Anniversary Game 2: Return of the Koloss

[Kasimir he/him]

Except that I smoked myself (and no one else) last night, so whatever a Seeker saw, it wouldn't have been my alignment. I reasoned that a Seeker was less likely to hit me; I was more likely to get votejacked since I'd made it clear I'm gonna be busy this week, so I'd be less likely to be able to change my vote. Had PMed Hreo offering to drop my Coppercloud tonight, but thanks, Hellscythe, I guess that won't bloody fly anymore because the Spiked will just cloud me anyway. Thank you for throwing a spanner into that plan.

 

(And yeah, in case it isn't obvious, I was already planning on going hot and claiming Smoker publicly: there's a reason for my defending the Smoker's choice to Smoke rather than to go bare, and the first letters of each paragraph in the above RP post spell out 'SMOKER'.)

[Mashadar Mistborn he/him]

 

I figure if I die I don't want it to be without information so here's my thoughts straight from my AG2 Docs Notes

 

Day 1 Suspicious Thingies

 

Redundant statement. Sounds evil.

 

 

Not sure what this means at all. If they were in the group why would they not want us to have one? Also sounds evil.

 

 

 

 

Okay. I was trying to say that the eliminators didn't want us to form PM groups, so they killed Seonid who was behind it and had put one of them into his message.  You do have a point though, if an eliminator was in the group, maybe they didn't have someone in every group, but the more I look at that reasoning, the flimsier it sounds. I was trying to propose a reason, but maybe it was merely a poke kill (is that the right term?). I'm just trying to figure out why they'd go after Seonid.

Edited December 27, 2015 by Mashadar Mistborn

[Hellscythe he/him]

Except that I smoked myself (and no one else) last night, so whatever a Seeker saw, it wouldn't have been my alignment. I reasoned that a Seeker was less likely to hit me; I was more likely to get votejacked since I'd made it clear I'm gonna be busy this week, so I'd be less likely to be able to change my vote. Had PMed Hreo offering to drop my Coppercloud tonight, but thanks, Hellscythe, I guess that won't bloody fly anymore because the Spiked will just cloud me anyway. Thank you for throwing a spanner into that plan.

 

(And yeah, in case it isn't obvious, I was already planning on going hot and claiming Smoker publicly: there's a reason for my defending the Smoker's choice to Smoke rather than to go bare, and the first letters of each paragraph in the above RP post spell out 'SMOKER'.)

;p Tehee.

So your plan was to block a vote change? Then claim? Why would anyone use their vote change on someone who A) Claimed Smoker (B doesn't exist because it's an emoji) C) Claimed they can't be vote changed.

Also why are the Spiked just going to cloud you anyway.

 

Also my suspicion that Hero is a Seeker still stands. If Kas came up as smoked I could see Hero voting for him because of that.

 

 

I'm just trying to figure out why they'd go after Seonid.

You're looking for them in the wrong places. Seonid was most likely a random kill since it was night one and nobody had posted enough times or said anything significant enough to attract the attention of a kill.

 

He could've claimed something important to an evil one and that'd be the one reason he was purposefully targeted, but he was roleless so kudos to him if he really did take one for the team.

Edited December 27, 2015 by Hellscythe

[Wyrmhero he/him]

Also my suspicion that Hero is a Seeker still stands. If Kas came up as smoked I could see Hero voting for him because of that.

 

Survivor alive, why don't we just have our Coinshots and Seekers Roleclaim publicly? Would save you time pointing them out to the Eliminators.

Edited December 27, 2015 by Wyrmhero

[Kasimir he/him]

;p Tehee.

So your plan was to block a vote change? Then claim? Why would anyone use their vote change on someone who A) Claimed Smoker Claimed they can't be vote changed.

Also why are the Spiked just going to cloud you anyway.

You're assuming I had a plan. Unfortunately, your assumption does not bear out. My plan had nothing to do with claiming; I'm claiming on the basis of pre-game advice from Wilson. My reason for Smoking myself was that I felt I was likely to be a tempting target for a votechange (see: stable vote, not likely to be suddenly withdrawn and therefore wasted, in the case of Soothing), as compared to how likely it was I would be Seeked in a game with a number of priority targets.

Other than the fact that it seemed to me that the natural question (if confirmed that Hreo did in fact Seek me) would eventually go down to whether I should be scanned, and it's practically zero effort for a Spiked Smoker to Smoke me to further mess with what the Seeker is doing?

Assuming, of course, y'all aren't going to lynch me to avoid wasting a scan, in which case I'll:

A. Be very pissed off, since the whole point of taking Wilson's advice was to not die early/on Night 2 again, as I usually do.

B. Give the hell up and just dump whatever info I've got so it doesn't go down on me.

What have I missed?

Edit: *so it doesn't go down with me.

Edited December 27, 2015 by Kasimir

[STINK he/him]

Dump all that info! Take a massive dump! 

[Kasimir he/him]

Dump all that info! Take a massive dump!

Should clarify this will not include roles. While I know a few (...I don't know why either, but it seems 17S is full of trolls), I'm not about to out anyone to the main thread who doesn't want to be outed. And I take it that because they haven't outed themselves, they didn't want to be outed in general.

[Hellscythe he/him]

Survivor alive, why don't we just have our Coinshots and Seekers Roleclaim publicly? Would save you time pointing them out to the Eliminators.

In my opinion the Spiked have a higher rate of communication and therefore had a higher chance of reaching the same conclusion as me than any single villager multiplied by however many active members they have.

 

You're assuming I had a plan. Unfortunately, your assumption does not bear out. My plan had nothing to do with claiming; I'm claiming on the basis of pre-game advice from Wilson. My reason for Smoking myself was that I felt I was likely to be a tempting target for a votechange (see: stable vote, not likely to be suddenly withdrawn and therefore wasted, in the case of Soothing), as compared to how likely it was I would be Seeked in a game with a number of priority targets.

Other than the fact that it seemed to me that the natural question (if confirmed that Hreo did in fact Seek me) would eventually go down to whether I should be scanned, and it's practically zero effort for a Spiked Smoker to Smoke me to further mess with what the Seeker is doing?

Assuming, of course, y'all aren't going to lynch me to avoid wasting a scan, in which case I'll:

A. Be very pissed off

Personally I don't think you're worth Spiked Smoking for multiple reasons. First off you can smoke yourself which would make the other person's smoke redundant. Second off there's no point in smoking you because it's more than likely that even if you claim you won't be smoking(haha) nobody from now on will use abilities on you that will be blocked by smoking.

 

Also is A. a sign of evil!Kas? It sounds off and not very Kas-like to me. Although I haven't seen his evil play.

[STINK he/him]

Hellscythe, you're being a bit aggressive there. Someone being annoyed if they get lynched makes them evil? Pretty sure everyone would get annoyed. Want to tunnel on to me for a bit? I think I need a bit of suspicion.

[Hellscythe he/him]

Hellscythe, you're being a bit aggressive there. Someone being annoyed if they get lynched makes them evil? Pretty sure everyone would get annoyed. Want to tunnel on to me for a bit? I think I need a bit of suspicion.

Am I? And here I was thought I was doing well trying not to be Kasimir isn't my main suspicion as of the time anyway. Although some of he things he's said don't make much sense to me. It's Mashadar first then Wyrm for reasons already stated.

 

Someone being annoyed if they get lynched doesn't make them evil. Someone who reacts differently to the same scenario in different games has the potential to have that be due to an alignment change.

 

That was how I obtained my read last game on Creccio. I thought it was odd he all of a sudden didn't want to die when every other game he didn't care too much about being lynched, and although he wanted to prove himself good, he didn't said "Don't kill me!" in every post. This game specifically he felt he was too important to die. Which lead me to believe he was either evil or got an important role. He later claimed Restares/Lightweaver, 2 very important roles. Whether that's true or not is still to be proven after the game.

 

Tunnel on you? That honestly sounds a little suspicious to me. It's purposefully attracting attention, normally something you wouldn't want to do as a Spike but simple and easy enough to be a Spike play to gain trust. Regardless you're still not on my suspicion list. Sorry D:

[STINK he/him]

You're definitely less aggressive than you have been previously, which is great! 

 

I get your point about reacting differently because of different situations, but in the situation of Kas claiming his role, it is understandable to be annoyed, and I'll just like to say that Kas is looking to me to be under considerably more suspicion for what he has done, compared to Wyrm who used his Tineye message (though I can see why).

 

I won't talk about the MR.

 

Honestly, people tunneling on me is fun. Nothing like having to defend yourself and finding out what you've done that is suspicious. 

[Kasimir he/him]

Am I? And here I was thought I was doing well trying not to be Kasimir isn't my main suspicion as of the time anyway. Although some of he things he's said don't make much sense to me. It's Mashadar first then Wyrm for reasons already stated.

 

Someone being annoyed if they get lynched doesn't make them evil. Someone who reacts differently to the same scenario in different games has the potential to have that be due to an alignment change.

 

That was how I obtained my read last game on Creccio. I thought it was odd he all of a sudden didn't want to die when every other game he didn't care too much about being lynched, and although he wanted to prove himself good, he didn't said "Don't kill me!" in every post. This game specifically he felt he was too important to die. Which lead me to believe he was either evil or got an important role. He later claimed Restares/Lightweaver, 2 very important roles. Whether that's true or not is still to be proven after the game.

 

Tunnel on you? That honestly sounds a little suspicious to me. It's purposefully attracting attention, normally something you wouldn't want to do as a Spike but simple and easy enough to be a Spike play to gain trust. Regardless you're still not on my suspicion list. Sorry D:

You definitely did not see all the cursing and swearing I did after getting offed relatively early in LG15. (...Considering the dead doc had to be PG-9, not that surprising.) Frankly, my death rate is absurd, and I'm sick and tired of it. It was the last straw for Maili after getting killed on Night 1 three games in a row; similarly, getting killed early on was more or less the last straw for me last game, and pretty much has been.

I joke about it now with Wilson, but back then, Maili and I were both truly angry. I refused to speak to Wilson immediately after, because I did not trust myself to be civil enough to politely laugh off my death. It took us both a good chunk of time to deal with the anger enough to do what we had to do. It seems like I took too much pains to avoid making my feelings about the matter known, which is kind of funny, in retrospect.

[Mailliw73 he/him]

B. Give the hell up and just dump whatever info I've got so it doesn't go down on me.

What have I missed?

Edit: *so it doesn't go down with me.

Yes, come to the dark side of info dumping.

I don't think you're worth Spiked Smoking for multiple reasons. First off you can smoke yourself which would make the other person's smoke redundant. Second off there's no point in smoking you because it's more than likely that even if you claim you won't be smoking(haha) nobody from now on will use abilities on you that will be blocked by smoking.

Also is A. a sign of evil!Kas? It sounds off and not very Kas-like to me. Although I haven't seen his evil play.

His point is that the Spiked can Smoke him to make it seem like he is trying to hide himself from Smokers still even though he said that he wouldn't.

It is. I can verify what Kas said above about LG15. He was pissed and so was I(Thanks, by the way, Spiked and Coinshots for not killing me last night), and I think it's very understandable.

Wyrm, what's with the Tineye reveal so early? This doesn't quite seem typical.

Venture, it was fast because of your habit in other games to post once and then drop off the map for the next few cycles.

[Kasimir he/him]

His point is that the Spiked can Smoke him to make it seem like he is trying to hide himself from Smokers still even though he said that he wouldn't.

Actually, HS is claiming that there would be no point in the Spiked doing that. His claim is as follows:

A. The Spiked know that everyone else knows I can Smoke myself.

B. The Spiked believe that no one would want to use any sort of ability on me if it could be blocked by Smoking (for the reason that people would always be unsure of whether I'm Smoking and therefore waste an ability.)

C. From A. and B., The Spiked would, therefore, conclude that there is no point in Smoking me; it just wastes a Smoke and is redundant.

I'm not sure how much I think B. is a claim that should be endorsed, as I've found that players don't always follow the logic we expect them to (my Smoking myself, if we'll permit me the assumption I'm on Team Village, is probably an example, as I'd bet that before the game started, many people would believe that someone Smoking themselves or being Smoked had a high chance of being Spiked.)

Edit:

Open In Case Of Death

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Edited December 27, 2015 by Kasimir

[Mailliw73 he/him]

Ah, I see. Thanks.

I, too, hate relying on assumptions. When I'm evil, I intentionally do things that no one would assume an evil player would do(see my voting on the player we killed the next night in QF10). It throws off assumptions and people don't know what to do.

[Hellscythe he/him]

Well thanks Kas +1 brownie points to you.

I wasn't sure how I was going to respond to Mail because I already said everything I've thought of on the matter.

There's no white text down here.

Stop.

What are you doing?

THERE'S NOTHING DOWN HERE STOP HIGHLIGHTING PATRICE! (+1 to you if you get the reference)

Oh boy we have a problem... On happier thoughts... What would you do for a Klondike bar?

I am a Sons of Honour Runner. Regular.

[STINK he/him]

So does anyone else suspect anyone?

[Hellscythe he/him]

So how are we going to get the password if you're dead Kas? Your ghostie? Or do you have a friend you've entrusted the password with when you die, only to find out when you get to the dead doc that they were evil and your last wishes won't be seen!

 

Vote Actions in Order

Hael votes for Lopen

Mail votes for Venture

Venture votes for Lopen

Stink votes for Jain

Hero votes for Kas

Mail retracts Venture

How do retractions work? The original post has to be greened out? Or just a new green named person like Mail did?

 

Total Votes.....

Lopen (2) - Hael, Venture

Jain (1) - Stink

Wyrmhero (1) - Hellscythe

 

Personally I believe Lopen to be innocent just based off of pure gut. If we keep going in the direction we're in he's likely to die so I'm going to place my vote on Wyrmhero. While he's not my #1 most suspected, the basis for which I suspect him is stronger than Mashadar.

[Mailliw73 he/him]

Meta said either greening the original or just making them green later on works. I usually do the latter if the first isn't required.

[Haelbarde he/him]

Well my vote was to encourage Lopen to post, but it's been almost a day, so I might shift it. Back when I work out what I want to do.

[Metacognition he/him]

Vote Actions in Order

Hael votes for Lopen

Mail votes for Venture

Venture votes for Lopen

Stink votes for Jain

Hero votes for Kas

Mail retracts Venture

How do retractions work? The original post has to be greened out? Or just a new green named person like Mail did?

 

Meta said either greening the original or just making them green later on works. I usually do the latter if the first isn't required.

 

I guess I never really saw how reading the 'first red vote' thing helps much in the first place. When I'm tallying votes, I'll start at the beginning of a turn and just record votes as I go. So if you switched your vote, all it means to me is that I replace your previous vote with the new one. So no, you don't have to worry about going and switching your previous votes to green. 

I will say this though, you do have to retract your previous vote though. You can do this in the same post that you're creating the new vote though; you don't have to go back and find your previous votes. If you have one red vote and then you vote for someone else without retracting, I will take the first red vote.

I think that covers it?

[Araris Valerian he/him]

"So he hasn't spoken up a whit, and your belly tells you that he must be innocent..." Aralis shook his head slowly. "That isn't how this works. By the Lord Ruler, you rile up a crowd and claim that Koloss are attacking our city, but then all you can say is that this Lopen fellow is not one of these supposed Spiked. I say we should lynch you today, and maybe tomorrow we will get more sense out of this crowd..."

 

Aralis is still grouchy. But anyways, Hellscythe, that seems like a suspicious move to me. I mean, Lopen hasn't posted, so you might retract because inactives might just be inactive the first cycle or so of this game, and we weren't going to hear from him. But there is no reason to come out and say that he is innocent. I know that I recently played a game of Resistance and I spotted a Government player when he defended a player he knew to be good for little reason. So, yeah, I actually feel fairly confident about this cycle one vote as compared to others that I have made.

[Hellscythe he/him]

I've pmed with Lopen more than he's posted. My reasons for believing in his innocence are not completely unfounded. And until he gives me a reason to distrust him I'll stand by him as a fellow villager.

Edited December 28, 2015 by Hellscythe

[Mark IV he/him]

I second Hellscythe's opinion on Wyrm. Wyrm's reveal was quite suspicious to me. If I were a Spiked player, I would try to make myself indispensable to the team, hence making the coinshots hesitate to kill me (something like that). In any case, Wyrm, you are at the top of my 'suspicious list'.

[Mark IV he/him]

So, current tally-

Lopen (1)- Venture

Jain (1)- STINK

Wyrmhero (2)- Hellscythe, Mark

Hellscythe (1)- Araris

Correct me if there are any mistakes.