Chapters 29 and 30

[Isilel]

On 11/11/2024 at 7:11 PM, alder24 said:

And in the end they captured all of Ghostbloods except for the three main guys. Of course they did, of course the mission went almost perfectly. I’m so utterly disappointed by how all of this was executed. Shallan basically single-handedly destroyed the Rosharan cell of Ghostbloods in one sweeping strike, one of "the most powerful secret organizations in Cosmere." Just like this, with barely no effort… 

 

I mean, this is the same organization that, on it's own turf, provided impetus for creation of a cult of inimical deity through slopiness, then allowed the Set to become much more powerful than itself and nearly destroy the very same planet that it's members had sworn to protect above all else. So, par for the course.

Prancing around in masks in a place where this is pretty much unheard of and extremely conspicious, also doesn't speak for their discretion.

I share your frustration about how the Ghostbloods have been depicted so far. Their main strength should have been the ability to mix and match powers and technologies from different worlds, but Sanderson never allows them to do so! Which feels extremely contrived and implausible to me.

OTOH, given that nobody had used any off-world powers or even pulled out a gun in Shallan's previous chapter, I am glad that the lesser Ghostbloods were captured. Because one of the very widespread tropes, that I am very tired of, is that only the main characters matter and must do everything by themselves, while any support they should or might have, particularly if it largely consists of nameless people, has to be ineffective or gets removed. Here, Shallan thought to call for backup, and they proved competent. Arguably, they are the reason for Shallan's survival. I liked that. It also demonstrated her growth.

That being said, I am still not sure that Mraize isn't playing his own game and didn't lead Shallan to the meeting place without Iyatil's knoweldge. Maybe he disagrees with his bosses plans for BAM, maybe he thinks that Shallan has a better chance of finding her and their best bet is to follow her, or maybe it is just a power grab. In any case, neither the Seon, nor his Aviar seem to be in the hide-out, which strikes me as suspicious. I also noticed that Iyatil was apparently unaware of Shallan's declaration of war, or that her brothers had been spirited away. So, there is still hope for a twist.

After all, I have been complaining a lot after RoW about how incompetent the planning for capturing Kalak had been, and look how it turned out...

Now, a couple of different things - how can it be that poor Gav doesn't remember Ehlokar's face? Shouldn't there be portraits? IIRC, it was mentioned back in WoK that artists and artisans flocked to the Shattered Plains camps.

And I have been excitedly thinking how Shallan's ability to enter Shadesmar at will would be extremely useful if she became a worldhopper, but then it occured to me that it should probably be one way only and that she'd still need perpendicularities to actually visit any other worlds in the Physical.

[OoklaApologist She/her]

22 hours ago, Ninth of the Night said:

Potentially there's some... Child of a Herald shenanigans going on with her. We shall see!

Maybe it's the influence of growing up around an Unmade. It could also be related to the weird Spiritual stuff she can do. If I saw some other evidence, I might make a "Testament was enlightened" theory. We shall see, indeed!

3 hours ago, Isilel said:

Now, a couple of different things - how can it be that poor Gav doesn't remember Ehlokar's face? Shouldn't there be portraits? IIRC, it was mentioned back in WoK that artists and artisans flocked to the Shattered Plains camps.

That's a very good point, however though can't speak to Alethi traditions, old portraits were often touched up. Maybe that was done to a large extent in the portraits Ehlokar had done? 

[Slayd_07]

On 11/11/2024 at 8:59 AM, BinarySecond said:

Such a good catch. I was wondering where the number 12 came from through - So it's probably 9 plus Kal, Syl, and Szeth.

 

Who are the 9? Unmade?

They've got to be the remaining Heralds, right? Since Jezerin is Dead dead now, there's only 9 of them left.

[teknopathetic he/him]

Did the Ghostbloods really use a bonded spren to teleport? If So, why didn't Shallan see these spren in the cognitive realm?
 

Quote

Three people on a small boat pulled by mandras, heading for a nearby platform with massive spren overhead. Mraize, Iyatil, and Lieke. One tall figure, two short. They had planned this special means of escape, and were heading to Urithiru. Their cell here had suffered a terrible blow—but they’d already set something in motion with Dalinar. A plot to find Ba-Ado-Mishram, the Unmade.

She specifically says she only saw 3 people on the boat. There should have at least been 4 figures if there really was a True Spren. I know it sure did look like they used a surge, but that specific "3 figures" line is odd. 

Options:
1. Corrupted/Enlightened Spren don't show up in the same way in Shadesmaar as Regular Truespren
2. One of the three figures is a spren and something happened to 1 of the ghostbloods
3. The Truespren fled after the transportation for some reason.
4. Sja-Anat moved the Ghostbloods to the cognitive realm somehow.
5. The Ghostbloods used off-world magic to mimic the ability (one of the trophies from the case)
6. The ghostbloods didn't really teleport there and it was a ruse somehow. 
7. Continuity Error

I guess I will need to go read the descriptions of height for these 3 ghostbloods and see if they should all be tall or short

Mraize: Mraize is a tall man with jet black hair and light violet eyes
Iyatil: Iyatil is a short, tan-skinned woman
Lieke: I dont think we get a height (likely short because not Rosharan)

Edited November 13, 2024 by teknopathetic

[Sedside she/her]

4 hours ago, teknopathetic said:

Options:
1. Corrupted/Enlightened Spren don't show up in the same way in Shadesmaar as Regular Truespren
2. One of the three figures is a spren and something happened to 1 of the ghostbloods
3. The Truespren fled after the transportation for some reason.
4. Sja-Anat moved the Ghostbloods to the cognitive realm somehow.
5. The Ghostbloods used off-world magic to mimic the ability (one of the trophies from the case)
6. The ghostbloods didn't really teleport there and it was a ruse somehow. 
7. Continuity Error

8. Their spren were under the surface, at the bottom of the sea of beads.

[Wanguu He/Him]

17 hours ago, teknopathetic said:

She specifically says she only saw 3 people on the boat. There should have at least been 4 figures if there really was a True Spren. I know it sure did look like they used a surge, but that specific "3 figures" line is odd

Wow, this is an amazing spot - I just glossed over this line when I was reading. I don't think Brandon would've overlooked this, so hopefully we'll get an explanation soon.

[The Sovereign]

Another couple of potential reasons that Shallan didn't see the Spren:

1.) Like Glys, the Enlightened Spren can actually go inside the body of its Bonded Radiant. 
2.) The Spren is an Enlightened Inkspren and made itself extremely small as we've seen with Ivory. I'm not sure if Inkspren can change their size in Shadesmar, but I believe we also do not know that they cannot.

Edited November 14, 2024 by The Sovereign

[Namle84]

32 minutes ago, The Sovereign said:

Another couple of potential reasons that Shallan didn't see the Spren:

1.) Like Glys, the Enlightened Spren can actually go inside the body of its Bonded Radiant. 
2.) The Spren is an Enlightened Inkspren and made itself extremely small as we've seen with Ivory. I'm not sure if Inkspren can change their size in Shadesmar, but I believe we also do not know that they cannot.

I’m fairly certain that both of these (#2 especially) apply in the physical realm only. In shadesmar, all true spren are human-sized and cannot change their form

Edited November 14, 2024 by Namle84

[elihaun]

On 11/11/2024 at 11:50 AM, CtrlAltDepressed said:

Who is the blue skinned woman? That was weird.

I assumed that the blue skinned woman was Syl?  

[elihaun]

On 11/11/2024 at 1:59 PM, CtrlAltDepressed said:

Could very well be just as disappointing as it appears, but I am holding out hope this is part of a bigger scheme. There's always another secret!

I think this is true, because Illital started talking to shallan in Alethi BEFORE she pulled the hood off.  I think she knew before she even left the main room.  They were playing her.  And she had more than enough opportunity to shoot shallan, but waited.  I think they knew what they were doing

[BinarySecond]

21 minutes ago, elihaun said:

I assumed that the blue skinned woman was Syl?  

That's currently a theory I believe in. It's Kaladin, Szeth and Syl with the 9 surviving Heralds.