How would you break up episodes for a Stormlight TV Show?

[kientha]

With Fantasy TV being the hip new thing, I've been thinking about how episodes for a potential Stormlight Archive TV show could go. Here are my rough musings of the different options:

One viewpoint/episode: Each episode would follow a specific main character for a good chunk of their story. For example, one episode would follow Kaladin from being in the slave wagon to his choosing not to kill himself by jumping in to the chasm. The next would follow Shallan from the Queen's Pleasure to Jasnah's ethics murder lesson and so on. When POV characters were together, it would still focus on the actions of one character if they split off from one another (Adolin & Dalinar for example) and maybe have the finale of a series follow multiple view points to deal with events like the end of Oathbringer. 

Chronological: Events follow chronologically jumping between multiple characters an episode. This would resemble the books closely with the sequence of events following roughly those of the POV chapters with less important events cut out for time reasons. 

Something in the middle: An episode would focus on a particular POV character but will occasionally cut away to other characters. For example, Kaladin could be the focus of 3/4 of the episode but could have snippets of Shallan and Dalinar to break up scenes. 

I'm also curious how the flashbacks could be handled. Should it be like the books where one series follows one characters backstory or should multiple characters backstories be in each series. The story as written obviously works better with each characters backstory playing an important part to the flashback characters plot but I'm sure it could be adapted so that you get some backstory of the other characters in earlier seasons as that might lend itself better to TV even if each season focuses closer on one character to match up with the plot. 

I'm currently feeling one viewpoint/episode with flashbacks sticking to the way they are in the books. What I don't have an idea for is how to present the notes at the start of each chapter like the last words of the dying from TWoK

[Karger he/him]

12 minutes ago, kientha said:

Chronological: Events follow chronologically jumping between multiple characters an episode. This would resemble the books closely with the sequence of events following roughly those of the POV chapters with less important events cut out for time reasons. 

Honestly I think this one is the best.  Stormlight Archive is generally to dense for anything else.

[Jofwu he/him]

Technically, The Way of Kings isn't really chronological. Shallan's initial chapters all take place a few months before Kaladin reaches the Shattered Plains. And Dalinar's initial chapters don't happen until sometime during Part 3 for Kaladin, I think. See timeline linked in my signature.

But that's just being nitpicky.

Yes, I agree that it would be best to jump around between characters in a TV show.

[Nathrangking he/him]

32 minutes ago, kientha said:

With Fantasy TV being the hip new thing, I've been thinking about how episodes for a potential Stormlight Archive TV show could go. Here are my rough musings of the different options:

One viewpoint/episode: Each episode would follow a specific main character for a good chunk of their story. For example, one episode would follow Kaladin from being in the slave wagon to his choosing not to kill himself by jumping in to the chasm. The next would follow Shallan from the Queen's Pleasure to Jasnah's ethics murder lesson and so on. When POV characters were together, it would still focus on the actions of one character if they split off from one another (Adolin & Dalinar for example) and maybe have the finale of a series follow multiple view points to deal with events like the end of Oathbringer. 

Chronological: Events follow chronologically jumping between multiple characters an episode. This would resemble the books closely with the sequence of events following roughly those of the POV chapters with less important events cut out for time reasons. 

Something in the middle: An episode would focus on a particular POV character but will occasionally cut away to other characters. For example, Kaladin could be the focus of 3/4 of the episode but could have snippets of Shallan and Dalinar to break up scenes. 

I'm also curious how the flashbacks could be handled. Should it be like the books where one series follows one characters backstory or should multiple characters backstories be in each series. The story as written obviously works better with each characters backstory playing an important part to the flashback characters plot but I'm sure it could be adapted so that you get some backstory of the other characters in earlier seasons as that might lend itself better to TV even if each season focuses closer on one character to match up with the plot. 

I'm currently feeling one viewpoint/episode with flashbacks sticking to the way they are in the books. What I don't have an idea for is how to present the notes at the start of each chapter like the last words of the dying from TWoK

Things like the interludes may need to be shorts.

[Use the Falchion]

1 hour ago, kientha said:

With Fantasy TV being the hip new thing, I've been thinking about how episodes for a potential Stormlight Archive TV show could go. Here are my rough musings of the different options:

One viewpoint/episode: Each episode would follow a specific main character for a good chunk of their story. For example, one episode would follow Kaladin from being in the slave wagon to his choosing not to kill himself by jumping in to the chasm. The next would follow Shallan from the Queen's Pleasure to Jasnah's ethics murder lesson and so on. When POV characters were together, it would still focus on the actions of one character if they split off from one another (Adolin & Dalinar for example) and maybe have the finale of a series follow multiple view points to deal with events like the end of Oathbringer. 

Chronological: Events follow chronologically jumping between multiple characters an episode. This would resemble the books closely with the sequence of events following roughly those of the POV chapters with less important events cut out for time reasons. 

Something in the middle: An episode would focus on a particular POV character but will occasionally cut away to other characters. For example, Kaladin could be the focus of 3/4 of the episode but could have snippets of Shallan and Dalinar to break up scenes. 

I'm also curious how the flashbacks could be handled. Should it be like the books where one series follows one characters backstory or should multiple characters backstories be in each series. The story as written obviously works better with each characters backstory playing an important part to the flashback characters plot but I'm sure it could be adapted so that you get some backstory of the other characters in earlier seasons as that might lend itself better to TV even if each season focuses closer on one character to match up with the plot. 

I'm currently feeling one viewpoint/episode with flashbacks sticking to the way they are in the books. What I don't have an idea for is how to present the notes at the start of each chapter like the last words of the dying from TWoK

I should note that in my mind, Stormlight is an anime (I even have the intros and outros!) so I'm viewing the question through that lens.

In my mind it's told how they are in the books, with one or two chapters per episode (the pilot can be extra long to cover most of the characters and get a feel for what's going on). Think of it like The Dragon Prince. There are three main groups in the show (the Dragaang, the Brodigies, and Viren), each getting more or less time depending on what the story needs. Game of Thrones was similar at first, with 4 main branches: Ned in King's Landing, Jon at the wall, Catelyn making her way down to King's Landing, and Dany on the other side of the world. Certain characters pop in and out of the groups dependent on the story, but following the groups in different settings keeps the story pretty straightforward. In terms of flashbacks...maybe link those to when the Kaladin section of the story isn't normally needed. Like, you usually have a Shallan/Kaladin or Shallan/Kaladin/Dalinar episode, but Kaladin's stuff needs a time-skip, maybe use a flashback instead to get an idea as to what his past would be? But in all honesty, all that's needed for the flashbacks is a slightly different style than the present and people will catch on quick. 

In terms of the interludes chapter, I'd make them all one episode per set. So when you finish Part 1, the next episode would all be interludes and marked as such. Like the Avatar: The Last Airbender episode "Tales of Ba Sing Se." 

Episodes would come out in Parts like the book, with the whole book being a "Season." So maybe in January you'd get Part 1 and maybe 2 with interludes, July you'd get Part 3 with interludes, and in December you'd finish the book. This an unlikely schedule, but it paints the picture I'm trying to set. 

[Singer she/her]

12 hours ago, Nathrangking said:

Things like the interludes may need to be shorts.

That would actually be awesome for a TV show. To do mini episodes released online between seasons or something along those lines.

I think it makes more sense to go chronological-ish or at least have multiple viewpoints per episode if the story beats work well.

As awesome as a live action series would be, I think it would be awesome-er to have an animated series, especially of it was in the animation style of Into the Spider verse. The spren would look awesome in that style.

Edited May 18, 2019 by Singer

[Karger he/him]

On 5/17/2019 at 11:04 AM, Nathrangking said:

Things like the interludes may need to be shorts.

You could just make all of interlude 1 be one episode same for 2 and 3 exc

[Nathrangking he/him]

2 hours ago, Karger said:

You could just make all of interlude 1 be one episode same for 2 and 3 exc

Yeah but I think the relevance might get lost if they are combined.

@Bigmikey357 I totally agree with you. They could be produced by the same company and released at the proper juncture of the story.

Edited May 19, 2019 by Nathrangking

[Bigmikey357 he/him]

The issue with interludes is that while some of them are general worldbuilding others are essential to the ending of the book. Szeth in WoK, Taravanginan in WoR, Venli and the translation work in OB. I do like the idea of online shorts between episodes, but who gets to run it? The same company would certainly have to produce both. 

[+Invocation]

1 hour ago, Nathrangking said:

Yeah but I think the relevance might get lost if they are combined.

Here's an idea: make them play in place of the credits of the last episode relevant to the part that comes before said interlude.

Edited May 19, 2019 by Invocation

[Karger he/him]

2 hours ago, Invocation said:

Here's an idea: make them play in place of the credits of the last episode relevant to the part that comes before said interlude.

Interludes can be a bit long for that.

[Willshaping Crasher]

4 hours ago, Bigmikey357 said:

The issue with interludes is that while some of them are general worldbuilding others are essential to the ending of the book. Szeth in WoK, Taravanginan in WoR, Venli and the translation work in OB. I do like the idea of online shorts between episodes, but who gets to run it? The same company would certainly have to produce both. 

I mostly agree.  If some of the interludes are dropped, the overall story just does not make sense.  For instance, Lift starts as an interlude between Part 3 and 4 of WOR.  Even putting the interludes as shorts which a large portion of the viewing audience will not seek out on their own may cause confusion.

[Elegy he/him]

As much as I disapprove of any form of Stormlight adaptation (if it's done, animated is the way, but adult animation is near impossible to market in the west), if it was done, they would have to overthrow most of the structure, leave out most of the interludes and relocate the important informations to other places. The whole story and the structure of the books are made for the literary medium and would not work as well in another context. So I wouldn't worry about where to put the interludes - it would need a completely different approach anyway.

In general, I'd really like the episodes to be split between the main arcs. For Way of Kings, for example, there would be episodes for Shallan's arc (approximately a fourth of them), and episodes that change between Kaladin and Dalinar (since both of these character's stories influence each other from very early on). Lift's interlude (which would be necessary in one way or another) would make a perfect episode. Devoting an entire episode to one arc is a way of emphasize the arc's specific feeling - so you'd stay in Kharbranth for an episode instead of switching between different atmospheres. I think that's an underestimated way of doing it.

[ScavellTane]

3 Seasons with 10 Episodes each for each book.

[+Invocation]

10 hours ago, Karger said:

Interludes can be a bit long for that.

Not if you do them right.

[Wander89 he/him]

For what it's worth, I happen to think that Game of Thrones handle the point of view chapters incredibly well. It can be broken up like that, used to including flashbacks and everything.

[NattyBo]

I really hope they don't do a live action adaptation. There's just no way the show would get the kind of budget it would need to do justice to the books.  An animated anime style adaptation would be the best of both worlds, allowing for a lot of character development, and appropriate pacing (to answer the OP question!), without shortchanging the fantastic elements.

 

I posted it in another thread but I think the best way to do it would be to cut the interludes entirely and make them into their own episodes after the season is complete. IE, you get the entire Rysn viewpoint chapters as a coherent "bonus" episode, while you'd also have already met Rysn by the end of the Oathbringer season, if that makes sense.

Edited May 20, 2019 by NattyBo

[Jofwu he/him]

I imagine one season per book. Ten seasons is on the high end for a TV series, but I don't think it's unreasonable. Especially with the time gap between 5 and 6.

I'd use prologues/flashbacks as a cold open (one character per season, matching the books). So the first episode of each season starts with the prologue, and then the flashbacks have to be condensed into however many remaining episodes there are for the season. With exceptions if necessary. (might make sense to give some of Kaladin/Shallans' final flashbacks mid-episode) With Kaladin and Shallan I think this is very reasonable. For Dalinar things would need to be cut/merged.

Interludes need to be cut or worked into the flow of the story. Something like Ishikk needs to be cut, or worked in some other way. (e.g. maybe you meet him in a season 3 Szeth PoV for the heck of it). If they don't directly relate to the main story then the information needs to be communicated another way. The interludes for "main characters" (Szeth, Eshonai, Venli, Teft...) can be worked into the normal flow of scenes. (i.e., once every episode or two in season 2 we cut to a brief Eshonai scene.) Trickiest thing here is Lift. Probably can cut her stuff and just introduce her in season 3.

[Eluvianii he/him]

For the interludes, they'd probably have to cut the ones with non-recurring characters and put whatever there is to learn from them somewhere else. Now, for recurring characters like Szeth, Lift or Rysn, just putting them on the same point as in the books should work. Each one would probably be no more than 5-10 minutes of an episode and it would create curiosity, like "Hey, it's this guy again, I wonder what's up with him." It would blend in pretty nicely.

[Rainier]

Here's what I think.

Short stories are the right length for movies. Novels are the right length for a single season of a television series.

These are not your typical novels, however, and I'm not sure how well they'd work in that format. Looking at Game of Thrones, with 10 episode seasons, the first of which lined up with the book exactingly and was the best season, gives me hope, but I'm worried you couldn't do justice to The Way of Kings in 10 hours. 

[Singer she/her]

7 hours ago, Jofwu said:

Trickiest thing here is Lift. Probably can cut her stuff and just introduce her in season 3.

I'm imagining a Christmas special of "Edgedancer" like a double length episode of Lift and Wyndle and Gawx. And maybe include the Ym interlude as a prologue to the episode to properly set up Nale.