Farnsworth Posted August 1, 2016 Report Share Posted August 1, 2016 I recently read this quote by Sanderson: Quote INTERVIEW: Mar 21st, 2014 WOR Signing Table Q&A (Verbatim) NUTIKETAIEL Were the original sixteen Shardholders after the shattering all human? BRANDON SANDERSON Uh … RAFO. There are three races on Yolen. Three sentient races. Since Frost is from Yolen, and he is a dragon, then one of those races is definitely dragons. So is is extremely likely that some of the Shardholders were dragons. Which ones? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainRyan Posted August 1, 2016 Report Share Posted August 1, 2016 21 minutes ago, Figberts said: Uh … RAFO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathfinder Posted August 1, 2016 Report Share Posted August 1, 2016 40 minutes ago, Figberts said: I recently read this quote by Sanderson: Since Frost is from Yolen, and he is a dragon, then one of those races is definitely dragons. So is is extremely likely that some of the Shardholders were dragons. Which ones? Well unless the third race looks exactly like humans, we can rule out Leras and Ati as we see their bodies. True the dragons of the cosmere could potentially shape shift, but death tends to be the universal returner to original forms 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PallonianFire Posted August 1, 2016 Report Share Posted August 1, 2016 49 minutes ago, Pathfinder said: Well unless the third race looks exactly like humans, we can rule out Leras and Ati as we see their bodies. True the dragons of the cosmere could potentially shape shift, but death tends to be the universal returner to original forms And we saw them in the Cognitive Realm, where I'd imagine they would see themselves as dragons, not as humans. Count me in on Leras/Ati=humans bandwagon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oversleep Posted August 1, 2016 Report Share Posted August 1, 2016 Tanavast also represents himself as human and bought Hoid a drink once, so I guess he was also human; and since he and Cultivation's Shardholder were a couple, I guess Cultivation's holder is also human. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argel Posted August 2, 2016 Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 Brandon is probably keeping dragon form for Dragonsteel, so I doubt one will figure prominently in SA/Roshar. IIRC, there is a WoB that we have seen a dragon in human (or maybe humanoid) form. I don't think we have any hints as to who beyond that. Could be as obscure as the unidentifiable terriswoman in Warbreaker. So in the maybe too obvious department, Dominion and Devotion? D&D.... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiant Returned Posted August 2, 2016 Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 We don't really know what the differences between humans and dragons are in this series, so it's impossible to judge based off Intent. It's even possible that dragons live a lot of their lives in human form and aren't usually in "dragon form" or something like that. So even if we've seen a human Shardholder it's not 100% guaranteed they're actually human. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farnsworth Posted August 2, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 I feel like Bavdin was a dragon, because of his association with the sun, and dragons have an association with fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patar Posted August 2, 2016 Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 Edgli kinda sounds like a dragon name. That's all I got. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata Posted August 2, 2016 Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 (edited) 9 hours ago, Figberts said: I feel like Bavdin was a dragon, because of his association with the sun, and dragons have an association with fire. We don't know how the Cosmere's Dragon works. And to be honest the only Dragon knowed is named Frost... And it's a ironic name for a flamethrowe reptile XD Edited August 2, 2016 by Yata Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParadoxicalZen Posted August 2, 2016 Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 (edited) 6 hours ago, Patar said: Edgli kinda sounds like a dragon name. That's all I got. On this, "dragon's nest" is mentioned by Vivenna and Siri's father in regards to Hallandren and no other cosmere work (as far as I can recall) so far even mentions the word. I actually had this idea that Edgli was dragon too! Edited August 2, 2016 by AnanasSpren 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argel Posted August 2, 2016 Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 I was thinking Edgi as well, since we don't see her in action, the magic system feels more alien for some reason and ditto for the Returned. Plus it doesn't feel like we will see her in action anytime soon. Ditto on Bavdin, but I have not read the White Sand prose, plus if he's Trell then less likely. In role-playing games there are a myriad of dragons with different breath types. In Dungeons and Dragons there is a frost/cold attack (white dragons), lightning (blues), acid (blacks), and corrosive gas (greens). Didn't Brandon read the Dragons of Pern novels early on? I have not read them, but that could be an obvious influence in addition to Dungeons and Dragons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eki Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 On 2016-08-02 at 6:01 PM, Argel said: Didn't Brandon read the Dragons of Pern novels early on? I have not read them, but that could be an obvious influence in addition to Dungeons and Dragons. The book that got him into fantasy was called "Dragonsbane", I believe. After that, I think he basically went through all the fantasy books in the library beginning with "Dragon". So... yeah, probably those books, among many others Ati/Leras as humans seems very reasonable, since when they decided to create sentient life, it was humans they went with. Same with Honor and Cultivation, though we don't know if they actually created humans. Regardless, they (at least Honor) have a very strong connection to humans. Do you think any non-human vessel created sentient life in their own image somewhere? Most fantasy books have mostly humans as main characters (which is understandable - humans are relatable to us), but it would be cool to see a story where there are no humans, or maybe humans are a small minority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echaozh Posted August 5, 2016 Report Share Posted August 5, 2016 10 hours ago, Eki said: The book that got him into fantasy was called "Dragonsbane", I believe. After that, I think he basically went through all the fantasy books in the library beginning with "Dragon". So... yeah, probably those books, among many others Ati/Leras as humans seems very reasonable, since when they decided to create sentient life, it was humans they went with. Same with Honor and Cultivation, though we don't know if they actually created humans. Regardless, they (at least Honor) have a very strong connection to humans. Do you think any non-human vessel created sentient life in their own image somewhere? Most fantasy books have mostly humans as main characters (which is understandable - humans are relatable to us), but it would be cool to see a story where there are no humans, or maybe humans are a small minority. Hmm, what if Rayse is a dragon, and Parshendi's final form is the dragonform? He also likes to create great shelled creatures to fight the humans. Edgli is a good candidate, as she didn't show up in a human form before Lightsong when he died. What did he see, iridescent light? What if it's reflection of light from her scales? Aona and Skai may be dragons as well. The Elantrians transform into a somewhat metallic skin color, which may be because Aona was a silver dragon? And their splinters the seons and skaze are somewhat egglike. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argel Posted August 5, 2016 Report Share Posted August 5, 2016 (edited) 3 hours ago, echaozh said: What if it's reflection of light from her scales? Worth noting that in D&D the chromatic dragons were evil and the metallic dragons were good. This was highlighted in DragonLance. Could have been an influence, and metal can obviously reflect light very well. Silvers are particularly interested in the affairs of the lesser races (humans, elves, etc.). DragonLance spoiler Spoiler The draconians were created by corrupting the stolen eggs of the good dragons. (and the stolen eggs kept most of the good dragons out of the War of the Lance until they learned the origin of draconians). Some of the best dragon artwork came out of the DragonLance, especially Larry Elmore's paintings. http://www.larryelmore.com/store/?search=dragonlance Edited August 5, 2016 by Argel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightGradient Posted August 7, 2016 Report Share Posted August 7, 2016 Another thing supporting Edgli being a dragon is the fact that the King of Idris state's that Hallandrend's noble court is a 'dragons nest'. I like the idea of Bavadin as a dragon, but there's little to no proof supporting it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toaster Retribution Posted August 8, 2016 Report Share Posted August 8, 2016 Didn't Brandon say that he liked Bavadin? Might be cause he is a dragon. Also, didn't Hoid call Rayse "individual" in the letter. There could be a reason to why he chose that instead of "human being." The fact that a dragon as villain might seem random to the readers who don't know the Cosmere speaks against this though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farnsworth Posted August 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 Since dragons are immortal, they probably have a different sense of how time works than humans. Maybe they would have a larger chance of taking a shard that can see the future? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ari Posted August 10, 2016 Report Share Posted August 10, 2016 On 8/08/2016 at 7:43 AM, KnightGradient said: Another thing supporting Edgli being a dragon is the fact that the King of Idris state's that Hallandrend's noble court is a 'dragons nest'. I like the idea of Bavadin as a dragon, but there's little to no proof supporting it. Or it's equally as possible they're just being metaphorical. Occam's razor definitely cuts this to shreds atm as far as I'm concerned, I imagine Brandon will drop some hints if there are any nonhuman Vessels out there and it becomes relevant. Most likely is that it's the third race from Yolen if there are any non-human people who became Vessels, as we'd currently have no way to know, lol, wheras there was some pretty pointed language between Hoid and Frost that hinted the letter's recipient was a dragon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightGradient Posted August 10, 2016 Report Share Posted August 10, 2016 2 hours ago, Ari said: Or it's equally as possible they're just being metaphorical. Occam's razor definitely cuts this to shreds atm as far as I'm concerned, I imagine Brandon will drop some hints if there are any nonhuman Vessels out there and it becomes relevant. Most likely is that it's the third race from Yolen if there are any non-human people who became Vessels, as we'd currently have no way to know, lol, wheras there was some pretty pointed language between Hoid and Frost that hinted the letter's recipient was a dragon. What I meant is that the Siri's dad knew enough about dragons to refer to a city he found dangerous as their nest, which means their culture at least knows a little bit about dragons. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainRyan Posted August 10, 2016 Report Share Posted August 10, 2016 11 hours ago, KnightGradient said: What I meant is that the Siri's dad knew enough about dragons to refer to a city he found dangerous as their nest, which means their culture at least knows a little bit about dragons. Or the phrase "dragon's nest" is simply the best "translation" between English and whatever native Nalthis language Warbreaker was written in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argel Posted August 10, 2016 Report Share Posted August 10, 2016 (edited) Yeah, but it's interesting the word "dragon" does not appear in any other published Cosmere books. EDIT!!! Word of Brandon on this via Twitter!!! Question: Quote Is "dragon's nest" a Nalthis to English translation or are dragons part of their culture? Is Edgli a dragon? Brandon: Quote Dragons are mythological on Nalthis, but there is a reason the stories exist. It's not a translation quirk. Edited August 13, 2016 by Argel 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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