The Hemalurgic Table of Metals!

Will we have a podcast on the Hemalurgy Table? Lord Ruler, we will, do not worry. This is spicy!

At least in this context, "powers" clearly refers to the powers granted by individual Allomantic or Feruchemical metals. "Abilities" is much more interesting to me - are we looking at mundane ones, like the ability to juggle, or is it spicier than that, with things like the ability to perform Allomancy? 

Ain't it cool. I'm confident Destiny is fortune and its a way more accurate word for what we know about it. I think abilities are stuff like memory and intelligence (from copper)? More 'core' than juggling or skill but less magical. And copper is interesting to me - with the questions we've had about compounding copper perhaps it does more feruchemically than just memory. 

I feel like ability might refer to all variants of hemalurgy, powers and non-powers. So basically lerasium would steal the entirety of a person to add to another person, which sounds both very interesting and very dangerous and could potentially lead to interesting situations. What if you spiked yourself into lerasium then placed it in someone else? How much of that person would now be you? Or if you dumped it into a body without a mind, would it effectively be binding your mind into a new body? Lots of fun there.

Nicrosil is interesting and I think is an important clue. Up to now I've held the thought that the "Investiture" of nicrosil feruchemy has always referred to ability to use manifestations of investiture (powers across all magic systems), in other words, limited to only that part of the innate investiture (soul). However, one main counter thought has been that it refers to the entirety of the soul, ergo anything that hemalurgy could steal. However, given now that nicrosil hemalurgy "steal Investiture," if Investiture is referring to the entirety of the soul and everything that hemalurgy can steal, then that means that nicrosil hemalurgy can steal anything that any other spike can steal, which seems a bit much and to me makes this idea feel less likely. At the same time, I think it does cast some shadow on my idea since my idea of what "Investiture" means that it includes the abilities of steel, pewter, brass, bronze, cadmium, bendalloy, gold, and electrum plus others, plus "powers" seems to be more directly referring to what I was defining "Investiture" as. Hopefully Brandon has some answers for us soon.

The smaller distinction of any (Atium) vs. all (Lerasium) is also interesting, confirming a few theories that Lerasium can likely steal more than a single power from someone at a time.

1 minute ago, Voidus said:

The smaller distinction of any (Atium) vs. all (Lerasium) is also interesting, confirming a few theories that Lerasium can likely steal more than a single power from someone at a time.

Not even powers, lerasium can probably steal all attributes a person possesses at the same time and pass it on to a new recipient.

1 minute ago, Spoolofwhool said:

Not even powers, lerasium can probably steal all attributes a person possesses at the same time and pass it on to a new recipient.

Does this mean that a Lerasium spike is potentially more dangerous to Hoid than Nightblood?

Just now, Use the Falchion said:

Does this mean that a Lerasium spike is potentially more dangerous to Hoid than Nightblood?

I mean, hemalurgy in general is probably pretty dangerous to Hoid, but no. Nightblood is probably still more dangerous since it's irreversible annihilation while in theory you can survive and recover from a spiking.

Oh no. It's what I feared. More of the non-canon, MAG crap.

Because there's no such thing as Hybrid Feruchemical powers.

I weep.

4 minutes ago, Oversleep said:

Oh no. It's what I feared. More of the non-canon, MAG crap.

Because there's no such thing as Hybrid Feruchemical powers.

I weep.

Hybrid feruchemical powers has been the canon name since the release of the Feruchemy table no? It's officially on Brandon's site.

Just now, Spoolofwhool said:

Hybrid feruchemical powers has been the canon name since the release of the Feruchemy table.

Just because it was in the table does not mean it was canon. Brandon has said that Feruchemy has 8 Physical metals. On top of that, BoM throws out Feruchemy table out of the window, so I'm not sure what's your point.

Just now, Oversleep said:

Just because it was in the table does not mean it was canon. Brandon has said that Feruchemy has 8 Physical metals. On top of that, BoM throws out Feruchemy table out of the window, so I'm not sure what's your point.

These tables are as canon as they can be as of Era 1. What's the issue here?

Just now, Oversleep said:

Just because it was in the table does not mean it was canon. Brandon has said that Feruchemy has 8 Physical metals. On top of that, BoM throws out Feruchemy table out of the window, so I'm not sure what's your point.

My point is that I didn't think there was a problem since I thought that the Hybrid category had been made canon.

I do believe Era 2 wise Hybrid metal is correct as the Feruchemy quadrant name, superceding the eight "physical" metal things.

How does BoM throw out the Feruchemy table?

The Dark Alley is commandeering this copy of the table. Thank you and good day.

6 minutes ago, Chaos said:

How does BoM throw out the Feruchemy table?

Anything related to how medallions work, IIRC.

I don't really think that invalidates the table at all, it's just additional complexity.

be still my beating heart, it's time to THEORIZE ABOUT ALL THE NUTS STUFF WE CAN DO WITH THIS

1 hour ago, Spoolofwhool said:

I mean, hemalurgy in general is probably pretty dangerous to Hoid, but no. Nightblood is probably still more dangerous since it's irreversible annihilation while in theory you can survive and recover from a spiking.

Good point thanks!

Might steal destiny.

Ok, he's just messing with us now .

But I find the 'might' so confusing. We know that this isn't some canonical mistake by the in world table makers because otherwise they wouldn't know what a lerasium spike would do anyway, so we have to assume this a perfect table, which means 'might' is true. What does this mean? Does it mean there's a chance of failure when using the spike?

This is so cool! I've been looking forward to seeing how all the metals work.

There's also the "Must be refined" line for Atium breathing some life back into the "Atium from the pits is an alloy" theory.

8 hours ago, I think I am here. said:

Might steal destiny.

Ok, he's just messing with us now .

But I find the 'might' so confusing. We know that this isn't some canonical mistake by the in world table makers because otherwise they wouldn't know what a lerasium spike would do anyway, so we have to assume this a perfect table, which means 'might' is true. What does this mean? Does it mean there's a chance of failure when using the spike?

It could just be that the actual effect is less clear. I mean if you did spike someones destiny into yourself how would you be able to tell? Whereas all abilities being spiked into you would be pretty obvious even though Lerasium itself is far rarer.

Another interesting point for me at least is that destiny isn't capitalized here, unlike Identity, Connection, Fortune.

1 hour ago, Voidus said:

It could just be that the actual effect is less clear. I mean if you did spike someones destiny into yourself how would you be able to tell? Whereas all abilities being spiked into you would be pretty obvious even though Lerasium itself is far rarer.

Another interesting point for me at least is that destiny isn't capitalized here, unlike Identity, Connection, Fortune.

That makes sense, unless you could see into the future you wouldn’t be able to know whether you’d actually stolen someone’s destiny.

The idea of destiny and how you can Spike it is really interesting to me. If somebody had spiked the destiny out of Sazed and put it in themselves, would they have become the Hero of Ages?

2 minutes ago, I think I am here. said:

That makes sense, unless you could see into the future you wouldn’t be able to know whether you’d actually stolen someone’s destiny.

The idea of destiny and how you can’t Spike it is really interesting to me. If somebody had spiked the destiny out of Sazed and put it in themselves, would they have become the Hero of Ages?

See the weird part is that we know that seeing the future in the cosmere isn't completely reliable, especially the further into the future you go you can only see possibilities, not a single predefined destiny.
So does Chromium steal simply your possible futures? Or a single possible future? Or does it have access to something more reliable than Shardic future sight?