is very extreme and won't be stopped in any way. I wonder if the other two siblings will need to be bonded to someone from another society. Like if the Nightwatcher is a the 2nd bondsmith spren, maybe a Shin would need to bond with her as shin want to grow things, they regard farmers higher than anything else so maybe their mindset fits the most with her. No clue about the 3rd sibling though

It could also be any number of the secret organizations out there. We've already seen how the Diagramist's had access to hidden shards somehow. Maybe the Sons of Honor or the Ghostbloods have been getting them as well? That wouldn't account for thousands of blades but if the figures more in the hundreds, who knows how many organizations are hiding shards away.

We know that the highstorms and spren did predate the arrival of Honor, Cultivation and Odium to Roshar so it'd make sense that the more powerful ones at one time were tied or connected to Adonalsium somehow. Do you think the Stormfather would be a spren created by Adonalsium or did he form because of the thoughts of Adonalsium, like how Syl describes some spren were imagined by humans and some by the listeners.

I really like this theory, cause if Dalinar is simply becoming Honor 2.0, why wouldn't Odium be convinced he could win again. He's done it once, he can do it again. Also a part that kind a supports the idea that this is Adonalsium is right before Dalinar unites the three realms, when the gloryspren are flocking to him it says. "Beyond it, Odium stumbled back. So small, Dalinar thought. Has he always looked that small?" OB p.1136 If Dalinar was merely being influenced why would one shard think the other shard was small? Especially when Odium clearly has the power to kill Honor as he's already done it. I think the reason Odium seems small is Dalinar is somehow tapping into the power/influence of Adonalsium. Maybe, there could be something we're not seeing here though

I wonder if spren settle cities near cultures that mimic what they focus on. Like are the Honorspren cities near cultures that focus on doing what is right. Do the cultivationspren have their cities near human societies that are more concerned with growing and building than with war? Since we don't know what spren inhabit which cities that's difficult to prove but its an idea I had while re-reading some of the sections while they're in Shadesmar

A few of my favorite Passionate, with an intense smoldering resolve. A leashed anger that he used, because he had dominated it. And a certain tempting arrogance. Not the haughty pride of a highlord, instead, the secure, stable sense of determination that whispered that no matter who you were- or what you did-you could not hurt him. Could not change him. He was. Like the wind and rocks were. The purpose of a storyteller is not to tell you how to think but to give you questions to think upon. Definitely not—you optimists just can't understand that a depressed person doesn't want you to try and cheer them up. It makes us sick.

ScavellTane, isn't your first quote from Dalinars flashback when he takes Rathalas the first time and he confronts Tanalan the younger. When the little boy is trying to defend his father in the secret hideaway? I might be mistaken so I'll have to go back and check once I get home

Also, by the end of Warbreaker its pretty clear that Susebron and Siri have some feelings for each other so why would Susebron go and marry Vivenna?