ScavellTane Posted October 22, 2017 Report Share Posted October 22, 2017 I thought only the Windrunners and Stonewards were army/soldier oriented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxal she/her Posted October 22, 2017 Report Share Posted October 22, 2017 Just now, ScavellTane said: I thought only the Windrunners and Stonewards were army/soldier oriented. I think all orders can have soldiers within their ranks, but some orders will have more than others, some less. I don't think all Windrunners and all Stonewards were soldiers either just as not all Elsecallers were scholars, the majority, yes, but not all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects he/him Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 On 10/22/2017 at 11:47 AM, maxal said: There is also the fact most readers thought Dustbringers would be those massive killers onto the battlefield, always ready to kill. In fairness, my reasons for thinking Dustbringers could've been killing machines had nothing to do with "bravery," and everything to do with our limited understanding of their surges and powers at the time. It's not a far cry to assume an Edgedancer or Truthwatcher would become a field medic or doctor because they have Progression, which is an assumption made by many people who don't remember the Divine Attributes off-hand. On 10/18/2017 at 1:51 PM, Wreith said: it means "make a Truthless to use" make to use is actually proper grammar because you weren't supposed to end a sentence with a prepositional phrase. Google doesn't appear to like "make to use." No matter what I try, it only brings up search results related to "make use of." (Or some vague things regarding makefiles and C programming.. ) If you or someone else can provide some manner of english source on "make to use," that would be greatly appreciated, as I can't find anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wreith he/him Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 7 minutes ago, The One Who Connects said: On 10/18/2017 at 1:51 PM, Wreith said: it means "make a Truthless to use" make to use is actually proper grammar because you weren't supposed to end a sentence with a prepositional phrase. Google doesn't appear to like "make to use." No matter what I try, it only brings up search results related to "make use of." (Or some vague things regarding makefiles and C programming.. ) If you or someone else can provide some manner of english source on "make to use," that would be greatly appreciated, as I can't find anything yeah, you're not gonna find that specific an example. That said, I'm not as sure I'm right about the grammar as I was when I replied earlier. I'm reasonably sure I was taught that --not ending with a prepositional phrase at all, not just avoiding ending with a preposition itself-- in highschool, but I can find no evidence of it, so maybe I'm imagining things. Also English is stupid. That is still how I read the quote though. Can we make, to use, a Truthless (commas added). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects he/him Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 Just now, Wreith said: Also English is stupid. But, the grammar... Ok fine, there's no defending this one. (Of all the things to have a Wikipedia Page....) Quote "James while John had had had had had had had had had had had a better effect on the teacher" is an English sentence used to demonstrate lexical ambiguity and the necessity of punctuation,[1] which serves as a substitute for the intonation,[2]stress, and pauses found in speech.[3] It refers to two students, James and John, required by an English test to describe a man who had suffered from a cold in the past. John writes "The man had a cold," which the teacher marks incorrect, while James writes the correct "The man had had a cold." Since James' answer was right, it had had a better effect on the teacher. The sentence is much easier to understand with added punctuation and emphasis: James, while John had had "had", had had "had had"; "had had" had had a better effect on the teacher.[5] 23 minutes ago, Wreith said: That is still how I read the quote though. Can we make, to use, a Truthless (commas added). And to me, that doesn't look grammatically correct. It probably is technically correct, but it looks wrong to me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wreith he/him Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 12 minutes ago, The One Who Connects said: But, the grammar... Ok fine, there's no defending this one. (Of all the things to have a Wikipedia Page....) And to me, that doesn't look grammatically correct. It probably is technically correct, but it looks wrong to me. yeah, but "make to use" when "make use of" would be far better... or even just "use". I don't think the phrasing makes any sense at all if you believe he's just planning to commandeer an existing resource. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis he/him Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 (edited) It is an odd form of grammer, but I I think that's more because of the word "make" is being used in a way that we no longer use it for. From the Merriam Webster dictionary. Quote Definition of make made play \ˈmād\; making transitive verb 1a obsolete :behave, act b :to begin or seem to begin (an action) made to go So in this context it would be saying, "can we begin to use a Truthless" or "can we start using a Truthless" @Wreith @The One I Cannot Ping Edited October 23, 2017 by Calderis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bo.montier Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 46 minutes ago, Calderis said: It is an odd form of grammer, but I I think that's more because of the word "make" is being used in a way that we no longer use it for. From the Merriam Webster dictionary. So in this context it would be saying, "can we begin to use a Truthless" or "can we start using a Truthless" @Wreith @The One I Cannot Ping This is pretty much how I read it. You can even stretch it to mean "try", as it's used in the Diagram. "Can we try to use a Truthless" It's definitely odd usage and syntax, but it's as workable as any of the other options. I think the options that suggest using an already existing truthless work better, since 1) The diagram was written after the truthless, Szeth, was already around and 2) Szeth WAS used by Taravangian. It stands to reason, then, that the diagram pointed Taravangian in the direction, with events playing out like this: Gavilar is killed (by a truthless)> Taravangian goes to the Nightmother > Taravangian has his day of brilliance > Taravangian works out that Szeth is a truthless > The diagram tracks Szeth down and Makes (begins) to use him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostlander Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 (edited) Agreed and chiming in with the OED: "make to" is an even more obscure form of "make for." Essentially, it should correspond to: "proceed or direct one's course towards; go in the direction of." So in an attempt to double-translate a choppy, compact passage from a section of Floorboard 17 that hilariously uses the word, "apricity," I would keep that four-sentence complex in mind. (They are with the Shin. We must find one. Can we make to use a Truthless? Can we craft a weapon?) "The Honorblades are with the Shin! We have to get ahold of an Honorblade. What about directing our efforts toward acquiring the services of an Honorblade-wielding Truthless? Can we mold the Truthless into a weapon (that will presumably cause worldwide political instability)?" Yeah, English is weird, but it can be really fun in its weirdness... Edited October 23, 2017 by Frostlander Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects he/him Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 2 hours ago, Calderis said: I think that's more because of the word "make" is being used in a way that we no longer use it for. Given the usage of "apricity"(which my computer's spellcheck doesn't consider as a word, for the record), I'm not exactly surprised there's more obsolete things being used. A little unhappy, but not surprised. Quote 14 Botanica Ah but they were left behind. It is obvious from the nature of the bond. But where where where where? Set off. Obvious. Realization like apricity. They are with the Shin. We must find one. Can we make to use a Truthless? Can we craft a weapon?[9] The term "realization like apricity", what does it mean? I found it quite odd here. Peter Apricity is a very obscure English word (which no reader is expected to know without looking it up) meaning the warmth of the sun. This just means that the dawning of this realization is like the warmth of the sun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis he/him Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 4 minutes ago, The One Who Connects said: Given the usage of "apricity"(which my computer's spellcheck doesn't consider as a word, for the record), I'm not exactly surprised there's more obsolete things being used. A little unhappy, but not surprised. Hmm... Realization like the warmth of the sun... Warm golden glow in Dalinar's non-stormfather vision... Touch of Cultivation on the Diagram? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morsk he/him Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 I see the tangent about "apricity" as an expression of mania. It's not the only strange word choice. He also says the Desolation can and well "sit" where it pleases, and calls the Unmade "a flair". Brandon couldn't explain Mr. T's reasoning on the Shin anyway. Handwaving, and covering it with a mention of apricity, or something like "but of course", is as good as it's going to get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis he/him Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 4 hours ago, Morsk said: I see the tangent about "apricity" as an expression of mania. It's not the only strange word choice. He also says the Desolation can and well "sit" where it pleases, and calls the Unmade "a flair". Brandon couldn't explain Mr. T's reasoning on the Shin anyway. Handwaving, and covering it with a mention of apricity, or something like "but of course", is as good as it's going to get. Because, as I've believed much longer than my comment prior to yours, something external (in my opinion Cultivation) was feeding into and driving the goals of the Diagram. Taravangian made "logical" leaps that require information that humanity just does not have. He thinks it was all him, but pure logic requires something to build off of, and all of Taravangian's sources are subject to the hierocracy's alteration of history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subvisual Haze Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 Didn't Mr. T make up his own language when writing the diagram for efficiency and then include a primer on how to translate it? I wouldn't nit-pick too closely over the wording, with it already being a translation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toaster Retribution he/him Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 Anyone who has any ideas about Malata now? She calls Shallan sister, and seems genuinely interested in the Radiants, but she doesn't seem to be too fond of the Alethi leadership, or trust them when it comes to the Desolation. She smells power-hungry to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subvisual Haze Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 6 minutes ago, Toaster Retribution said: Anyone who has any ideas about Malata now? She calls Shallan sister, and seems genuinely interested in the Radiants, but she doesn't seem to be too fond of the Alethi leadership, or trust them when it comes to the Desolation. She smells power-hungry to me. She might just suffer from an off-putting personality? It seems like she's trying to get to close to others, but everyone feel weirded out by her. She might just be bad with people. Her calling her spren "Spark", is appropriate, if not very inventive. Apparently spark is the essence associated with the Dustbringers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toaster Retribution he/him Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 1 minute ago, Subvisual Haze said: She might just suffer from an off-putting personality? It seems like she's trying to get to close to others, but everyone feel weirded out by her. She might just be bad with people. Her calling her spren "Spark", is appropriate, if not very inventive. Apparently spark is the essence associated with the Dustbringers. Good point there. I missed that one completely. Too busy looking for hidden agendas :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kari-no-sugata Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Toaster Retribution said: Anyone who has any ideas about Malata now? She calls Shallan sister, and seems genuinely interested in the Radiants, but she doesn't seem to be too fond of the Alethi leadership, or trust them when it comes to the Desolation. She smells power-hungry to me. Probably most people on Roshar consider the Alethi to be warmongers. I don't think she's power-hungry but rather that she's worried about the probably power-hungry Alethi. It could be both of course, but the way she described her situation it sounded like she wanted some stability in her life. Edited October 24, 2017 by kari-no-sugata 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects he/him Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 17 minutes ago, Subvisual Haze said: Didn't Mr. T make up his own language when writing the diagram for efficiency and then include a primer on how to translate it? I wouldn't nit-pick too closely over the wording, with it already being a translation. Well, there was this second day of intelligence... On the Day of Brilliance(Diagram Day, if you will), he created the Diagram, made up a language and scrawled it on any surface he could reach. because he had no memory of Diagram Day, he could not translate it, and neither could his more normal associates/handlers. It took another day, which I refer to as the Day of Interpretation, for him to be able to translate what he had written. The exact wording might not be precise in terms of them, but in terms of what Brandon is giving us? I'm inclined to think the odd word choices were deliberate 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nymeros Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 (edited) Malata just seems like a smug haughty person who assumes too much familiarity....so annoying, yes. Interesting that her spren is named Sparks.....I guess Dustbringer spren are similar to red lightning spren? Also, Dustbringers are looking more and more like a real power-house Order, as was expected. Edited October 24, 2017 by Nymeros Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Invested Beard Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 So today's chapters confirm that she at least claims that she tagged along with Mr. T because she wanted to get to Urithiru and is fascinated by being a Radiant. She's my new favorite guys. I think I'm in love. Don't tell my wife. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeldancer he/him Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 2 minutes ago, The Invested Beard said: So today's chapters confirm that she at least claims that she tagged along with Mr. T because she wanted to get to Urithiru and is fascinated by being a Radiant. She's my new favorite guys. I think I'm in love. Don't tell my wife. Is she on the Shard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Invested Beard Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 Just now, Steeldancer said: Is she on the Shard? Nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Star Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 I know this is weird, but I can't read her name (Malata) without thinking of ES IV Oblivion Malada is a ruin in the game that's part of a really awesome questline, and the similarity between the names is screwing with me big time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Invested Beard Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 Just now, Patrick Star said: I know this is weird, but I can't read her name (Malata) without thinking of ES IV Oblivion Malada is a ruin in the game that's part of a really awesome questline, and the similarity between the names is screwing with me big time. It's okay. I keep accidentally switching out Nightwatcher with Nightmother. Stinkin' Dark Brotherhood. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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