Bigmikey357

In the Szeth example he cut a section of a fortress wall away and had to lash that portion enough to counter the weight of the surrounding stone including the stone weighing down from above. This is an extreme example of what I had in mind. If that stone were free it wouldn't have taken as many lashings to move it. I'm thinking a rock someone could pick up by hand. Dalinar threw a fist-sized rock with enough force to destroy the function of a massive machine from a good distance away. Bullet speed may be an exaggeration, but I don't feel it's much of one. If a normal human can throw a baseball 100mph or more, how much faster could someone throw one if they were wearing Shardplate? A baseball thrown at the fastest speed one could achieve on Earth is already difficult to track by eye. Soulcasting smoke is one of the ways I figured Jasnah could use to counter this ploy. Soulcast a smokescreen and use transpotation to move around within it. She can use her CR sight so her smokescreen wouldn't hinder her. What are the mechanics of the Transportation surge? A person moves through the CR by creating a mini-perpendicularity. I would argue that while Syl or others may not always be able to see other cognitive beings in the Physical Realm, they would be able to see an opening into their home realm. All higher spren likely have this ability. Willshapers, Elsecallers and Lightweavers have the ability imparted upon them via the Nahel bond. Syl will see a Perpendicularity even if she cannot see Ivory. And she's got enough consciousness to recognize what she sees and can warn Kaladin whenever one forms. I haven't disregarded Kaladin's Stormlight usage by the way. I just don't think that any of his Stormlight usage costs as much as Jasnah's. Take lashing vs Soulcasting. Everytime someone soulcasts they must overcome the initial Investiture of the object. Doesn't matter if it's a rock or a person, they're basically using their power uphill. Lashing an object, at least the gravity ones, doesn't effect the object, only redirects the forces acting upon it. It probably takes more Stormlight to lash something heavy than something light but essentially it's still a redirect. Overcoming the initial Investiture isn't necessary. What that means to me is that every time Jasnah soulcasts something she burns off more of her Stormlight than a comparative action from Kaladin. If neither go into battle with a mind for Stormlight conservation Jasnah will run out faster. If Kaladin burns like crazy and Jasnah conserves Kaladin lasts longer than if the roles were reversed. If Kaladin conserves and Jasnah burns like crazy, Kaladin dies cause Jasnah has wiped him.

I wasn't thinking about the 'wind sense'. Syl is of CR origin. She may not be able to impart that vision onto Kaladin like Ivory does for Jasnah but she can see enough to maybe predict where Jasnah is reforming a mini-perpendicularity. This wouldn't be unique to Kaladin by the way. I think all Radiants highly progressed enough could do the same. Roshar is rocky as ever a planet as there is. Kaladin has a weapon that treats rock like air. He'd be wearing Shardplate and could just pulverize a rock face and make rocks that way. And it's not limited to rocks. With a lashing anything he can reach becomes a weapon. Controlling the trajectory of the weapons in question is irrelevant. As long as there's a reasonable chance it will connect Jasnah has to account for it. Sure she can dodge if he threw one weapon at a time. What if he threw a knife from each hand, one high and one low, applying a triple lashing to the first knife and one to the second? Say he's applied a reverse lashing to account for any return fire from Jasnah? Hell, Kaladin could pick up a handful of rocks, fly up 20 feet or so, and start chucking them with or without lashings. Jasnah in Shardplate may be able to ignore some of the objects launched and dodge others she may see as non-threatening, but she cannot be sure which will be which. Look at Dalinar in the flashback chapter, the one where he's taking out catapults on the heights. In regular, dead Shardplate he's destroying catapults 40 feet or more away by chucking fist-sized rocks at them. This ain't slow-pitch. Now apply this to Kaladin. Add a multiplier for Radiancy, a multiplier for living Shardplate, and another multiplier for however many lashings Kaladin can apply to any object and those projectiles are flying nearly as fast as bullets. Can Jasnah dodge a bullet in Shardplate? How many hits can she take before sections break? How fast can she soulcast the projectile away or make a wall to block them? If Kaladin is smart he won't leave her much time. Like I said, there are ways to make her use Stormlight via Soulcasting or Transportation. Now, all this is assuming Jasnah's soulcast range isn't something ridiculous, my definition being anything over 10 feet away from her.

Illumination is quieter. Soulcasting isn't. That's why Hoid had to roll out the aluminum siding so that the Wall Guard in Kholinar could feed themselves when the Fused laid siege. What if he lashes something too large to dodge? Or 5 or 20 little objects at slightly different trajectories? There are ways to do it that'll force her to Soulcast, even if it's just a wall to block incoming objects. Again I'm only proposing a way for Kaladin to win against the ridiculously powerful surges Jasnah can bring to the table. We know that the powers aren't balanced and that some have better applications in some situations than others. I've stated that Jasnah wins a fight with Kaladin more times than she loses, particularly if they're of equal Oaths and start off with the same amount of Stormlight. I'm just saying not to count out Kaladin so easily. He's nearly as smart, has more combat experience and is younger than Jasnah. This is like the Cosmere Battle Royal post where people argued TLR would destroy everything in an eyeblink without taking into account some of the other overpowered participants, the Heralds restored in particular.

Kelek gets worshipped as the father of storms in some places so Kelek's breath is a relevant use of a curse. Can't think of any others at present but it's possible this will be on my mind all day

1. If he's not constantly in flight it's not going to burn off as fast. 2. If he's a full 5 Radiant he burns more efficiently. Of course the same applies to Jasnah. 3. If he's throwing and lashing a barrage of knives and rocks and debris at Jasnah it forces her to use up her Stormlight, which costs more for her to use per surge, on defense. Why does it cost more for Jas? Overcoming the innate Investiture of the objects she soulcasts. It costs less to direct an object than it does to change it to something else.

This may sound like I'm sidestepping the question but in terms of Kaladin fighting I never pictured him lashing someone directly. It's obviously something that can be done but that seems more Szeth with his akido-like martial arts. In a fight he may make the ground sticky or if they're fighting on a platform he might try to collapse it. Kaladin's best bet is to run Jasnah out of Stormlight, similar to the best way to kill Mistborn burning Atium is to make them use it up. How to do this? Throw things at her from distance. Jasnah can soulcast at range but it can't be more than a few feet. Kaladin can lash rocks at her just outside her range. He can maintain distance because he's faster than her. Jasnah either will have to dodge or soulcast them away. Any attempt at Transportation gets the Syl warning system. That's the only feasible way Kaladin beats Jasnah. Outmaneuver until she runs dry the use his superior fighting abilities to close the deal.

@Pathfinder I actually agree with you. Jasnah has the edge. I think at this point we're arguing frequency rather than capabilities. As long as Jasnah has Stormlight she can beat Kaladin in a stand-up fight between Radiants. I would probably say if they had the same fight 10 times she'd probably win 7. You and others probably would say at least 9 of 10. By the way, a fully Oath Kaladin in a fight is going to be one of the most heavily Invested beings in the Cosmere. If he's fighting there's no way he's not holding Stormlight. And he's not going to be burning through Stormlight as quickly. His surges do not have to overcome enrmy Investiture to do what he wants. Meanwhile every move Jasnah makes on the Soulcasting side pushes against the innate Investiture of the object being cast. In a prolonged fight that resistance adds up.

Something that you confirm with your in-depth analysis and something I've been arguing for awhile is that Jasnah is easily misunderstood both in story and by readers. By readers because most of what we get comes from Shallan's POV, and she's got a serious girl-crush on her mentor. On the few times we get into her head we actually get to see her vulnerable. In the first 2 books there's very few times where we see that vulnerability, we get more in OB but not much. In the narrative she's misunderstood because she projects strength so well. The lesson she give Shallan on the deck of Wind's Pleasure is how she lives her life. She isn't letting many people in, possibly because she's been hurt by those she's loved previously. Add to the fact of her heresy and the assumptions she has to deal with as a result of those beliefs and nobody is really probing beneath the surface. The advantage in that is love or hate her, she gives no one an opportunity to disregard or disrespect her. She's a force in the world with or without Surges.

And turtles all the way down....

Oh I think Shallan Kaladin would be great narrative. It would be a beautiful disaster. But that's my opinion. Not trying to reignite the great Shipping War of SA.

Crap I meant Shadolin. You know, it took me 3 times looking at the post before I realized. And the funny thing is I support Shallan and Adolin over a Kaladin match.

Syl is more mature in CR where she has the access to all her experience. She's less aware in the PR but gains awareness as Kal progresses in Ideals. We see the same with Pattern as Shallan reestablishes her bond. As far as her childishness, I see at least some of that as her natural personality.

From what we've seen, Elsecalling is local, local in this case meaning in-system. One cannot yet blink from Roshar to Sel though it is probably possible to blink from Ashyn to Braize. The Oathgates look as though they are terminals. Terminals mean someone must build at both ends. Since it seems like Surgebinding is limited to Roshar then a different Cosmere planet will have to figure out a local method that approximately does the Transportation surge. Sel has something close I believe but it's individual only and also localized. Plus, one must consider how well those systems play with others. Will Rosharan Transportation be compatible with the Selish version? What other methods have we seen for moving between worlds other than using Perpendicularities? Lastly, involving Investiture, most places are not like Roshar where magic fuel flows like a broken tap. In most places gathering Investiture is hard. So discovering a method for Elsecalling using a different magic system, then gathering enough free Investiture to build a terminus and keep it running. I guess you're going to have to build on top of a Perpendicularity to harness the power. But if the Well of Ascension has taught us anything, it's that those Shardpools are finite resources. An interplanetary Elsecaller network is going to drain the pool much faster if it's being used for commercial and freight purposes. Both methods have their uses. I'm quite sure Worldhopping ain't going away when FTL spaceflight comes online. And if spaceflight opens up other planets for colonization we are likely to see the CR expand right alongside it.

I didn't even think of the cargo and interstellar trade applications. Good point @Calderis.

As I read these comments I've come down to two routes Kelsier could go based off one event. Lightweaver or an Odium Knight based on the events that led him to eventually Snap, the Mare incident. His struggle with that would produce some of his most powerful lies; a Cryptic would definitely be drawn to him in my opinion. The pain of that possible betrayal lands him on Odium's watchlist. And Kel as Odium's Champion should scare any Cosmere aware person. Point in the Lightweaver column, that smile. He hides everything behind that smile. Point to Odium, the hatred towards all nobility.

Another reason. Since there's only 16 Shards there's a very limited number of Perpendicularities to choose from. Really limited real estate options. Expansion due to technology increases their options exponentially, even if only a fraction of the worlds they visit are able to support life. And they could establish a civilization not overtly dependent on the whims of a Shardic entity who one, may or may not have their best interests at heart or two, attracts other Shardic entities hell bent on destroying them. For example, if Roshar developed spaceflight I could see a host of people for whom a life without Odium gunning for them would be an attractive prospect.

What are the Intents of the last 6 Shards?

For what it's worth, I can see Kaladin maybe graduating to take up a Bondsmith position if that's possible. I don't see him reaching Ascension. At this point in the story it's Dalinar or nobody.

And can u imagine how Windle reacts to a grown-up Lyft snarking her way through a romantic encounter? Hilarious and somewhat icky by turns.

Because we know that the metal percentages have to be exact in order to work allomantically. And we don't know the allomantically viable percentages for all the metals. Or even if those percentages have changed from Era 1 to Era 2.

I always get the image in my mind of Syl sitting on the top of the headboard alternately cheering and giving helpful advice.

Or in Odium's words, the Other One.

With the Shalladin Marriage, or Dalinavani we just may get to find out in book 4.

I think the Tenacity Shard WOB could be a stand-in for Ambition. We know Threnody is where the shattered Ambition ended up, and it does seem particularly easy to become a Cognitive Shadow there. Also, tenacity is often a key component for ambitious people.

Tentative book title. It may change in future.